CA CA - Bob Harrod, 81, Orange County, 27 July 2009 - # 4

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I know this is an awkward place to put this, but I just want to remind anyone who is posting from inside of this case, defined as a local, family members, friends of a case player, interested parties, witnesses etc: WS has a process in place for verifying you in order to protect our sleuthers. Let's face it, anyone can sign onto the WWW and claim to be someone else...people often do. If you fall into the above category, please contact the owner of WS, Tricia Griffith at tgrif@xmission.com.

DPM has come forward with her location, and CA Exile is the only other player who has been verified and is posting on behalf of Bob Harrod.

TIA!!!


Believe, verification is only for those posters wishing to post as being verified. No one is required to get verified, but members MUST be verified if they wish to post as having contact with a key player.

If someone does not wish to be verified they do not have to, however non verified members can NOT post as being a key player, or having contact with a key player to the case.

I am going to be discussing this with Tricia later today, provided neither of us have other 'fires' to attend to but it is on our to do list.

hth

Yes, thus far the only key player who is verified posting is CaExile.


Once I speak with Tricia, either she or I will post additional info.

thank you
Cubby
 
Dear Websleuths Members,

Websleuths is the only true crime discussion forum that has any sort of a verification process when someone claims to be a person involved in a case.

Our verification process is limited however since the only way to 100 percent guarentee someone is they say they are is to look at their driver's license and birth certificate.

Cubby has a source in this case. I know who this person is and I can say that as with as much certainty as I have ever verified someone this person is who they say they are.

Cubby, with my permission, is posting information from her source. I have no reason to believe this person is lying.

I would appreciate if you have any issues with our verification process you contact me and do not post about it on the thread or contact any other moderator. They are over worked as it is.

It is rare that we allow a source to operate through a moderator but it does happen.

In the Susan Powell case I have several very good sources who have given me information that I can't link to. But I feel very confidant it is the truth.

It is the same situation here.

I appreciate you taking an interest in Bob's case. It really helps to keep his case alive in the public's eye.

Thank you,

Tricia Griffith
Owner/Websleuths.com
 
Thank you Tricia.

You know, I realize there is some confusion around who called in the well being check and who filed the MP report so let me throw this out there:

Elder Abuse came to Bob's house on the Wednesday Fontelle arrived because they had received a tip that Bob was being abused in some fashion. For the second time. Perhaps this is the welfare check/well being check call from the daughter who is claiming she made a call?
 
Daughter R posted on IS on Aug 13/09 that she had placed the 'welfare check' call "the night we knew he hadn't come home". I am curious about the call pertaining to the second allegations of elder abuse. Would it have been made after Bob married Fontelle? Based on the timing, I would guess so, but I have no idea of how quickly or slowly they act; but if it was made after he was already married, it just seems stranger to me.
 
I dont recall her stating she called PPD? Although that may have been an obvious conclusion to be reached, I think in this case it might not be accurate.

Fontelle calls PPD, arranges for neighbor to provide access to the home and then files MP report.

Clearly there would have been no need for her to arrange for the neighbor to open the house had one or more of the daughters called PPD and requested a welfare check. Because they could have arranged for that same scenario-in fact they had access to a family member who was living quite close to the home who could have taken care of checking for Mr. Harrod with PPD.

PPD didnt check twice right? Because that would make even less sense. So I wonder if the daughter is confused and in fact she called the elder abuse hotline for a welfare check.

JMO.
 
Daughter R posted on IS on Aug 13/09 that she had placed the 'welfare check' call "the night we knew he hadn't come home". I am curious about the call pertaining to the second allegations of elder abuse. Would it have been made after Bob married Fontelle? Based on the timing, I would guess so, but I have no idea of how quickly or slowly they act; but if it was made after he was already married, it just seems stranger to me.

I am also very curious about the second call to Social Services.

Until Mr. Harrod married Fontelle, there was not much interaction with the daughters. Mr. Harrod called his daughters to tell them about Fontelle and their plans for marriage.

Seems to me the second call was made after his marriage to Fontelle. Very strange.

