CA - Joey, Summer, Gianni, Joseph Jr McStay Murders - Feb 4th 2010 #7

[missy1974]

It will be so fascinating if she testifies

I agree. There is so much I don't know about her, or her and Chase's relationship that I don't understand lol I don't know how much they will go into, but I do think it will be interesting.

 

[missy1974]

She would of know within a week of the 4th the Family had gone missing and so why wouldn’t she remembered that Chase had his phone off for multiple hours and was unaccounted for as well during that time period. We are talking days where Chase would of been acting off and not answering his phone and so on.

That would of stood out like a sore thumb.


IMO

Maybe we will hear that from her, or maybe we won't. Maybe there was nothing "off" to her? We really don't know until we hear directly from her I think. I am surprised that no one has tried to interview her ... or maybe they have. Don't know! I was looking for info about her this morning and just couldn't find much.

 

[Edmo]

It will be so fascinating if she testifies

According to Inv Fisher (Lead Homicide) they interviewed her multiple times, so I assume she will take the stand.

 

[Mica]

Of COURSE I do. I'm Canadian. The 4th was my last day of work before maternity leave. From the 12th until the 28th. I was sitting on my butt, 8.5 months pregnant, watching hockey and figure skating (among other events) on TV as any good Canadian was, since the Olympics were in Vancouver! On the 28th, it was the gold medal game. 16.6 million Canadians were watching, and 27.6 good Americans were too.

But you are entirely correct. Unless there is a significant event, it is very VERY difficult to remember anything from the past without a certain amount of hints. I'm not surprised that people don't remember much about what happened before the McStay's went missing, but their memory recall seems much better after they KNEW they were missing as it was a triggering event.

BBM, regarding your comment and respectfully snipped by me...

Snip

I'm not surprised that people don't remember much about what happened before the McStay's went missing, but their memory recall seems much better after they KNEW they were missing as it was a triggering event.

I would agree with you. But after watching Mike’s and Susan’s testimony, they didn’t remember much of anything, and they were very involved after the family went missing. It surprised me, actually. I thought they would have better recall especially since they often gave interviews to the media related to key events. JMO

 

[Edmo]

So if it's a triggering event, and it's the reason why Chase should recall what he did that night, why can't the same be said for his family?

Didn't it take days before the family realized they were missing?

 

[katydid23]

I don't think gambling leads to murder very often, but if there are issues with the court it might be something he didn't want law enforcement to know. There was a bench warrant for his arrest when he was first interviewed. This was for failure to appear. Even if Chase lied, the lie may have been to cover up other activity than murdering his only source of steady income, and that source's family.

As to the bolded:

http://www.sfexaminer.com/prosecutor-fingers-gambling-problem-motive-sf-quintuple-homicide/

Prosecutor fingers gambling problem as motive for SF quintuple homicide

November 29, 2017
A plumber accused of five heinous slayings inside a single-family home in San Francisco was driven to kill when a gambling problem left him without money to pay rent, a prosecutor argued Tuesday during closing arguments in the quintuple murder trial.

Gambler guilty of body-in-suitcase murder

Body-in-suitcase trial: Gambler murdered friend to assume identity

• 28 April 2017

An "insatiable gambler" has been found guilty of murdering his friend to claim his identity and clear huge debts.

Indebted Ming Jiang was being hounded by creditors when he killed his friend and fellow Chinese national Yang Liu.

He then dumped 36-year-old Mr Liu's dismembered body in a suitcase near a remote Derbyshire lay-by.


Police Say Accused Craigslist Killer Owed Gambling Debts

Police Say Accused Craigslist Killer Owed Gambling Debts
Philip Markoff allegedly hit Conn. casino after killing, source tells ABC News.


Gambling Debts Cited as Motive in Murder

Gambling Debts Cited as Motive in Murder

GLENDORA — Gregory Rains, the husband of former Glendora librarian Marilyn Rains, had $14,000 in gambling debts and a $50,000 life insurance policy on his wife at the time of her murder, police investigators testified last week in court in Northern California.


