Boulder Grand Jury Voted To Indict-Boulder Dailey Camera

[KoldKase]

Yes, you're correct!!! And it's very good post by KoldKase on FFJ in regards of above stated money and phone records. We need KoldKase permission to copy her post in WS.

KoldKase, would you please post your excellent post here!!!! Such a valuable information in it!!!

Is this the one you mean?

[FYI: Much of this is documented in Tom Miller's trial transcript, under oath. Miller made that available for purchase on cd; I extensively went through most of it to discuss on an FFJ thread some years ago. Other facts are documented in news articles, books, etc.]

Originally Posted by OpenMind4U


He said Craig Lewis was heads above the other tabloids, because he moved to Boulder, he had private investigators in Denver, had fist fulls of cash from The Globe, could get PRIVATE PHONE RECORDS, so so much for any conspiracy theory about any phone records, because Craig Lewis knows if that is true or not that they exist or not.

Just an FYI: Craig Lewis did have lots of money, and plenty of lawyers, too. That's how he got to "donate" $100K to Micheal Tracey's journalism school to get the charges dropped against him...and yes, that's called BUYING "justice" in America.

Miller in fact went to trial for what Craig actually did. which is why Miller was acquitted by the jury. It cost Miller that same $100K to defend himself, though, so that's how Team Ramsey burned Miller, A HANDWRITING ANALYSIS EXPERT, for doing an analysis on the ransom note in which he concluded PATSY WROTE THE NOTE.

About those phone records: the man who was convicted of illegally obtaining the Ramseys' phone records, Rapp, in fact did so to sell them through a third party in California to an "unnamed" tabloid. Think about it.

These are the phone records walked past Steve Thomas and other BPD detectives in Boulder to the evidence room, for the prosecution of Rapp, when they were told they'd NEVER see them.

Amazing, how those who went against Team Ramsey would find themselves being prosecuted and thrown into jail, or even sued, isn't it?

Hunter had no problem nailing that "criminal" Rapp down, did he?

And where are those case files, containing the Ramsey phone records, today? Probably burned long ago...but someone should finally get that subpoena and look, if the grand jury didn't.

Here's the thing: I may be altogether wrong about the phone records proving anything...but how on earth can it look any other way, when the PROSECUTING DA OBSTRUCTED DETECTIVES FROM GETTING THEM?

It's criminal investigation 101. Only a FOOL would be stupid enough to block that subpoena in a CHILD MOLESTATION, ABUSE, AND MURDER case.

Unless that FOOL was covering something up....


That's all I'm saying.

As for what Craig Lewis knows: we don't know that he ever GOT those phone records, since Rapp got caught and went to jail for obtaining them. Even if Craig did, he could never say without setting himself up for another legal bath, which could include jail time, as Rapp proved.

Just my opinion, of course.

Agree or disagree, it's all the same to me. But for anyone interested in the Tom Miller trial thread at FFJ I mentioned above, I looked it up for you. Since I went through the transcripts summarizing as I read--and yes, my biased observations are included--it's excruciatingly long and detailed. You can skim, as well, for particular areas of interest. By the end of my recounting the closing arguments, turned out Karr was being paraded around in Thailand for the world to gawk at, so I finished in a jarringly abrupt fashion, leaving a few loose ends dangling, like the issue of Fleet White being arrested for not appearing under subpoena and Thomas not being served his subpoena papers, etc.. But we know in hindsight how those turned out, as well.

http://www.forumsforjustice.org/forums/showthread.php?t=7035&highlight="Miller+trial"

 

[SunnieRN]

Guys and Girls,

Highly recommend to read this thread on FFJ. Our talented Cynic has opened the 'iron curtain'!!!!!! Thank you Cynic!

We can now request the Ramsey Grand Jury files! - Forums For Justice

Thank you for this gem!!! Looking forward to tomorrow night! Cynic, once again you have dazzled me!

