GUILTY CA - Erin Corwin, 19, pregnant, Twentynine Palms, 28 June 2014 - #14

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SeesSeas said:
Interesting that CL said he strangled Erin for FIVE minutes.
ME Sheridan said Erin likely suffered brain death within FOUR minutes.

Dr Sheridan said he believes Erin “suffered brain death within four minutes.“
CL described “the homemade garrote in his hand and the five minutes it took to strangle the life out of 19-year-old Erin Corwin.”[/FONT]
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Snipped for focus: Seriously? Not sure what your point is, but do you think CL had a stopwatch on him to time this? Or do you think maybe he was estimating? And even if it took FOUR minutes according to the ME, it doesn't mean that CL let go at EXACTLY FOUR minutes; maybe he let go after FIVE minutes, just to be sure and all.
 
lisette said:
Did they already do closing arguments?
Click to expand...

The closing arguments were to begin this morning 10am CA time then jury instructions, then verdict watch.

We don't know how far they have gotten so far.


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Meemaw12 said:
The closing arguments were to begin this morning 10am CA time then jury instructions, then verdict watch.

We don't know how far they have gotten so far.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

Thanks Meemaw...I wish we could see those closing arguments!
 
Just, a lot has been happening here in the last few hours. Someone mentioned that I was being kind of negative with my comments. I'd just like to explain why it might seem that way. My perspective of this website is that people come here to "Sleuth", that is to use inductive and deductive reasoning in an attempt to ascertain the truth of a matter. For me, personally, I like a balanced discussion on the merits. If I see that the rhetoric of a discussion is becoming a little less objective, and a little more emotional, maybe even kind of slanted towards one particular side of an argument, I'm going to respond to that and try to even it out. That's just me.

Now, that doesn't mean that I have a problem with people venting their frustration, or stating their opinion, or believing in someone's guilt, or seeking comfort from like-minded individuals. It's just that I would like the other side of the argument to be represented as well. Except for out and out personal attacks, I have never once tried to censor anyone else's viewpoint. We're all adults here, and I think we can make arguments while accepting that if we do so, they will be subjected to other's scrutiny. Thank You
 
Richmond said:
Snipped for focus: Seriously? Not sure what your point is, but do you think CL had a stopwatch on him to time this? Or do you think maybe he was estimating? And even if it took FOUR minutes according to the ME, it doesn't mean that CL let go at EXACTLY FOUR minutes; maybe he let go after FIVE minutes, just to be sure and all.
Click to expand...
Ummmm No. Not my point At All.

Thinking outside the box: Four or five minutes is a LONG time to hold a garrote around Erin’s neck with her back up against his back. A couple of minutes would be a long time to hold that position. But five minutes is what we’re told CL stated. Maybe he said five minutes because that would coincide with ME Sheridan’s testimony that she suffered brain death within four minutes.
Perhaps CL waited to confess in order to protect the real killer. Perhaps CL helped dispose of an already dead body. He waited until the prosecution provided all their trial testimony and evidence. Then, CL could make up his confession to match the testimony details.
During CL’s confession, not only was there no mention of striking Erin’s head with a “heavy object”, CL also did not mention putting gloves on his hands before strangling Erin with the garrote.
CL’s DNA isn’t on the garrote, even though he strangled her with the garrote for four or five minutes, and then he dragged her body to the mine shaft, and the garrote was found around her neck.

Who hit Erin in the head with a heavy object?
Why wasn’t CL’s DNA found on the rebar handles of the garrote?

http://www.wbir.com/news/crime/former-marine-admits-in-court-that-he-killed-erin-corwin/346341698
Lee said he approached Corwin from behind and strangled her for at least five minutes with a garrote made up of two pieces of rebar and a cord. He released his hold and her body fell to the ground. He spent 30 seconds checking if she was alive, but found no signs of life.
The defendant testified he then dragged the body to the mine shaft and pushed Corwin in head first.

http://www.hidesertstar.com/news/article_3ca45c40-9bfe-11e6-abc7-47e53d6e4baa.html
Corwin was determined to be the sole possible contributor to the DNA found on the water jug, propane tank and rebar handles. There was only one profile found on each of these items.
 
