CA - Jonathan Gerrish, Ellen Chung, daughter, 1 & dog, suspicious death hiking area, Aug 2021 #4

[Lex Parsimoniae]

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I think they simply did not realize how dangerous it was.

 

[Curious_in_NC]

Those hiking times are not speedy hike - just slightly faster than the 2 mph the rest of us can do in varied terrain.

I don't think the training that JG did qualifies him as "great stamina" like an Olympian, but I can tell you that even top level marathoners have died of heat in Grand Canyon (and elsewhere).rsbm

I agree. I'm several years older than JG and 19 min/mile is about my pace on a flat shady trail. With my dog, and/or on more challenging terrain, it varies between 20-30 min/mile.

What we really don't know is how much both adults had been hiking or exercising outdoors in the preceding weeks. Were they both acclimatized and had been regularly hiking in the heat? Was 8 miles a typical distance? A friend was quoted in MSM as saying they went hiking every weekend but that doesn't really provide this info. Based solely on JG's AllTrails data from several months prior, 8 miles was longer than his usual hikes up to that point.

 

[sfinkz]

Those hiking times are not speedy hike - just slightly faster than the 2 mph the rest of us can do in varied terrain.

I don't think the training that JG did qualifies him as "great stamina" like an Olympian, but I can tell you that even top level marathoners have died of heat in Grand Canyon (and elsewhere).

Carrying 35 lbs is typical for what the average backpacker in Grand Canyon or Yosemite would carry for a multi-day trip, and JG was presumably used to carrying the baby. I could certainly carry my 1 year old on Sierra hikes back in the day, and I would say I was just of average fitness.

Not that fitness protects against heat. We still await the more complete toxicology report - but since they apparently didn't find anything in their water carrier, I'm not optimistic that toxins will be found.

Do we know the capacity of the camel back? I bet it was less than a gallon (8.3 lbs extra in the first part of the hike - almost no water was left when the couple was found). That would have meant he was carrying about 40 lbs, I'd think (heavy for sure). Do we know for sure that he was carrying the water? It would have made more sense for them to have the non-baby carrying person carry the water.

LE, rightfully, not disclosing much but early on identified route (seems elementary based on footprints) and revealed they were “well-prepared” for their outing (based on physical evidence recovered). Other than revealing locations/positions of bodies, which is ripe for speculation, that’s about it. Many here have disputed this. I am taking LE at their word, otherwise to gum-up what little tidbits they have thrown out would be very disturbing though with precedent but I ain’t going there.

Earlier, I estimated a 7-hr journey, including ample time at the river to refresh. The water consumption would be 8L minimum (many here seem to hike faster and drink more water, maybe I’ll try that). Being “well-equipped”, the total weight carried on the two backs is approaching 70#, with I imagine the gentleman doing the yeomans work. (The shifting weight of the baby carrier is much more awkward than dead weight in a fitting backpack). This is not a walk in the park.

A not insignificant 10# could be saved by carrying a filtration device. Did their “well-prepardness”include either 8L of carrying capacity or a filtration device? Apparently so. If they did have a filtration device did they use it? If not, why not?
If instead they carried their entire water supply (8L min ~20 #) for the day down from the trailhead did they at least fill up their empty containers for cooling purposes, if not drinking. If not, why not?

 

[Auntie Cipation]

Assuming they headed downhill along Hites Cove OHV trail, was there a warning sign there about the algae mats at the river?

We've only heard about the sign at the top of Savage-Lundy, which they likely didn't see (at least not that day) since they went the other way.

 

[Lex Parsimoniae]

Great question I’ve been curious about without definitive answer. The affected trails were closed for essentially three summers—the entire residency of the family—until last winter due to fire damage. Perhaps not a continuous, lush green belt but definitely spotted with numerous oasis. (Also been curious about temperature and flow of river at annual and historic lows. I’m guessing 62 deg with 1-foot pools). IMHO

I saw a lot of downed trees in the Google Maps images and figured they were from after the 2018 Ferguson Fire, but just checked Bing Maps. I was wrong. Holy guacamole. The entire slope where they were found was incinerated, all the brush gone, nothing but bare dirt. The Hites Cove Trail down to the river also burned, though not quite as bad. Many trees along the river are still green, though.

 

[MrsEmmaPeel]

Just returned from NYC where I saw far too many pups being dragged down hot sidewalks and red-faced babies, crying in strollers. I almost wanted to shout at every parent I saw

--

While we wait for the final facts of the case, I'd like to repeat this. IMO it is a miracle that first children survive, if their mother is anything as inexperienced and selfish as I was. When the 2nd one came, I finally began to learn how to be a good mother -- but I still made plenty of dangerous mistakes. Without experience of babies (which I did not have) it is so hard to remember they are not like us adults.

