Billings -Couple with 12 adopted children murdered #4

[Steely Dan]

Earlier, I stated that I was puzzled, why LE did not openly state that Byrd made a loan to LPG Jr. Here is the answer, the loan is disputed by family members. Billings family is saying that there was no such loan:

http://www.pnj.com/article/20090720/NEWS01/90720018/1006/RSS01

Ok, now why would LPG Jr say that Byrd had loaned him money if he didn't? I know...everyone will say LPG Jr is a pathological liar, but even from a liar, this does not make any sense. Why would victim's killer say, "I owe the victim money" if he didn't?????

IMO, this supports Rick Outzen's (from Rick's blog) statement that this was a contract hit. LPG Jr maybe supplying LE with a possible motive (outstanding loan) in order to cover for the people above who gave him the contract. Thoughts?

That is beyond bizarre? That's a great question.

I think we all get that!
But how and why does this tie into them being killed?

TIA

I don't know. It's just another wrinkle in a very interesting case.

 

[patho]

The children with serious medical conditions would not have been eligible for life insurance. Nobody takes out life insurance on children with the intent of collecting. It's for the children to have later on for their future families. When children do tragically die, a lot of times the the small life insurance policies (50K) pay for the parents to bury them, take time off from work to grieve, and a lot times pay for grief counseling for parents and siblings.

There is a special kind of whole Life insurance for the special need. It is twice as much for half as much, and The child has to have only developmental, and,or physical special needs with out medical special needs. If a special needs has medical special needs they can only get term life insurance that only covers accidents not medical or natural deaths.

 

[RoseRed]

Buying life insurance on young kids is not unusual but cashing 3 in, is.

There was only one young child. The other two were actually adults. JMO

 

[Curious1381]

That kind of un-informed sensational post is not helping anyone.

1. Maybe they wanted the son the live up to his financial responsiblity of having a child.

2. A 50,000 dollar life insurance policy is peanuts and not at all strange for parents to take out on kids or grandkids.....

I have two adult children. When they were very young, we took out life insurance policies on each of them in the amount of $50,000. It served several purposes. They were insurable for life based on these policies, and it had a growing cash value. When they became responsible adults, we turned the ownership of the policies over to them. Just last month, my 28 yr. old son purchased his first home. Part of his down payment was from borrowing against the cash value of his policy.

I might add, that should this same son ever become so irresponsible as to do something to have his children taken away from him, I would certainly raise them, but I would fully expect him to be financially responsibility for his own children. If I had to go to court to accomplish this so be it.

I don't see any of the above as remotely suspicious, and I have many friends who did the same or similar with their children.

 

[patho]

I'm half and half in believing.

During Hurricane Katrina the media didn't seem too keen on talking about just how many illegals there were doing construction work along the gulf coast. The Red Cross and other organizations estimated there were possibly thousands needing help after the hurricane, but were too afraid to seek it due to their status.

All I have to do is walk out the front door and take stroll a couple of blocks and I'm greeted by hundreds of illegals doing construction work. And yes they are illegal, they have no ID, nothing, to cash payroll checks with and the employer uses his ID for them to cash any checks. Most are paid in cash. And all send 80% of the money across the border with money orders.

Somebody, is bringing in them by the boat loads and illegally employing them. This has been going on since the 80s at least and nothing has been done about it.

So her claims on that are true to a degree.

There is a picture of her with the guy she says is her husband that is registered as a sex offender in FL with 2 children, so the part about that is also true.

I can't find anything to back up her claims on the juvenile judge, but he doesn't seem too popular via word from the streets. The shrink she mentioned, I'm having to wait for a friend to be able to check that out locally. But in all honesty, I haven't much trust in drug pushing shrinks. Responsible ones seek alternative therapy due to the severe side effects of the drugs.

The 911 terrorist crap and Billings family I can't make a connection on.

She is bringing attention to a major problem, but in my opinion going about it the wrong way.

If he is the killer and It was a "move for Humanity" because he felt like that was the only way Americans would address this issue. What issue well if you go to his MP and read you will see. Now I do admit unless you are a Family and Juvenile activist and keep up with the groups. One would not understand to the fullest. So If you all really want to investigate. Google CPS because 48 of 50 states call it that, the other 2, I think call it DFACS but not sure. http://fightcps.blogspot.com/ http://www.fathers-4-justice.us/ http://fightcps.com/pdf/TheCorruptBusinessOfChildProtectiveServices.pdf http://waysandmeans.house.gov/hearings.asp?formmode=view&id=2296
There is a few to get you started. It does not matter if YOU believe it. They believe it. And that is why this may have been a "move for humanity" to them. I feel America will soon see it is true and that is why the Sheriff is so shut mouth because there is a national investigation on family and Juvenile court in fact it is about to be busted wide open! BUT a crazy person and his activist may have took law in their own hands. If he would have just waited a little longer and keep believing that the groups were gaining ground.