Dodie, according to the law (see Cynic's post), LHP can TALK and write her book now!!! Based on my understanding, we have couple issues here:

- we need to find out if FRAUD has been commited during the Circuit Court procedure in August 2003 (4 years after GJ indictment!) by ML when she stated on the record that ' "No indictment or grand jury report concerning that murder has been issued.";

- according to the LAW of constitutionality of a Colorado statute governing the secrecy of grand jury investigations, 'Colorado requires a grand jury witness to take an oath not to disclose her testimony, except to discuss it with her attorney or with the prosecutor, until and unless an indictment or report is issued.. Means, indictment has been made therefore LHP was/is free to talk and write the book since 1999!!!!;

- if above two statements are correct than:
a) LHP can sue ML for false pretent and time lost for publishing her book;
b) other GJ witnesses can talk without penalty of anykind.

- still not clear if PUBLIC can request GJ transcript. Indicted party (JR) could request for GJ transcript which is not good news...but we need to find out through legal channels which GJ documents can be available to public. For example, LS Power Point presentation to GJ should be available to public. We need to find out what else can we see/read.

...like I said before, hope 'GJ leak' becomes the snowball...lease:
jmo

I am looking forward to this being explored more thoroughly. The thread At FFJ is a wealth of information and can give us some hope that a snowball effect might occur!! I hope this will be addressed by Kolar tomorrow night.

Again, looking forward to the show!

 

[ILikeToBendPages]

Whew what a week huh? I have so. So many emotions running through my head and heart. So much to say. I feel this great sense of relief.....,but it's short-lived when I think of JonBenet and the last eighteen months of her life.

A little girl that should of been just that, a little girl, and I think of a vain woman that I've learned so much about her family and life.

When I read Steve Thomas's book and his conversations with Jeff Shapiro , and I think of Alex Hunters favorite saying. So maybe in this passage of time it's comes true for not only John and Pasty, but more so for him......it's his time.

 

[redheadedgal]

... the evidence against (josh powell) being considerably compelling to a degree not demonstrated by anything presented in the Ramsey case.

not according to the Salt Lake County DA (and police chief -- see article for his remarks):

"It never did get to a point we felt like we could file charges," she said. "The difficulty comes where you are trying a case without a body. You have to have either a substantial period of time where the person is missing where you can assume she's dead and prove behind a reasonable doubt she's dead to a jury, or some pretty overwhelming evidence as to the fact that she's dead and the person did it.

"They're very, very hard cases to prove."

http://www.ksl.com/?nid=148&sid=198...idence-to-arrest-josh-powell&s_cid=featured-1

 

[DeeDee249]

The GJ believed JR and/or PR killed JB, in conjunction with the sexual abuse. This puts an end to BDI theories. (As if they weren't already silly enough to dismiss)


.

No it doesn't. It could also be construed that the child abuse and endangerment the GJ mentioned was the parents' failure to keep her safe from her brother.
I know of cases where a child had been killed by another child in the family- even a very young child. The parents were held responsible because they failed to prevent it. There was one horrible case here a few years ago where a toddler was in a playpen and some older kids piled toys on top of him. He suffocated to death- not because he didn't have enough air to breathe, but because the weight of the toys prevented him from physically breathing- his chest was compressed. The day care worker (one of the other kids parent) was held responsible for the death (it was negligent homicide) because she failed to stop the activity that led to the death.

 

[ILikeToBendPages]

No it doesn't. It could also be construed that the child abuse and endangerment the GJ mentioned was the parents' failure to keep her safe from her brother.
I know of cases where a child had been killed by another child in the family- even a very young child. The parents were held responsible because they failed to prevent it. There was one horrible case here a few years ago where a toddler was in a playpen and some older kids piled toys on top of him. He suffocated to death- not because he didn't have enough air to breathe, but because the weight of the toys prevented him from physically breathing- his chest was compressed. The day care worker (one of the other kids parent) was held responsible for the death (it was negligent homicide) because she failed to stop the activity that led to the death.

I wonder what is hiding in the "island of privacy"? Would John/Pasty be held accountable for abuse if there was no prior conflict between Burke and JonBenet?
If BR did the head bash then would it be neglect for not seeking help and then murder? No way to prove who was the molester,so how would that be handed?