I am wondering if that call, along with daughter P's posts about the SIL seeing the hairdresser's car in the neighborhood the day of Mr. Harrod's disappearance, were done to point the finger of suspicion at the hairdresser.
 
I dont recall her stating she called PPD? Although that may have been an obvious conclusion to be reached, I think in this case it might not be accurate.

Fontelle calls PPD, arranges for neighbor to provide access to the home and then files MP report.

Clearly there would have been no need for her to arrange for the neighbor to open the house had one or more of the daughters called PPD and requested a welfare check. Because they could have arranged for that same scenario-in fact they had access to a family member who was living quite close to the home who could have taken care of checking for Mr. Harrod with PPD.

PPD didnt check twice right? Because that would make even less sense. So I wonder if the daughter is confused and in fact she called the elder abuse hotline for a welfare check.

JMO.

We have the post from RB that Montjoy posted above. The only other reference I have is the below from the OC Register Oct 10, 2009 article. It just says “they called the Placentia Police to do a welfare check at the residence” but implies the daughters called. Not sure if it's accurate but just what I've read.

=====

Harrod's daughter Julie Michaels, Jeff Michael's wife, called the house later that night, and there was no answer. She called her sisters, Roberta Brady and Paula Borcher.

They called Placentia Police to do a welfare check at the residence, Brady said. Officers found the house was as empty as Michaels said he left it.

Bob Harrod's daughters called Fontelle Harrod in Missouri, and she called in a missing persons report to police.

http://www2.ocregister.com/articles/harrod-bob-police-2598739-fontelle-michaels?orderby=TimeStampAscending&showRecommendedOnly=1&oncommentsPage=2#slComments
 
TY Cloudajo-so in fact the girls are saying they had two welfare checks done?

Well isnt that head scratchin. I suppose then they would have a case against PPD for ignoring the first request, and waiting until Bob's wife called after midnight her time to actually drive out there and be greeted by the neighbors. IIRC one of the daughters arrived as well....

So then there were either two welfare checks, one request by the daughter that was ignored, or that call from the daughters never reached PPD and Fontelle's request was the only one logged.

Hmmm.
 
I am trying to consider all angles, but how did the officers find the house empty if they had to be let in at least two hours later by the neighbor across the street? Did they just peer into the windows? I mean, we know there was no one at the house earlier who let them in so they could find the house empty....
 
TY Cloudajo-so in fact the girls are saying they had two welfare checks done?

Well isnt that head scratchin. I suppose then they would have a case against PPD for ignoring the first request, and waiting until Bob's wife called after midnight her time to actually drive out there and be greeted by the neighbors. IIRC one of the daughters arrived as well....

So then there were either two welfare checks, one request by the daughter that was ignored, or that call from the daughters never reached PPD and Fontelle's request was the only one logged.

Hmmm.

BBM~~~~

One of the daughters arrived as well. That would mean the daughter's arrival time was sometime after midnight.

Reviewing the driving times:

Daughter - P
38 mins; 1 hour 10 mins in traffic

Daughter -R
26 mins; 45 mins in traffic

Daughter - J
1 hour 20 mins; up to 2 hours in traffic


You would think the daughters living closest to Mr. Harrod would be making the late night trip, yet they have never posted about that.

We know that daughter J posted she went DTH to change the linens and get the house ready for Fontelle. Was this done in the middle of the night?

Just thinking out loud.........
 
I am also very curious about the second call to Social Services.

Until Mr. Harrod married Fontelle, there was not much interaction with the daughters. Mr. Harrod called his daughters to tell them about Fontelle and their plans for marriage.

Seems to me the second call was made after his marriage to Fontelle. Very strange.

I am wondering if that call, along with daughter P's posts about the SIL seeing the hairdresser's car in the neighborhood the day of Mr. Harrod's disappearance, were done to point the finger of suspicion at the hairdresser.

Info on SS call. Note that PB says on Aug 13th that she "thinks" her youngest sister JM placed the call, and RB implies on Oct 10th that she doesn't yet know when the call was placed. Come on.