 

[sfinkz]

Assuming they headed downhill along Hites Cove OHV trail, was there a warning sign there about the algae mats at the river?

We've only heard about the sign at the top of Savage-Lundy, which they likely didn't see (at least not that day) since they went the other way.

This is the other great unknown I’m curious about. Conflicting reports. Main access from highway to South Fork at its mouth, definitely posted. I’ve heard conjecture from trailheads up top that posted only after incident.

(If the hiking party was unaware prior and it was not posted at TH, only discovering at the source, would definitely spawn panic of some degree, depending upon how they intended to interact with the river).

There are the two adjacent trailheads maybe one-third a mile apart. Typically in this scenario, one would drop of one parent and baby at starting point to get prepped while other parent parks vehicle at ending point, doubling back on foot. As I understand, the vehicle was parked at Hites Cove OHV trail, the starting point.

And the OHV trail bothers me. Someone posted a video of dirt bikes tearing it up, from bottom to top. It may be it was accessed by the party to ‘check-out some mines’, which the loop allows. But certainly the punishing itinerary allows for little dallying. Otherwise, if alternative exists, I would avoid the OHV trail.

Also, if it were my intent to solely access the river I woulda descended S/L in relative coolness of morning, frolic at first best day spa, before returning up the brutish S/L ascent and saving about 2.5 miles of hiking. If determined to do full loop, reverse order would be less hellish.

 

[fred&edna]

I'm so impatient waiting on the tox screen results. (I remember a 2018 Florida case - mother and daughter died from inhalation of hydrogen sulfide - leak from car battery - and it took 4 months for the results in that instance )

 

[Speculaytor]

So sorry if this has been repeated over and over, I have been on other threads for days, and have missed a lot here. I just went to the MSM and saw that part of the River down from where they were found is now closed due to toxic algae. I was just reading the symptoms of toxic algae in humans, and one of the top three is neurological symptoms, muscle weakness/dizziness. I think it possible that they were very ill from the toxic water, they had neurological symptoms that prevented them from getting back to the car before they succumbed to heatstroke. It is unbearable to think about, really is. I pray it was lightning. I was thinking there would be heart damage with lightning, no?

Illness and Symptoms: Cyanobacteria in Fresh Water | Harmful Algal Blooms | CDC

 

[Lex Parsimoniae]

JG searched for Hites Cove trail specifically on his phone the night before.
There's no way the family should've been ended up in complete opposite side of the switchback trail (SL's NOT even listed in Alltrails site)
I personally don't think they would've taken the steep switchback down trail to just reach for Merced River.
They could've easily finished the Hites Cove hike before noon and by the time they returned who knows what happened.
They could've consumed much of water from Hites Cove hike.
Is it common to see hikers take on an unknown trail and just follow along to see where they may end up?
I just have hard time believing that the man planned for HC trail, changed his mind to take on a completely uninformed steep downslope hike.
That is with their baby and the dog.

Loop hikes are more fun than an out-and-back on the same trail. It doesn't surprise me that they would opt for the loop, not knowing it was the Loop Hike from Hell. Doing an out-and-back on the Hites Cove Trail would have been shorter, with a little more shade, but they still would have faced a 2000'/610M climb in the heat back to their truck. Their chances would definitely been better if they hadn't opted for the loop. MOO.

 

[gitana1]

But weren't they found on the Savage-Lundy Trail?

The only thing I know for certain is they were found 1.5 miles from their vehicle.

Briese said the family was found about 1.5 miles from their vehicle, a gray truck. It was parked at a trailhead down Hites Cove Road past the Jerseydale Sierra National Forest station and community of Mariposa Pines.

https://www.fresnobee.com/news/local/article253642528.html

The two trails are close to one another.

 

[gitana1]

I believe that the average 1-year old weighs between 20-30 pounds?

I am quite a bit smaller than this man, but I am able to comfortably carry a 35-pound backpack up a mountain, on distance hikes, and even portaging a canoe a short distance. I would think it would have been no issue for this man to carry a child and a water bladder. I've never carried a baby on my back, so don't know if the child's movement would make it more difficult or not.

MOO.

How about uphill, in 100% weather, no shade?

 

[CocoChanel]

This thread is/WAS unfortunately closed again for clean-up.

Here’s the thing:
There is no point in continuing to repeatedly question why this family did what they did that day. It does not change the outcome, nor does it help us determine how they died. None of that is within our reach. We do not know what was in their minds, nor do we know the cause of death. Questioning their judgment is not victim-friendly and is not allowed. Until and UNLESS we learn more from authorities to tell us JG or EC were at fault, Websleuths will NOT permit posts that imply in any way they are to blame. Websleuths will be forced to restrict the posting privileges of those who have participated in violating the Terms of Service we ALL agreed to when we joined, and that you have been reminded of countless times.

