CA - Jonathan Gerrish, Ellen Chung, daughter, 1 & dog, suspicious death remote hiking area, Aug 2021

[Hoytie]

This will be solved whether it was a homicide/suicide or some type of toxic substance unaware to the family. So many scenarios enter my mind that they are too numerous to list so I will just wait for the toxicology reports.

 

[LietKynes]

Reason why CA DOJ is involved. I've seen this happen in other cases, doesn't at all mean it's a homicide.

Brits' hiking deaths are homicide say cops who've 'never seen a case like it'

You have two healthy adults, you have a healthy child and what appears to be a healthy canine all within a general same area.

"So right now, we're treating the coroner investigation as a homicide until we can establish the cause."

It's good that they're leaving no stone unturned !
Every scenario considered.

The families must be in anguish, waiting ...

 

[starviego]

If it was heatstrokc, would the medical examiner be able to determine that in an autopsy? Or does heatstroke leave no tell-tell signs?

 

[Lexiintoronto]

The testing of their supplies will be critical in ruling out a non-environmental related COD. I wonder if the autopsy of the dog would produce quicker answers? I think they said something about UC Davis for that. I sent a chicken in for a necropsy a few years ago.

Off topic, but why did you send a chicken in for a necropsy?

 

[Knox]

Off topic, but why did you send a chicken in for a necropsy?

I thought she was symptomatic for Mareks, needed to know for sure in order to treat others.

 

[Officer Dibble]

I did remember seeing a documentary a few years back, how something similar happened in Africa....toxic gas bubbled up from a lake and killed thousands of people and livestock.

Apparently, there are quite a few lakes where this could potentially happen again, and not just in Cameroon either.

Lake Nyos disaster - Wikipedia

omg!

 

[Officer Dibble]

It reminds me of a case here, in Australia, where a couple were found dead near a river.

Bogle–Chandler case - Wikipedia

The Bogle–Chandler case refers to the mysterious deaths of Gilbert Bogle and Margaret Chandler on the banks of the Lane Cove River in Sydney, Australia on 1 January 1963. The case became famous because of the circumstances in which the bodies were found and because the cause of death could not be established. In 2006 a filmmaker discovered evidence to suggest the cause of death was hydrogen sulphide gas. In the early hours of 1 January an eruption of gas from the polluted river bed may have occurred, causing the noxious fumes to pool in deadly quantities in the grove.

OMG I've never heard of such things as gas from water sources before now.

 

[Officer Dibble]

While I agree that a noxious gas eruption would be very unusual, I could see a potential situation where either the baby or dog was affected more quickly, causing the whole party to stop and try to administer care to that member of the family. Smaller humans’ and animals’ systems are more easily overwhelmed, and if, for example, the baby suddenly showed signs of sickness or becoming floppy, the responsible thing to do would be to stop and try to rouse them.

If a gas was odourless or not of obvious concern, then you might not think to leave an area until it was too late, perhaps.

I don’t know the area well, but I understand there are parts of forest in that state where trees have died from the CO seeping up from below the ground.
Additionally, had there been any old refuse used as landfill at some time in historic decades in the area, this can catch alight as part of the composting process, especially in hot weather, which causes underground fires and small plumes of very toxic smoke.

Good point about smaller bodies succumbing first and bigger ones trying to help them. I wonder if they were trying to get back to the car when the adults succumbed? Perhaps had carried the baby and dog?

 

[MrsEmmaPeel]

Homicide (from the Mirror story) implies a perpetrated murder. However, I still feel that heatstroke is a possible cause that could take them all down. If you haven't read the Philip Kreycik thread, you may want to dip into it. Heatstroke happens fast. Those who are affected do not necessarily know they have it. Or if they know, they can't remedy the effects without cooling the body. There can be confusion and poor decision making (ie walking away from car rather than towards it) which leads to physical deterioration and death. It's very sneaky and once it hits, drinking water does not help. An autopsy cannot prove heatstroke. So in the end, cause of death is inconclusive. (I learned all this on the Kreycik thread.)

That said, we shall know more soon.

