Deceased/Not Found CA - Sierra LaMar, 15, Morgan Hill, 16 March 2012 #19 *A. Garcia-Torres guilty*

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Whisperer said:
I want this AGT to talk. This is really bugging me...constitutional rights being acknowledged on this forum and all. This is getting ridiculous. Perps are now hiding bodies better, and if they get caught, they take the chance on a jury being fooled by "Reasonable Doubt" and roll the die. It getting worse, folks.
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They are hiding bodies better because of all of these CSI shows, even LE has stated how these shows are making it harder to charge these criminals.
 
I was pretty sure that AGT acted alone, that this was his own sick perversion, but if this Gilroy accusation ends up being linked to him, combined with Sierra and the Safeway attempts, I have to consider the possibility of human trafficking.

JMO, but if he's guilty of all these crimes, that is a wide range of victims (or possible victims). All ages,sexes, and ethnicity's. Of course there are always exceptions to the rule, but usually criminals have "a type" (even if it's as broad as BOYS), if he's really after a wide range it makes me think he's not alone.

I'm not forming any solid opinions until we get more evidence, but I just had this thought in my head all day after seeing the POSSIBLE link to AGT and Gilroy, and wanted to put it out there.

JMO JMO JMO
 
Hey everybody - take the constitution discussion to the jury room and let's get back on track here. This is about Sierra Lamar, not the constitution.

Thanks,

Salem
 
Whisperer said:
I was under the impression that if a lawyer knew his client was guilty because of discovery (and that includes admission) that he would not be allowed to defend him....that he must plea him out.

.....but defense attorneys get away with murder (pun intended)
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It's not the defence lawyer's job to decide the client's guilt or innocence. That job belongs to the jury (or to the judge in a bench trial).

The system will not work if the defence were doing the prosecution's job for them. In fact, if it were okay for the defence to do the prosecutor's job, why have a system of justice at all? Why not do as is done in many countries and have trials that are really only for the purpose of handing down sentences?

The countries that have such justice systems are not ones I want to live (Iran and China spring to mind). Even with civil rights and a system of justice, there are still those pesky 5% of unjustly convicted people sitting in prison because the system failed them.

A defence lawyer's personal opinion is their personal opinion. It shouldn't get in the way of presenting a good defence.

A defence lawyer cannot coerce the client into doing anything the client doesn't want to do. For instance, at one point, the state of Florida offered Ted Bundy a plea deal where he would plead guilty to second degree charges for the two Chi Omega murders and receive life in prison without parole. Bundy's lawyers were no fools and urged him to accept the deal but Bundy refused.

Look where that got him.

But it's not his lawyers's fault that Ted was an egocentric bipolar who had a tenuous grip on reality. They were bound to carry out his wishes.

If a defence attorney believes their client is guilty but the client wants to proceed with a plea of not guilty, that's what the defence attorney has to go with.

The lawyer can only hope that their client's guilt will be obvious to the jury as well. Really, the odds are that the client will be found guilty.
 
Thirteen said:
IMO they should search where AGT grew up for Sierra. Usually perps take the victim to a place they feel safe. If they have searched his usual hang outs its going to be someplace from his childhood that he took her to.
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I think you're right.

It just makes sense. If you're going to do something highly illegal, which is the better choice? Do it somewhere familiar that you know you probably won't be interrupted or do it somewhere unfamiliar where you don't know if the local hiking club is going to come bounding over the hill at any moment?

Plus, if AGT is responsible for the Safeway attacks, that seems to indicate someone who wants to stick to familiar territory.

I just read a new book about Ted Bundy that was really informative (it focused on his childhood/teen years). One thing Ted told the FBI before he was executed was that he spent a lot of time rehearsing various behaviours as practise for murder. For instance, he would lure women into his car, take them for a drive, then let them out at their destination.

From the point of view of those practise victims, nothing really happened. They wanted a ride, a nice young man gave them a ride and that was the end of it. They had no idea that a future serial killer was using them to polish up his skills in luring and manipulating women.

One thing I hope LE is doing is trying to find any of AGT's past GFs, even girls he just dated once or twice. Find out from them where he took them, what he did. Even if he was the perfect gentleman during the entire relationship, anything he did back then may provide clues to what he did recently.
 
krkrjx said:
Yes, it's getting more and more difficult to find citizens who take jury duty seriously. And of course we saw last July what happens when you seat people who really couldn't care less about justice for a victim.

I can only hope that the evidence in this case is strong, and that the people in CA where the jury will be chosen are more on the ball than those 12 from Pinellas County FL.
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On the peninsula, the jury pool is deep with educated people. Having been called many times and never chosen, I can vouch that it is impacted with college educated and professional candidates. It is rare to have one who isn't a professional being called for duty.

Of course, I am speaking for San Mateo, the next County just North of Santa Clara.. Santa Clara is also full of professional people. They may have a better understanding of legal terms and we need that. I have high hopes that AGT will be convicted.

San Mateo gave Scott Peterson Death. I hope Santa Clara follows suit. I think they will do the same.
 
GrainneDhu said:
I think you're right.

It just makes sense. If you're going to do something highly illegal, which is the better choice? Do it somewhere familiar that you know you probably won't be interrupted or do it somewhere unfamiliar where you don't know if the local hiking club is going to come bounding over the hill at any moment?

Plus, if AGT is responsible for the Safeway attacks, that seems to indicate someone who wants to stick to familiar territory.

