CA - Joey, Summer, Gianni, Joseph Jr McStay Murders - Feb 4th 2010 #5

[Force Ten]

Because they only have the video starting at 7pm and he arrived before 7pm. In the video we do see other vehicles driving straight ahead but they haven't analysed them because there would be no proof it related to the McStays house. Same could be true for the hour 6pm to 7pm, no proof it was related. They've only concentrated on the parts they have because they can show them turning into the driveway (the Dodge) and out of the driveway (the unidentified truck). A vehicle driving straight ahead could be going to any house in the cul de sac.

The camera has the dodge on video arriving the day before, in daylight. I remember Rodriguez asking Michely to confirm it.

 

[missy1974]

But speaking on CNN in 2010 he said: 'My understanding was in the last year he’d been having these vertigo type symptoms. He was in the hospital for a couple of weeks, and on the (February) 4, he was talking to my mother and he had to pull over when he was driving home because he felt vertigo type symptoms.'

Joseph McStay feared wife was POISONING him before they disappeared claims book | Daily Mail Online

Snipped by me....

Do we know from Joey's records that he did indeed talk to Susan that day? Sorry, trying to catch up quickly before heading out and don't have time to look myself and some of you know the records way better than me.

Joey's illness was talked about greatly in those early years, it wasn't something that Chase made up IMO.

 

[missy1974]

Then they should also consider the demeanor of each testifying witness.

Like Sgt. Ryan Smith.... I am not impressed by him... I know that probably isn't popular opinion, but I expect LE to be unbiased and professional when they testify. They are there to get the facts out and into the trial for a jury to get the information.

Again, JMO ... please don't hurt me Sgt Ryan Smith lovers ... haha

 

[missy1974]

The camera has the dodge on video arriving the day before, in daylight. I remember asking Michely to confirm it.

It's in her testimony.

 

[Force Ten]

Snipped by me....

Do we know from Joey's records that he did indeed talk to Susan that day? Sorry, trying to catch up quickly before heading out and don't have time to look myself and some of you know the records way better than me.

Joey's illness was talked about greatly in those early years, it wasn't something that Chase made up IMO.

That statement from Susan has been most perplexing, because she didn't talk to him on the 4th.

 

[MsFacetious]

I saw that JM played Soccer. I WONDER if CM was afraid of JM kicking him, being a soccer player and all and that's why his leg was broken?

This had not even occurred to me. I was thinking the break occurred as a torture method. However, it being a preemptive defensive break makes just as much sense. If you break the man's leg he can't run, he can't kick, you basically render him helpless.

Like Sgt. Ryan Smith.... I am not impressed by him... I know that probably isn't popular opinion, but I expect LE to be unbiased and professional when they testify. They are there to get the facts out and into the trial for a jury to get the information.

Again, JMO ... please don't hurt me Sgt Ryan Smith lovers ... haha

I think it's wise of the jury to look at it as well. If an LE is NOT unbiased or professional then you must consider their motivation. Why are they there? Do they have a personal vendetta? (Been there, seen that!) Absolutely it should be noticed by the jury.

Ok wait... he had recent surgery? How recent? Does anyone know? Was it in January 2010? Is this when his work was "lacking"? I mean... you don't walk out of a hospital after having stents put in and start lifting and making water fountains, do you?

I'm not making excuses for him... but I would like to know how recent "recent" is LOL If the video footage was a few months prior... was this before or after the stents? relatively healthy condition and then requiring stents... Ugggh I don't know how I feel about this lol I would like to know dates of surgery, etc. Was this condition known when he climbed the mountain?

If there is anything to the medical issues I am positive the defense WILL bring it up. Are there any doctors that might be for that on the defense's witness list? They could certainly introduce records without an expert witness but it would help to have one.

The main Defense Attorney used to be a Prosecutor, so he has connections.

He may still have connections. It really just depends on peoples opinion on him switching sides. I've seen defense attorneys become judges and defense attorneys become prosecutors that don't have a problem. Sometimes the ones that go from prosecutor to defense attorney are not as accepted. However I am guessing they have some connections regardless.

