CA - Joey, Summer, Gianni, Joseph Jr McStay Murders - Feb 4th 2010 #19

[Tricia]

On Feb 4th, 2010 the McStay Family, Joey, Summer, Gianni, and Joseph Jr vanished from their home. It looked like the family simply got up and left their home never to return.

Law Enforcement was convinced that the McStay family ran away to Mexico.

Patrick McStay, Joey's father, along with other loved ones knew there was no way Joey and his family would never flee to Mexico. There was no reason for this scenario presented by law enforcement.

Up until the remains of the family were found buried in the desert on November 11, 2013, Patrick McStay searched for his son and his family.

Family friend Chase Merritt was arrested for the McStay family murders on Nov 7th, 2014 and finally, Merritt's first-degree murder trial is underway.

The McStay forum is in our private section. However, we are making the discussion of the trial public.

Link to prior threads
#1 CA - Joey, Summer, Gianni, Joseph Jr McStay Murders - Feb 4th 2010

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[Harmony 2]

STOP personalizing posts. Timeouts will be forthcoming if this manner of posting continues.

Differences of opinion are to be expected and are allowed as long as the discussion remains civil and respectful. Looking at something from another angle is the foundation of this forum community. To expect members from all over the world and all walks of life to think the same is unrealistic.

If you don’t agree with a post, either scroll and roll or put the other member on ignore. Do not announce that you are placing someone on ignore- just do it.

Stick to the facts and use links to back up your assertions. If you see a problematic post, hit the alert/report button and move on.

 

[Harmony 2]

Continue discussion here...
Post #2 still applies. Posters continue to personalize posts. Posting in this manner may result in the loss of posting privileges.

 

[LadyL]

citygirl said:
"But not when you say you are too sick to represent your client in court."

bringing this over from the last thread to say ...

if the work is the source of the illness (stress) then yes
also, there are many illnesses that manifest themselves inconsistently
he could've been fine for just a couple hours

 

[mrjitty]

@Tortoise

I'm sure the jury's going to wonder why, when Gary Robertson is recalled, the defense didn't question him yesterday about his efforts to locate Riccobene and Knowles...

Yes - it also rather gives the impression he hadn't done the work yet

 

[oceanblueeyes]

I read the link again that smr had posted in the now closed thread where Maline is quoted about having to prove CMs innocence.

Imo, the DT knows if CM is convicted the jury is going to sentence him to death, and he even mentions why imo.

There's two children, age three, and four who had their skulls crushed in with a hammer. Paraphasing.

The DT is very worried about the death penalty turning out to be the punishment handed down, and they should be. Imo

Imo

 

[Recidivist]

citygirl said:
"But not when you say you are too sick to represent your client in court."

bringing this over from the last thread to say ...

if the work is the source of the illness (stress) then yes
also, there are many illnesses that manifest themselves inconsistently
he could've been fine for just a couple hours

Perhaps then, one should consider another line of work. If I were a family member of one of the victims, or in this case, four of the victims, I would be losing my mind over the games being played in that courtroom.

 

[la2cabo]

I read the link again that smr had posted in the now closed thread where Maline is quoted about having to prove CMs innocence.

Imo, the DT knows if CM is convicted the jury is going to sentence him to death, and he even mentions why imo.

There's two children, age three, and four who had their skulls crushed in with a hammer. Paraphasing.

The DT is very worried about the death penalty turning out to be the punishment handed down, and they should be. Imo

Imo

I'm not convinced the jury is too concerned about putting Merritt to death. This is why:
1) CA last executed a person in January of 2006
2) Merritt is 60+ years old
3) Merritt would likely be dead before all appeals are exhausted and that's assuming he's assigned a relatively decent public defender who actually cares about appealing the verdict

Merritt deserves to have his life snuffed out just like the McStays did but it likely won't happen. At least we know he'll never die outside the cold walls of prison or jail. The clock is ticking...

 

[la2cabo]

Perhaps then, one should consider another line of work. If I were a family member of one of the victims, or in this case, four of the victims, I would be losing my mind over the games being played in that courtroom.

I wish we could hear how the family is handling all of this. I wonder if they have a court advocate to help them address their concerns, if any. What would happen if the family wrote a letter to the judge voicing their concerns about the delays, etc.? Would that cause a mistrial?

 

[wary]

I wish we could hear how the family is handling all of this. I wonder if they have a court advocate to help them address their concerns, if any. What would happen if the family wrote a letter to the judge voicing their concerns about the delays, etc.? Would that cause a mistrial?