 

[RoseRed]

If he is the killer and It was a "move for Humanity" because he felt like that was the only way Americans would address this issue. What issue well if you go to his MP and read you will see. Now I do admit unless you are a Family and Juvenile activist and keep up with the groups. One would not understand to the fullest. So If you all really want to investigate. Google CPS because 48 of 50 states call it that, the other 2, I think call it DFACS but not sure. http://fightcps.blogspot.com/ http://www.fathers-4-justice.us/ http://fightcps.com/pdf/TheCorruptBusinessOfChildProtectiveServices.pdf http://waysandmeans.house.gov/hearings.asp?formmode=view&id=2296
There is a few to get you started. It does not matter if YOU believe it. They believe it. And that is why this may have been a "move for humanity" to them. I feel America will soon see it is true and that is why the Sheriff is so shut mouth because there is a national investigation on family and Juvenile court in fact it is about to be busted wide open! BUT a crazy person and his activist may have took law in their own hands. If he would have just waited a little longer and keep believing that the groups were gaining ground.

What is your theory if Sumners was the Killer since he had on his MS page " Killin Da Haters" ?

 

[tering]

nice! good info!!

Just wanted to place a factoid out there regarding MB's employment -- while looking at the Pamela Wiggins arrest report for other information, under the 'vicim' information, I noted that in 1993, there are two entries for MB where she listed her place of employment as Discount Auto Broker, 690 N Navy Blvd. She otherwise is listed as unemployed.

I wanted to find out if this auto broker was a BB owned operation, and it was not, at least as far as records show. What I did see, though, and I found this time and again when researching BBs businesses, as well as other loan and auto sales related business, was that these people will start a company at an address... then fail to file report, or voluntarily fold the biz. You then see that they physically never moved, never changed phone number, so you look up phone number. You find three other biz related to that number, some also no longer filing as active, with maybe one active, but under a new DBA name, but with same owners. In short, every one of these businesses I have looked into, without exception, meets my own definition of a 'web' of interlocking businesses, with no clear rhyme nor reason to the hop scotching. I followed this one across the state, and the business owner now runs an operation with entire family on the East Florida Coast, but the address of residence in corp filings is the same old Pcola address for Discount Auto broker at 690 N Navy. What I found interesting is that Bing and Google street view of that address show a clearly dilapidated old lot, with a building that looks ramshackle and abandoned... clearly no 'stock' of autos for sale... yet, there are four of five private cars pulled in front of it in most photos, so *something* goes on at that location....

I have a couple of reasons for writing this post:

1) Document that MB was at one time shown as involved in used auto herself, otuside hubbies overt owned biz,

2) Illustrate the transient and shifting nature of the used auto business, and how difficult it is to trace the businesses themselves, let alone transactions.

3) Provide a resource -- The link where the Pam Wiggins report is at, also has links to all the other arrest reports, so it is a handy reference for sleuths:

http://www.northescambia.com/?p=9545

 

[LifeTimeAdventure]

If he is the killer and It was a "move for Humanity" because he felt like that was the only way Americans would address this issue. What issue well if you go to his MP and read you will see. Now I do admit unless you are a Family and Juvenile activist and keep up with the groups. One would not understand to the fullest. So If you all really want to investigate. Google CPS because 48 of 50 states call it that, the other 2, I think call it DFACS but not sure. http://fightcps.blogspot.com/ http://www.fathers-4-justice.us/ http://fightcps.com/pdf/TheCorruptBusinessOfChildProtectiveServices.pdf http://waysandmeans.house.gov/hearings.asp?formmode=view&id=2296
There is a few to get you started. It does not matter if YOU believe it. They believe it. And that is why this may have been a "move for humanity" to them. I feel America will soon see it is true and that is why the Sheriff is so shut mouth because there is a national investigation on family and Juvenile court in fact it is about to be busted wide open! BUT a crazy person and his activist may have took law in their own hands. If he would have just waited a little longer and keep believing that the groups were gaining ground.

Are You The Lady In The You-Tube Video? Your English Is Broken Like Hers...

 

[JustPokingAround]

Are You The Lady In The You-Tube Video? Your English Is Broken Like Hers...

