CA CA - Bryce Laspisa, 19, Castaic, 30 Aug 2013 - #5

[cluciano63]

I agree but they keep saying the dogs picked up his scent exiting the park.

If the dogs are right (I thought different dogs had different opinions, am I wrong? Wasn't there something about the dam?)then maybe he was disoriented or seeking a ride. Just not sure I can believe in amnesia being the answer. JMO

 

[SCV_EagleJ]

If the dogs are right (I thought different dogs had different opinions, am I wrong? Wasn't there something about the dam?)then maybe he was disoriented or seeking a ride. Just not sure I can believe in amnesia being the answer. JMO

I believe one of them led them half way across the damn and then they believed he back tracked. The other tracked him down to the water

#277

Just trying to gather into one spot what we've heard about the dog tracking. If anyone has anything else to add, please do.

Search dogs were able to follow a scent to the entrance into the recreation area, but then it dropped off.
http://www.placerherald.com/article/...ollege-student


The Times said Sunday that tracking dogs followed a scent in the direction of the lake, but lost it.
http://www.upi.com/Top_News/US/2013/...2681379874302/


LE stated that their findings were that Bryce left the Castaic park area BECAUSE the bloodhounds followed his scent leading out of the park. Not too difficult to understand that.
post by dragracerz: http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sho...222066&page=25


We were informed by somebody at the "search HQ" (Starbucks) in the morning that Bryce's scent had been found by dogs, starting at the east end of the dam, but disappearing at the west end of the dam...
post by yellow Camaro: CA CA - Bryce Laspisa, 19, Castaic, 30 Aug 2013 - #2 - Page 38 - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community .

From dragracerz on Thurs, 9/12:
"The initial dog search revealed the the scent went from the car to the water, nothing else, but that places Bryce at Castaic
Another dog search with bloodhounds on Tuesday showed Bryce by the waters edge but going along the shore towards the dam
Yesterdays bloodhound search picked up scents possibly leading out of the park so it is hopeful that he is trying to still get home to Laguna however might be impaired due to a head injury.
I think the search of the water itself is over and LE has concluded that he is NOT in the lake but also thinking he might be trying to head towards Laguna"

These are the 2 posts that seem to give the most information.There is no real answer to where the "enterence to the park" really is and where does the scent end? He could have easily wondered back towords the crash and then out into the wilderness? If he was wet would they still be able to track him?

I really don't know much about search dogs or blood hounds. I'm attaching 2 pictures. 1. the assumed "entrance" to the park. 2. The arial view.

 

[Whiteorchids]

Are any private S&R searches with dogs still being done in rural areas near Castaic or any other close by along I5 within a certain mile radius? I hope they are still continuing and not completely relying on possible sightings only. We all know some bogus sightings come from crazies that have nothing better to do.

 

[Seajay]

If the dogs are right (I thought different dogs had different opinions, am I wrong? Wasn't there something about the dam?)then maybe he was disoriented or seeking a ride. Just not sure I can believe in amnesia being the answer. JMO

There is more info on the Find Bryce FB page. One set of dogs followed to the dam and then to the road out of the park. Same dogs.

 

[Seajay]

Im a little late to the party, but here's a fun (well, about as fun as it gets given the subject matter) video about hearsay exceptions:

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=UoJ6fgIKYy8&desktop_uri=/watch?v=UoJ6fgIKYy8

I remembered that from law school and thought maybe some of you would enjoy.

That was too cute Bunny. Thanks.

 

[SCV_EagleJ]

There is more info on the Find Bryce FB page. One set of dogs followed to the dam and then to the road out of the park. Same dogs.

The crash had to happen between 4:20 a.m. and 5:15 a.m, It had gone down a 15-foot ravine nose first and landed on the passenger side. Bryce (or someone) has used an emergency tool to break the back window

Friday 5:30 am officers of the California Highway Patrol found his 2003 Toyota Highlander SUV on its side.

So let me ask you this. according to timeline the crash had to happen between 4:20 and 5:15. CHP showed up at 5:30. How is it possible for BL (possibly hurt) Make it down to the water, back to the main road and down 2 miles without anyone seeing him? Unless of course he went through the park which would have taken him even longer.

 

[SCV_EagleJ]

I really don't mean to beat a dead horse. I just really don't understand it. LOL

 

[SandSage]

So let me ask you this. according to timeline the crash had to happen between 4:20 and 5:15. CHP showed up at 5:30. How is it possible for BL (possibly hurt) Make it down to the water, back to the main road and down 2 miles without anyone seeing him? Unless of course he went through the park which would have taken him even longer.