 

[Darlene733510]

I believe that if the JBR case is re-opened, and the evidence that has been sealed is brought forward, there may be justice for this murdered child. The fact that the GJ voted to convict, and AH did not do it, and did not follow the proper procedure really is unconscionable. The ML fiasco was disgusting parading Karr around and the expense of that fiasco was shameful. ML and AH are a disgrace to their profession.
Once this case is opened is the only way there will ever be justice for a child who had no chance for survival when she was murdered by a vicious attack by an enraged person.
RIP JB - we will seek justice for you.

 

[Tricia]

Please stop the name calling and the insults or I will start timing people out.

When we get accused of only allowing one side to tell their story I want to be able to prove those naysayers wrong.

I can't do that if you all can't behave

If you respond to an insult with an insult you too will be given a vacation.

 

[SunnieRN]

The radio show tonight was great!! Thank you Chief Kolar, Tricia, Bob C., Cynic, Cherokee, KoldKase (love the accent), Wengr, Kimster and I love to Bend Pages.

One question I really wanted to ask was of Chief Kolar. If he were to publish his book today, would he have made any changes based upon the revelations of the GJ disclosures?

Loved the DNA evidence, as it is withheld as the cornerstone of ML's acquital, when it is really nothing

Hope Chief Kolar get back in touch with Tricia after he looks into the case of LHO's book being blocked due to a lie!

Thanks again for all the hard work!!.

 

[midwest mama]

The radio show tonight was great!! Thank you Chief Kolar, Tricia, Bob C., Cynic, Cherokee, KoldKase (love the accent), Wengr, Kimster and I love to Bend Pages.

One question I really wanted to ask was of Chief Kolar. If he were to publish his book today, would he have made any changes based upon the revelations of the GJ disclosures?

Loved the DNA evidence, as it is withheld as the cornerstone of ML's acquital, when it is really nothing

Hope Chief Kolar get back in touch with Tricia after he looks into the case of LHO's book being blocked due to a lie!

Thanks again for all the hard work!!.

It was a great show!! It was made clear that ML lied with her statement about "no indictment from the GJ" during the case tried in the Appeals court which ended up keeping LHP from publishing her book.

So, can ML be charged with purgery? Wouldn't you think that LHP is preparing a civil suit against her for loss of income over the years her book might have been on the market?

 

[OpenMind4U]

It was a great show!! It was made clear that ML lied with her statement about "no indictment from the GJ" during the case tried in the Appeals court which ended up keeping LHP from publishing her book.

So, can ML be charged with purgery? Wouldn't you think that LHP is preparing a civil suit against her for loss of income over the years her book might have been on the market?

I hope so!!! The good news is that LHP can publish her book now!:great:

 

[wengr]

I hope so!!! The good news is that LHP can publish her book now!:great:

I hope so as well. I hope it's 100% prepared and ready to go.

 

[UKGuy]

I hope so as well. I hope it's 100% prepared and ready to go.

wengr,
Nice, it will sell more copies than FF. LHP probably knews more than anyone else about the Ramsey's.


.

 

[madeleine]

Don't get me wrong but I am glad there wasn't a trial ....the Ramsey team would have kicked AH's butt bigtime IMO and it would have been the end of the game (if a NG verdict) .he would have lost I am sure....because the investigation was a joke,the crime scene wasn't properly secured,important evidence wasn't collected ,the police interviews were a joke (Kane was close but it was too late IMO),the DA office was afraid and intimidated.

there are much better chances for a G verdict in the future IF something new is discovered or someone spills the beans!

who knows,it happened in other cases.... a new DA who happens to be obsessed with this case or maybe just wants justice or likes challenges!

moo

 

[SunnieRN]

wengr,
Nice, it will sell more copies than FF. LHP probably knews more than anyone else about the Ramsey's.


.

The 2 together would be a great 1-2 punch. I just got FF late yesterday and am finding it very helpful for facts I didn't know, as well as some I had forgotten. Easy to read, lots of information and autographed besides! :great:

 

[UKGuy]

The 2 together would be a great 1-2 punch. I just got FF late yesterday and am finding it very helpful for facts I didn't know, as well as some I had forgotten. Easy to read, lots of information and autographed besides! :great:

SunnieRN,
Good to hear. I reckon I'll get round to purchasing it. Kolar's BDI perspective needs some reading.


.

