Found Deceased CA - Blaze Bernstein, 19, Lake Forest, 2 Jan 2018 #5 *Arrest*

[Milenalee]

Has it occurred to anyone else to question why LE (presumably) let this text conversation about "outing" out (as well as the information about what SW told them about the kiss)?

I can't help but think that perhaps someone in LE finds Blaze's homosexuality distasteful and is purposely trying to garner support for a (potentially) "poor straight guy" who was hit on by a homosexual.

Releasing these particular bits is questionable IMO.

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I think it might be the basis for hate crime charges. Though hating for outing isn't exactly hating for being gay....


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[Cora]

http://www.latimes.com/local/lanow/la-me-blaze-bernstein-details-killing-20180116-story.html

The parents of slain college student Blaze Bernstein said it's possible their son was the victim of a hate crime after new details emerged about his killing.

A law enforcement source told The Times that Bernstein was found with more than 20 stab wounds, inflicted by a former high school classmate. The source spoke on the condition of anonymity because he or she was not authorized to discuss the case publicly.

Snipped

“We are saddened to hear, on the day we laid our son to rest, that gruesome details of the cause of his death were published," Gideon Bernstein and Jeanne Pepper Bernstein wrote. "Our son was a beautiful gentle soul who we loved more than anything. We were proud of everything he did and who he was. He had nothing to hide. We are in solidarity with our son and the LGBTQ community.”

They noted the investigation was continuing. "If it is determined that this was a hate crime, we will cry not only for our son, but for LGBTQ people everywhere that live in fear or who have been victims of [a] hate crime," they wrote."


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[Gussified]

On the one hand, I think we’re reading a lot into the one sentence in the OSR article, probably fueled by internet rumors.

On the other hand, I think we’re searching for motive. So, IF BB did out SW, then that could speak to motive. And apparently LE thought so, too, that’s why it’s in the affidavit.

 

[Milenalee]

Thanks for your perspective. As I'm reading at this point, that was my instinct, that one gay does not out another like there is a code or something. I intended to put that question to any of our gay WSers so I'm glad you answered it.

That was my feeling exactly. Each gay person has their own struggle, their own journey and one of the hardest things is for a gay person to get to the point where they are comfortable in "coming out." It's a personal decision and one doesn't get to make that decision for another, only for themselves. So Blaze committed a cardinal mistake by doing so. IMO

Yes, well with this perspective it makes it a little more likely that Blaze sent the I've done something horrible text...like maybe Sam told him how far the story had spread and he began to realize how much damage was done in telling his friends.


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[TeaTime]

The "outing" as it is being called is nothing more than a fact that may or may not be relevant in showing the possibility of animosity on the part of the killer prior to the murder. It is not LE hating on gays, it is not anyone hating on anyone. It is just one more piece to the entirety of the crime.

Just as all history between victim and perp is analyzed in every case, this is just one of the bits of history between these two.

JMHO

 

[Milenalee]

What I can not understand from Sam's POV.

He lead them to the body. When he said he was at that park and went back later in the night, he led them there. I understand that his car would be GPS tracked but if you were actually going to try to hide a body, wouldn't you travel around to different places? Say you dropped him off and drive by his house?

We are not dealing with an intelligent man.

I think it shows he was in shock and didn't know what to do or say. No premeditation in the usual sense. I can't say about the legal sense. MOO


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[Elley Mae]

Jmo I didn’t need Blaze to say SW is gay. Jmo

 

[stlrfninca]

There is no actual questioning of Blaze's behaviour. No reason that will ever justify murder in my opinion.

RSBM

I completely agree that none of what happened justifies murder. That being said, as I stated last week and as I'm sure we're all aware now, this case is nowhere near "black-and-white". Two lives have been destroyed by this, and there's no other emotion I can muster other than sadness.

Before I get crucified for "blaming the victim" again, let me just reiterate that I am not. However, I will say that it was not cool for BB to out SW.

As DAnthrplgst said, in the gay community "outing" another gay person is a cardinal sin. I am not a gay man, but I have friends that are. I've learned about it from them, and this concept has been documented very well in movies and TV. Not being gay I can't for a moment completely understand the persecution gay people face in our society, just as I can't completely understand the persecution black people have felt in our society. But as an intelligent person, I can certainly empathize with both. And I have to completely take DAnthrplgst and others with first hand experience at their word as to the seriousness of this and the type of emotional upheaval it can cause. In SW's case this seems to be compounded by deeply held religious beliefs within his family, which as someone else posted, is a recipe for potential disaster.

I also think there's much more to this. These two, BB and SW, seemingly have had at least a friendship and possibly a deeper relationship lasting over several years. Adding potential love, rejection, etc. to the mix simply makes the situation more volatile. The "lover scorned" angle could certainly be a part of this.