*le sigh* Valid as heck. :banghead:

 

[Whiteorchids]

There is more info on the Find Bryce FB page. One set of dogs followed to the dam and then to the road out of the park. Same dogs.

He could have wandered off dizzy, disoriented with a serious head injury and passed out lord knows where. It could have been miles off the road and just hasn't been located. It was 105 degrees (very hot) that day when Bryce crashed. I remember that week well as I only live a couple hours from there. This is why they need to continue all areas within miles with S&R dogs that are cross trained cadaver dogs.

 

[gitana1]

shortened for space

I think they can. If they have laptops in their vehicle, they have acess to wants, warrants, arrest information etc. available from NCIC at their fingertips.

i have never heard of any cop accessing NCIC for national criminal records, except outstanding warrants, to check if a car has been reported stolen or to see if the person has been reported missing. In fact, it appears it would be against the rules for them to do so as there are "locks" on the system in place that can only be opened if they meet certain criteria. IMO, a roadside stop would not allow for a search of someone's national criminal history, only for outstanding warrants, fugitive status, things like that. I don;t think they would be able to access the entire criminal history of a person at a traffic stop via their laptops. Specific categories of information given via NCIC and individuals covered by the system are at the link:

NCIC is a computerized index of criminal justice information (i.e.- criminal record history information, fugitives, stolen properties, missing persons). It is available to Federal, state, and local law enforcement and other criminal justice agencies and is operational 24 hours a day, 365 days a year. PURPOSE: The purpose for maintaining the NCIC system is to provide a computerized database for ready access by a criminal justice agency making an inquiry and for prompt disclosure of information in the system from other criminal justice agencies about crimes and criminals. This information assists authorized agencies in criminal justice and related law enforcement objectives, such as apprehending fugitives, locating missing persons, locating and returning stolen property, as well as in the protection of the law enforcement officers encountering the individuals described in the system.
ACCESS CONSTRAINTS: All records in NCIC are protected from unauthorized access through appropriate administrative, physical, and technical safeguards. These safeguards include restricting access to those with a need to know to perform their official duties, and using locks, alarm devices, passwords, and/or encrypting data communications.
USE CONSTRAINTS: Users of the NCIC system will be restricted to only those privileges necessary to perform an authorized task(s). http://www.fas.org/irp/agency/doj/fbi/is/ncic.htm

.

I agree, but honestly, I don't know what we can even discuss at this point.

It doesn't seem that the sightings are panning out. The lake is no longer being searched (which honestly I think he's most likely there). We don't have info about the phone, computer or xbox to discuss. We can't (for good reasons) speculate about the drug charges....I'm out of potential scenarios to pursue.

:banghead:

We can certainly talk about ways to find Bryce, different strategies. The family are employing some, such as vigils and FB. We can come up with others. Lots of creative people on here.

Sorry, what Bryce told his mother is not hearsay because we have his mother's first person record of the conversation.

What KS told Caron is hearsay because we're hearing it from Caron.

In a court, Caron can give evidence that the conversation took place, but the substance of it is not accepted as evidence . It would have to come from KS. :twocents:

Guys, it's all hearsay! We've gone over this before!

I always tread lightly when it comes to my posting & the FB rules, what is allowed / what isn't (so Mods, please snip away or remind me if i'm stepped over the line. :blushing: )

Has anyone caught this comment yet today? On the Find Bryce Laspisa fb page, in the others comments section, a commenter has brought to light another young man, living in Oregon, that does look quiet a bit like Bryce & apparently is this person they are seeing as Bryce. The similarities from the only pic he has on his own personal FB (initials of KA) are a pretty good match (almost eerily) to Bryce.

moo - i can absolutely see where the confusion would come into play with Port O in OR, the multiple sightings & now to see this gentleman possibly cruising around at the same time so many are on the lookout for Bryce..... wow.
But i am also incredibly hopeful otherwise. I so want to believe these Oregon sightings.....

He's like a twin, It's incredible. It shows he lives in Astoria, OR, though, which is 6.5 hours away from Port Orford. But he's a fisherman, so people are trying to determine if he had been in that area.

I am a prosecutor in Illinois. We often charge first offenders with drug cases with misdemeanors, despite the amount being a felony level amount, and give the individual supervision in the hopes that he can get back on the right track. Supervision is NOT a diversionary program and is not automatically dismissed. The arrest and disposition remains on your record forever. It is just not a conviction.

What is most telling in drug cases is the drug fine assessed. It encompasses a street value fine, usually roughly $10/gram in cannabis cases. His fine is REALLY steep and was paid up front, which is indicative of a large amount. The offense he actually pled to does not at all indicate what the ACTUAL level was. I can tell you that cannabis is negligible enough here that you don't see much simple possession charged, despite the fact that the laws are on the books. So I won't break the rules and speculate as to how much he actually had, who paid his fines, etc.- just filling you in on the law in Illinois.

