CA - 3 dead, including gunman, Saugus High School, Santa Clarita, 14 Nov 2019

[mickey2942]

Lack of counselors leaves students and schools more vulnerable

School counselors are worth funding. JMO.

 

[al66pine]

And, according to the recent data, the shootings took 16 seconds from start to finish. No way to stop this.

@Trino "No way to stop." Once someone w criminal intent w a gun was on campus, I totally agree.

My post about numerous buildings on campus responded to @oceanblueeyes post asking about metal detectors and how the shooter was able to get the gun into the area that was inside of his bag. I cannot imagine the logistics w metal detectors in ~20+ bldgs, with each w gosh knows how many doors, and students, teachers, staff, and others moving in and out multiple times daily.

And also agreeing (hypothetical or actual) armed security there would not have prevented the deaths and injuries.
jmo

 

[Crazyjster]

I don't know about your high school, but I went to high school about 30 miles from the one where this shooting occurred. Everyone had a place where they stand. The group where the shooting took place was in a particular "corner of the quad." At least, every group had their traditional places. There were patios and corners defended staunchly by the seniors, who kept everyone else in place. There were areas where each grade year mainly hung out. I've done research in a few other California high schools, and the stage was the same.

I went to high school nearby as well in Los Angeles and I keep trying to wrap my head around the fact that as we have put more plans in place, and people are more aware, this is something that we can't prevent entirely. I take comfort in knowing maybe we have unknowingly done better to prevent tragedies but we need to accept the fact that nothing is totally preventable.

Twenty something years ago we had weapons issues, violence, and gang issues to worry about in school. Our classrooms were bigger, we also had bussing. There were no metal detectors or security guards.People were selling everything imaginable at or around school. Something like a school shooting would have been easy to pull off but no one did?

So what makes it so appealing now? It is more than a mental health issue, I've worked in mental health for a long time. Granted these people suffer from MH issues but I think there is more of the glorification and notoriety of the event itself that drives the person sadly. In this case even more so it does as previous posters have mentioned seem to be aimed at a specific group of people.

I am interested to see if this is linked to the September event and any SM postings. I honestly don't even know just how premeditated this was...my thoughts honestly are this seems more impulsive (mind you I have no information so for all I know he was planning this for a year...but I doubt it). I though up a couple of alternative scenarios: People can argue that the kid had a loaded gun therefore he went in with intent to kill...but maybe he was suicidal and carried it for something he was planning later, maybe he was just carrying a loaded gun period, and this group of people pushed him too far...regardless it does not excuse his actions he was a killer...I am thinking up alternative scenarios...

As for this kid...per the news update 15 seconds ago...there were guns in his home but they can't trace where the gun came from that was used in this incident. Evidently the father has a MH history.

 

[carollynden9]

There’s still so much to learn, as far as motives, etc. I did find it interesting that he followed the NRA, an NRA Shooting teen star, Hunter Wealot, and CNN on Instagram. He had one meme that was about typical teen angst. Had some posts of kids doing goofy stuff. He followed mostly alternative and metal bands. Followed his school track team and the cheer squad. Seemed like fairly “basic teen stuff” based on his postings/who he’s following.

 

[debbiegarcia36]

Inspiration from other shootings; each one perpetuates the next.

This just didn’t occur to kids years ago, but everyone is aware of Columbine and the shootings since.

24 Hour news, social media; this is the way to avenge a grievance, and achieve some level of fame.

Mass Guy You hit the nail right on the head with "Inspiration from other shootings; each one perpetuates the next" It's almost like mass shootings have become trendy or fashionable or in a morbid sort of way. The news media makes it worse by hyping it up and over sensualizing. I live a mile from the shootings and after 14 hours I can still hear the news helicopters hovering over the suspect's mother's house.

 

[mynoyb]

Are there any theories on why people are choosing to do this now? It seems like it started about 15 -20 years ago, but what would be the cause? Guns and mental illness have both been around for quite awhile.
Moo

Dennis Prager has a video where he gives his opinion on why the number of mass murders have risen dramatically.

 

[debbiegarcia36]

This one hit too close to home. My niece and nephew's elementary school was on lock down. Luckily my BIL was able to eventually pick them up.

Yes too close to home! My kids went to Saugus high school in the 90's and it is something I would never have imagined back in the day.

 

[debbiegarcia36]

@Trino "No way to stop." Once someone w criminal intent w a gun was on campus, I totally agree.

My post about numerous buildings on campus responded to @oceanblueeyes post asking about metal detectors and how the shooter was able to get the gun into the area that was inside of his bag. I cannot imagine the logistics w metal detectors in ~20+ bldgs, with each w gosh knows how many doors, and students, teachers, staff, and others moving in and out multiple times daily.

And also agreeing (hypothetical or actual) armed security there would not have prevented the deaths and injuries.
jmo

Saugus High School is an open campus, with no metal detectors. That will all change soon I'm sure. Santa Clarita, by the way was listed for a quite a few years as one of the top safest cities to live in the country. In fact locals call Santa Clarita "awesome town". It goes to show that these terrible mass shootings can happen anywhere.

 

[human]

The destruction of the family in this country has had a corrosive effect on society in general, I believe it has a huge impact on all manner of societal dysfunctions. I've yet to see any evidence to the contrary.

certainly not helpful but please name a country where this has not happened.