ETA after thread cleanup:
PLEASE MOVE ON FROM QUESTIONING WHY THE VICTIMS OF THIS TRAGEDY DID WHAT THEY DID. There are no answers to that, there may never be, and repeatedly asking it only prompts speculation of blame. PLEASE MOVE ON.

Thanks.
THREAD HAS REOPENED.

 

[Tiredmomofthree]

I live in the San Francisco Bay Area and have spent my entire life in and around Northern California. Toxic algae blooms have been a regular occurrence for a number of years and are frequently reported on the nightly news/MSM. Canine deaths from the neurotoxin produced by the cyanobacteria are not uncommon especially during drought years. There were several in 2016 (Russian River, Clearlake) for example. My point is that the couple are frequent Nor Cal hikers with a dog and likely know about common dangers like toxic algae blooms and would avoid affected areas. What most people don't know about, myself included, is that portable water filters don't filter out the neurotoxin itself. This has been stated on NPS water safety postings as well as different government websites like this one Oregon Health Authority : Frequently Asked Questions : Cyanobacteria Blooms : State of Oregon

Membrane filters as well as boiling don't remove the toxin.

Also, it seems strange that adults would be stricken in a similar time frame as the dog and baby, that is, one adult would likely be able to get back to the car, but it's just speculation. (I understand the dog would have fallen ill much, much earlier since according to vet postings they succumb quickly to the toxin which would spur an adult to seek help IMO.)

I posted a question earlier but didn't get a response. If they were killed by a underground lightening strike wouldn't that have damaged the cell phone? I ask because other posters state that this type of strike doesn't always leave obvious physical injuries and is hard to identify postmortem etc. but it seems like a cell phone would get damaged. MOO

In California we don't have as much summer lightening activity as most of the US and as such don't receive frequent warnings about lightening safety. For example, in 2019 Calif. had 365,225 strikes and Kansas had 8,200,321. And Calif is a lot bigger! That doesn't mean we don't know anything but it's just not always on our radar in terms of safety/risk assessment.

 

[sfinkz]

I live in the San Francisco Bay Area and have spent my entire life in and around Northern California. Toxic algae blooms have been a regular occurrence for a number of years and are frequently reported on the nightly news/MSM. Canine deaths from the neurotoxin produced by the cyanobacteria are not uncommon especially during drought years. There were several in 2016 (Russian River, Clearlake) for example. My point is that the couple are frequent Nor Cal hikers with a dog and likely know about common dangers like toxic algae blooms and would avoid affected areas. What most people don't know about, myself included, is that portable water filters don't filter out the neurotoxin itself. This has been stated on NPS water safety postings as well as different government websites like this one Oregon Health Authority : Frequently Asked Questions : Cyanobacteria Blooms : State of Oregon

Membrane filters as well as boiling don't remove the toxin.

Thanks for that. I’d assumed as much but quite some time ago there was a post citing a scholarly journal stating ‘not all toxins will be removed by filtration’. I wanted to research further. But also same site you list sez the onset of symptoms for humans is generally 1-3 days. I thought much sooner.

Regardless, faced with a life/death scenario, I’m taking my chances with a potential tummy ache later.

 

[rahod1]

Thanks for that. I’d assumed as much but quite some time ago there was a post citing a scholarly journal stating ‘not all toxins will be removed by filtration’. I wanted to research further. But also same site you list sez the onset of symptoms for humans is generally 1-3 days. I thought much sooner.

Regardless, faced with a life/death scenario, I’m taking my chances with a potential tummy ache later.

I've come to understand your take on this IE, they probably could have used the river to their advantage but avoided it. Having said this, I don't think lack of hydration was the issue....so drinking the river water wouldn't have helped in a case of impeding heat stroke. Would bathing/dousing have helped? Perhaps. We'll never know.

 

[Auntie Cipation]

Also, it seems strange that adults would be stricken in a similar time frame as the dog and baby,

I think there is zero chance the baby was affected by the algae toxin (unless it turns out to have been aerosolized somehow and they all breathed it in). Whatever happened to the adults, the baby almost certainly fell victim to the heat. Probably the dog too, although there's the chance the dog went in the water, which cooled him (briefly) but then exposed him to the algae toxin.

I don't expect that both adults were stricken simultanously unless by ground lightning, but since they were a family and not strangers passing on the trail, of course the still healthy one would stop along with the stricken one, to try to help/comfort, and only leave for help after it became clear that was the only chance for survival. (If she was even going for help as opposed to simply succumbing to her own heat stroke.)