Seriously! She is freaking me out, sounds just like the youtube girl!

 

[dood]

Underdog you are correct for State adoptions. However, only two of the kids were State kids. Private adoptions do NOT qualify for funds. The children would be eligible for SSI based on the families income.Therefore if the Billings were as well off as we all asume, they do not qualify. It is needs based. Th If they were to lose their SSI they would also lose their Medicaid. As I stated before, these kids are uninsurable. I know this for fact, I have adopted seven, and also worked for State for ten years as well as assisted on a National level w/special needs adoptions. He may have tried to do this to separate the kids on a financial basis from his income to protect their health benefits. IMO.

Actually a disability automatically qualifies....a perfectly healthy child may not qualify in the same situation maybe, but a proven medical/developmental disability automatically qualifies.

 

[NSC]

Seriously! She is freaking me out, sounds just like the youtube girl!

Cmon now yall' too early in the morning to start....

We can't make any accusations against others identities. And picking a needle in the USA of people who have broken English or any english at all. :blowkiss:

 

[JustPokingAround]

Cmon now yall' too early in the morning to start....

We can't make any accusations against others identities. And picking a needle in the USA of people who have broken English or any english at all. :blowkiss:

Sorry )

 

[daisy7]

Rick has some new posts about the case.

http://ricksblog.biz/

 

[dood]

Just a quick note here FLorida does have a CPS its Child Protective Services (NOT California Protective Services) and it is a department of Children and Families...


So yea Florida calls it CPS as well


EDIT: http://www.dexknows.com/business_profiles/state_of_florida_child_protective_services-l800610512

 

[patho]

When the article talks about child trafficking, what does that mean? When I think of that term I think of it in terms of the sex trade. I just do not see the Billings involved in this. Does the child trafficing term mean something else?

The UNODC, United Nations Office on Drugs and Crime, define human trafficking according to Article 3, paragraph (a) [1] of the Protocol to Prevent, Suppress and punish Trafficking in Persons in Persons as the recruitment, transportation, transfer, harboring or receipt of persons, by means of the threat or use of force or other forms of coercion, of abduction, of fraud, of deception, of the abuse of power or of a position of vulnerability or of the giving or receiving of payments or benefits to achieve the consent of a person having control over another person, for the purpose of exploitation.

*

child labor
*

force labor
*

sex slavery
*

institutional fraud
Child labor, refers to the employment of children at regular and sustained labor. This practice is considered exploitative by many international organizations and is illegal in many countries. Child labor was utilized to varying extents through most of history, but entered public dispute with the beginning of universal schooling with changes in working conditions during industrialization, and with the emergence of the concepts of workers' and children's rights In many developed countries, it is considered inappropriate or exploitative if a child below a certain age works, excluding household chores or schoolwork. An employer is usually not allowed to hire a child below a certain age. This minimum age depends on the country; child labor laws in the United States set the minimum age to work in an establishment without parents' consent and restrictions at age 16.

Forced labor, refers to work which one is compelled to perform against one's will, especially in conditions of involuntary servitude as a prisoner or slave.

Sexual slavery refers to the organized coercion of unwilling people into different sexual practices. Sexual slavery may include single-owner sexual slavery, ritual slavery sometimes associated with traditional religious practices, slavery for primarily non-sexual purposes where sex is common, or forced prostitution.

Istitutional fraud, refers to the organized abuse of power and, or color of law to have a person institutionalized or place in the custody of person for financial gain.

 

[dood]

The UNODC, United Nations Office on Drugs and Crime, define human trafficking according to Article 3, paragraph (a) [1] of the Protocol to Prevent, Suppress and punish Trafficking in Persons in Persons as the recruitment, transportation, transfer, harboring or receipt of persons, by means of the threat or use of force or other forms of coercion, of abduction, of fraud, of deception, of the abuse of power or of a position of vulnerability or of the giving or receiving of payments or benefits to achieve the consent of a person having control over another person, for the purpose of exploitation.

*

child labor
*

force labor
*

sex slavery
*

institutional fraud
Child labor, refers to the employment of children at regular and sustained labor. This practice is considered exploitative by many international organizations and is illegal in many countries. Child labor was utilized to varying extents through most of history, but entered public dispute with the beginning of universal schooling with changes in working conditions during industrialization, and with the emergence of the concepts of workers' and children's rights In many developed countries, it is considered inappropriate or exploitative if a child below a certain age works, excluding household chores or schoolwork. An employer is usually not allowed to hire a child below a certain age. This minimum age depends on the country; child labor laws in the United States set the minimum age to work in an establishment without parents' consent and restrictions at age 16.