August 10, 2009 - Daughter RB
“OC Social Services conducted an investigation of suspected elder financial abuse several months ago and we were told D did not want to pursue the issue. They could not pursue further at that time for that reason.
They were again contacted by family before D went missing and an investigator showed up to conduct the second investigation, two days after he went missing. We spoke with their investigator, while all the news crews were outside the house, the day of F's return.”

August 13, 2009 - Daughter PB
“Don't know what contact was given to the CA Senior Fraud Dept.
Will have to check with youngest sister, believe she is the one that called. If they are contacting D's house we will never be told anything by F.”

August 14, 2009 - Daughter RB
“Social Services finally conducted their second investigation on the day F arrived, two days after D's disappearance. The media was all over the place that day and the investigator asked what was going on.
It was then she found out that their investigation might have been "a day late and a dollar short". We went ahead and filled her in on the Financial Elder Abuse particulars for her report…”

October 10, 2009 - Daughter RB
“Just thought of this, perhaps Dad received a phone call from OC SS the day he disappeared. Hmmmm!”
 
September 2, 2009 : Daughter J posted on ROTW that she and her husband were giving away a Beautiful Oak Display Case 11 ft. L x 3 ft W x 4 1/2 ft tall.

On September 3, 2009, daughter J posts a long explanation pertaining to why they want the case picked up instead of them delivering it. She says the case is easy to move, but they are just tired of moving stuff and would rather have someone pick it up. J goes on to say that the last time they gave stuff away in bulk her husband ended up having to drive to the far side of Big Bear (with no thanks), hence her reason to offer the case as a pick up only. J also tells the forum that to move the cabinet only took 2 guys.

On September 4, 2009, daughter J bumps up the post.

The posts have now been deleted from ROTW. I wonder why.


http://www.rimoftheworld.net/discuss/194/55175
 
I am trying to consider all angles, but how did the officers find the house empty if they had to be let in at least two hours later by the neighbor across the street? Did they just peer into the windows? I mean, we know there was no one at the house earlier who let them in so they could find the house empty....

I've observed, here on WS, where sometimes the officers arrive for a welfare check and ring the bell, knock, look around the house and sometimes peer in and if there's 'no answer' and nothing appears out of the ordinary, they leave. 'no one home'

IF they were to spot something from a window, one case a body, they take further action. One other case it was the whole family, allegedly missing so officers thought it could be methane poisoning and they broke in. When they entered, they found no one home, so they left. (that was the Powell case)

Having a neighbor let them in the second call, makes sense. It might have appeared more urgent the second call and if they found someone had a key, they could check to be sure the occupant wasn't lying in bed in distress.

JMHO
fran
 
Interesting Fran-although the daughters quote is that the officers found the house empty.

Tough to imagine that possible-what if Bob was upstairs or in a back bedroom, or God forbid, had had a heart attack in the bathroom away from the windows. We are talking about an 81 year old man here...I would think the natural thought would be some kind of impairment. Further, the daughters state the officers found the house as empty as SIL said it was. During that first check. If there was a first check, which has me so confused.
 
On Tuesday, August 4, 2009, an article about Mr. Harrod's disappearance was posted on the forum ROTW.

The timeline in the article is as follows:

"Harrod was last seen Monday, July 27, by his son-in-law, JM, at Harrod's Placentia residence about 1 p.m. JM, who lives in the San Bernardino Mountains with his wife, J, went to Home Depot to pick up some items for Harrod and when he returned the man was gone."

In the same article is a copy of Mr. Harrod's missing flyer. The timeline on the flyer is as follows:

"Robert Harrod was last seen at his residence on July 27, 2009 at 1100 A.M. in the city of Placentia. When a family member returned to the house at approximately 1:00 P.M., Harrod was gone."

Two different timelines on a forum which is frequented by daughter J.

On August 4, 2009, daughter J posts on the ROTW forum which is attached to the article. J posts that she realized on the flyer her dad's eyes are noted as brown. She posts, "Correction: His eyes are Blue Gray."

She makes no mention of the incorrect times in the article and flyer, just the incorrect eye color. Hmmm.


http://www.rimoftheworld.net/columns/neufeld/police_seek
http://www.rimoftheworld.net/discuss/208/53962
 
Thanks Angelo...seems like it would be simple enough to clear up. I wonder who is actively searching for Bob now other than Fontelle?

