Still Missing CA - Orson & Orrin West (3&4), California City, 21 Dec 2020 #2

[cvaldez1975]

Re: the death threats:

422 PC states that “any person who willfully threatens to commit a crime which will result in death or great bodily injury to another person, with the specific intent that the statement, made verbally, in writing, or by means of an electronic communication device, is to be taken as a threat, even if there is no intent of actually carrying it out, which, on its face and under the circumstances in which it is made, is so unequivocal, unconditional, immediate, and specific as to convey to the person threatened, a gravity of purpose and an immediate prospect of execution of the threat, and thereby causes that person reasonably to be in sustained fear for his or her own safety or for his or her immediate family’s safety, shall be punished by imprisonment in the county jail not to exceed one year, or by imprisonment in the state prison.

A criminal threat is when you threaten to kill or physically harm someone and

1. that person is thereby placed in a state of reasonably sustained fear for his/her safety or for the safety of his/her immediate family,
2. the threat is specific and unequivocal and
3. you communicate the threat verbally, in writing, or via an electronically transmitted device.1

Criminal threats can be charged whether or not you have the ability to carry out the threat…and even if you don’t actually intend to execute the threat.
Penal Code 422 PC - Criminal Threats - California Law
https://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/codes_displaySection.xhtml?sectionNum=422.&lawCode=PEN
Law section
https://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/codes_displaySection.xhtml?sectionNum=422.&lawCode=PEN
Re: California Adoption Statutes and Administrative Code:
State Statutes Search - Child Welfare Information Gateway

in my correction days this was usually a companion charge to DV (273.5a pc)

 

[cuffem]

Braylen Noble's family, specifically, his mother.
The crowd had to be police monitored

Just jumping off your post. If my children, grandchildren, child relatives are missing; no one would stand in my way looking for them or speaking to media. No police, lawyers or angry crowds would stop me. Unless of course I know who is responsible.

 

[cvaldez1975]

Thanks! I must have missed the answer, will go back and reread thread #1.

well to be clear no one knows the exact reasons. they were just discussing reasons.

 

[IReadTooMuch]

@IReadTooMuch Are you familiar with this area?

The area where the apartments are is a “bad” part of town. Lots of drug and gang activity.

 

[IReadTooMuch]

Cool! Will you speak upon the general tone of the community? Enough time has passed where it must be the talk of the town by now. Not specifics of course but the feel as to whether it’s a consensus the boys are dead. Does the talk or your own observation lineup with the thought the geographical terrain is conducive to concealing bodies and evidence?

Don’t worry about the duplicate post. It happens sometimes. It’s just a glitche. If you see a little black pulsating dot? (Idk what you’d call it) at the top right upper corner after posting, just wait until it stops before hitting any buttons and your post should show up.

Sorry, I’m using my phone so it looks like it doesn’t post on my end so I clicked it again.

Honestly, I haven’t really heard many people talk about them missing. But my opinion is they never made it to Cal City. I think the AP know where/what happened to them.

Edit: On the local news stations people are talking a lot in the comment section, and there are a few local people that do lives every night, you can find them on FB.

 

[Peppery]

All children even their own 2 bio children are boys.

Do we know approximate ages? Are any teenagers?

 

[cuffem]

I see the Casa Loma apartments have the traditional apartment set-up for trash. You can see the enclosures with bins on Google Earth Pro in the parking areas.
Looks like the City of Bakersfield collect the trash themselves within the incorporated City and it's taken directly to Bena Landfill (no Transfer Station).

It's hard to ignore the possibility that the kids could have been placed in a bin either at the apartments or elsewhere in the City. Since the trash isn't going to a Transfer Station for sorting/processing prior to landfilling, the opportunity for missing small bodies is increased. Bena is a huge facility, @ 4,500 tons/day the trash is dumped, placed and compacted immediately

Bena Landfill- Source: CalRecycle
1. Permitted Tonnage/Traffic: The facility is permitted for a maximum tonnage of 4,500 tons per day and a traffic volume of 3,400 vehicles per day.
2. Operational Hours: The facility operates Monday through Sunday, from no earlier than 6:00AM to no later than 6:00PM.

Trash Collection - Kern County Public Works
Bena - Kern County Public Works

I recently watched a missing crime show where they found a young woman's body in a suitcase at the dump after 1 1/2 years of being missing.They did have the info of date and dumpster location from the perp.

 

[IHAVENOCLUE]

BBM - exactly. They are encouraging locals to search because it keeps them focused and *not* destructive.

Amateur opinion and speculation

My thoughts exactly...But you worded it so much better than I could! <<thumbup:

 

[Knox]

The area where the apartments are is a “bad” part of town. Lots of drug and gang activity.

When doing a Google search on the apartment complex, I did see a hit for subsidized housing. Not that it means anything, but may relate to the questions being asked about if the adoptive parents worked. I'm sure hoping we learn more details soon.

 

[TTF14]

Some random thoughts.

I wonder if it was the adoptive grandparents that triggered this. I know my grandmother would want to speak with her grandkids especially on Christmas.

I hope eventually MSM look into these boys adoption. I would love to know what prompted them to be removed. Does not seem to be a case of them being unwanted.


Also are there any under the table stuff that goes on with adoption? You know like how there are for profit prisons and the judge gets a cut for harsher sentences ?

I was wondering what triggered this as well. Could have definitely been the grandparents, or a planned "checkup" from CPS/an authority, etc. Something did. My opinion is that these boys have been gone for longer than reported, so an "explanation" had to be crafted. Again, my opinion.

