Found Deceased CA - Rachel Nguyen, 20, & Joseph Orbeso, 21, Joshua Tree Nat'l Park, 27 July 2017 #1

[Force Ten]

A very detailed report on search efforts
http://www.jttortoisetelegraph.com/...9/Couple-Missing-in-Joshua-Tree-National-Park


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There is quite a bit to gleam from this report. First it should be noted the amount of resources used was monumental.

"Agencies and organizations involved in search efforts include: the National Park Service, San Bernardino County Sheriff's Department, Joshua Tree National Park Search and Rescue, San Bernardino County Search and Rescue, the Bureau of Land Management, Orange County Sheriff's Department, San Dieego County Sheriff's Department, California Highway Patrol, Riverside County Sheriff's Department, the US Border Patrol, and the California Rescue Dog Association."

"We haven't had any good solid clues," Messaros said. "This area is extremely rugged. Lots of rocks, lots of holes."

"We had recently hiked the North Canyon Trail which departs from the same parking lot. Our car was the only car in the lot and we encountered no other hikers that evening. The washes, however, were filled with footprints, evidence that despite summer slowing down tourism and park visitation, there was still a steady stream of visitors. The Maze Trail area is both beautiful and challenging. Trails branch off from other trails, and what signage there is, can be confusing. According to sources, park staff have, over the years, changed the route of some trails in the area, but it is unclear whether signage changed with them, or if old trails continue to be used, making it sometimes difficult to know which trail is which. In addition, a commonly used map of the park produced by National Geographic, has out of date and erroneous trail maps of the area, according to several sources."

"The national park has established the time of their entry into the park to be approximately 6:45 a.m., Thursday, July 27, through video at the Joshua Tree entry gate of their car with license plate. The cell phone "ping" that Thursday, that was the last attempt at contact made that we know of, was made at 4 p.m. that afternoon. Park officials have noted that the area of the ping cannot be narrowed down to any clear geographic location."

This is kind of what I was wondering about as initial reports state they went to the park early friday morning. Check out time was 11 at the B&B not really enough time for a 6.5 mile hike. So they were out there 2 full days before JOSAR was able to really start searching. As many as 5 search members had to be airlifted out after one day due to heat exhaustion.

Curious about that ping though. I wonder if it was due to a call being attempted.

 

[Force Ten]

Here is where the closest cell tower is, intersection of highway 62 and Mantonya Rd.




Here's a broader overview of the canyons, the longest canyon in blue, alternative routes in black.

 

[thekarmabus]

There is quite a bit to gleam from this report. First it should be noted the amount of resources used was monumental.

"Agencies and organizations involved in search efforts include: the National Park Service, San Bernardino County Sheriff's Department, Joshua Tree National Park Search and Rescue, San Bernardino County Search and Rescue, the Bureau of Land Management, Orange County Sheriff's Department, San Dieego County Sheriff's Department, California Highway Patrol, Riverside County Sheriff's Department, the US Border Patrol, and the California Rescue Dog Association."

"We haven't had any good solid clues," Messaros said. "This area is extremely rugged. Lots of rocks, lots of holes."

"We had recently hiked the North Canyon Trail which departs from the same parking lot. Our car was the only car in the lot and we encountered no other hikers that evening. The washes, however, were filled with footprints, evidence that despite summer slowing down tourism and park visitation, there was still a steady stream of visitors. The Maze Trail area is both beautiful and challenging. Trails branch off from other trails, and what signage there is, can be confusing. According to sources, park staff have, over the years, changed the route of some trails in the area, but it is unclear whether signage changed with them, or if old trails continue to be used, making it sometimes difficult to know which trail is which. In addition, a commonly used map of the park produced by National Geographic, has out of date and erroneous trail maps of the area, according to several sources."

"The national park has established the time of their entry into the park to be approximately 6:45 a.m., Thursday, July 27, through video at the Joshua Tree entry gate of their car with license plate. The cell phone "ping" that Thursday, that was the last attempt at contact made that we know of, was made at 4 p.m. that afternoon. Park officials have noted that the area of the ping cannot be narrowed down to any clear geographic location."