 

[SunnieRN]

SunnieRN,
Good to hear. I reckon I'll get round to purchasing it. Kolar's BDI perspective needs some reading.


.

I'm only on page 98, but on page 65 this jumped out at me:

snip

Dr. Werner Spitz,forensic medical examiner for Wayne County, Michigan had conducted extensive studies of the wounds caused by force and was considered a leading expert on the topic.

He offered an opinion on the sequencing of injuries that had been inflicted upon JonBenet during her murder:

1) The first injury sustained by JonBenet was believed to have been the constriction marks on the side and front of her throat. He believed that her assailant had grabbed her shirt from the front and twisted the collar in their fist. The cloth from the edge of the collar had created the discolored, striated bruising and abrasions on the sides of her neck, and the knuckles of the perpetrator had caused the triangular shaped bruise on the front of her throat.

It goes on to step 2, the scratches on the neck. 3, the head blow, 4, unconsciousness, 5, insertion of the paintbrush, 6, the garrote. All in detail of course.


What I found interesting is that I have always believed that JonBenet was strangled twice. Once with a soft object, which can make the triangulated bruise on it own, then secondly with the garrote, which as we know is what actually killed JonBenet.

Interesting stuff and as I stated, I am only on page 98.

I think this theory also leads credence toward the injuries being inflicted by BR. I know there were times I grabbed my brothers shirt collar to restrain him. I didn't twist it, but it was a defensive move at times!! I would grab the back of his shirt, pull him down and run!!

 

[UKGuy]

I'm only on page 98, but on page 65 this jumped out at me:

snip

Dr. Werner Spitz,forensic medical examiner for Wayne County, Michigan had conducted extensive studies of the wounds caused by force and was considered a leading expert on the topic.

He offered an opinion on the sequencing of injuries that had been inflicted upon JonBenet during her murder:

1) The first injury sustained by JonBenet was believed to have been the constriction marks on the side and front of her throat. He believed that her assailant had grabbed her shirt from the front and twisted the collar in their fist. The cloth from the edge of the collar had created the discolored, striated bruising and abrasions on the sides of her neck, and the knuckles of the perpetrator had caused the triangular shaped bruise on the front of her throat.

It goes on to step 2, the scratches on the neck. 3, the head blow, 4, unconsciousness, 5, insertion of the paintbrush, 6, the garrote. All in detail of course.


What I found interesting is that I have always believed that JonBenet was strangled twice. Once with a soft object, which can make the triangulated bruise on it own, then secondly with the garrote, which as we know is what actually killed JonBenet.

Interesting stuff and as I stated, I am only on page 98.

I think this theory also leads credence toward the injuries being inflicted by BR. I know there were times I grabbed my brothers shirt collar to restrain him. I didn't twist it, but it was a defensive move at times!! I would grab the back of his shirt, pull him down and run!!

SunnieRN,
Thanks for the excerpt. Yes I tend to go along with that account. I've always thought JonBenet had far too many markings on her neck, than could be attributed to the ligature. Which I think is alike the longjohns and size-12's, i.e. to mask any prior neck injuries, otherwise why bother? Same with her internal injury, why not leave JonBenet naked from the waist down, presenting her injury?


.

 

[SunnieRN]

SunnieRN,
Thanks for the excerpt. Yes I tend to go along with that account. I've always thought JonBenet had far too many markings on her neck, than could be attributed to the ligature. Which I think is alike the longjohns and size-12's, i.e. to mask any prior neck injuries, otherwise why bother? Same with her internal injury, why not leave JonBenet naked from the waist down, presenting her injury?


.

The entire scene was propagated to misdirect and mislead BPD, media and naysayers. Never mind that there has never been another case like it prior to or after JonBenets death.

The sad thing is, they may have gotten away scott free unless something changes with the latest revelations.

 

[UKGuy]

The entire scene was propagated to misdirect and mislead BPD, media and naysayers. Never mind that there has never been another case like it prior to or after JonBenets death.

The sad thing is, they may have gotten away scott free unless something changes with the latest revelations.

SunnieRN,
ITA. A classic staged crime-scene with an alleged participant discovering the body, this is what the theory suggest should happen.

If its not BDI then JR could still be charged, there could be a new GJ hearing?


.