AZ - Isabel Mercedes Celis, 6, Tucson, 20 April 2012 - #20

[mamamia54]

One here

Well that makes three of us now.

 

[mijamawi]

Thanks for the pictures! Is that a chimney with the metal on top instead of a swamp cooler? Zillow has it with A/C. No fireplace mention etc.. Not that it matters much either way. lol!

http://www.zillow.com/homedetails/5602-E-12th-St-Tucson-AZ-85711/67098691_zpid/

FYI - Zillow has my house listed with the wrong square feet and number of bedrooms. Not sure where they get their info from.

 

[Anita Richman]

Originally Becky said she "went" to work at 7, so I don't know if that meant "left" for work, or "started" work. Then on the website that is run by volunteers it listed that Becky left for work at 6:30. Somewhere it is written that Sergio said she left for work at 6:47, another place it said Becky left at 7:30. I think the 7 or 7:30 timeline is most likely, but I am just guessing - for all I know she could have left home at 6:47, although I find it peculiar that Sergio would name such an odd time, unless he was looking at a digital clock which showed 6:47 as he heard Becky going out the door. I do wonder why Becky didn't hear the dogs barking if she was still home at 6:30 in the morning, unless she was in the shower perhaps?

Anyhow, if Becky was working an 8:00 o'clock shift we know she more than likely left home somewhere between 6:47 and 7:30. The part I don't believe is Sergio saying he woke up at 7:13 and didn't get out of bed until 7:54 (or whatever it was) - how did he know Becky left at 6:47 if he didn't wake up until 7:13? Something is really off with his timeline stories - this is one of the things that makes me suspicious of him. If he is not involved in Isabel's "abduction" why so many different stories and timelines, and how did so much happen around the 8 o'clock hour? Discovery, searches, phone calls, etc. etc. - until I can see a nice clean version of Sergio's actions and associated timeline, he remains on my radar. JMHO

I understand that. However, in our house (with lots of little Richrugrats running amok) our daytime timeline can look like this-from my perspective: 4:04 WAKE UP (glance at digital clock as the youngest comes into the room, looking for a drink) 4:15 WAKE UP (as the youngest informs me he has to pee) 4:42 WAKE UP (I've lost the covers) 5:00 Husband leaves (I hear the bedroom door close) 5:31 (Husband brings me coffee in bed) 5:45 I wake up (turn on tv news and listen, with my eyes closed, hoping the youngest doesn't wake up, 'cause he's next to me) 6:07 I'm up (washing my face, brushing my teeth, calling out to the Richmiddle that it's time to get up) 6:25 I'm out of my room (going downstairs to make breakfast) etc...In my scenario, daily life, I could be "up" for HOURS before I actually "get up" and I might do other stuff before I go into my daughter's room to "get her up". (Also, in my r.l., she HAS to be out our door at 6:53 in order to be at the corner bus stop one minute later.)

 

[pieper4]

Since the Home Invasion Unit was mentioned (much of that information redacted) in the docs, some background on that may help. Here is some information from a Reuter's article from 2009 -- interestingly, dated exactly 3 years before Isabel's "disappearance."


BEGIN EXCERPT:
The desert city is less than two hour's drive from the Mexico border. It lies on a crossroads for the multimillion dollar trade in drugs headed north to market across the United States from Mexico, as well as guns and hot money proceeds headed south to the cartels.

Five years ago, police say home invasions were virtually unheard of in Tucson. Now the crimes run at three to four a week, as criminals go after the profits of the illicit trade in marijuana, black-tar heroin, cocaine and methamphetamine through the city.

"We've always dealt with those in business establishments, banks and convenience stores, it was very unusual to see them in houses," Roberto A. Villasenor, Tucson's assistant chief of police said of the recent trend. "The home was seen as a safe spot."

CAUGHT UP

Curbing drug violence is a top concern for the government in Mexico, where rival cartels murdered 6,300 people last year as they battled the authorities and each other for control of lucrative smuggling corridors to the United States.

It is also high on the U.S. agenda as authorities seek to stop cartel-related crimes such as kidnappings, home invasions and gangland-style slayings from bleeding over the porous U.S. border and taking hold here.

A year ago, Tucson police department set up a special unit to target the rising number of home invasions. Since then, the officers have investigated at least 173 cases scattered across the city, three-quarters of them tied to the drug trade, investigators say.

U.S. Home Invasions Up As Thugs Seek Drug Cash
http://www.reuters.com/article/2009/04/21/us-usa-crime-homeinvasion-idUSTRE53K00Y20090421

I am not current here, so my apologies in advance if this has been stated/covered. I *think* that reference in the docs is to TPD being sent over to the Snyder molester incident. Anyone?

 

[Allusonz]

What report indicates blood was cleaned up?

Package 5 page 58 indicates apparent blood on the floor.

IMO it is possible that the blood belonged to an intruder who cut himself on the crunched screen.

Sorry Prof am only jumping off your post.


Ok I am totally doc'd out so can anyone help me here with respect to this apparent blood.

