Brendan Dassey's Habeas Corpus Petition Granted

[dexter75]

Hi Dexter75,
I have sent you a PM to apologise for taking too long to respond to your earlier message.

I'm going to use your post, and then add my comments in Bold if that is ok.

No apologies required. You know? It is really important that people are discussing things like this, as alluded to above. Everything is not Black & White and if I handed one Mantra down to my kids that they remember? It would be: CHALLENGE EVERYTHING!

I apologise for the use of capitals there, but it is an important point. People are challenging the convictions of Avery & Dassey, and they are correct to do so. However, despite the challenge, I think the correct outcome was borne out.

Missy, oh Missy, lol..weren't one of those Good Ole boys due to be deposed in court right around the time this happened? MS brain fog and I don't feel like digging/looking back, lol!

You're awesome Hoosen_Fenger
Thank you!

I love to be able to discuss things rationally🤗 Then again, I am the " go to girl" the " peace maker " of my circle of friends and my family❤

I know right! Some of you are thinking, no way!

Anyway, I like Zellner and think she has evidence🙄

Time will tell, my new favorite UK friend❤
Time will tell😉
And I've said before, more than once, if I am wrong, I can admit I am wrong.

I HAVE been wrong a time or fifty, in this life and probably others😊

This case though, too much wrong with it.
Just my own humble opinion though😉

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G935A using Tapatalk

 

[dexter75]

Ahahahaha!!! The Britain's got Talent comment wasn't BOLD and I JUST caught it...😂😂😂

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G935A using Tapatalk

 

[BigCityAccountant]

Not sure how you can come to that conclusion considering you said they just took their "word" for it and I was talking about them knowing the "evidence". But anyhow, the Halbachs are not stupid people. They're quiet the opposite. To make the assumption, because that is all it is, that they're a mindless bunch that cannot think for themselves and lack integrity by allowing anyone but the true murderer to be sitting in prison, is astounding.

They lost their loved one in a horrific way. 10 years later it is dredged back up again by a couple of "film makers" who are severely lacking in morals resulting in total strangers messaging them through social media telling them how dumb they are and asking how they can sleep at night (yes, Avery certainly has some vile people supporting him).

Unlike the PB case, the Halbachs are not relying on the memory of what the perp looks like. They have an abundance of physical evidence to follow.

Do you know them personally??? With all due respect to the Halbach family...you just come across as someone who knows them personally.

 

[Damarna]

The Halbachs know what happened and I find it insulting to them that people question their intellect and judgement. No one wants justice for Teresa more than they do. Its mind boggling to me that people feel they should actually watch the piece of garbage that is fraudently referred to as a documentary. Do they really need the painful reminder that their loved one is just a mere footnote in it? They were there. They sat through all the trials and know the brutal truth. Perhaps people should trust their judgement and support them instead of Teresa's callous murderers.

I'm one that questions the validity of Brendan's confession. My thoughts are pure speculation due to years of personal involvement with young adults involved in academic special education. Something (again just my gut) didn't sit well with me. With that said, I don't know if he's innocent or guilty. I want to see all the i's dotted and t's crossed to give Teresa the justice that she absolutely must have. I want the interviews, confessions, evidence to be flawless FOR Teresa. I think, at least in my perceptions, we all want one thing in the end - Justice For Teresa.

Sent from my SM-N910V using Tapatalk

 

[missy1974]

Not sure how you can come to that conclusion considering you said they just took their "word" for it and I was talking about them knowing the "evidence". But anyhow, the Halbachs are not stupid people. They're quiet the opposite. To make the assumption, because that is all it is, that they're a mindless bunch that cannot think for themselves and lack integrity by allowing anyone but the true murderer to be sitting in prison, is astounding.

They lost their loved one in a horrific way. 10 years later it is dredged back up again by a couple of "film makers" who are severely lacking in morals resulting in total strangers messaging them through social media telling them how dumb they are and asking how they can sleep at night (yes, Avery certainly has some vile people supporting him).

Unlike the PB case, the Halbachs are not relying on the memory of what the perp looks like. They have an abundance of physical evidence to follow.

#1 Please point out to me where I EVER said they were a mindless bunch that cannot think for themselves and lack integrity? Please.

#2. Getting their information from LE/Prosecutors, specifically BD's confession, which Mike states in a news conference that he did not watch..... if he didn't watch it, he is taking their word for it, where else would he be basing his opinion from?

#3 Them knowing the evidence. Please give me something, other than Brendan's interviews (that Mike didn't watch), that point to Brendan's guilt.