Now, with regards to Chris' confession in court. Most people here, ready to comment, have expounded the fact that he confessed on the stand. I think it would be a big mistake to accept his confession as proof of anything. Mainly because of all the lies.

Chris lies when it suits him. He lies when it doesn't suit him. He lies when it makes him look guilty. He lies just for the hell of it.

Some of these lies were:

-He never knew Erin
-He only ever knew Erin as an acquaintance
-He never had a relationship with Erin
-He never kissed Erin
-He never slept with Erin
-He was only whispering to Erin on the couch.
-He never saw Erin's car on the day she disappeared
-He did see Erin's car on the day she disappeared but he just checked the tires
-He never fought with Erin.

He lied throughout the confession itself:

-He lied about having used the Jeep to get out to the mine that day
-He lied about trying to build a fire
-He lied about Erin being free to move around
-He lied about being provoked
-He lied about the perpetrator not using gloves to commit the crime
-He lied about Erin not having been bound by her abductor
-He lied about wanting to try shooting a propane cylinder to cause an explosion
-He lied about the perpetrator not having taken Erin's Shoes, Keys, and cell phone
-He lied about whose fingerprints they would have found on the inside of the electrical tape found at the mine
-He lied about Erin listening to the radio in a deadzone
-He lied when he said Erin left the person she was in love with to go look at another mine, while he tried to blow his brains out with a gun.

Everywhere you look there's another lie. Why should we believe him when he says he did it? Because we want that to be the truth? His "whole truth" confession is not even corroborated by the facts of the case. I'm certainly not a catholic, but even I understand that absolution requires that you tell the truth.

Chris made this confession at the very moment he believed that doing so could not possibly hurt his case anymore than it had been hurt already. And at the time he thought it would be of most benefit to his case to do so.

Let me take this from another angle. Let's say Chris makes his confession, and then Nichole gets up right after him and says that she did it. Can anyone here truthfully say that no one would then come on this thread and say she's just lying to protect her hubby? Even knowing how much Chris has lied, and that Nichole has never lied under oath at all? That's a million dollar wager if ever I'd heard one.

I just want one compelling reason to believe that when he said "I did it" that was not a lie as well.
 
People, generally speaking, don't confess to a murder they didn't commit and go to prison for life in order to spare the life of someone who isn't even being looked at as a suspect by LE. Gloves are amazing tools that criminals use to keep their DNA and fingerprints off of items that they don't want to be traced back to them. However, even if CL's DNA was found on the garrote, etc. some would simply scoff and say that his DNA was probably placed on the item or because it was his possession for everyday use (like the shirt) his DNA was already on it. The evidence points to one person in this crime. Sure, we can toss around hypothetical scenarios (which make little to no sense in light of the evidence) to twist the facts to fit some sort of conspiracy theory but, at the end of the day, the evidence ALL points to CL. And his confession of the crime in which he was charged proves that the Prosecution and Law Enforcement in this case got it spot on. The San Bernardino Sheriff's Department (and the Rescue Team) did an amazing job with this case and Justice can not come swift enough, I am sure, for Erin's family and loved ones. I don't think the Jury will be out long on this one at all.
 
SeesSeas said:
Ummmm No. Not my point At All.

Thinking outside the box: Four or five minutes is a LONG time to hold a garrote around Erin’s neck with her back up against his back. A couple of minutes would be a long time to hold that position. But five minutes is what we’re told CL stated. Maybe he said five minutes because that would coincide with ME Sheridan’s testimony that she suffered brain death within four minutes.
Perhaps CL waited to confess in order to protect the real killer. Perhaps CL helped dispose of an already dead body. He waited until the prosecution provided all their trial testimony and evidence. Then, CL could make up his confession to match the testimony details.
During CL’s confession, not only was there no mention of striking Erin’s head with a “heavy object”, CL also did not mention putting gloves on his hands before strangling Erin with the garrote.
CL’s DNA isn’t on the garrote, even though he strangled her with the garrote for four or five minutes, and then he dragged her body to the mine shaft, and the garrote was found around her neck.