 

[missy1974]

That statement from Susan has been most perplexing, because she didn't talk to him on the 4th.

Weird lol Ok leaving now Fight nice WSers I will be back later! Some great discussion today!

Force Ten... do you know much more about CM's health? and when he was in hospital, etc.?

 

[citygirl]

Didn't LE get the hospital records to verify this? And it was false?

When you get a stent, you receive a card to carry with you in case you have a medical emergency. CM would have had one if that had been the case.

Got a chuckle out of this. My hubby who happens to be an MD and pays absolutely no attention to his health had a stent put in 10 years ago. I just asked him about the card. He said it's around here somewhere. Who knew?

 

[missy1974]

@MsFacetious

in regards to Smith... the only thing that I can think of with his mannerisms and his attitude towards the defense is that they are accusing SB of confirmation bias and not investigating properly. My opinion is, as a LE officer, if he knows he did a good job, or his dept did a good job, screw whatever the defense says, the facts will tell the story. In other words.. be professional. Again, JMO

 

[citygirl]

This had not even occurred to me. I was thinking the break occurred as a torture method. However, it being a preemptive defensive break makes just as much sense. If you break the man's leg he can't run, he can't kick, you basically render him helpless.




I think it's wise of the jury to look at it as well. If an LE is NOT unbiased or professional then you must consider their motivation. Why are they there? Do they have a personal vendetta? (Been there, seen that!) Absolutely it should be noticed by the jury.




If there is anything to the medical issues I am positive the defense WILL bring it up. Are there any doctors that might be for that on the defense's witness list? They could certainly introduce records without an expert witness but it would help to have one.




He may still have connections. It really just depends on peoples opinion on him switching sides. I've seen defense attorneys become judges and defense attorneys become prosecutors that don't have a problem. Sometimes the ones that go from prosecutor to defense attorney are not as accepted. However I am guessing they have some connections regardless.

Fascinated by defense attorneys becoming prosecutors. Never thought it worked that way? Going from the private sector ? Very interesting.

 

[Force Ten]

What interests me the most is to know if CJs statement to LE has changed any since they have long been apart now?

I think they most likely have interviewed her again since the PH was held to see if she may have remembered more concerning the day it happened, and all of the days afterwards.

Who's witness list is she on? Tia

We have often seen this happen in other cases when a live in partner is no longer in any kind of relationship with the defendant.

In fact, in several cases it was their helpful statement when they finally came forward to LE much later after the break up, and told them what they had known all along that finally lead to the case being solved.

I wonder if she saw any difference in what he may have been wearing that day or when she washed clothes? Just a thought.

At the time when these type of witnesses first gave a statement to LE some even admitted they had provided false alibis for the suspects when first questioned.

Sometimes their testimony can lead to them being one of the key witnesses in the case.

Will there be things she is willing to reveal now since the defendant has been locked up for years, and their relationship ended years ago? Did she say why their relationship ended in only 6 months afterwards?

She will now be able to look back without any emotional involvement.

If someone is able to finally look at everything with a more objective view from the outside looking in it can make them come to completely different conclusions.

Often they are able to see many things much clearer, and far differently than when they were in the middle of it at the time, where emotional attachments clouded their perspective, and choices they may have made back then or what they convinced themselves into believing at the time.

Imo

Hindsight is never clear. We don't know when she actually found out the family went missing, if it was from Chase or detectives. 2-3 weeks is a lot to go back and think about events, people and places.

Cathy told me that they separated because he was under tremendous stress directly due to the disappearance. To me, that could mean a lot of things.

 

[citygirl]

‘Joseph’s family are the ones who lost the most from all this, no question. But financially I lost everything. I was manufacturing all the waterfalls he was selling and I lost my entire business. Without his sales, I had nothing. I went bankrupt very soon after he disappeared, It killed me financially. I even split up with the mother of my three kids because of the stress.'
'Prime suspect' in McStay murder mystery breaks his silence | Daily Mail Online

Seriously? Was his business not up to snuff before joining Joseph? Joseph became his lifeline? An older man who has been in business all those years? What real man would even admit this? An older man with 3 children to support?