#4 Brendan's lawyers filed the petition long before the Netflix series came out, this ruling would have happened regardless of whether MaM ever saw the light of day. It's unfortunate and terrible if people are messaging Teresa's family with anything other than support; however, to lump all of us, or specifically me, into that group is an insult and I am done with this conversation because it is clear to me that you are not here to discuss anything.

 

[missy1974]

:wagon:

Welcome to all the new posters!

Karinna ~ somewhere deep in these threads we have discussed the possibility that she went to GZ's after Avery's. You might be interested in the phone call/cell phone threads. BigCityAccountant (BCA for us lazy typers .... hi by the way BCA! nice to see you ) has done some researching on cell towers, etc. At first I was sceptical about GZ and his stories, but I think I have come to the conclusion that he was a grumpy old man with possibly a drinking problem lol Zellner has implied that she has more cell phone info, so hopefully when she files, we will see what that is all about and what it means!

 

[mrsobrien]

I'm always happy to have opposing opinions on a complicated case! Thank you all for sharing your brains. <3

Did you all see the banner about Bessie? :-/

 

[missy1974]

I'm one that questions the validity of Brendan's confession. My thoughts are pure speculation due to years of personal involvement with young adults involved in academic special education. Something (again just my gut) didn't sit well with me. With that said, I don't know if he's innocent or guilty. I want to see all the i's dotted and t's crossed to give Teresa the justice that she absolutely must have. I want the interviews, confessions, evidence to be flawless FOR Teresa. I think, at least in my perceptions, we all want one thing in the end - Justice For Teresa.

Sent from my SM-N910V using Tapatalk

:wagon:

When I first watched MaM, Brendan's interviews/case was hard for me to watch. For quite awhile I didn't even want to listen to or read his interviews, I eventually did and I came away feeling that it was coerced and the poor kid didn't have anything to do with it.

Judge Duffin's ruling sure makes me feel better about my feelings and the system. I hope it does for you too

 

[missy1974]

I'm always happy to have opposing opinions on a complicated case! Thank you all for sharing your brains. <3

Did you all see the banner about Bessie? :-/

awwwww poor Bessie :hug:

Thank you so much for alerting us mrsobrien, I don't always look up there.

 

[Justiceseeker35]

Hi Dexter75,
I have sent you a PM to apologise for taking too long to respond to your earlier message.

I'm going to use your post, and then add my comments in Bold if that is ok.

No apologies required. You know? It is really important that people are discussing things like this, as alluded to above. Everything is not Black & White and if I handed one Mantra down to my kids that they remember? It would be: CHALLENGE EVERYTHING!

I apologise for the use of capitals there, but it is an important point. People are challenging the convictions of Avery & Dassey, and they are correct to do so. However, despite the challenge, I think the correct outcome was borne out.

challenge everything, I think that's very well said. I think for many of us this is not the first criminal case that's been
scrutinized by us sleuthers. I think over time many have begun to see that LE and prosecutors don't always tell the truth,
they aren't always above board. That cops lie, DA's lie, crime labs lie. People have agendas. The acting in good faith feeling is gone.
Next time you are on a jury and someone's life is hanging in the balance whether is be life in prison or death row, take a moment. Question if the evidence is legitimate. Really look at the dna evidence and some of the items they are pointing to that are evidence, does it make sense? Does the confession make sense. For me with the BD case something seemed incredibly wrong. All those people had an agenda
and to me, a third party viewer, seemed like he was targeted on purpose, easily manipulated and they needed him simply to bolster the case.
IMO BD is innocent. Most likely SA is innocent and KZ is going to be able to prove it. If her case is weak then maybe SA did
have a part in it all. I could concede to that.

 

[missy1974]

Karinna, if you haven't found it already, http://www.stevenaverycase.org/ has all the photo's, legal documents, police reports, etc that were available.

I have given up on the phone records until (hopefully) we see more of them. I can't believe that more wasn't introduced in the trial, it seems that in almost any case we are hearing about cell phone pings and towers, but not in this case, on either side, it's odd to me.

 

[Karinna]

Karinna, if you haven't found it already, http://www.stevenaverycase.org/ has all the photo's, legal documents, police reports, etc that were available.

I have given up on the phone records until (hopefully) we see more of them. I can't believe that more wasn't introduced in the trial, it seems that in almost any case we are hearing about cell phone pings and towers, but not in this case, on either side, it's odd to me.

Thankyou for posting the link. Sounds like a lot of good info. there to read up on.