 

[Crazyjster]

I agree with Santa Clarita being a great place...it's hard to imagine things actually hitting this close to home...and I always figured if it would be anywhere it would be at a different school. But then I think of the other schools, and they have all been in places where no one would expect...cities and towns that are "safer" than average...which makes it all that more frustrating when something like this happens...

These seem to happen more in public schools...in private there is less security, does anyone have any thoughts on this? I don't think kids are safer regardless of where they go to school, I honestly think its a luck factor sadly if something like this happens.

 

[human]

Social media is all over the planet

 

[margarita25]

Catching up, sorry if already posted:

"I also want to acknowledge a posting on the bio of what we believe to be the subject's Instagram account," he said. "It says underneath his pseudonym: 'Saugus have fun at school tomorrow.' "
Wegener said police confirmed it was the shooter's account and it had been changed since the shooting. They are investigating to see who else had access to the account.”

https://www-m.cnn.com/2019/11/14/us/california-school-shooting/index.html?r=https://www.cnn.com/
November 15, 2019

 

[Crazyjster]

I gotta check into local news...if I am understanding what you wrote SM was updated AFTER? Interesting? Possibly more than one person in on this?

 

[Ray_of_hope]

Thank you. I don’t mean to draw any attention to myself or make this thread about me. Just feeling a little raw after today’s events. Wishing I could do more to help those who have experienced the same terror.

I don't think you've done that at all. Sadly, you can share the perspective from a survivor's point of view. It may also help you deal with any unresolved feelings. And it helps the rest of us understand the terror students feel. It gives them a voice. I can't imagine.

 

[Hippiemomof5]

Oh my goodness, not again. This breaks my heart.

My oldest son turned 16 on Tuesday. He passed his permit test. He got a new pair of Nikes and funny socks with bananas on them. He asked for make-your-own pizza for his birthday dinner. He held his baby brother on his lap while we sang to him.

How could the shooter’s birthday be so drastically different? I can’t imagine how his mother feels tonight.

 

[Ray_of_hope]

"He was a smart, quiet boy who played chess and had been active in a local Boy Scout troop, acquaintances said.
He seemed like “one of those normal kids,” according to a student in his physics class.
One girl who knew him for years said he wasn’t bullied and had a girlfriend.
The teen’s father died two years ago. An online obituary said he loved big-game hunting. In 2015, the father had been arrested amid a domestic dispute with the boy’s mother but no charges were filed."

https://www.news4jax.com/news/natio...s-teen-kills-2-shoots-3-at-california-school/

 

[Ozoner]

Schools are not only more violent, but increasingly more vicious. Bullying, social ostracism, racism is absolutely diabolical in high school. The fact that no one acknowledges this is part of the problem.

Not "victim blaming" or supporting a school shooter. Just acknowledging that the social life in high school is like swimming in shark infested areas. Maybe this situation should change. But it hasn't.

I agree. I don't know about this particular shooting, but one root cause of school shootings is that school administrators won't do anything to stop bullying. Most school bullies are psychopaths and shouldn't be handled with kid gloves.

 

[margarita25]

Dbm

 

[enelram]

i have been on this forum for a long time, and i have three teenage boys.

i'm pro-gun but we don't own and never will. but that's not the issue nor should it be discussed per TOS.

when/if one of the boys come home distraught, we talk. not all mary-poppins-like but we do have the luxury of sitting down at least 5x a week to eat dinner together. are we the cleavers? hell no. we're more like the connors on crack.

talk to your kids, folks. this is not the fault/responsibility of the LAPD, santa clarita LE, Saugus high school, guidance, local high school security nor anyone else. this is on the PARENTS. not siblings, extended family, etc. it may take a village, but that's after the parent(s) have already exhausted their own selflessness. i'm sorry this young man lost his father but he's far beyond the only one and gives NO excuse to shoot up his peers.

see you on the next missing kids' case folks. good to see you bravo. if you have kids, TALK TO THEM. even if they don't want to listen, be a parent. insist. it's our job.

Totally agree.
This young man came from an UNSTABLE family:
2015- his father was arrested for domestic violence/battery on his mother. Father was
reported to have alcohol problem, was big game hunter, owned numerous guns.

2016- His mother filed for full custody of 3 children.
2017- His father died suddenly from heart attack.
2019- Shooter decides to commit suicide on his
16th birthday. His internal anger and disrespect
for other and life cause him to take out others.
He was probably depressed.
His problems all started and ended within his chaotic
family life.
No mystery here.
MOO

 

[Presley78]

Totally agree.
This young man came from an UNSTABLE family:
2015- his father was arrested for domestic violence/battery on his mother. Father was
reported to have alcohol problem, was big game hunter, owned numerous guns.

2016- His mother filed for full custody of 3 children.
2017- His father died suddenly from heart attack.
2019- Shooter decides to commit suicide on his
16th birthday. His internal anger and disrespect
for other and life cause him to take out others.
He was probably depressed.
His problems all started and ended within his chaotic
family life.
No mystery here.
MOO

Thank you for this. Personally I feel that there’s some serious wake up calls that need to be made here. The resources we have are not enough because this keeps happening. Friends should be checking on each other and if they see something, say something. He was clearly in a downward spiral, even his friends said he was acting differently. Did anyone ask him what was wrong or offer him help? Nope. Not the friends who were interviewed by MSM.
This keeps happening with mainly young males. We need to change the stigma that boys don’t cry and are supposed to be tough. This is not working.