Bosma Murder Trial - Weekend Discussion #14

[Typhoo1961]

.

Black trucks on the Super Sucker video (early sightings 9:00-9:15)

Just the other day a member posted they live in the rural Ancaster area and there are another two black trucks like Tims and they use Trinity Road. Could explain those early sightings on the video

Last Monday, I had the unfortunate experience of ending up in St. Joe's emergency room. I got to talking with one of the paramedics in there during the course of the evening and he told me he lived not far from the Bosmas on Trinity road, was also trying to sell his truck at that time and it was black, the same size as Tim's but ran on gas instead of deisel.

 

[Typhoo1961]

Nothing was mentioned in the media (unless not important) So I assume Pedo was with AM at DM'S house. CN and MB went and picked him up from AM.

IF Pedo was with DM when arrested, then AM picked him up (again CN and MB pick him up from AM) That would explain how everyone knew about his arrest so quickly.

It also explains why the SPCA wasn't involved.

 

[Typhoo1961]

No he couldn't! Because MS's story is twisted with lies to make him look innocent of the murder and the destruction of a body.

MOO

I meant MS could have turned into the Bosmas right after DM shot him and gotten them to contact the police.

 

[brightii]

Every witness has the incentive to put themselves in a positive light. That's pretty much a given. AM said on the stand he initially lied to police to protect himself. In contrast, MH kept insisting he lied because he didn't think DM could be involved and because he was worried about his family. AM did not hide his face when he left court. MH did.


TD's theory that AM lied about Mark wanting the toolbox to protect DM doesn't really hold up given that AM's testimony was very damning to DM including the comment that DM stole for "the thrill."


Also, DM's own letters indicated Andrew was telling the truth.


The big question for the jury re AM will be if Mark told him to bring the toolbox or if AM deliberately dumped it on unknowing Mark to help DM.


Certainly it's in MS's interest to say it was dumped on him. But I don't see that it's in AM's interest to say MS asked for it. Such a statement doesn't help AM in any way, and while it may help DM, the rest of AM's testimony didn't.

From DM's letters to CN he seems to indicate excitement that AM may have decided to help DM after all, IMO. See page 89 at the link. http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/hamilton/news/bosma-trial-noudga-testimony-1.3561968#letters


"Kodiak and Snogg both went back for more interviews. Idiots! I haven't had a chance to watch the entire videos. My interviews aren't that long. I did skip through quickly though, and it looks like Kodiak is changing his statement. It's a whole lotta, 'I can't remembers', and "I really don't know' s. This is great news! It shows he is willing to help. If the entire video is like that, it will fit together even better than before, with what I need him to say. If you see that bear over the holidays, tell him that I love him."

I believe CN did succeed in getting messages to AM. I also believe that AM heard DM speak not only about a planned truck theft which AM finally admitted, but possibly of a planned murder because AM's response of F-off seemed way out if proportion to me and some others here as well.

When DM asked AM who he should steal the truck from - the a-hole or the nice guy - why was AM so alarmed when in the past regarding DM's planned theft missions AM was not alarmed? Also DM had mentioned to AM in texts that missions were going to become more dangerous and AM did not say in response F-off, AM replied that he was in. I am not convinced that AM didn't know more, but I can see why he would only tell what he had to tell to police, to help himself, and to whatever degree he could, to help DM. Had AM also mentioned that DM talked about a planned murder, he would have proven the pre-meditation aspect of the case, IMO, and he did not. That could be because the conversation didn't happen as I think it did, but IF it did happen the way I think it did, AM was protecting DM as much as he could without getting himself into more trouble, IMO.

All MOO.

 

[Claroon]

I meant MS could have turned into the Bosmas right after DM shot him and gotten them to contact the police.

What do you mean by "turned into the Bosma's?" If DM in fact shot TB at Bobcat, that was very far away by then.