 

[IDK]

challenge everything, I think that's very well said. I think for many of us this is not the first criminal case that's been
scrutinized by us sleuthers. I think over time many have begun to see that LE and prosecutors don't always tell the truth,
they aren't always above board. That cops lie, DA's lie, crime labs lie. People have agendas. The acting in good faith feeling is gone.
Next time you are on a jury and someone's life is hanging in the balance whether is be life in prison or death row, take a moment. Question if the evidence is legitimate. Really look at the dna evidence and some of the items they are pointing to that are evidence, does it make sense? Does the confession make sense. For me with the BD case something seemed incredibly wrong. All those people had an agenda
and to me, a third party viewer, seemed like he was targeted on purpose, easily manipulated and they needed him simply to bolster the case.
IMO BD is innocent. Most likely SA is innocent and KZ is going to be able to prove it. If her case is weak then maybe SA did
have a part in it all. I could concede to that.

JusticeSeeker35, Thanks for your post. My views on the case are very similar to yours.

I don't know if this has been discussed before but is there any possibility that if Steven Avery did kill TH, it was done accidentally? Just curious what others think of that possibility since there is no evidence of malice or premeditation, that I am aware of.

 

[missy1974]

JusticeSeeker35, Thanks for your post. My views on the case are very similar to yours.

I don't know if this has been discussed before but is there any possibility that if Steven Avery did kill TH, it was done accidentally? Just curious what others think of that possibility since there is no evidence of malice or premeditation, that I am aware of.

hmmm I don't know if it's ever been discussed. I'm trying to think of a scenario where he could have done it accidentally, and I can't think of one. She was there taking a picture of a vehicle, normally took her 5-10 minutes, in those 10 minutes, what could happen accidentally?

I remember discussing early on about the possibility of her being accidentally shot, EA and his buddy were supposedly on the golf cart out shooting rabbits.... with a .22.

JusticeSeeker ~ I could concede to SA being guilty too..... if we were presented with reliable evidence of how it happened, etc. I'm not buying the narrative that Kratz spewed, mostly because the evidence doesn't back it up, including BD's involuntary confession.

 

[Hoosen_Fenger]

I don't know if LE set SA up, but what if someone else that lived there and knew SA & BD very well did and they were actually the real perps.? Probably wouldn't be difficult to do seeing as they had access, IMO.

Yes Karinna,
That is something to be explored. I am not sure it has been during the last 10 years, but if I were a defending lawyer (or whatever they are called in the US,) I would take a look down this route. That said, if not Avery & Dassey, then who? How can this be checked now? I do not like the idea of naming suspects without evidence, so people smarter than me involved in this case would have done so if they had an inkling, surely?

I have said in other responses, I watched the MAM and shouted at the Tele. Then I took a step back. I thought thy were both innocent until I began to look deeper. Now I have changed my mind. (I am probably not the best person to be a juror on that admission.

 

[Hoosen_Fenger]

What do you make of the

" place Teresa in Averys garage " note?
You know, the one Kratz wrote to Culhane..

Yes Dexter75, a good example of the case being handled in a way I would hope I never had to suffer from.

Culhane was asked if Teresa's DNA could be found in the Garage. It was helping the Prosecution build their case. The snippets from Dassey, whether we agree or disagree on the validity of their extraction, meant the prosecutors had to go down that route.

Let's go back to my first points and the first interaction Dassey & Avery had with law enforcement. They both lied. I hope you can see this.

If you agree they both lied? Then the investigation has to follow whatever path it can to get to the truth.

I have said this several times. I agree the way the investigation was conducted was not perfect. In fact, downright shoddy in places. But I am one of the few who think the right result was reached, as cack handed and unethical as it might seem to people.

Don't stay up until 4 tomorrow morning responding to this. Have a day off.

 

[Hoosen_Fenger]

challenge everything, I think that's very well said. I think for many of us this is not the first criminal case that's been
scrutinized by us sleuthers. I think over time many have begun to see that LE and prosecutors don't always tell the truth,
they aren't always above board. That cops lie, DA's lie, crime labs lie. People have agendas. The acting in good faith feeling is gone.
Next time you are on a jury and someone's life is hanging in the balance whether is be life in prison or death row, take a moment. Question if the evidence is legitimate. Really look at the dna evidence and some of the items they are pointing to that are evidence, does it make sense? Does the confession make sense. For me with the BD case something seemed incredibly wrong. All those people had an agenda
and to me, a third party viewer, seemed like he was targeted on purpose, easily manipulated and they needed him simply to bolster the case.
IMO BD is innocent. Most likely SA is innocent and KZ is going to be able to prove it. If her case is weak then maybe SA did
have a part in it all. I could concede to that.

