Deceased/Not Found Canada - Alvin, 66, & Kathy Liknes, 53, Nathan O'Brien, 5, Calgary, 30 Jun 2014 - #13

[Blue Amethyst]

When I consider the head trauma scars, I think either scars from a brain tumour surgery or the car accident that has been referenced in court documents. I still stick to my thought that DG was the driver of the car accident that killed MH. I pursued that many threads ago.

I personally know people who were neighbours to the Hartley's. The kids shouldn't have been driving because he didn't have a driver's license yet and went to the little store at Aetna which is east of Cardston for Halloween costumes. The person driving the pick up truck was another neighbour and he was hurt badly in the accident. He would have been in his seventies now but has since passed away. It is a tight knit community and people don't want to talk about it so I told my friend that I wouldn't use names. Matthew Hartley and my friend's son were good friends when they were young.

 

[LoriMcA]

When I consider the head trauma scars, I think either scars from a brain tumour surgery or the car accident that has been referenced in court documents. I still stick to my thought that DG was the driver of the car accident that killed MH. I pursued that many threads ago.

^^BBM

Actually, this post in thread #9 from our own member here Blue Amethyst *thank you BA!* gives a recollection from a local about the accident of MKH & his sister....it didn't involve DG....I had been on that train of thought as well...that DG quite possibly had been the 'other driver', but I was mistaken.

"Matthew lost control on a corner and hit a truck driven by a local man"

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...-June-2014-*ARREST*-9&p=10764435#post10764435

ETA: & again I go off hunting for posts and I'm in slow poke mode....thank you AGAIN Blue Amethyst for this insightful post! *I really need to get my speed up!*

 

[LoisLane]

^^BBM

Actually, this post in thread #9 from our own member here Blue Amethyst *thank you BA!* gives a recollection from a local about the accident of MKH & his sister....it didn't involve DG....I had been on that train of thought as well...that DG quite possibly had been the 'other driver', but I was mistaken.

"Matthew lost control on a corner and hit a truck driven by a local man"

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...-June-2014-*ARREST*-9&p=10764435#post10764435

ETA: & again I go off hunting for posts and I'm in slow poke mode....thank you AGAIN Blue Amethyst for this insightful post! *I really need to get my speed up!*

I recall reading a different article about a volkswagen and the other driver falling asleep at the wheel. Does that sound like the same accident?

Also, this is for anyone... I am trying to back-track by going thru my previous posts and they seem to be disappearing as more are posted ( the oldest are gone). Frustrating, because now I have to read all the threads again. If I delete some of my irrelevant ones will the older ones come back into my profile? TIA

 

[LoriMcA]

Much larger head shot of DG if anyone would like it...
http://www.thestar.com/content/dam/...s_garland_investigation/douglas_garland_2.jpg

 

[LoriMcA]

I recall reading a different article about a volkswagen and the other driver falling asleep at the wheel. Does that sound like the same accident?

Also, this is for anyone... I am trying to back-track by going thru my previous posts and they seem to be disappearing as more are posted ( the oldest are gone). Frustrating, because now I have to read all the threads again. If I delete some of my irrelevant ones will the older ones come back into my profile? TIA

The Volkswagen accident was another around Claresholm that was reported in the Lethbridge Herald in the same article as the Hartley accident...which made it a tad confusing at first for sure
Here is an old post of mine with article & obituary from the Lethbridge Herald:
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...algary-30-June-2014-5&p=10724418#post10724418

 

[Kimster]

I'd best not see posts like I just saw again, the ones that were recently removed. :saber:

:notgood:

 

[Tinkerbel1]

I've been wondering about something for quite a while. KL and DG are approximately the same age, do we know if they went to school together? Did they both grow up in the Airdrie area?

 

[Lalalacasbah]

I see your point. However, i was the PG at one time in your scenerio. My brother was troubled, hard to handle, caused a lot of problems. (did not murder any one tho). When he went to prison it was still hard because i felt as if i lost my brother. Even tho it was hard to be around him, the thought of him never seeing my kids again, never being at another family get together, the torture that he may go through in prison, was heartbreaking. My brother was never the same person when he got out as he was before he went into prison. He has passed away since then, and i always thought i would feel a little relieved but it never prepared me or taken away the pain i feel for his loss.

Thanks for sharing, and sorry about your brother, I can't imagine how you felt in your situation. I was relating it to a person (not a family member) I was exposed in the past who was violent and who I thought that 'it was only a matter of time' before their violence escalated to the point where they might seriously harm or kill someone). I should've ETA my post (thought about it after that it might sound harsh - unintended of course).

I don't doubt PG is suffering, and don't get me wrong, I very much empathize for what she's going through also (and all the family connected), I only meant maybe if they were semi-estranged as it seems they might've been and she might've known he was capable of doing something awful for years and have a little relief knowing he can't harm anyone else if incarcerated. I hope I didn't offend anyone, it wasn't intention, just an observation from myself who was around someone in the past I thought capable of something terrible.