Gambling debt possible motive for murder
Gambling debt possible motive for murder - The Nation

THE PROBE into the murder of former night-entertainment tycoon Somyot Suthangkool has made progress and police now believe gambling debts and lawsuit lobbying as possible motives, national police chief Pol General Somyot Poompunmuang said.


and then there was the professional gambler, who murdered his parents so he would inherit cash, so he could keep gambling:

5 Gruesome Gambling Murders Motivated By Debt, Greed, And Power

The Country Club Murders
Scherer may have been a talented player, but his $350,000 dollars in poker earnings didn’t make up for the phenomenal amount of debt he’d managed to acquire over the years. With $90,000 in gambling debt, $40,000 in credit card debt and a $616,000 loan from his father for a new house – Scherer was under a lot of financial pressure. Add to this his failing marriage, and what could be described as a somewhat sociopathic mindset, and you have someone on the brink of snapping.

And snap is exactly what he did. In 2008, on a sunny day in March, Scherer visited his parents at their country club home in California. Scherer’s family, consisting of his parents and sister, were very close. They regularly went on holidays together and kept in touch through phone calls and emails. There was no reason for Scherer’s parents to have been surprised when their son suddenly appeared at the door. After welcoming Scherer in, his father turned his back for a moment. Scherer took the opportunity to pick up a baseball bat and viciously beat his father until he was on the ground and incapable of moving. His mother stood screaming in horror. Scherer’s father died after multiple blunt force trauma injuries to his head, at which point Scherer turned to his mother, Charlene. She suffered at least twenty blunt force injuries to her head. She also had her wrists, carotid arteries and jugular vein slit open.

In an attempt to make the murder look like a robbery, Scherer then stood in his parent’s blood with a pair of Nike shoes he’d bought the day before in a size different from his own. He then walked over the house in the direction of valuables, pulling aside sheets, knocking vases and emptying drawers. Scherer removed all murder weapons before exiting the scene. Ironically, it was his deliberate and careful attempt to stage the crime scene as burglary which had detectives suspecting there was something more to the case.

 

[citygirl]

I hope I never lose my memory... my hubby, and especially my kids wish I had lost it a long time ago LOL In a former life, I used to code medical records, having a good memory made my job exceptionally easy!

I have a cousin that plays in the NHL... it is definitely in my blood! Don't need to be Canadian to love it Schitt's Creek is awesome ;-)

I was a nurse back in the day. Retained everything. Never forgot a face. I have to say when I read all the memory stuff I can see how it fades over time.
My boys wanted us to move to Canada because of hockey. LOL.
And my last OT . Haven't been able to watch season 5. Can't wait to binge on netflix. So many of us were in mourning when season 4 ended. It's good medicine.

 

[citygirl]

It will be so fascinating if she testifies

I am really anticipating her testimony. I HOPE they have the live stream under control by then.

 

[QueenBofOB]

Did Susan sit down at Joey's computer on the 4th, and write out a check in her name as payee?

Or, have her cell phone ping out in Victorville near the gravesites, a few days after her son was last heard from?

 

[citygirl]

Citygirl. Maybe I can give you some answers.
Joey and Summer lived in a rather new and remote subdivision here in California.
It's rare for neighbors to know or visit each other.
Seriously rare.
I've lived in Fallbrook since January 2000.
I've been invited in to exactly 2 houses during all of this time.
People here come home from a long day of work, a long commute, go into their homes and shut the world out.
Maybe that sounds strange to you. But that's actually the way things are here.
I think that it was easy for Chase to move cars around without being noticed.
Very easy. Just my op.

I had that sense just from looking at the pictures of the neighborhood and houses. And I remember a family interviewed back in the day that had young children. The kids had briefly interacted. They lived closer to the cul-de-sac, I think. I did think that the cul-de-sac was somewhat a problem. No easy in and out.

 

[Tortoise]

So if it's a triggering event, and it's the reason why Chase should recall what he did that night, why can't the same be said for his family?

Did his family have a problem a week or two after the disappearance recalling what they were doing?

 

[MsFacetious]

I agree. There is so much I don't know about her, or her and Chase's relationship that I don't understand lol I don't know how much they will go into, but I do think it will be interesting.