I am seeing that they used luminol but no where do I see that they have used even a presumptive TMB test.

Is there anywhere in these documents that states categorically that there was a positive test for blood?

 

[A_News_Junkie]

Here is a link to Wolverine boots at the Airforce Exchange (read department store):

https://shop.aafes.com/shop/search/default.aspx?freeText|81296.047125=Wolverine%20boots

Also, here is a possible route to the camera on the roof, which wouldn't have exposed the person moving it.

And thus the bootprint on the gas meter when the camera was moved.
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=22673&d=1338090614

Sure hope they dusted it for prints - just in case!

 

[Lark2]

Originally Posted by mamamia54
With the 85 people that we have here reading this thread, how many are at least considering the fact that Isa could still be alive?

The potential blood evidence unveiled in this document release is ominous. I would be surprised if she was alive.

I am trying to connect the blood in Isa's bedroom to potential blood in the disabled car in the driveway. Assuming the reddish-brown stains in the car are Isabel's blood,, and also assuming the "apparent blood" in her bedroom comes from her, how could that have come to pass?

I hope she's alive, but it is not looking good for that scenario.

 

[pieper4]

FYI - Zillow has my house listed with the wrong square feet and number of bedrooms. Not sure where they get their info from.

They get it from assessor's sites and other public domain sources. So mine is wrong, too since the Pima County Assessor's site is a mess.

 

[mamamia54]

Sorry Prof am only jumping off your post.


Ok I am totally doc'd out so can anyone help me here with respect to this apparent blood.

I am seeing that they used luminol but no where do I see that they have used even a presumptive TMB test.

Is there anywhere in these documents that states categorically that there was a positive test for blood?

Nope, just apparent blood.

 

[Allusonz]

Good day everyone, you know, the more I read through these docs, the more I feel certain that someone within the Celis family circle are involved in where Isa went. All these douments, all the work that's been devoted to this case, and I'm not finding any real solid evidence of anything outside the family.

The footprints on top of the electrical box, the footprints on top of the gas meter just tells me that someone from the outside came in that way, and left through the door on the oposite side of the wall. This just isn't screaming out to me, stranger abduction. I really don't know why.

I as well am not seeing any solid evidence here so what is the purpose of this doc dump?

Are they looking for more tips from the public? Trying to see what forums like this come up with?

I am so totally confused here.

 

[carole]

I as well am not seeing any solid evidence here so what is the purpose of this doc dump?

Are they looking for more tips from the public? Trying to see what forums like this come up with?

I am so totally confused here.

BBM

IMO it is to keep the case in the public eye. So the case doesn't go cold. Hoping someone has some information and will come forward.

 

[azmary]

Sorry, one more response to your post . . . I am not too bothered by her arriving at work early because I'm sure there is more to her job than just showing up a few minutes before her shift starts. I always thought that nurses' shifts ran from 7 to 7 (they do at the hospitals I have had experience with) and I can imagine that regardless whether they start at 7 or 8, the incoming nurse has to be brought up to speed with what the outgoing nurse has experienced on her shift, and there is no doubt a fair amount of paperwork to be checked, etc. as well as just getting settled in or having coffee and/or something to eat before starting work. It's not Becky's timeline that disturbs me, it's Sergio's version(s) of the timelines that bothers me. :what:

Nurses are given 30 minutes to do shift report before starting their shift. That 30 minutes is included in either an 8 hour shift or a 12 hour shift.

 

[Anita Richman]

The potential blood evidence unveiled in this document release is ominous. I would be surprised if she was alive.

I am trying to connect the blood in Isa's bedroom to potential blood in the disabled car in the driveway. Assuming the reddish-brown stains in the car are Isabel's blood,, and also assuming the "apparent blood" in her bedroom comes from her, how could that have come to pass?

I hope she's alive, but it is not looking good for that scenario.

I personally can't assume the reddish-brown stains in the disabled car are Isa's because the car is still there. IMO, if LE found blood connected to Isa in ANY of the vehicles, they would have been impounded and still not released.

 

[Lark2]

I as well am not seeing any solid evidence here so what is the purpose of this doc dump?

Are they looking for more tips from the public? Trying to see what forums like this come up with?

I am so totally confused here.

This might help: LE has strategically released info and made comments to the media that were not exactly supportive of the family. After one month they still haven't cleared them.

Many feel that they are on the verge of an arrest of certain family members in this case.

These latest documents continue to make the family look bad. Perhaps that's the point.

 

[Lark2]

I personally can't assume the reddish-brown stains in the disabled car are Isa's because the car is still there. IMO, if LE found blood connected to Isa in ANY of the vehicles, they would have been impounded and still not released.

You have a point there. But I believe they removed the carpet from the car for further testing. Perhaps in later doc releases we will learn more. BTW, much of this entry was redacted.

 

[Allusonz]

The potential blood evidence unveiled in this document release is ominous. I would be surprised if she was alive.