This is kind of what I was wondering about as initial reports state they went to the park early friday morning. Check out time was 11 at the B&B not really enough time for a 6.5 mile hike. So they were out there 2 full days before JOSAR was able to really start searching. As many as 5 search members had to be airlifted out after one day due to heat exhaustion.

Curious about that ping though. I wonder if it was due to a call being attempted.

They may have planned a partial hike. Only an hour or two. I found it interesting that they stated they were not sure if the two even stayed at the airbnb on the night before the hike... which might put more of thought as to if they had been taking a drug of sorts and the party ended at JT. Would be interesting to know what they were doing the night before. I'm sure LE would check those records. We may never be privy to that info


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[GigTu]

maps maps maps

http://npmaps.com/joshua-tree/

 

[GigTu]

<respectfully snipped>

"The national park has established the time of their entry into the park to be approximately 6:45 a.m., Thursday, July 27, through video at the Joshua Tree entry gate of their car with license plate. The cell phone "ping" that Thursday, that was the last attempt at contact made that we know of, was made at 4 p.m. that afternoon. Park officials have noted that the area of the ping cannot be narrowed down to any clear geographic location."

This is kind of what I was wondering about as initial reports state they went to the park early friday morning. Check out time was 11 at the B&B not really enough time for a 6.5 mile hike. So they were out there 2 full days before JOSAR was able to really start searching. As many as 5 search members had to be airlifted out after one day due to heat exhaustion.

Curious about that ping though. I wonder if it was due to a call being attempted.

I think they could have opted to go to the top of one of the hills to watch the sun rise or view a specific feature, but got lost when coming down. Gut instinct tells me they realized they were lost and attempted to call for help on Thursday around 4:00 pm.

 

[GigTu]

Here's a quick article on a popular day hike. Just a hunch that Rachel or Joseph read some articles similar to this and chose to mimick one of the hikes they read about.- I don't think anyone knows what their actual plan was, or what supplies they brought with them, so like i said, just a hunch.

http://parksfolio.com/2013/09/14/best-day-hike-joshua-tree-national-park/

After reading a few reviews of what was described as “The Best Day Hike” in Joshua Tree National Park, it was decided that this trail would be perfect for my annual birthday trip to the park. The reviews of this loop hike declaring it to be the best, appear to be accurate even if the mileage estimates vary from 6.2 – 7 miles, as this has become my new favorite hike in the high desert. When inquiring about this hike, it’s best just to call it “North View-Maze-Window Rock Loop” after the three trail segments that make up this particular trek.

The hike has been known of for quite some time, but until recently it required some orienteering skills to complete. The entire hike with its various loops and trail junctions are now well marked and signed. Anyone with moderate hiking experience will be able to finish the hike according to the prescribed route. However at times, the trail becomes “subtle” as it crosses over barren rocks and through washes susceptible to the smoothing out of boot tracks and cairn scattering. If you pay attention, carry a trail guide with a simple map you’ll be fine. If you wander off trail to take advantage of a photo op or to water the plants, be mindful of where the trail was when you left it. In some sections, the trail is virtually invisible unless you were directly on it.

 

[GigTu]

And another public article that indicates people could get lost easily, although this group did not get lost. Also note... phone worked in a certain location on the trail.
http://smokyscout.blogspot.com/2013/06/

In between the stacked boulders we could see down into the town of Joshua Tree spread out in the valley. Jeff and David took the side trail up to a viewpoint of Copper Mountain while I chilled out with a view of my own. (When I turned on my phone to take a photo here, it surprised me by ringing! It was the tech at the computer repair store in Charlotte with the sad news that my laptop could not be resurrected.)

From the high points of the bare rocks the trail descended down a wide ridge and dropped into a gulch and our not-so-favorite thing: a series of sandy washes. Trail signs were few and far between here and following footprints were not always a good clue, as many people have taken detours as the washes split apart. Just keep following David.

 

[Force Ten]

They may have planned a partial hike. Only an hour or two. I found it interesting that they stated they were not sure if the two even stayed at the airbnb on the night before the hike... which might put more of thought as to if they had been taking a drug of sorts and the party ended at JT. Would be interesting to know what they were doing the night before. I'm sure LE would check those records. We may never be privy to that info

As per the aforementioned link, it states twice they entered the park early thursday morning.