 

[fred&edna]

It appears they (as a couple, likely before daughter was born) did a 10-day journey through the Gobi Desert which has intense temp changes day to night. So it seems to me they would be experienced regarding heat exposure symptoms. And, the dog was apparently a golden retriever.

Horrifying Mystery As Family Of Three – And Their Dog – Found Dead With No Apparent Cause On Devil’s Gulch Hiking Trail

 

[Officer Dibble]

Thanks for the info - does anyone know where the closest egress was to where they were found? I.e., if they were in trouble, was their truck the closest refuge or were there other, closer ways to reach civilization/get assistance?

I wonder if the car broke down/ran out of gas/petrol in the car park and then they got heatstroke? Anyone heard if the car was in working order?

 

[Officer Dibble]

My sister, her ex and their dogs used to hike this area and specifically this trail often in the spring and fall. One time my brother in law took the dog in the middle of the hot summer up there for a hike while my sister was at work. He called her mid afternoon while driving back. She says he could barely get out a word. He and the dog barely made it back to the car due to heat exhaustion. It took both of them a few days to recover. This is a guy who builds tennis courts and other sports courts for a living. He is used to being outside in the heat. My sister doesn’t believe it is gases or algae bloom.

Thanks for sharing this. That is very telling IMO.

 

[carbuff]

Treating an unexplained death as a homicide usually doesn't mean anything except that the LE agency is following good practices.

If you treat it as a homicide, gather evidence and all that, and it turns out to be an accident, you've lost nothing. But if you assume it's an accident, tromp around the scene, etc. and later you find out it was foul play, you can't go back and get the evidence you should have looked for back then.

So I don't think it's significant.

 

[SophieRose]

Entire family reported missing, later found dead in Mariposa County

The last contact was a photo they uploaded Sunday at 6:45 a.m. of the baby backpack they take with them.
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So they must have started the hike early to try and beat the heat. I'd say on really hot days in the area, it's about 90 degrees by 10-10:30.

 

[MrsEmmaPeel]

It appears they (as a couple, likely before daughter was born) did a 10-day journey through the Gobi Desert which has intense temp changes day to night. So it seems to me they would be experienced regarding heat exposure symptoms.

Philip Kreycik had equally rigorous training and experience and died of heatstroke. He didn't understand the microclimates of the unfamiliar CA park he had chosen for his casual run. The parking lot was 85 degrees when he began, 20 minutes later he was on a peak where temp was well over a hundred. However, he was running.

 

[dcfi224]

I wonder how frequented this trail is? Being a Tuesday and a hot one at that likely limits the number of people who were out. I am only familiar with hiking in the Appalachians and some of the other more popular trails, but even the less exciting ones, I assume at least a few people hike those per day? (this could be a bad assumption on my part). With that thought process, how long would we expect them to not encounter any one else? I’m just trying to think of “natural” events that could have killed 2 adults, an infant, and a dog in a relatively short span of time. And the fact that no one else has dropped dead there recently

EBM: correction they were found on Tuesday but had gone out hiking on Sunday. Meaning no one had used the trail besides them in over 2 days? That makes me wonder about the justification about going on such a hike, in the heat, with a baby, and a dog.

 

[mickey2942]

Yosemite. I wonder what the air quality was on the date they were hiking. I can't imagine that all four of them drank bad water and died that quickly.

Odd. It will be interesting to find out the cause of death.

 

[Wild Rose]

As a teenager, I was on a class trip to Florida and one of my oldest friends noticed I wasn't making any sense. Thank God for him. The gym teacher put me in a bathtub filled with ice from the hall and they sent for the ambulance. Thank God for her. I remember asking them on the way to the hospital, why are you putting me in a pizza wagon? That is how quick you lose your ratuonal mind from heat.

 

[StillDiggin]

The burnt trees that are in some photos, does anyone know if they have been part of some recent forest fires? I wonder if it was a sharp short fire, but again bodies not showing burns, such a mystery...

 

[fred&edna]

Philip Kreycik had equally rigorous training and experience and died of heatstroke. He didn't understand the microclimates of the unfamiliar CA park he had chosen for his casual run. The parking lot was 85 degrees when he began, 20 minutes later he was on a peak where temp was well over a hundred. However, he was running.

I'm reading about Kreycik now... thank you for the info!