I also wonder if anyone who believed they were the focus of the investigation has hired a criminal defense attorney which is their right...look at the Kyron Horman case. StepMom went out and got one right away to try and field the pressure she has been experiencing.
 
September 2, 2009 : Daughter J posted on ROTW that she and her husband were giving away a Beautiful Oak Display Case 11 ft. L x 3 ft W x 4 1/2 ft tall.

On September 3, 2009, daughter J posts a long explanation pertaining to why they want the case picked up instead of them delivering it. She says the case is easy to move, but they are just tired of moving stuff and would rather have someone pick it up. J goes on to say that the last time they gave stuff away in bulk her husband ended up having to drive to the far side of Big Bear (with no thanks), hence her reason to offer the case as a pick up only. J also tells the forum that to move the cabinet only took 2 guys.

On September 4, 2009, daughter J bumps up the post.

The posts have now been deleted from ROTW. I wonder why.


http://www.rimoftheworld.net/discuss/194/55175



BBM
Another reaction to posts on this thread?
 
Thanks Angelo...seems like it would be simple enough to clear up. I wonder who is actively searching for Bob now other than Fontelle?

I also wonder if anyone who believed they were the focus of the investigation has hired a criminal defense attorney which is their right...look at the Kyron Horman case. StepMom went out and got one right away to try and field the pressure she has been experiencing.

It may be their right, but if anyone has lawyered up I believe it is telling.

Also telling IMO would be:

• Who passed a polygraph
• Who failed a polygraph
• Who refused a polygraph
 
I honestly wouldn't read too much into the difference of time. You're talking about various family members and such. When you don't realize you are going to be asked the course of your day, it's difficult to be that specific. Then when someone else is trying to explain the same event and they weren't there at the time, their timing might vary a bit. Now that so long has elapsed, memories fade.

I just say this because I once had to answer LE questions and specific times. Seriously, at the time I was distraught and couldn't recall. I know it sounds dumb now, but all I could think of was the lighting, 'sun down, but not dark' and I looked at the clock trying to figure out how long I'd been gone. Of course, I did have proof, I realize now, a number of receipts and phone records, but it was never necessary for them to check. It's been three years since I was in that position and I still can't remember specific times and it was a day that changed my life.

Although the family has had time to reflect and go over everything in their mind, this has also been a stressful time for them as well. I'm sure they're very frustrated and it seems NOTHING is being resolved. I honestly have empathy for them, I do.

I do not think it's necessarily unusual that the sil left before Mr. Harrod returned. He may have been frustrated and just wanted to get home. He could have thought his fil was being forgetful or just onry. I don't mean that in a disrespectful way, LOL, I just know older people can get set in their ways and do things like that. They also get forgetful and he may have assumed Mr. Herrod FORGOT he'd made arrangements for the cleaning lady.

I know my late fil, after my mil passed away, he was angry and hurt and he took it out on us by not wanting to see us, especially on holidays. Thankfully it only lasted for about a year, but we lived only a few blocks away, so we watched over him from a distance.

Anyway, the sil had a long distance to go home and in that traffic, it could be a grueling drive.

OTOH, not pointing towards anyone specifically, but there are a LOT of areas close to Placentia where someone could dispose of a body and it would be hard to find. When a victim from Anaheim went missing, her family thought she might be in an area where she and her husband used to camp. That's where they looked. But she was found on a lonely, desolate area of South OC, a year or two or three(?) later.:( So, at first there was no proof she was dead and by the time they found her, her, ehhhh hubby had split and her case is still unsolved.

I don't know what happened to this gentleman, but I'm frustrated by his case and I don't even know anyone involved. It's like all roads lead to nowhere. But we still have a man missing without a trace and a family at odds with each other. :(

JMHO
fran

PS.....IF it were any of my relatives, I'd be out looking for them!
 
I am glad we are being helpful if the family is cleaning up some of the discrepancies or confusion surrounding their online campaign.
 
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