I highly doubt the algae killed any of them with a slight possibility for the dog, though I still think heat much more likely.

I think the algae toxin, if it played a role at all, simply slowed them down enough to let the deadly heat take its toll. MOO

 

[Auntie Cipation]

Would bathing/dousing have helped? Perhaps. We'll never know.

When I am working in my yard in hot conditions, as I described earlier, I often wear a lightweight long sleeved overshirt over a tee or tank top, and I take the overshirt off and saturate it with water, wring it out, and put it back on.

When I do this, it will keep me cool for 45 minutes to an hour in mid-90s temperature, however I'm generally in the shade and also have water at hand.

If they had soaked themselves in the river right before heading up, I suppose they might have gotten one-third to halfway up the switchbacks before clothes were completely dry/hot again. That's just a wild *** guess, plus it doesn't address degree of exertion, but I'd think it would delay the rising of core body temp at least somewhat. Of course that still leaves them the rest of the way up in heat more than sufficient to cause problems for the baby and dog for sure, and probably the adults as well. Overall I'm guessing it wouldn't have mattered. MOO

 

[SophieRose]

Ferguson fire is burning in 'some of the most unforgiving topography in the central Sierra,' Forest Service says

“We’ve got this chunk of gulch here called Devil’s Gulch. People go in there and never come back out,” Mackensen said. “It’s a really, really steep hole choked with brush and rocks and the fire is burning in that."

Yosemite Valley closed as deadly Ferguson fire grows, sending smoke into park

One particularly precarious area where the fire is burning was named the Devil’s Gulch many years ago by the area’s first explorers, fire information officer Rob Deyerberg said.

The terrain is “only a place where the devil would live,” Deyerberg said. “We will not put firefighters down in the worst places. That’s where they build their lines, develop their plans of where can we catch this fire on our terms.”

 

[Newsjunkiejen]

I think I can shed light on it. We're well past our prime now, but ~40 yrs ago my wife and I were hiking (and backpacking) with our baby and dog. These days we walk or hike nearly every day with our dog, and this time of year have to take heat and toxic algae into consideration. We live an hour drive north of San Francisco, and 3 or 4 hours from Mariposa. We organized hundreds of hikes and other outings for our club, so we have a lot of experience with hiking, and things going wrong on hikes including the death of a dear friend from a heart attack. I have NEVER hiked up a long, steep climb in that kind of heat. I don't think I've ever done any hiking in that kind of heat. I agree with Runswithdogs comments about the effect of heat on dogs, my dogs have less tolerance than I do. My opinion is that the dog and adults were all suffering severely from the heat and exertion of the climb, but the dog collapsed first. This happened either where they were found or the dog was carried there. JG was older, some photos show him with a bit of a paunch, and he was carrying the baby (and maybe the dog). He was the next to overheat and be unable to go on, either after carrying the dog a short distance or after stopping where the dog collapsed. EC was younger and thinner, and not carrying the baby, so the last to overheat. Leave your husband, baby and dog? No, she would have stayed with them and done what she could as she overheated too, which wouldn't take long. At that point she went for help, but only made it 100 feet/30m before collapsing. I have no experience with extreme heat and babies, and it's just too sad to contemplate, so I'm not going to speculate about that beautiful child. In that kind of heat, and steep slope, there is no "running" to the air conditioned truck. Continuing up that steep slope in that heat was not survivable, staying where they were in that heat with no shade was not survivable, and by then it was too far to go back down to where there was shade. There was no way out once they were in the middle of those switchbacks. My own opinion, based on decades of hiking, and planning and organizing hundreds of hikes.

This is pretty much the conclusion I'd reached in my head, if ruling out any kind of ground lightning strike. I don't think it was the algae or potential toxic gases, I think it was heat exhaustion, and your order of events matches with what I posted here a couple of days ago: Ellen was the last to succumb, and her being found that short distance up the trail from the others was her last ditch attempt to reach the vehicle and/or help.

So tragic.

Some have questioned why the family wouldn't have turned back or returned sooner once they realised just how bad the seering heat was (which they had maybe underestimated at the start of their hike)...

I still wonder if there was something that delayed them making the ascent back up to the vehicle.

Does anyone recall if reports or LE have said the car keys were found on either body? I wonder if they'd lost the keys and wasted valuable time looking for them and retracing their steps? This would've meant additional exertion, a longer time exposed to the sun, and more water intake than they'd planned.

A small amount of water was found in their water carrier, I believe (someone please correct me if I'm wrong), but if they were already well into the throes of heat exertion at that point, I imagine confusion and delirium would've rendered any logical or rational thought process pretty much nonexistent, and they might not have even thought to drink the last drop of water (although I strongly suspect it wouldn't have made hardly any difference to their plight at that stage).