I seriously doubt that it’d cause a mistrial. The judge, unlike the jury, is supposed to be a professional, and to be able to handle appeals to emotion, and all sorts of other things.

 

[la2cabo]

I seriously doubt that it’d cause a mistrial. The judge, unlike the jury, is supposed to be a professional, and to be able to handle appeals to emotion, and all sorts of other things.

I wasn't sure about a family member making contact with the judge. I'm sure somebody would complain. Lol

 

[Mica]

Following

 

[Bobcat1]

I wish we could hear how the family is handling all of this. I wonder if they have a court advocate to help them address their concerns, if any. What would happen if the family wrote a letter to the judge voicing their concerns about the delays, etc.? Would that cause a mistrial?

I can tell you there is an advocate for the families and some of them are in contact with her every day and some periodically. If you want verification of this she is in the courtroom every day with Tracy Russell (Summer's sister). PM speaks to her regularly and has been with Tracy and her on his trips to the trial.

 

[oceanblueeyes]

I'm not convinced the jury is too concerned about putting Merritt to death. This is why:
1) CA last executed a person in January of 2006
2) Merritt is 60+ years old
3) Merritt would likely be dead before all appeals are exhausted and that's assuming he's assigned a relatively decent public defender who actually cares about appealing the verdict

Merritt deserves to have his life snuffed out just like the McStays did but it likely won't happen. At least we know he'll never die outside the cold walls of prison or jail. The clock is ticking...

Hi la2!

On this we will have to respectfully degree this time. Lol!

These jurors are death penalty qualified jurors for a valid reason.

I do think if convicted they will impose the harshest punishment allowed under CA law.

It really isn't about him ever being executed. Athough I did read last year they are going to find ways to speed up the appeal process, which is great news.

It's all about rendering the harshest, and correct punishment allowed to be handed down that fits the crimes committed on who, and how CM murdered all 4 victims.

Its evident juries in CA most definitely thought/think the DP is/was the appropriate punishment for certain individual defendants since they have over 700 inmates on death row. I have no doubt all those juries knew about the DP not being carried out like it should be too.. But that was irrelevant to them. They were there to decide which punishment fit the crimes.

What the government does or doesnt do afterwards once the sentenced was handed down by them was/is irrelevant to the juries as it should be. They are there to solely decide what the correct punishment should be based on each individual DP trial.

I realize it's the government who is standing in the way, and thumbing their nose to all the juries who actually sat on all of those cases, who with great thought, seriously decided the harshest punishment should be carried out.

It's not the fault of all of those countless jurors that the government has some of the longest appeal processes in the nation. Nor is it their fault their heavily weighed decisions have not been carried out. They did their duty. What happens after then has nothing to do with their rendered decisions at trial.

And the last poll I saw over 60 percent in CA still want the DP as an option.

I most certainly do believe if CM is convicted of brutally murdering two parents, and not one, but two, very defenseless little children, the jury will vote death because it is the most deserving sentence they are allowed to render. based on the severity, and heinousness of the four murders.

I also believe the DT knows he will be sentenced to death too if convicted. Maline pretty much said so himself in the article.

He knows what will come next if CM is convicted, and it gets to the sentencing phase. It will only get far worse for CM in that phase

It's not often even parents brutally murder their own children with a sledgehammer. It's even much more rare for any murderer to carry them out against young children who isn't even kin to the murdered children.

Jmo

 

[wary]

I can tell you there is an advocate for the families and some of them are in contact with her every day and some periodically. If you want verification of this she is in the courtroom every day with Tracy Russell (Summer's sister). PM speaks to her regularly and has been with Tracy and her on his trips to the trial.

Thank you. I’m so glad the family has this support.

 

[la2cabo]

I can tell you there is an advocate for the families and some of them are in contact with her every day and some periodically. If you want verification of this she is in the courtroom every day with Tracy Russell (Summer's sister). PM speaks to her regularly and has been with Tracy and her on his trips to the trial.

That's great news! How is the family holding up? Are they getting just as frustrated as the rest of us? It's been 9+ years since the family was murdered and it's about time the family gets some peace.

 

[la2cabo]

Hi la2!

On this we will have to respectfully degree this time. Lol!

These jurors are death penalty qualified jurors for a valid reason.

I do think if convicted they will impose the harshest punishment allowed under CA law.