 

[oceanblueeyes]

‘Joseph’s family are the ones who lost the most from all this, no question. But financially I lost everything. I was manufacturing all the waterfalls he was selling and I lost my entire business. Without his sales, I had nothing. I went bankrupt very soon after he disappeared, It killed me financially. I even split up with the mother of my three kids because of the stress.'
'Prime suspect' in McStay murder mystery breaks his silence | Daily Mail Online

Respectfully that doesn't make sense to me.

If he was making all of this money working for Joey as a subcontractor then why was he having to steal from Joey?

And why wouldn't he have paid him back for the 43K he owed him or at least paid some of it?

Does that mean after Joey went missing no one else would hire him as a sub to do welding work? Welders are usually in high demand, and have a heavy workload.

He was just an independent self employed subcontractor of Joey's. He was free to work with any other companies.

He could have easily subcontracted for other companies after Joey went missing.

Imo

 

[citygirl]

In the CM tapes there is an interesting exchange at Day 10, Part 4, 7.25 minutes.
The discussion is about Feb. 4th. He is asked when did you last talk to Joseph. He immediately responds: I talked to him at his desk at home . . .

CM quickly seems to notice that the answer could be incriminating so he offers up without being prompted: I know he was at his desk because I could hear the kids in the background . . . He thus successfully turns the encounter into a call instead of a physical meeting. When asked about what time this was - he offered: about 5:00 or 5:30.

I might be indulging in confirmation bias, but I thought it to be a moment when the truth almost slipped out.

Day 10, Part 4, 7.25
https://youtu.be/rU8KiBBEZHI?list=PLoW1SIeAWaWbwJ1vHpbDdmaU11eqbo5WQ

Agreed. Very telling. Who is to say Joseph wasn't on his phone in the bathroom, the bedroom,anywhere else in the house?

 

[Force Ten]

Weird lol Ok leaving now Fight nice WSers I will be back later! Some great discussion today!

Force Ten... do you know much more about CM's health? and when he was in hospital, etc.?

I don't know of any hospital visits or surgery. Could be another propogated story. Chase has had CHF since was the age of 2. That comes directly from his grandmother.

 

[citygirl]

Interesting info from the courtroom. Hope you continue to tell us more. I'm interested in who (e.g. which relatives) will be in the audience. I hope that alternate, should he happen to replace a juror during the deliberations, will not base his decision partly on his interpretation of CM'S reactions during the hearings.

Can't let this slide. The jury is there to assess the witnesses, the attorneys and the defendant. All part of the process.

 

[Force Ten]

Seriously? Was his business not up to snuff before joining Joseph? Joseph became his lifeline? An older man who has been in business all those years? What real man would even admit this? An older man with 3 children to support?

Right? Why is he pushing the blaim on his failures on Joseph disappearing?

 

[citygirl]

But the Trooper wasn't parked at the house.

Do we know this for sure?

 

[citygirl]

Then they should also consider the demeanor of each testifying witness.

Agreed.

 

[Funky funky]

Respectfully that doesn't make sense to me.

If he was making all of this money working for Joey as a subcontractor then why was he having to steal from Joey?

And why wouldn't he have paid him back for the 43K he owed him or at least paid some of it?

Does that mean after Joey went missing no one else would hire him as a sub to do welding work? Welders are usually in high demand, and have a heavy workload.

He was just an independent self employed subcontractor of Joey's. He was free to work with any other companies.

He could have easily subcontracted for other companies after Joey went missing.

Imo

Agreed. I assume his cash flow problems were the result of being a gambler - horrible addiction - an alcoholic will eventually fall down but a gambler will keep going until they lose everything. And I’m thinking the reason he said his business was finished was so that he could lay foundations to provide another reason of why he couldn’t have possibly murdered the family. All that interview indicated to me is what a brazen liar Merritt is.

 

[citygirl]

Like Sgt. Ryan Smith.... I am not impressed by him... I know that probably isn't popular opinion, but I expect LE to be unbiased and professional when they testify. They are there to get the facts out and into the trial for a jury to get the information.

Again, JMO ... please don't hurt me Sgt Ryan Smith lovers ... haha

Professional ? Yes. But unbiased?