No idea why the bio mom relinquished custody. Could have just been an issue of low income and unstable housing. Could have been more, but the birth family definitely seems to love the boys. Sometimes love isn't enough if the resources aren't there.

 

[cuffem]

When doing a Google search on the apartment complex, I did see a hit for subsidized housing. Not that it means anything, but may relate to the questions being asked about if the adoptive parents worked. I'm sure hoping we learn more details soon.

May not be working because of covid and many people losing jobs.

 

[cuffem]

I was wondering what triggered this as well. Could have definitely been the grandparents, or a planned "checkup" from CPS/an authority, etc. Something did. My opinion is that these boys have been gone for longer than reported, so an "explanation" had to be crafted. Again, my opinion.

No idea why the bio mom relinquished custody. Could have just been an issue of low income and unstable housing. Could have been more, but the birth family definitely seems to love the boys. Sometimes love isn't enough if the resources aren't there.

With technology that allows people to visibly connect over the internet like FaceTime, it is hard to hide a disappearance for too long.

 

[MichelleBlue]

Do we know approximate ages? Are any teenagers?

No, they are not teenagers. IMO

 

[TTF14]

Where exactly was adoptive dad getting firewood from? One of the vacant lots on either side of the house? Was he getting kindling only? Not seeing any trees to chop down around there.

 

[IHAVENOCLUE]

I’m thinking neglectful unintentional fatal injury. I just can’t see intentional homicide here. Two little boys. At the same time? Maybe accidental poisoning, left in a hot car; how else? It’s always the cover up that takes you down. (Nixon) Panicked adopters?
View attachment 278003
https://www.cdc.gov/injury/images/lc-charts/leading_causes_of_death_by_age_group_2018_1100w850h.jpg

Fascinating Chart, ISG!

 

[Lyanna]

Where exactly was adoptive dad getting firewood from? One of the vacant lots on either side of the house? Was he getting kindling only? Not seeing any trees to chop down around there.

I wondered that, and was it raining that day to be gathering firewood?

 

[imstilla.grandma]

Sorry, I’m using my phone so it looks like it doesn’t post on my end so I clicked it again.

Honestly, I haven’t really heard many people talk about them missing. But my opinion is they never made it to Cal City. I think the AP know where/what happened to them.

Edit: On the local news stations people are talking a lot in the comment section, and there are a few local people that do lives every night, you can find them on FB.

@IReadTooMuch Or anyone? Is Kern River, Buena Vista Lake or Lake Isabella near their Bakersfield location?

 

[Bopit]

So as I turned on my computer I found my screenshot comparison (trying to find the location of where the Christmas bag was) and I got a haunting thought. Forgive me cause this is incredibly morbid to think about.

The roads are dirt but they seem to have lots of plots of land in Cal city. It's still a fairly new area and I suspect development is probably happening, as there are lots of half-done roads, seems they're building the city out. September would have been months ago, but what if they hid them on a plot of land being developed (do they do house foundation and cement there, unfamiliar with California construction)? Maybe the other kids were on vacation to hide the disappearance and they were waiting until the house was built?

Amateur speculation

 

[imstilla.grandma]

The first part of the article is the headline. I find it interesting about verification of claims. The covid funding has been a magnet for fraud schemes. It’s a rampant trend and people know how to navigate and work the system. We’ve heard nothing of employment/unemployment for either parent. Do adopters meet special criteria for extra assistance for emergency funding during this unnatural time of covid?

In an effort to fight fraud, the Employment Development Department has suspended what it's considering "high risk" claims. The California EDD tweeted over the weekend saying, "As part of ongoing efforts to fight fraud, EDD has suspended payment on claims considered high risk and is informing those affected that their identity will need to be verified starting this week before payments can resume.
...
People relying on unemployment benefits have been told by the California Employment Development Department that their accounts have been frozen. At the beginning of the year, an email was sent to some recipients saying their claim may be tied to fraudulent activity. Throughout the pandemic, EDD has been dealing with several issues pertaining to fraud.


It’s been 14 days since two California City boys were reported missing. On Saturday, members of a community search party say they found items that could possibly be linked to the boys’ disappearance. The owners of the Greenstone marijuana dispensary organized the search party Saturday afternoon. It included several dozen residents of California City and surrounding areas. According to members of the search party, a Christmas gift bag with one of the boys name’s on it, as well as clothing items were found during the search. The community members say the items were taken to police for further analysis.
https://kernriverradio.com/local/regional-news

Kern River Canyon: I’m finding articles about bodies, body parts and submerged vehicles found in the three water locations I mentioned earlier. It’s tough weeding out the accidental drownings because there have been so many.
Google Maps

 

[Auntie Cipation]

Where exactly was adoptive dad getting firewood from? One of the vacant lots on either side of the house? Was he getting kindling only? Not seeing any trees to chop down around there.

MOO -- I'm guessing that, assuming the firewood story is even correct, he would have been gathering kindling size sticks for a rainy-day ambience fire, not for regular home heating.

People who regularly heat with wood buy their firewood by the cord or go up to the woods to cut their own by the truckload. Not scrounge it each day.

If there was a cord of wood stacked in the empty lot against the outside of his fence, his "throwing wood over the fence" phrasing would make more sense to me.

Incidentally, an open fireplace like that shown in the zillow photo of their house, is really more of an ambience thing, "sit in front of a crackling fire on a rainy day", but it generally loses more heat up the chimney than it puts out into the house, so this would not be a good way to heat a home on a regular basis.

MOO