I am trying to connect the blood in Isa's bedroom to potential blood in the disabled car in the driveway. Assuming the reddish-brown stains in the car are Isabel's blood,, and also assuming the "apparent blood" in her bedroom comes from her, how could that have come to pass?

I hope she's alive, but it is not looking good for that scenario.

I am sorry I am not even at the moment seeing the potential for blood here.

I have seen LE state luminol but luminol reacts with far too many things thus they usually do a presumptive test like TMB.

 

[Anita Richman]

Nurses are given 30 minutes to do shift report before starting their shift. That 30 minutes is included in either an 8 hour shift or a 12 hour shift.

Thanks, Mary. So does that mean, if my "shift" starts at 8, I have until 8:30 to get into gear, then I work until 4 or 8 and just walk out of the hospital?

The reason I ask, I have a family member who is a nurse and occasionally their "12 hour shift" turns into 13 or 14 hours. I assumed perhaps that the extra hour or two was before "scheduled shift", 30-60 minuts exchanging information with nurses leaving their shift and then another 30-60 minutes exchanging info with oncoming nurses. Is that common?

 

[makayla]

I understand that. However, in our house (with lots of little Richrugrats running amok) our daytime timeline can look like this-from my perspective: 4:04 WAKE UP (glance at digital clock as the youngest comes into the room, looking for a drink) 4:15 WAKE UP (as the youngest informs me he has to pee) 4:42 WAKE UP (I've lost the covers) 5:00 Husband leaves (I hear the bedroom door close) 5:31 (Husband brings me coffee in bed) 5:45 I wake up (turn on tv news and listen, with my eyes closed, hoping the youngest doesn't wake up, 'cause he's next to me) 6:07 I'm up (washing my face, brushing my teeth, calling out to the Richmiddle that it's time to get up) 6:25 I'm out of my room (going downstairs to make breakfast) etc...In my scenario, daily life, I could be "up" for HOURS before I actually "get up" and I might do other stuff before I go into my daughter's room to "get her up". (Also, in my r.l., she HAS to be out our door at 6:53 in order to be at the corner bus stop one minute later.)

Thanks Anita - good to know, because that MIGHT help explain some of Sergio's discrepancies. Since I am the type of person who wakes up early with no alarm and gets up right away, I was having a hard time fathoming Sergio knowing Becky left at 6:47 ( IF she did) when he said he didn't wake up until 7:13. I still think his stories don't add up though - JMO

 

[Azcrabcakes]

The 355th Aerospace Medicine Squadron provides primary care services for a population of over 2,500 aircrew and their families and conducts occupational health services for over 3,800 active duty and civilian personnel across the base. Team Aerospace provides vital health services to foster a fit fighting force for the 355th Fighter Wing and tenant organizations, promotes preventive medicine programs to maintain maximum Air Force readiness, monitors the environment and occupational work areas for hazards and provides CBRNE response for Homeland Defense while supporting worldwide contingency operations. Team Aerospace consists of 70 active duty and civilian personnel making up the Flight Medicine Flight, Public Health Flight, Bioenvironmental Engineering Flight, Optometry Flight and the Human Performance Flight.

Ok, this is sort of what I was searching for, there are civilian jobs on base. If I remember correctly a civilian can get on a flight out, one that has already been schuled to be leaving, sort of a red eye thing. I'm not saying this happened, I'm just posing the possibility that someone got together with someone and away they went. How this could happen, I don't know.

Also, if civilians work there, then they know the ins and outs of the security there. Not to long ago, on May 2, someone with a weapon was able to get on the base, I just read, so it can apparently be done. MOO

We are retired military, and I am NO expert on base rules. We have flown numerous times on military hops and civilians are NOT allowed on them. There may be times a contractor, such as medical staff, MAY fly on a military plane in an emergency/crisis, but not without the direct permission of the base commander.

That is what is supposed to happen. A perp COULD fly out if he is military/retired military, if there is Space A. But smuggling Isa, dead or alive, would be a problem.

Then again, rules are broken from time to time, and I would hate to shoot down any plausible theory.

But, generally speaking, even though contractors DO work on bases/posts/forts, they are not allowed on military aircraft. BTW, two years or so ago, some teens in a stolen car crashed the gate at Luke AFB here in Phoenix. They were ordered to stop, did not, and one was shot and killed, the other injured. That is what happens if you crash a base gate. A sad end for that teen who made a poor choice.

 

[Anita Richman]

This might help: LE has strategically released info and made comments to the media that were not exactly supportive of the family. After one month they still haven't cleared them.

Many feel that they are on the verge of an arrest of certain family members in this case.

These latest documents continue to make the family look bad. Perhaps that's the point.

Another line of thought is that although LE seems to be leaning on certain family members, they still haven't arrested them. Why is that? If they had enough evidence to do so, they would.

Many feel that a stranger or a person known to the family is the perp, but LE doesn't have enough leads to find that person. Sometimes creeps get lucky.

These latest documents continue to show the concerted effort that TPD has done to find the perpetrator(s) in this crime. I think they've been released because of court requests made by the press.