I don't see how she could avoid testifying. If one side doesn't call her the other will. She's too central to the case to not be called.

Anyone who doesn't want to hear legal rambling should probably skip my posts.

Theft is a classic dishonesty offence

Well actually over here it's more complicated than that under the law, believe it or not! I actually just researched this issue last month. (We have every intention of introducing the defendant's prior ourselves but we wanted to have the first word on it to the jury.)

So to bring in a prior conviction of a defendant to impeach them if they testify. The current rules in my state require that there needs to be an element of untruthfulness, dishonest act or false statement otherwise it shall be excluded.

The phrase "dishonest act" only applies to a narrow subset of criminal convictions, thus the crime must include the elements of a dishonest act or false statement for the prior conviction to be admissible.

According to the Supreme Court "theft" does NOT meet the criteria of a dishonest act or false statement unless a fraudulent act or deception is involved (i.e. theft by deception or identify fraud.)

I was rather surprised myself at this finding. However it made sense once I thought about it. You can be charged with theft without being dishonest. There are misunderstandings, forgetting to return a rental, etc but fraud or deception means the intent was there.

These little nuances in the law complicate things a lot!

 

[Edmo]

Speaking of CJ. Is it true she filed a restraining order against Chase 3 months after the murders took place?

 

[oceanblueeyes]

I am really anticipating her testimony. I HOPE they have the live stream under control by then.

Imo, the state will definitely be calling her as a state witness.

That's why the investigators have interviewed her several times. It shows each time they learned more information causing her to be interviewed several times since the PH.

Imo

 

[Mica]

delete

 

[Mica]

Speaking of CJ. Is it true she filed a restraining order against Chase 3 months after the murders took place?

I checked Pacer and could find no record. I don't know if restraining orders would be found in Pacer though.

 

[citygirl]

I don't see how she could avoid testifying. If one side doesn't call her the other will. She's too central to the case to not be called.

Anyone who doesn't want to hear legal rambling should probably skip my posts.




Well actually over here it's more complicated than that under the law, believe it or not! I actually just researched this issue last month. (We have every intention of introducing the defendant's prior ourselves but we wanted to have the first word on it to the jury.)

So to bring in a prior conviction of a defendant to impeach them if they testify. The current rules in my state require that there needs to be an element of untruthfulness, dishonest act or false statement otherwise it shall be excluded.

The phrase "dishonest act" only applies to a narrow subset of criminal convictions, thus the crime must include the elements of a dishonest act or false statement for the prior conviction to be admissible.

According to the Supreme Court "theft" does NOT meet the criteria of a dishonest act or false statement unless a fraudulent act or deception is involved (i.e. theft by deception or identify fraud.)

I was rather surprised myself at this finding. However it made sense once I thought about it. You can be charged with theft without being dishonest. There are misunderstandings, forgetting to return a rental, etc but fraud or deception means the intent was there.

These little nuances in the law complicate things a lot!

I enjoy your posts. You explain the law very clearly.
One question? If CJ is called by the prosecution is she automatically classified as a hostile witness? How does that work?

 

[mom2chloe]

The blockbuster purchases weren't made on the 4th and for an alibi. I only showed them to show that somehow, someway he was watching movies, as some have stated that it was an outright lie because no way he could because he didn't own a TV.

Do we know what movies he rented? TIA!

 

[HelenK]

Ripoff Report: Waterfalls By Chase - San Dimas, California Furniture & Furnishings

Ripoff Report: Waterfalls By Chase - San Dimas, California Outdoor Furniture & Equipment

Ripoff Report: I Design 4u Chase Merritt - Pomona, California Outdoor Furniture & Equipment

I'm aware of these. What do they have to do with Joseph McStay?

 

[cobalt sky]

Did Susan sit down at Joey's computer on the 4th, and write out a check in her name as payee?

I don't know. But that's not what we were talking about. We were talking about faulty memory vs. lies. If Joey's own mother can't remember when she last talked to her own son before he disappeared, why would I expect Chase to remember what movie or tv he watched on the 4th? If Chase is lying because he changed his story as to what he watched on tv or didn't watch, is Susan lying about the last time she talked to Joey?