 

[musicaljoke]

He needed the one at the farm to uplift his victim to the eliminator, I think (IF it is a bobcat= wheel loader/telescopic forklift). MS left out that part but maybe, it happened indeed. Planned then at least by DM (we can't say by MS also). If the wheel loader had white telescopic arms then I can imagine the intended purpose for the x white spray paint cans, perhaps.
I don't remember DM asking AM for keys. But I remember vague DM asking SS whether the bobcat would be functional.

On April 27th, Millard texts Schlatman: "check that ether in front end loader is in good supply."

Ether is used to start a diesel engine, especially one that hasn't been started in a while. Was DM was preparing to use the bobcat, or the excavator?

Then on May 3rd, DM asked Schlatman if the junk forklift mast/forks are working.

The same day, Smich texts DM to "come scope something out", and "there's a bunch. Missions and more". Late that evening Millard computer accesses the Bosma truck ad on Kijiji, which, looks to me, the first time they find the ad. Was it Smich who told DM about the truck ad, knowing that DM was preparing the details of the mission?



https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1Hb6kEtpLa8cHCVorBuy4yqfHymGvhfHeM6s8QMWGVW8/pubhtml

 

[Inspector_North]

I meant MS could have turned into the Bosmas right after DM shot him and gotten them to contact the police.

He could have if you believe MS's fiction.

MOO

 

[Typhoo1961]

What do you mean by "turned into the Bosma's?" If DM in fact shot TB at Bobcat, that was very far away by then.

Yes it was far away but if MS had remembered how they got to Bobcat then he could have backtracked once he got back into the Yukon and made his way back to the Bosmas to tell Sharlene what had just happened. If he hit the accelarator he could have been there within 20 minutes and I can't see DM chasing him with a body in the RAM.
Brantford isn't too far from Ancaster...about a half hour drive IIRC.

 

[Typhoo1961]

He could have if you believe MS's fiction.

MOO

I'm not talking about MS's testimony here. I'm talking about the night the murder happened. What I am saying IS if MS really wanted to save his neck this is what he COULD HAVE done on the night of the murder. Jeeze.

 

[flipflop]

the mission failure gang

"It was a plan for quite some time," he says. "Well over a year."

Dungey asks what his role was. "Keep 6," he says. He'd watch Millard's back while he actually popped the hood.

Smich says taking trucks for a test drive was "more of a recent plan by Dell. All the other ones, nothing ended up happening." >So he's admitting they needed keys to be successful. they were essentially useless at stealing a truck with no keys right? no success there... even after been given lessons from SS right? so stealing a truck with the keys and the unfortunate owner in it while test riding was the best plan for them right? now what will happen to the unfortunate owner... take his phone and let him out somewhere 20 miles away to walk home and a promise to be quiet I'm guessing? moo

why did he implicate himself and accompany DM on test drive trips when DM wants to find a suitable truck for himself? What was his purpose/role there...? keep 6? hmmm moo

why did he accompany DM and be seen by everyone at Bosma's home? He could have stayed in the Yukon hidden. DM could figure out whether the truck suits him or not on his own? keep 6? moo

Was he carrying his own weapon, like DM, as a backup? keep 6? moo

at bosma's home in the driveway, MS was keeping 6 for DM right? when dm and ms were greeted by the bosma's and tenant, their plan was in play, already scoped, want this truck!!

This has been a burning question for me as well. If MS knew the plan was to kill TB, why would both go to TB's house?

 

[Typhoo1961]

This has been a burning question for me as well. If MS knew the plan was to kill TB, why would both go to TB's house?

MS could have stayed with the Yukon.

 

[ArianeEmory]

This has been a burning question for me as well. If MS knew the plan was to kill TB, why would both go to TB's house?

Yep, this one bugs me. It seems like it would have been smarter to have him lie in wait ...

UNLESS they thought they was some chance TB would be alone at his home and had planned to kill him there. But since DM had already described him as the "nice guy", it seems that he must have had some impression of Tim as a family man.

(Which leads to an unrelated question: how DID DM form his description of TB as "the nice guy"? Just his general demeanor on the phone?)

Edit: oh I forgot--it could also be that they thought it would look more suspicious to just have one guy walking up the driveway with no car than two.