 

[Lalalacasbah]

Although DG received an assessment as to his mental condition when originally being admitted to the Remand, there has been an obvious decline in his status. It is my understanding that DG would be attended by a Physician, and since he is on suicide watch, he would be undergoing some sort of mental assessment and treatment to get his mind balanced in order to remove him off suicide watch. There may not be a decision as to whether or not to pursue a "not criminally responsible" plea yet, if he has not had a definitive diagnosis from Psychiatrists yet. We don't know if he has or hasn't as there hasn't been any information given about this. Therefore, KR may not know what mental state DG is in and possibly could have been at the time of the murders. His mental state now may preclude a full assessment in or determine if there was a pre-existing undiagnosed mental illness at the time of the murders.

We have to remember DG is a con and plays people. He could be playing up the suicide watch as well to garner sympathy from the public and families. If his suicide watch is real - I doubt it's from a guilty conscience, it could be more likely because he's a trapped rat in a cage going crazy internally at the thought he might be trapped there forever.

Also, when I asked my family member who worked in maximum security prisons for his career and whose job it was to interview violent offenders about suicide watch, he told me about the 'zero state' psychopaths get when caught and that can put them into a depression (it was discussed earlier in the threads, I don't think you were here yet Tinkerbel1). Not disagreeing with you really, just putting the info out there to contribute the topic. I found the zero state stuff interesting when I was told about it.

 

[winnnancy]

Oh my gosh yes! Looks like a scar to me. He has one above his lip too.... Will see if I can find it.

It does look like a scar. That tuft that remains with balding is usually closer to the forehead.

 

[Tinkerbel1]

We have to remember DG is a con and plays people. He could be playing up the suicide watch as well to garner sympathy from the public and families. If his suicide watch is real - I doubt it's from a guilty conscience, it could be more likely because he's a trapped rat in a cage going crazy internally at the thought he might be trapped there forever.

Also, when I asked my family member who worked in maximum security prisons for his career and whose job it was to interview violent offenders about suicide watch, he told me about the 'zero state' psychopaths get when caught and that can put them into a depression (it was discussed earlier in the threads, I don't think you were here yet Tinkerbel1). Not disagreeing with you really, just putting the info out there to contribute the topic. I found the zero state stuff interesting when I was told about it.

That is very interesting about the 'zero state' stuff. Thanks for the information!

I've also thought that it could be that DG may be 'playing the role' in order to set himself up for a NCR plea, just in case. JMO

I don't know if I thought that any decline in his mental health putting him on suicide watch was caused by a guilty conscience. I think that maybe he's had a really rough couple of months. Sleep deprivation alone is hard on the mental faculties, especially if one might not sleep properly for a while. If he does do some recreational drugs (as had been suggested by someone in a previous thread, possibly because he made meth), then he may have been suffering some withdrawal symptoms. Or, its possible that perhaps LE's interrogation has worn him down...I have heard that there can be some pretty long, hard sessions. Maybe the stress has caused some exacerbation of his ADD symptoms...or perhaps there's an undiagnosed mental illness present as well.

FACT: A person with ADD/ADHD is six times more likely to have another psychiatric or learning disorder than most other people. ADD/ADHD usually overlaps with other disorders...http://www.helpguide.org/mental/adhd_add_adult_symptoms.htm

I can imagine your family member has some very interesting stories. Tough job.

 

[Tinkerbel1]

It does look like a scar. That tuft that remains with balding is usually closer to the forehead.

It could be a scar, for sure. FWIW...unfortunately for the man, there are those that bald that don't have the tuft...they just seem to get larger and larger foreheads
NHL Hockey Coach...I wish I could remember what team...it was a few years back...Stanley Cup Playoffs...his hairline was the strangest I've ever seen...lol. Looked like he took clippers and buzzed his head in the front from ear-to-ear...right over the top.
Anyway...you're probably right...and it is a scar...could've gotten hit in the head at some point in his life...could've bang it easily enough. Happens to a lot of people.

 

[Sillybilly]

It certainly appears that way. I wonder if this was a result of his 'car accident'?

It would be interesting to note as many Neurologists believe that damage to the frontal lobe can cause significant judgement, reasoning and social skill impairment:

"According to one research study the brains of 70 serial killers were examined and of those 70, all of them showed some type of trauma or damage done to the frontal lobe. The frontal lobes are located behind the forehead and are responsible for our speech, our thoughts, the way we learn, how we react to emotions, and control our movement. According to Pennie Packard, the frontal lobe “is responsible for much of the behavior that allows humans to live together in stable social relationships. It is what stops most human beings from acting on their inherent violent tendencies.” (Packard)

http://criminalprofilingworks.blogspot.ca/2011/04/psychology-of-serial-killer.html?m=1

Aha !! Psychopathy and the fascinating little amygdala ... one of my most favourite topics. My friends discuss gardening, celebrities, cooking and such ... I discuss serial killers, psychopathy, and the under-developed amygdala :


from:
http://bjp.rcpsych.org/content/182/1/5.full

THE NEURAL BASIS OF PSYCHOPATHY

The amygdala is involved in aversive conditioning and instrumental learning ( LeDoux, 1998). It is also involved in the response to fearful and sad facial expressions ( Blair et al, 1999). The amygdala is thus involved in all the processes that, when impaired, give rise to the functional impairments shown by individuals with psychopathy. It is therefore suggested that amygdala dysfunction is one of the core neural systems implicated in the pathology of psychopathy ( Patrick, 1994; Blair et al, 1999).