Justiceseeker 35,
I accept your points. As an Anti Theist, I cannot ask a higher being to help me if I end up either in the Dock, or on Jury service.

In addition, I totally get your opinion on Dassey being targeted. My slant on that is that the prosecution knew, he knew more than he was letting on. Can you get your head around that? It was a difficult one for me, but once I did, I kept going back to the first interviews on the 5th & 6th of November. That lies were told by both Dassey & Avery, sets them both up.

I'll say once again I agree the way this case was handled was not perfect. I would have been sat there banging my head on the desk at some of the antics. (Luckily, I do not have in in me to hurt anyone.)

Finally, if Zellner knows who did it, why has that person not been arrested? If there are better suspects, why has it taken 10 years to find them. Let's not forget that the appeals process has been running during this time and Avery and Dassey, were not faring well.

Great debate though.

 

[missy1974]

Hoosen_Fenger ~ Why do you think investigators went to talk to BD on February 27th? It's my understanding that a female cousin (who later said she had lied and still says she lied) made some remarks to a school counsellor, who told LE when they started poking around the family again, which led them to interview Brendan. I understand your opinion about the earlier interviews because you have presented it in a way that I can understand why you feel the way you do, even if I don't agree. The earlier interview of BD didn't lead police to believe Brendan had anything to do with murder though IMO, if it had, why did they wait so long to interview him again? As a side note.... this was right around the time that SA retained Buting and Strang.

As for Zellner... she hasn't been on the case for 10 years, she has been on the case formally for 8 months, but I think may have had the files before that, from SA's girlfriend. I could be wrong, but even if Zellner knows or maybe even has evidence of who did it, it's not her responsibility to help the police or to arrest anyone, her responsibility is to her client first. She needs to prove that SA didn't do it. I don't think Buting and Strang even have a concrete opinion about who did it, even if they had a feeling, they obviously didn't have proof, but they still think that SA didn't do it.

I hope that makes sense? lol

ok wait... I have another question for you since you are willing to discuss lol Take the case in it's entirety, all the documents that we have available to us..... now take away ALL of Brendan's interviews (because a judge has ruled they can't be used now). What evidence do they have that if TH was killed on that property that day, and even if SA did it, that Brendan had anything to do with it. Remember though, you can't use his statements. I really can't think of anything, but it has been awhile since I have read some of the documents, I'm curious if there is something I am forgetting.

 

[krkrjx]

You have made my point for me. They worked with LE and Prosecutors the whole time, that is where they got their information from, they trusted them, as in most cases, we should trust them. I don't fault them for trusting them and what was being told to them.

Just like Penny believed for years that SA was the one that assaulted her.... just because she believed that for 18 years, didn't make it true.

Penny did not believe it for 18 years. She ID'd SA for the rape but almost immediately began having second thoughts. She just was not sure and she even tried contacting authorities to discuss her concerns. She was told that she had named the right person, that he was guilty, that she was not to discuss this with any other LE and just to let the system take care of things.

Penny never truly believed she had identified the real perp but no one in authority would allow her to change her mind and with all the stress she was under after her ordeal, she was easily brainwashed into accepting it, IMO. Even after she found out from other LE that they believed the rapist was someone else, no one would listen to her--they actually told her to leave things alone and not listen to rumors, that they knew what they were doing.

Yeah, they knew what they were doing alright!

 

[missy1974]

Penny did not believe it for 18 years. She ID'd SA for the rape but almost immediately began having second thoughts. She just was not sure and she even tried contacting authorities to discuss her concerns. She was told that she had named the right person, that he was guilty, that she was not to discuss this with any other LE and just to let the system take care of things.

Penny never truly believed she had identified the real perp but no one in authority would allow her to change her mind and with all the stress she was under after her ordeal, she was easily brainwashed into accepting it, IMO. Even after she found out from other LE that they believed the rapist was someone else, no one would listen to her--they actually told her to leave things alone and not listen to rumors, that they knew what they were doing.

Yeah, they knew what they were doing alright!

You are right! And I actually thought about that when I typed it. We have the benefit of knowing all this now, and if we are being fair, right now, we don't know what the Halbach family has or has not watched, read, questioned. I just know what I watched and read from 2006/07, when MH was doing press conferences and stated he had not watched BD's interviews.