Forced labor, refers to work which one is compelled to perform against one's will, especially in conditions of involuntary servitude as a prisoner or slave.

Sexual slavery refers to the organized coercion of unwilling people into different sexual practices. Sexual slavery may include single-owner sexual slavery, ritual slavery sometimes associated with traditional religious practices, slavery for primarily non-sexual purposes where sex is common, or forced prostitution.

Institutional fraud, refers to the organized abuse of power and, or color of law to have a person institutionalized or place in the custody of person for financial gain.

Bolded by me.

And another note that is bugging me. Sovereign Citizens are NOT A TERRORIST GROUP. Sovereign Citizens is a MOVEMENT. There is not really a central organization of these people, it is a group of people that prescribe to the philosophy of the movement. The Color Of Law abuses is what started the term "Paper Terrorist" it is a descriptive term of people that abuse Color Of Law.

these most often include groups that ARE terrorist in nature, such as some militias. (Tim McViegh is the most cited as a Sovereign Citizen, but its failed to mention that he was alos a member of a Militia with violent ties.)

A person can LEGAL ascribe to the Sovereign Citizen, but that does not mean that they are a terrorist.

Color Of Law basically refers to interpreting the law word for word and drawing on the inconsistencies in today's laws. Especially around Financial laws.

Color of is a legal term meaning "pretense or appearance of" some right; in other words, 'color of', as in 'color of law', means the thing colors (or adjusts) the law; however the adjustment made may either be lawful or it may merely appear to be lawful.

---wikipedia

I think the government has a nasty way of labeling anything that is counter government as terrorists.

The documents BB filed would place him in the sovereign citizen mindset, and the flurry of illegal demands for millions of dollars from DCF, could be seen as a paper terrorism tactic, but that does not mean that he was part of a terrorist organization.

 

[catfishb]

Bolded by me.

And another note that is bugging me. Sovereign Citizens are NOT A TERRORIST GROUP. Sovereign Citizens is a MOVEMENT. There is not really a central organization of these people, it is a group of people that prescribe to the philosophy of the movement. The Color Of Law abuses is what started the term "Paper Terrorist" it is a descriptive term of people that abuse Color Of Law.

these most often include groups that ARE terrorist in nature, such as some militias. (Tim McViegh is the most cited as a Sovereign Citizen, but its failed to mention that he was alos a member of a Militia with violent ties.)

A person can LEGAL ascribe to the Sovereign Citizen, but that does not mean that they are a terrorist.

Color Of Law basically refers to interpreting the law word for word and drawing on the inconsistencies in today's laws. Especially around Financial laws.

---wikipedia

I think the government has a nasty way of labeling anything that is counter government as terrorists.

The documents BB filed would place him in the sovereign citizen mindset, and the flurry of illegal demands for millions of dollars from DCF, could be seen as a paper terrorism tactic, but that does not mean that he was part of a terrorist organization.

Anything that is counter government is terrorists. They want to over throw by not paying taxes.

 

[dood]

Anything that is counter government is terrorists. They want to over throw by not paying taxes.

simply not true, why do you think that we have a constitutional right to protest?

Does that mean that all protesters against the government are terrorists?

I think we all pretty much know that not paying your taxes is NOT GOING to over throw the government. Labeling Tax Protesters as terrorists is just a propaganda technique by the government.

Terrorism is defined as:

S: (n) terrorism, act of terrorism, terrorist act (the calculated use of violence (or the threat of violence) against civilians in order to attain goals that are political or religious or ideological in nature; this is done through intimidation or coercion or instilling fear)

source:http://wordnetweb.princeton.edu/perl/webwn?s=terrorism

Protesting Taxes hardly fits that description. There are such things as peaceful protesting.

 

[UnderDog]

I want to thank everyone that is looking at ALL angles in a respectful manner. From my perspective, the Sovereignty issue reveals a side of the Billings that is clearly "out of the mainstream" and in conflict with the "Angels" image initially portrayed in the media. The illegal adoption, subsequent divorce and petition for child support with his second wife and the adversarial relationship with the older son, MB (also involving child support), both show that BB was quite capable of creating "tension" to push his position. I believe these events and circumstances, which are facts, are quite relevant. As Sheriff Morgan said "It is what it is".

 

[catfishb]

Its a patteren of behavior. I know you don't want to hear it, but BB was dealing with scumbags all the time. If your from pensacola, you know his businesses were in the low rent side of town. When you deal with doo-doo, you eventually get some on you.