Interestingly, two recent neuroimaging studies have confirmed that amygdala dysfunction is associated with psychopathy ( Tiihonen et al, 2000; Kiehl et al, 2001). Thus, Tiihonen et al ( 2000) used volumetric magnetic resonance imaging (MRI) to explore the relationship between amygdaloid volume and degree of psychopathy in violent offenders as measured by the PCL-R. They found that high levels of psychopathy were associated with reduced amygdaloid volume.

OT .. Like my good ol' Mom used to say, "I'd rather have a bottle in front of me than a frontal lobotomy" :banghead:

 

[Blue Amethyst]

^^BBM

Actually, this post in thread #9 from our own member here Blue Amethyst *thank you BA!* gives a recollection from a local about the accident of MKH & his sister....it didn't involve DG....I had been on that train of thought as well...that DG quite possibly had been the 'other driver', but I was mistaken.

"Matthew lost control on a corner and hit a truck driven by a local man"

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...-June-2014-*ARREST*-9&p=10764435#post10764435

ETA: & again I go off hunting for posts and I'm in slow poke mode....thank you AGAIN Blue Amethyst for this insightful post! *I really need to get my speed up!*

That was the first post I made and that was when I joined WS. I thought it was important that I could add one tiny piece to this huge puzzle. My friend recalled that she should have been on call at the hospital that night but someone else had traded shifts with her. She said it would have been devastating to have been there when her neighbours were brought in. Thanks Lori for finding that post. Thanks to everyone for all the research that has been done especially the ones who have lost family members and spend hours on this site trying to help another family.

 

[bullish]

The Volkswagen accident was another around Claresholm that was reported in the Lethbridge Herald in the same article as the Hartley accident...which made it a tad confusing at first for sure
Here is an old post of mine with article & obituary from the Lethbridge Herald:
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...algary-30-June-2014-5&p=10724418#post10724418

Wasn't there some earlier discussion about another car accident that involved a semi? Some people were wondering whether DG might have been driving that semi, if it was the one that he'd been charged with stealing.

 

[bakerlady]

DG might have faked suicide watch for his own safety so that he would be segregated from the general population. Child killers don't do well in prison.

 

[otto]

DG might have faked suicide watch for his own safety so that he would be segregated from the general population. Child killers don't do well in prison.

If he plans to use a temp insanity defence, it helps if he's remorseful and suicidal, as it could be interpreted as: he came to his senses and can't deal with what he did. On the other hand, it would be difficult to argue that he was temporarily insane, as insane people do not cleverly hide the evidence.

 

[LoriMcA]

That was the first post I made and that was when I joined WS. I thought it was important that I could add one tiny piece to this huge puzzle. My friend recalled that she should have been on call at the hospital that night but someone else had traded shifts with her. She said it would have been devastating to have been there when her neighbours were brought in. Thanks Lori for finding that post. Thanks to everyone for all the research that has been done especially the ones who have lost family members and spend hours on this site trying to help another family.

It added a HUGE piece to the puzzle...I had been on the train of thought that DG had possibly been that other driver....your information cleared it up completely! I am so glad your friend was not on call...I know I would not have been able to handle something so tragic....
I'm glad I found your post....took some digging....I remembered it but couldn't remember who or which thread...but I definitely remembered...& I wasn't coming back to post till I found it!

 

[LoriMcA]

Wasn't there some earlier discussion about another car accident that involved a semi? Some people were wondering whether DG might have been driving that semi, if it was the one that he'd been charged with stealing.

IIRC...I think....think... that was when he was in BC? For some reason that sticks in my mind....I remember the semi but not an accident (maybe there was & I don't recall) ...

Wasn't it when he was eventually caught....for his first set of charges in 1999 or thereabouts? I could be way off on that...

ETA: Here is one article...and yes it was BC:

http://fullcomment.nationalpost.com...dparents-has-well-honed-sense-of-entitlement/

"He was belatedly tracked down — in Richmond, B.C., where he had also been arrested in connection with a stolen tractor-trailer — in 1999 only after Calgary RCMP put him on its most wanted list on the web."

 

[Power of Two]

"He was belatedly tracked down — in Richmond, B.C., where he had also been arrested in connection with a stolen tractor-trailer — in 1999 only after Calgary RCMP put him on its most wanted list on the web."[/QUOTE]

BBM What on earth would someone steal a tractor-trailer unit for? Surely not for a one-time joy ride. They are upwards of 65 feet in length and not just anyone can drive one of those rigs, given all the gears and bells and whistles on them, farm boy, or not. Any idea where this unit was stolen and for how long it was in DG's possession? Did it belong to a trucking company? Was it a dry or refrigerated trailer? Where would he have parked it? The bigger question is.. What were his plans for it??