"The new release states that Rachel Nguyen and Joseph Orbeso entered the park around 6:45 a.m. on Thursday, July 27. This is the first time we have been made aware that the park had pinned down their entry time."

"Some additional details: The national park has established the time of their entry into the park to be approximately 6:45 a.m., Thursday, July 27, through video at the Joshua Tree entry gate of their car with license plate. The cell phone "ping" that Thursday, that was the last attempt at contact made that we know of, was made at 4 p.m. that afternoon. Park officials have noted that the area of the ping cannot be narrowed down to any clear geographic location."

 

[GigTu]

The cell phone "ping" that Thursday, that was the last attempt at contact made that we know of, was made at 4 p.m. that afternoon ( Thursday, July 27)

the area of the ping cannot be narrowed down to any clear geographic location.

We now know where the cell towers are thanks to Force Ten. And we now also know that when in between the stacked boulders that overlook the town of Joshua Tree, there is a side trail up to a viewpoint of Copper Mountain that allows cell reception.

From those two pieces of information, knowing they probably left the car around 7:00 am more or less (because they entered the park at 6:45 and they needed to drive to a post and park so I gave a 15 minute window, in general) is there any way to determine where they might have been 9 hours later, at 4:00 pm (probably already lost)?

 

[thekarmabus]

As per the aforementioned link, it states twice they entered the park early thursday morning.

"The new release states that Rachel Nguyen and Joseph Orbeso entered the park around 6:45 a.m. on Thursday, July 27. This is the first time we have been made aware that the park had pinned down their entry time."

"Some additional details: The national park has established the time of their entry into the park to be approximately 6:45 a.m., Thursday, July 27, through video at the Joshua Tree entry gate of their car with license plate. The cell phone "ping" that Thursday, that was the last attempt at contact made that we know of, was made at 4 p.m. that afternoon. Park officials have noted that the area of the ping cannot be narrowed down to any clear geographic location."

Yes ...I read that . 6:45 can be the night before for some. Article states
"According to JOSAR, Joshua Tree Search & Rescue, the couple is believed to have been missing since around 6 a.m. Friday. JOSAR was called into action by 4 p.m. and had trackers processing the tracks near the couple's vehicle. They believe to have found the couple's tracks heading north into a canyon and several teams were deployed with no results. Other information indicates the couple may not have spent Thursday night at their Airbnb rental." And... "observers have raised the question as to whether the two, who were going to the park to celebrate Rachel's birthday, may have planned to use hallucinogenics during their time inside the park. While we have no knowledge that this is likely or even possible, it would help explain aspects to their disappearance."


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[Force Ten]

Yes ...I read that . 6:45 can be the night before for some. Article states
"According to JOSAR, Joshua Tree Search & Rescue, the couple is believed to have been missing since around 6 a.m. Friday. JOSAR was called into action by 4 p.m. and had trackers processing the tracks near the couple's vehicle. They believe to have found the couple's tracks heading north into a canyon and several teams were deployed with no results. Other information indicates the couple may not have spent Thursday night at their Airbnb rental." And... "observers have raised the question as to whether the two, who were going to the park to celebrate Rachel's birthday, may have planned to use hallucinogenics during their time inside the park. While we have no knowledge that this is likely or even possible, it would help explain aspects to their disappearance."


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Right, but the updated version clearly states 6:45 AM Thursday as caught on video.


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[GigTu]

Yes ...I read that . 6:45 can be the night before for some. Article states
"According to JOSAR, Joshua Tree Search & Rescue, the couple is believed to have been missing since around 6 a.m. Friday. JOSAR was called into action by 4 p.m. and had trackers processing the tracks near the couple's vehicle. They believe to have found the couple's tracks heading north into a canyon and several teams were deployed with no results. Other information indicates the couple may not have spent Thursday night at their Airbnb rental." And... "observers have raised the question as to whether the two, who were going to the park to celebrate Rachel's birthday, may have planned to use hallucinogenics during their time inside the park. While we have no knowledge that this is likely or even possible, it would help explain aspects to their disappearance."