Jeez, on that note, why hide the Yukon at all? Why not just say "my friend here will follow us to Tim Horton's and pick me up there"?

 

[hellkat2]

I do wonder how the scoping mission with TB's truck was supposed to happen if it was just a scoping mission?

1) They park next door and walk to TB's
2) They go on a test drive and return to TB's
3) They say something about still looking at others like they told IV and walk back to the Yukon?

I would assume TB would have been questioning why their "imaginary friend" didn't pick them up. The only reason DM would need MS on the test drive is if they planned on taking it at that time. In fact both not being on the test drive would be more realistic compared to bringing along a shady character wearing a hoodie.

For IV, being in an urban business area, the walk up/walk away test drive was not that unbelievable compared to doing it in a rural area.

MOO

It may have been that they did not want to take the chance that TB or his wife would take down their license plate number. So they did not want to drive up in the truck.

 

[hellkat2]

I want to know if others were asked to be part of this mission as lookouts?

I wonder if there were some walkie talkies involved as they have been on other missions.

 

[Inspector_North]

It may have been that they did not want to take the chance that TB or his wife would take down their license plate number. So they did not want to drive up in the truck.

I get that, but how were they going to exit if it was just a scoping trip? Just walk away?

 

[slowsleuthy]

This has been a burning question for me as well. If MS knew the plan was to kill TB, why would both go to TB's house?

because he wanted to be part of it all, he was likely packing his own weapon, to keep 6 too. moo

 

[hellkat2]

Ravin Pillay is a guy.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/hamilton/news/tim-bosma-trial-who-is-who-1.3425638

Thanks. Ravin Pillay. Let's hope he asks the right questions.

 

[ArianeEmory]

because he wanted to be part of it all, he was likely packing his own weapon, to keep 6 too. moo

I don't know what "keep 6" means, but are you saying he wanted to be in on the part where they met Tim's wife, etc? Because by their accounts he was pretty damned nervous when he was there.

 

[mimimic]

From DM's letters to CN he seems to indicate excitement that AM may have decided to help DM after all, IMO. See page 89 at the link. http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/hamilton/news/bosma-trial-noudga-testimony-1.3561968#letters


"Kodiak and Snogg both went back for more interviews. Idiots! I haven't had a chance to watch the entire videos. My interviews aren't that long. I did skip through quickly though, and it looks like Kodiak is changing his statement. It's a whole lotta, 'I can't remembers', and "I really don't know' s. This is great news! It shows he is willing to help. If the entire video is like that, it will fit together even better than before, with what I need him to say. If you see that bear over the holidays, tell him that I love him."

I believe CN did succeed in getting messages to AM. I also believe that AM heard DM speak not only about a planned truck theft which AM finally admitted, but possibly of a planned murder because AM's response of F-off seemed way out if proportion to me and some others here as well.

When DM asked AM who he should steal the truck from - the a-hole or the nice guy - why was AM so alarmed when in the past regarding DM's planned theft missions AM was not alarmed? Also DM had mentioned to AM in texts that missions were going to become more dangerous and AM did not say in response F-off, AM replied that he was in. I am not convinced that AM didn't know more, but I can see why he would only tell what he had to tell to police, to help himself, and to whatever degree he could, to help DM. Had AM also mentioned that DM talked about a planned murder, he would have proven the pre-meditation aspect of the case, IMO, and he did not. That could be because the conversation didn't happen as I think it did, but IF it did happen the way I think it did, AM was protecting DM as much as he could without getting himself into more trouble, IMO.

All MOO.

I think this is bang on!
Also palisadesk's comment on what would they actually have said to Tim after "scoping" out the truck after a test drive...about where their "friend from Timmie's" was and their ride to pick them up...?

 

[slowsleuthy]

I don't know what "keep 6" means, but are you saying he wanted to be in on the part where they met Tim's wife, etc? Because by their accounts he was pretty damned nervous when he was there.

if i say to my buddy that i got your 6, i really mean that i'm watching your back, make sense now? its gang slang really.