Who hit Erin in the head with a heavy object?
Why wasn’t CL’s DNA found on the rebar handles of the garrote?

http://www.wbir.com/news/crime/former-marine-admits-in-court-that-he-killed-erin-corwin/346341698
Lee said he approached Corwin from behind and strangled her for at least five minutes with a garrote made up of two pieces of rebar and a cord. He released his hold and her body fell to the ground. He spent 30 seconds checking if she was alive, but found no signs of life.
The defendant testified he then dragged the body to the mine shaft and pushed Corwin in head first.

http://www.hidesertstar.com/news/article_3ca45c40-9bfe-11e6-abc7-47e53d6e4baa.html
Corwin was determined to be the sole possible contributor to the DNA found on the water jug, propane tank and rebar handles. There was only one profile found on each of these items.
Click to expand...

His version of the killing was a LIE because he confessed just to prevent being convicted of Premeditation. So he had to make up a story that left out any signs of premeditation. IN reality, he may have hit her hard from behind, before he began the attack. He may have worn gloves when he got the garrote, but he couldn't say so, because it would lead back to premeditation. JMO
 
77DarkHorse7 said:
Now, with regards to Chris' confession in court. Most people here, ready to comment, have expounded the fact that he confessed on the stand. I think it would be a big mistake to accept his confession as proof of anything. Mainly because of all the lies.

Chris lies when it suits him. He lies when it doesn't suit him. He lies when it makes him look guilty. He lies just for the hell of it.

Some of these lies were:

-He never knew Erin
-He only ever knew Erin as an acquaintance
-He never had a relationship with Erin
-He never kissed Erin
-He never slept with Erin
-He was only whispering to Erin on the couch.
-He never saw Erin's car on the day she disappeared
-He did see Erin's car on the day she disappeared but he just checked the tires
-He never fought with Erin.

He lied throughout the confession itself:

-He lied about having used the Jeep to get out to the mine that day
-He lied about trying to build a fire
-He lied about Erin being free to move around
-He lied about being provoked
-He lied about the perpetrator not using gloves to commit the crime
-He lied about Erin not having been bound by her abductor
-He lied about wanting to try shooting a propane cylinder to cause an explosion
-He lied about the perpetrator not having taken Erin's Shoes, Keys, and cell phone
-He lied about whose fingerprints they would have found on the inside of the electrical tape found at the mine
-He lied about Erin listening to the radio in a deadzone
-He lied when he said Erin left the person she was in love with to go look at another mine, while he tried to blow his brains out with a gun.

Everywhere you look there's another lie. Why should we believe him when he says he did it? Because we want that to be the truth? His "whole truth" confession is not even corroborated by the facts of the case. I'm certainly not a catholic, but even I understand that absolution requires that you tell the truth.

Chris made this confession at the very moment he believed that doing so could not possibly hurt his case anymore than it had been hurt already. And at the time he thought it would be of most benefit to his case to do so.

Let me take this from another angle. Let's say Chris makes his confession, and then Nichole gets up right after him and says that she did it. Can anyone here truthfully say that no one would then come on this thread and say she's just lying to protect her hubby? Even knowing how much Chris has lied, and that Nichole has never lied under oath at all? That's a million dollar wager if ever I'd heard one.

I just want one compelling reason to believe that when he said "I did it" that was not a lie as well.
Click to expand...

The forensics left at the crime scene, DO NOT show that Nichole was the killer. The Sprite bottle was shared by Erin and CL. The other DNA was Chris's not Nicholes. The person that lured Erin to the desert was CL, not his wife. Erin would never have gone out to the remote area with Nichole. Besides, Nicholes whereabouts were known at the time this was happening. It was Chris who was out and reportedly 'hunting' in that area. Same area he had been the previous weekend.