Oh, and the reason it can go up to $2500 is that you can be assessed a fine up to $2500 and up to 364 days in the county jail on a Class A misdemeanor. That fine does not include a street value or drug assessment fine. That is how his was able to exceed that amount.

Thank you so much for this info. You cleared up a lot. I'm out of my league when it comes to other states and although I make minor appearances and observe my law partner litigate and talk to his clients, criminal law is not my thing, so I can only do so much here. I practice family law! You should try to become a verified attorney on websleuths. It's the one place where no one says there are too many of us!!! Criminal attorneys are scarce here, and I don;t think we have ever had a prosecutor.

The case I was referring to is Ivy Merck...

she disappeared... Car was found... No one knew if she was alive or not...

so... There was an "organized campaign" to flood her FB with well wishes... Happy Birthdays... We miss you.. Messages on her birthday...

she saw the messages... Went to an LE building to contact them... And, coincidentally... Some of her family members were at that same LE building!

Florida... I think... Last year... I think...

sorry... Don't have all the particulars at the tip of my fingers... But her case was followed by many here on WS...

HTH...:seeya:

Wow. What a story. I read she was missing for 21 days. Where was she and how did she survive?

In researching Port Orford, it looks one of the few ways to gain more traction could be through the Chamber of Commerce. I have sent a detailed message to them and asked them to visit the Find Bryce FB page. I specifically asked how we can get the word out more effectively, and noted that someone is removing the "Missing" posters from local businesses. I made a plea that will hopefully resonate with someone there, including a bit about the accident, the head trauma and the blood discovered. I will update here if I receive a response.

Thank you for that. Smart thinking.

Hearsay is an out of court statement offered for the truth of the matter asserted. Any of those statements offered in court to prove they broke up would be hearsay. Outside of trial, the word has very little significance.

Thank YOU for that. I think people get confused about the difference between hearsay and what's considered "verified" or allowable for purposes of websleuths.

 

[SCV_EagleJ]

Also. Who's to say those tracks weren't from before the accident. He could have taken a night walk. He was in and out of the park from 2:08 until the accident.

I guess the only plausible answer would be if he parked his car at the cell tower, walked to the water/dam, walked back to the car and crashed when his car got stuck. Then walked back to the road and down to the entrance.

Welp there goes my theory! back to square one. lol

 

[gitana1]

Wow, it appears websleuths was very involved in the Ivy M case and helped the family come up with the idea to create a website for her and flood it with birthday wishes - which worked!! http://jacksonville.com/news/crime/...e-camden-woman-home-her-parents#ixzz2gizf2y1w

The article also explains how Ivy survived for 3 weeks:

On the drive to their hotel room, the family members learned about Ivy Merck’s ordeals over the previous three weeks.
“Ivy ... survived sleeping on the beach and had several people that helped her at key times with food and protection,” Chad Merck said in his Websleuths.com posting.
“I am sure there were many harrowing experiences over these weeks on the street, but God provided protection for her to leave unharmed physically,” he said.
“Ivy had her laptop, money and most of her belongings stolen in separate instances, but she survived the experience and was reunited with family. Our family is overjoyed with the outcome.”
Steven Merck did not know if or when his daughter would return to Athens, because seeing to her emotional needs comes first.
“We’re going to take care of her and do whatever it takes to get Ivy back to society and back to just being Ivy,” he said.

To me it seems she was having emotional problems when she disappeared. I hope for a similar outcome here.

 

[Voice4theSilent]

So let me ask you this. according to timeline the crash had to happen between 4:20 and 5:15. CHP showed up at 5:30. How is it possible for BL (possibly hurt) Make it down to the water, back to the main road and down 2 miles without anyone seeing him? Unless of course he went through the park which would have taken him even longer.

He could have gotten into another car and been driven out of the area.

I would love to understand the tracking dogs better. What would make his scent disappear so that they couldn't continue to follow it if they were able to follow it to the dam and then back up to the road? My (uneducated) guess would be that he was driven out of the area (or could dogs still track his scent if he was in a car?)

 

[Voice4theSilent]

He could have wandered off dizzy, disoriented with a serious head injury and passed out lord knows where. It could have been miles off the road and just hasn't been located. It was 105 degrees (very hot) that day when Bryce crashed. I remember that week well as I only live a couple hours from there. This is why they need to continue all areas within miles with S&R dogs that are cross trained cadaver dogs.