I just read a new book about Ted Bundy that was really informative (it focused on his childhood/teen years). One thing Ted told the FBI before he was executed was that he spent a lot of time rehearsing various behaviours as practise for murder. For instance, he would lure women into his car, take them for a drive, then let them out at their destination.

From the point of view of those practise victims, nothing really happened. They wanted a ride, a nice young man gave them a ride and that was the end of it. They had no idea that a future serial killer was using them to polish up his skills in luring and manipulating women.

One thing I hope LE is doing is trying to find any of AGT's past GFs, even girls he just dated once or twice. Find out from them where he took them, what he did. Even if he was the perfect gentleman during the entire relationship, anything he did back then may provide clues to what he did recently.
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That's really interesting! Would you mind posting the title?

/ Looks guiltily at the stack of research papers in her "to read" pile.
 
As anyone seen this? ...........

Antolin Garcia-Torres Support Page: The red dot is where the black plastic garbage bag is buried while the shoes were thrown where the white dot is..
9 hours ago ·


Honestly if this person running this page is a fake I wish LE & FB would close it down!
 
Whisperer said:
On the peninsula, the jury pool is deep with educated people. Having been called many times and never chosen, I can vouch that it is impacted with college educated and professional candidates. It is rare to have one who isn't a professional being called for duty.

Of course, I am speaking for San Mateo, the next County just North of Santa Clara.. Santa Clara is also full of professional people. They may have a better understanding of legal terms and we need that. I have high hopes that AGT will be convicted.

San Mateo gave Scott Peterson Death. I hope Santa Clara follows suit. I think they will do the same.
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I live in San Mateo and have sat on four juries. Every time, I was impressed with my co-jurors - smart, thoughtful and took the job seriously. Fortunately, all four cases were relatively simple, but I have no doubt the jury pool will consist of the same type of citizens. Juries are vetted by both the prosecution and defense.

This ain't Florida, thank heaven.
 
Bellazz said:
As anyone seen this? ...........

Antolin Garcia-Torres Support Page: The red dot is where the black plastic garbage bag is buried while the shoes were thrown where the white dot is..
9 hours ago ·


Honestly if this person running this page is a fake I wish LE & FB would close it down!
Click to expand...

That page was discussed upthread. Beginning at post #313.
 
Marlene LaMar wanted to find Sierra's jewelry for sentimental reasons but if a necklace or bracelet turns up, it could advance the search. If a description is not available to the public, the significance of finding a piece will be overlooked. No one would know it belonged to the victim.
 
that whole AGT Support FB page is strange. i do not see any entries from a Malcolm (possibly deleted?). the Calero photo is interesting though. IF her belongings were placed at the shed AFTER the crime, it does make more sense to me that it occured at Calero and not Uvas.
 
PlainJaneDoe said:
That's really interesting! Would you mind posting the title?

/ Looks guiltily at the stack of research papers in her "to read" pile.
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The Ted Bundy book I referenced is called Ted and Ann: The Mystery of a Missing Child and Her Neighbor Ted Bundy by Rebecca Morris.

I found it a fascinating read, particularly the interviews with people who knew Ted during his childhood and teen years who have not previously appeared in any other books.

Ted may have confessed to her abduction and murder in one of his third person hypotheticals. The details of the "hypothetical" situation are eerily identical to those surrounding Ann's abduction.

Something that is somewhat relevant to some of the early threads on Sierra: Ann's family had a Cocker Spaniel. The night that Ann was abducted out of the family home, there was this huge storm. The family heard their dog barking but dismissed it at the time as the dog barking at the storm.

Seems like an example of how dogs that bark at a lot of things like the pack of small dogs next door to Sierra's house start to be tuned out by the humans.
 
Bellazz said:
As anyone seen this? ...........

Antolin Garcia-Torres Support Page: The red dot is where the black plastic garbage bag is buried while the shoes were thrown where the white dot is..
9 hours ago ·


Honestly if this person running this page is a fake I wish LE & FB would close it down!
Click to expand...

I just have to laugh.

This is a page supposedly to support AGT? How does publishing guilty knowledge (if true) qualify as supporting him?

More FB drah-mah.
 
Tuba said:
Marlene LaMar wanted to find Sierra's jewelry for sentimental reasons but if a necklace or bracelet turns up, it could advance the search. If a description is not available to the public, the significance of finding a piece will be overlooked. No one would know it belonged to the victim.
Click to expand...

I think that you made a really good point. It isn't uncommon to lose jewelry. At my workplace, if someone finds a piece in the parking lot, hall, or sidewalk, they usually tape it to a sheet of paper and hang it by the elevators, with a note "found in lot A on 6/4" eg. Eventually the thing isn't hanging by the elevator anymore, but who knows whether the rightful owner reclaimed it, or a janitor took it down because it was hanging for so long. IMO unless it was a pricey looking item or I'd been asked to look out for a particular item, I'd put it out there and forget about it.
 
Annie1004 said:
Malcolm, Isis and the supposed 3rd admin of both boards is one troll who used to hang out on Twitter. I see he's threatening people's lives again and had photos last night of two guys holding guns. The idiot's poor writing style and misspellings duplicate the same behavior of the Twitter troll. For some reason, he thinks he's fooling everyone. Such an amateur! But then we are giving him the attention he craves.

LE has been notified about the accounts.
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I've been out of the loop the last few days, but what is interesting is you mentioned Isis and that map says Ming Wu. If you look at his videos on YouTube, many of them are about Isis.
 
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