6:45 am would not be the night before, it would be the morning of. They entered the park on Thursday 7/27 at 6:45 am, the phone pinged at 4:00 pm on Thursday 7/27, they were reported missing on Friday 7/28 and JOSAR was called into action on Friday 7/28 when it appeared they had not returned to their AirBnB room on Thursday night 7/27.

 

[Force Ten]

We now know where the cell towers are thanks to Force Ten. And we now also know that when in between the stacked boulders that overlook the town of Joshua Tree, there is a side trail up to a viewpoint of Copper Mountain that allows cell reception.

From those two pieces of information, knowing they probably left the car around 7:00 am more or less (because they entered the park at 6:45 and they needed to drive to a post and park so I gave a 15 minute window, in general) is there any way to determine where they might have been 9 hours later, at 4:00 pm (probably already lost)?

The 4 PM ping could have been the soonest her phone could have gotten reception, as they may have hiked to a high spot to see better or try to make a call. Maybe after all day of having the phone it died when she tried to call.


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[Satchie]

Thanks everyone for the recent links/clarifications.

I think the one issue to keep in mind is the effects of extreme heat and dehydration on someone's mental and physical capacities. If they decided to go on a vigorous 5 hour hike starting at 7:30 am, and then got lost, having drunk all their water, they'd be wandering around in the worst heat of the day, suffering extreme headaches, exhaustion, confusion. While they could have climbed a hill in cooler weather, they may not have had the energy to do it.

Last week an emergency physician died in the Grand Canyon from the heat, after hiking only a few hours on a downhill trail, and only 20 minutes from help.

Edited to add: she got lost from an exceptionally obvious and marked trail that probably ten thousand people hike every year.

 

[thekarmabus]

6:45 am would not be the night before, it would be the morning of. They entered the park on Thursday 7/27 at 6:45 am, the phone pinged at 4:00 pm on Thursday 7/27, they were reported missing on Friday 7/28 and JOSAR was called into action on Friday 7/28 when it appeared they had not returned to their AirBnB room on Thursday night 7/27.

What I'm trying to say... if the night before they partied ... never made it back to airbnb then they could have been under the influence.... ended the night ( which yes was the next day) at JT. MDA, acid, shrooms all are about 10 hours ( shrooms a bit less). It's more about daylight hours and not am and pm when I was stating party ended there from night before.


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[Force Ten]

What I'm trying to say... if the night before they partied ... never made it back to airbnb then they could have been under the influence.... ended the night ( which yes was the next day) at JT. MDA, acid, shrooms all are about 10 hours ( shrooms a bit less). It's more about daylight hours and not am and pm when I was stating party ended there from night before.


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Well there is no indication that they were drug users, let alone partiers. I prefer to stick the nuts and bolts of this, what we do know about them. This is how bad rumors get started and really cloud things. JMO.

 

[Force Ten]

Here's an interview with a member of JOSAR. He discusses different rescues that happen and what gets people lost or stuck. One way is how is people climb up the rock piles and can't get down.

[video=youtube;_INh0-IXq-s]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_INh0-IXq-s[/video]

 

[thekarmabus]

Well there is no indication that they were drug users, let alone partiers. I prefer to stick the nuts and bolts of this, what we do know about them. This is how bad rumors get started and really cloud things. JMO.

True story. I'm not one to feed on rumors nor start them. They were young... 20th birthday celebration. I'll leave it as that.


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[flower_girl]

Rachel and Joseph, Jonathan and Audrey, Olivia and Brian.....what is happening to ealy 20s couples in California?! Olivia is the only one that has been found out of all of them.

 

[Cryptic]

Last week an emergency physician died in the Grand Canyon from the heat, after hiking only a few hours on a downhill trail, and only 20 minutes from help.
Edited to add: she got lost from an exceptionally obvious and marked trail that probably ten thousand people hike every year.

Then factor in that judging by her photograph and interests, she was healthy and physically active. In short, she was not say, a long time smoker with a sedentary lifestyle who decided to hike the Grand Canyon on a whim. Wow, these horrible deaths have caused me to re evaluate my own hiking hobby. I still plan to do desert hikes, but I am going to err on the side of caution.