It really isn't about him ever being executed. Athough I did read last year they are going to find ways to speed up the appeal process, which is great news.

It's all about rendering the harshest, and correct punishment allowed to be handed down that fits the crimes committed on who, and how CM murdered all 4 victims.

Its evident juries in CA most definitely thought/think the DP is/was the appropriate punishment for certain individual defendants since they have over 700 inmates on death row. I have no doubt all those juries knew about the DP not being carried out like it should be too.. But that was irrelevant to them. They were there to decide which punishment fit the crimes.

What the government does or doesnt do afterwards once the sentenced was handed down by them was/is irrelevant to the juries as it should be. They are there to solely decide what the correct punishment should be based on each individual DP trial.

I realize it's the government who is standing in the way, and thumbing their nose to all the juries who actually sat on all of those cases, who with great thought, seriously decided the harshest punishment should be carried out.

It's not the fault of all of those countless jurors that the government has some of the longest appeal processes in the nation. Nor is it their fault their heavily weighed decisions have not been carried out. They did their duty. What happens after then has nothing to do with their rendered decisions at trial.

And the last poll I saw over 60 percent in CA still want the DP as an option.

I most certainly do believe if CM is convicted of brutally murdering two parents, and not one, but two, very defenseless little children, the jury will vote death because it is the most deserving sentence they are allowed to render. based on the severity, and heinousness of the four murders.

I also believe the DT knows he will be sentenced to death too if convicted. Maline pretty much said so himself in the article.

He knows what will come next if CM us convicted, and it gets to the sentencing phase. It will only get far worse for CM in that phase

It's not often even parents brutally murder their own children with a sledgehammer. It's even much more rare for any murderer to carry them out against young children who isn't even kin to the murdered children.

Jmo

You make some excellent points, OBE. Thank you. I think you have changed my thought process on the subject.

 

[Force Ten]

Hi la2!

On this we will have to respectfully degree this time. Lol!

These jurors are death penalty qualified jurors for a valid reason.

I do think if convicted they will impose the harshest punishment allowed under CA law.

It really isn't about him ever being executed. Athough I did read last year they are going to find ways to speed up the appeal process, which is great news.

It's all about rendering the harshest, and correct punishment allowed to be handed down that fits the crimes committed on who, and how CM murdered all 4 victims.

Its evident juries in CA most definitely thought/think the DP is/was the appropriate punishment for certain individual defendants since they have over 700 inmates on death row. I have no doubt all those juries knew about the DP not being carried out like it should be too.. But that was irrelevant to them. They were there to decide which punishment fit the crimes.

What the government does or doesnt do afterwards once the sentenced was handed down by them was/is irrelevant to the juries as it should be. They are there to solely decide what the correct punishment should be based on each individual DP trial.

I realize it's the government who is standing in the way, and thumbing their nose to all the juries who actually sat on all of those cases, who with great thought, seriously decided the harshest punishment should be carried out.

It's not the fault of all of those countless jurors that the government has some of the longest appeal processes in the nation. Nor is it their fault their heavily weighed decisions have not been carried out. They did their duty. What happens after then has nothing to do with their rendered decisions at trial.

And the last poll I saw over 60 percent in CA still want the DP as an option.

I most certainly do believe if CM is convicted of brutally murdering two parents, and not one, but two, very defenseless little children, the jury will vote death because it is the most deserving sentence they are allowed to render. based on the severity, and heinousness of the four murders.

I also believe the DT knows he will be sentenced to death too if convicted. Maline pretty much said so himself in the article.

He knows what will come next if CM us convicted, and it gets to the sentencing phase. It will only get far worse for CM in that phase

It's not often even parents brutally murder their own children with a sledgehammer. It's even much more rare for any murderer to carry them out against young children who isn't even kin to the murdered children.

Jmo

About 20 years or so ago, I heard a news report of a father in New York who did a deed like Andrea Yates. Took his 4 children one by one into the basement and bludgeoned them with a hammer. From what I recall it was not foreseeable for him to do it. No rhyme nor reason. I never followed up on the story and lost track. It was only local news and I only knew of it because I lived there at the time.

It goes to show that some of the worst monsters could be living under your own roof.

 

[smr]

Big kudos to Post #1629 from the previous thread

Very informative, too. Thank you MsFacetious! :thumbs up:

Well. Wow. That took quite a dramatic turn.