BBM

I completely agree. The ONLY clue they have as to where he went following his car crash came from those dogs.

 

[SCV_EagleJ]

He could have wandered off dizzy, disoriented with a serious head injury and passed out lord knows where. It could have been miles off the road and just hasn't been located. It was 105 degrees (very hot) that day when Bryce crashed. I remember that week well as I only live a couple hours from there. This is why they need to continue all areas within miles with S&R dogs that are cross trained cadaver dogs.

I agree. If he did wonder off at the time of the accident he could be miles away. More if he had been in a car. They didn't start searching for him until after 8am when LE showed up at his parents house to see if their car had been stolen. That's at least 3 hours headway.

and who in the world would pick up a confused, possible injured person and just drive them hundreds of miles and not to a hospital. :banghead:

 

[gitana1]

So let me ask you this. according to timeline the crash had to happen between 4:20 and 5:15. CHP showed up at 5:30. How is it possible for BL (possibly hurt) Make it down to the water, back to the main road and down 2 miles without anyone seeing him? Unless of course he went through the park which would have taken him even longer.

It would take 43 minutes for him to walk to the shopping center, nearby in Castaic. If the accident happened right around 4:30 a.m., let's say, then he had about 40 minutes left to get out of there. https://maps.google.com/maps?saddr=lake+huges+road+and+main+ramp+road,+castaic,+ca&daddr=Castaic+Shopping+Center,+Castaic,+CA&hl=en&ll=34.506344,-118.610072&spn=0.029141,0.038581&sll=34.507016,-118.609385&sspn=0.02914,0.038581&geocode=FYysDgIdUl3u-CnrLFm5TnnCgDECAm_i7NaqFg%3BFfJnDgIdbPPt-CHfl4IQ-wTzZikpCOMs1H7CgDHfl4IQ-wTzZg&oq=castaic+sho&t=h&dirflg=w&mra=ltm&z=15

It would take about 7 minutes for LE to get from the 5 freeway to the scene of the accident. https://maps.google.com/maps?saddr=...castaic+shopping+cente&t=h&gl=us&mra=ltm&z=14

So they easily could have missed Bryce. If the crash happened early enough it looks like he would have had 10 minutes to run around the area. And maybe few people were going in that specific direction, at that time, to fish.

I wonder if LE has managed to track all the people who fished in the area that morning to see if anyone saw someone walking around.

ETA: How far away is the dam? BRB

 

[gitana1]

Okay, so I see the dam is on his way out of the area, so he could have veered off the road, on his way back to the 5, walked near the dam for a bit and by the lake before coming back to the road. It's all the same direction, so again, I think it is possible for him to have had time to go where he went then leave the area and avoid detection.

 

[Jillybean78]

I really wish we could get more specifics from "the husband" of the woman who posted on the FB page. I won't mention his name, because I don't think I'm supposed to go there. Right? Although, his wife mentioned his name to everyone. He owns his own K-9 company, but works for LA County LE.

 

[SandSage]

It would take 43 minutes for him to walk to the shopping center, nearby in Castaic. If the accident happened right around 4:30 a.m., let's say, then he had about 40 minutes left to get out of there. https://maps.google.com/maps?saddr=lake+huges+road+and+main+ramp+road,+castaic,+ca&daddr=Castaic+Shopping+Center,+Castaic,+CA&hl=en&ll=34.506344,-118.610072&spn=0.029141,0.038581&sll=34.507016,-118.609385&sspn=0.02914,0.038581&geocode=FYysDgIdUl3u-CnrLFm5TnnCgDECAm_i7NaqFg%3BFfJnDgIdbPPt-CHfl4IQ-wTzZikpCOMs1H7CgDHfl4IQ-wTzZg&oq=castaic+sho&t=h&dirflg=w&mra=ltm&z=15

It would take about 7 minutes for LE to get from the 5 freeway to the scene of the accident. https://maps.google.com/maps?saddr=...castaic+shopping+cente&t=h&gl=us&mra=ltm&z=14

So they easily could have missed Bryce. If the crash happened early enough it looks like he would have had 10 minutes to run around the area. And maybe few people were going in that specific direction, at that time, to fish.

I wonder if LE has managed to track all the people who fished in the area that morning to see if anyone saw someone walking around.

ETA: How far away is the dam? BRB

Whether he is missing intentionally or not, I just do not believe he is deceased. I just DON'T.

 

[cluciano63]

I honestly can't get a feeling as far as what happened to Bryce. What I don't think is that he is popping up all over the west coast, yet can't be pinned down. I am afraid I tend to think the worst, if there is no apparent reason for a person to be on the run. JMO