Just because he was a no good liar, it does not mean that the bare bones of his confession is not factual. He lied through his teeth through out, but enough of it is true the convict him, imho.
 
katydid23 said:
The forensics left at the crime scene, DO NOT show that Nichole was the killer. The Sprite bottle was shared by Erin and CL. The other DNA was Chris's not Nicholes. The person that lured Erin to the desert was CL, not his wife. Erin would never have gone out to the remote area with Nichole. Besides, Nicholes whereabouts were known at the time this was happening. It was Chris who was out and reportedly 'hunting' in that area. Same area he had been the previous weekend.

Just because he was a no good liar, it does not mean that the bare bones of his confession is not factual. He lied through his teeth through out, but enough of it is true the convict him, imho.
Click to expand...

BBM

Where? I have never seen anywhere that Nichole had an alibi! Surely such a fact would have been disclosed to the jury immediately. It is the next logical step.

Okay, for you, there is no reason not to believe it's true. Can you give me a compelling reason TO believe that it is true?

The sprite bottle and the shirt are items that a manchild would leave behind in his car forever. They could have been there from five months before this happened.

And the forensics at the mine also do not show that Chris was the killer. They only demonstrate that the Jeep was at the mine when Erin was put there.

If Chris was at that specific mine the previous weekend, couldn't he have cleaned out his car, tossing some casings and a bottle into the mine, maybe some gas and a torch while he's at it? That would have been a pretty cool thing to show a fellow marine, right? A bonfire in a mine?


Not a response to your post , just to save space:

I also don't really get why a marine would feel the need to use a garrote on a girl half his size and bound by zip ties. Why couldn't he have stood her up and used a chokehold? Or pushed her in head first and let gravity do the rest. Such a specialised weapon seems more appropriate for a person of equal size or less. Someone who would not be so sure of their chances of success otherwise.
 
The jury has started deliberations #ErinCorwin #JusticeForErin

Bethfordroth

Posted at 6:39 pm EST

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
77DarkHorse7 said:
Just, a lot has been happening here in the last few hours. Someone mentioned that I was being kind of negative with my comments. I'd just like to explain why it might seem that way. My perspective of this website is that people come here to "Sleuth", that is to use inductive and deductive reasoning in an attempt to ascertain the truth of a matter. For me, personally, I like a balanced discussion on the merits. If I see that the rhetoric of a discussion is becoming a little less objective, and a little more emotional, maybe even kind of slanted towards one particular side of an argument, I'm going to respond to that and try to even it out. That's just me.

Now, that doesn't mean that I have a problem with people venting their frustration, or stating their opinion, or believing in someone's guilt, or seeking comfort from like-minded individuals. It's just that I would like the other side of the argument to be represented as well. Except for out and out personal attacks, I have never once tried to censor anyone else's viewpoint. We're all adults here, and I think we can make arguments while accepting that if we do so, they will be subjected to other's scrutiny. Thank You
Click to expand...

Respectfully, you may be getting the site mixed up with a debate club.

I don't mind the odd bit of debate when something just doesn't make sense, but arguing just for the sake of devil's advocacy in some of these more heinous (and utterly obvious) cases isn't something most of us take pleasure in. And Websleuths is a victim-friendly site; we are not required to behave as jury members.

I myself strive for objectivity--and pragmatism, and Occam's Razor. None of them lead me to any doubt that CL is guilty. Making up random scenarios isn't something I have time to amuse myself with.
 
Meemaw12 said:
The jury has started deliberations #ErinCorwin #JusticeForErin

Bethfordroth

Posted at 6:39 pm EST

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Click to expand...

Beth said she we could expect to see a blog post around 6PM.

So late in the day to begin deliberations. Wonder if they will do a straw poll, then call it a day?
 
Knox said:
Beth said she we could expect to see a blog post around 6PM.

So late in the day to begin deliberations. Wonder if they will do a straw poll, then call it a day?
Click to expand...

I think they can go as long as they want if they vote and are close, might want to sleep on it too. Prob take an hr to get organized . Just never know about juries.


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