MrsPC said: ↑
Wow...Prosecutor saw McGee Saturday night out drinking & dancing!!! Claiming defense is deliberately using stall tactics to delay trial.

I hope he has more than just a few minutes of observation to back up such an accusation. There are people who use a wheelchair, but can walk a few yards. Just because you see them walking doesn't mean they are faking their condition.

There are plenty of conditions that might allow a couple of hours of feeling decent, especially at night rather than first thing in the morning.

Does McGee have a history of faking illness to get out of trial?
A history of unethical behavior?
Or is this supposed to just be the first time it's ever happened?
Is Chase just so wonderful that McGee is willing to tarnish his career to delay his fate?


UndiscoveredTruth said: ↑
Cathy Russon‏ @cathyrusson 11s12 seconds ago
#McStay - Cross examination of defense investigator: You didn't look anywhere in Hawaii, did you? (for Kavanaugh) No.
That would be pretty cost prohibitive for the defense. If asking for the court to fund the trip, I can see the state objecting it was extravagant to send the PI on a tropical vacation.


citygirl said: ↑
Really want to stick with you on this , Missy.
But this is big time. Like end of game time.
Is it physical or is it psychological?
And how much leeway should be given for this
I am really thrown by the PT stating the man is out drinking and dancing.
I witnessed a recent case which had 2 defense attorneys. The lead attorney did the majority of the work, had most of the knowledge and did the majority of the questioning. But he totally worked himself to death. He actually fell asleep in court.

I think it would have been much better if he'd requested a delay to actually get some sleep.


mom2chloe said: ↑
Birds of a feather flock together! Who wants to work when you can gamble and or drink and dance the night away?! I work with people who have a tendency for the exact same and it’s a disgraceful despicable work ethic particularly when you are servicing others. Shameful yet not surprising! IMO
The Prosecutor was there as well, I guess they could both be unethical? However, since they were both there I'm guessing it wasn't exactly a rave.

I'm a bit intrigued as to exactly what event they were both attending. I'd think they'd not want to associate as catty as this trial has been.


Karinna said: ↑
I hope the jurors are smart enough to realize DK was investigated and to date that LE have found no evidence to tie him to this horrific crime. He has never been arrested and charged for it either. Without solid evidence against DK there is no case to answer.
I think if that is true, the state should have no problem just showing the evidence that DK was in Hawaii. I mean is it really worth fighting to keep DK's name out of it, when you could just display the proof?

I would NOT want a jury to assume someone was investigated. Because they aren't always investigated. That's how people get wrongly convicted, because the state gets confirmatory bias and doesn't investigate anyone else.

I hope the state simply shows the proof, so that the jury doesn't have to wonder.


smr said: ↑
Within Sight Of Trial’s End, Merritt’s Defense In A State Of Exhaustive Collapse | SBCSentinel

"After testimony concluded on Wednesday, a bleary-eyed Maline explained to the Sentinel why he, McGee and Guerard are being so exacting and driving themselves to the point of disintegration.
“In most cases, the defense needs only to demonstrate to the jury that there is reasonable doubt about the defendant’s guilt to prevail,” he said. “This case is different, way different. You have babies – a three-year-old and a four-year-old – whose heads were beaten in with a hammer. Showing that there is some doubt our client did this will not suffice, not in this case. We have to prove by a country mile that he is absolutely innocent. We can’t let anything that the prosecution does or says go unchallenged.”
Click to expand...

THIS IS 100000% TRUE.
There are certain cases where you don't go in with the presumption of innocence. You go in guilty until PROVEN innocent. Maline is completely accurate on this. They do have to go above and beyond what a regular defense would need to do. No doubt about it.

We just dealt with a case where the defense thought they'd demonstrated innocence, (with an electronic alibi for starters) but the jury convicted because the correct suspect wasn't allowed to be introduced at all.

The correct suspect also was NEVER investigated. At all. Period. They found the defendant and decided he did it and quit investigating. At least one witness lied to cover for the true suspect, but we couldn't point that out either. It was appalling.

So, the jury convicted the one they had in front of them, even though there absolutely was not evidence to support the conviction because they wanted to hold someone accountable.

This jury will likely be looking for any justification to hold someone responsible for these brutal crimes. If there isn't another suspect offered and if everything the state says isn't rebutted, the defense will end up with a client on death row regardless of guilt.

 

[Funky funky]

Death penalty or not, an oxygen thief like Chase Merritt, who brutally murdered 2 defenceless children, will be a dead man walking in prison IMO.