As I said, it's all just very sad that the emotions were so charged that it wound up in an apparent murder. Perhaps if we lived in a more tolerant society, emotions and tensions wouldn't have to be so high to become a catalyst for such a terrible act.

Or perhaps it was pure vengeance, plain and simple.

I think it's too soon to know how much sympathy, if any, we should have for SW in this case.

But I don't think it's a cut-and-dry case of evil either. I think it's much more grey than that

JMO

 

[Gooddeeds]

[Quote Originally Posted by Gussified]
Right I’m with you. Possibilities:
1) completely unrelated to murder, just a coincidence (unlikely)
2) rented before the murder for the purpose of murder, indicates premeditation (but LE says not premeditated, so probably not this)]Quote


On 2-‘LE says not premeditated’. I haven’t seen that before, please point me to that link. TIA

 

[stlrfninca]

Yes, well with this perspective it makes it a little more likely that Blaze sent the I've done something horrible text...like maybe Sam told him how far the story had spread and he began to realize how much damage was done in telling his friends.

Very interesting. I hadn't gone back to think about that text in the context of all the new information we have.

I'm not sure one way or the other, though, but it's definitely something worth considering. I wonder how that would fit into the timeline. Are you thinking that perhaps SW and BB initiated the meeting that night in order to confront BB with a) that he knew about the "outing" and b) how much pain it had caused him? Then BB sends this text once he realizes how bad SW was feeling about it. Then some disagreement ensues between BB and SW resulting in BB's death and/or SW initiates the (premeditated) sequence that results in BB's death

Something like that?

 

[stlrfninca]

Jmo I didn’t need Blaze to say SW is gay. Jmo

I'm curious, how would you have known otherwise? Do you have personal knowledge of either of these two? Did you go to OCSA with them?

BTW, I love your tagline in your sig... so true!

 

[PlayByAnsible]

IMO ...

This might be against popular opinion here, but I don't believe Sam is gay. I think he was baiting and he didn't like that someone thought he was or eluded to the fact he is gay. Makes me think that he used whatever method possible (grooming) to get trust and then do what he did. He seems more like a predator. Again, this is my opinion and based on his Saboteur username postings and followings.

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[Gooddeeds]

There was a post a few days ago with a photo of an LE log attached. In the log there is a documented ‘disturbance’ at about 2 or 3am in the Hobby Lobby parking lot (identifiable as per the address). Has anyone seen any further details from that log entry?

 

[ReckoningDay]

If BB did out S, when did this happen? And when did S find out about it? That might tie more into motive if he had just found out. Also, wonder why B would do this.

Some openly gay individuals have anger towards closeted gays. They consider denial of homosexuality as a betrayal of the gay community, and for that reason will sometimes intentionally out them. Not saying this was the case here, but it is a thing.

 

[sequences]

I think it shows he was in shock and didn't know what to do or say. No premeditation in the usual sense. I can't say about the legal sense. MOO


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Change scenario. Confined space of a vehicle, a young man forcible kisses a young woman.

Young woman is not afraid of being outed as a heterosexual. Young man planning sexual in-counter..I scored. Young woman not playing game...does not know rules..reacts without thoughts.

 

[PlayByAnsible]

There was a post a few days ago with a photo of an LE log attached. In the log there is a documented ‘disturbance’ at about 2 or 3am in the Hobby Lobby parking lot (identifiable as per the address). Has anyone seen any further details from that log entry?

It's a police log and I have not heard them elaborate more which I bet they won't be able to if it's part if their case.

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[PaulR]

Some openly gay individuals have anger towards closeted gays. They consider denial of homosexuality as a betrayal of the gay community, and for that reason will sometimes intentionally out them. Not saying this was the case here, but it is a thing.

There have been a few high profile outings of high profile individuals for just this reason.

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[msphilosopher]

Some openly gay individuals have anger towards closeted gays. They consider denial of homosexuality as a betrayal of the gay community, and for that reason will sometimes intentionally out them. Not saying this was the case here, but it is a thing.

Eh, it goes both ways. But less likely to go this way IMO.

A closet gay friend of mine was outted by a ex lover / fling not because he was still closested but because of the rejection when my friend terminated the relationship. He ended things because the openly gay lover turned creepy and stalkerish towards him.

IMHO, the majority of LBGTQ community are very supportive of those still in the closet. They’re understanding because everyone has to go through this process of “coming out” because everyone assumes you’re straight until you “come out”. Usually, openly gay people are pretty supportive of how difficult it can be.


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[Zinvestigator]

The OC Register has made a lot of errors in their reporting getting BB confused with SW. Very bad journalsim!

 

[Zinvestigator]

Do we know or has it be said/confirmed/reported that BB was gay?