Deceased/Not Found Canada - Alvin, 66, & Kathy Liknes, 53, Nathan O'Brien, 5, Calgary, 30 Jun 2014 - #26

[deugirtni]

Did anyone notice how during the trial at one point, it mentioned that a lot of size 13 WOMENS shoes had been found at the G property?

Also, earlier, I had noticed something odd about the prints found at the front door of the L home.

It was the testimony from Gallen the Shoeprint Expert (Day#5)

Nancy Hixt ?@NancyHixt
"Gallen-3 prints Liknes tile floor “they were made by the left shoe of a Delta 2 size 13 or another shoe of the same shape or size” #garland" (deugirtni's note: the 'tile floor' is only found (imo) at the front door entryway, there are 3 prints there marked '1', '2', and '3'. All three were of the left shoe.)

Ina Sidhu ?@CTVInaSidhu Jan 20
"Impressions 13, 16, 17 - made by left shoe of delta 2, size 13, or any other shoe of the same shape and size - Gallen" (deugirtni's note: markers 13 through 18 were in the garage. It is being noted by Gallen that 13, 16, and 17 were made by the left shoe. At the time, I had wondered why there was no reference made to marker numbers 14, 15, and 18!!! Notice how it is not fitting the Prosecution's storyline if they were to mention the difference in shoes, so they left that out?)

Also notice how only a couple of the reporters even bothered to tweet about the mention of the left and no mention of the right?

 

[deugirtni]

Further to my post above, here are marker#s 1, 2 and 3 from the front entry; it was said by Gallen the shoe expert, that these 3 prints were made by the left shoe. (Where's the right shoe?)

 

[deugirtni]

Here are pics of DG's shoes, the shoes he was wearing at time of arrest, and the shoes worn by him (which were testified to as looking like Delta 2s) at Princess Auto (deug's note: to me, in the PA video, it looks like the right foot is larger, if anything):

These are the shoes DG was wearing upon arrest (which do not match the sole prints found in the L home); Do they look to be the same size, and further, if they were NOT the same size, would that peculiar note not have been mentioned at trial, considering the prints found at the crimescene were also different sizes?

 

[olivebpa1]

I do not think it's the barrels...

I'm on my phone and could not enlarge the picture of the truck. Are you able to say what you see? Or at least give me a hint!

 

[MistyWaters]

Wow, excellent eye Marmot, in noticing the seemingly different sizes of the left and right suspect shoes! As another poster mentioned, I too thought it was just the camera distance which was making the one 'appear' to be larger. I turned the pics though, and it is very clear that the two shoes are very differently sized. How bizarre!

Any idea why, through actual comparison on my computer screen, I notice the white paper measuring scales that are placed beside each shoe print are also different lengths? #13 appears to be about 20% longer than #14. If the photo of the shoe print is deemed to be different sizes, to be accurately compared, shouldn't each of the white paper scales in the photo be exactly the same length as each other?

I'm probably not explaining myself well but that's the reason I think the size variance of the shoe prints is due to photo distortion. The witness has the opportunity of examining the actual shoe prints, not a photograph taken from a slanted angle.

 

[otto]

What exactly was DG so upset with the Liknes about? I never heard the specifics of their "falling out"....

In 2007, Alvin Liknes asked Douglas Garland to design wiring to modify a previously filed patent. Garland was working on the project at the acreage. My understanding is that the project was taken, or "stolen", as his father put it. <modsnip> In 2009 the patent was filed with only the name of Alvin Liknes.

In 2010, Garland's sister learned that he held a grudge regarding how the business deal was handled. It seems that Garland obsessed over this for 3-4 years. When he learned that the Liknes couple declared bankruptcy in business on the same day that they liquidated household possessions, he knew that his last chance to act was the night they were murdered.

 

[MistyWaters]

Wow, excellent eye Marmot, in noticing the seemingly different sizes of the left and right suspect shoes! As another poster mentioned, I too thought it was just the camera distance which was making the one 'appear' to be larger. I turned the pics though, and it is very clear that the two shoes are very differently sized. How bizarre!

Any idea why, through actual comparison on my computer screen, I notice the white paper measuring scales that are placed beside each shoe print are also different lengths? #13 appears to be about 20% longer than #14. If the photo of the shoe print is deemed to be different sizes, to be accurately compared, shouldn't each of the white paper scales in the photo be exactly the same length as each other?

I'm probably not explaining myself well but that's the reason I think the size variance of the shoe prints is due to photo distortion. The witness has the opportunity of examining the actual shoe prints, not a photograph taken from a slanted angle.

 

[Deleted member 192280]

Holy cow! That's clear!

Sent from my SM-G920W8 using Tapatalk

I'm on my phone and could not enlarge the picture of the truck. Are you able to say what you see? Or at least give me a hint!

Or if PrincessButtercup could tell us? I magnified it and couldn't tell anything alarming. There is a dark area but it could be anything. The barrel-like things, though, I wonder if they were there when the "empty" truck was captured.

 

[otto]

Or if PrincessButtercup could tell us? I magnified it and couldn't tell anything alarming. There is a dark area but it could be anything. The barrel-like things, though, I wonder if they were there when the "empty" truck was captured.

I think it's very unlikely that Garland was driving around with three barrels in the back of his truck. Why would he use barrels if he could put a tarp over the victims?

 

[otto]

off topic ... Two bodies were discovered outside of Calgary (one East, one West) this weekend, both look suspicious.

 

[deugirtni]

In 2007, Alvin Liknes asked Douglas Garland to design wiring to modify a previously filed patent. Garland was working on the project at the acreage. My understanding is that the project was taken, or "stolen", as his father put it. It's unlikely that Alvin had access to the acreage, but Allen did due to his relationship with Garland's sister. In 2009 the patent was filed with only the name of Alvin Liknes.

In 2010, Garland's sister learned that he held a grudge regarding how the business deal was handled. It seems that Garland obsessed over this for 3-4 years. When he learned that the Liknes couple declared bankruptcy in business on the same day that they liquidated household possessions, he knew that his last chance to act was the night they were murdered.

According to one reporter's tweets when Doreen was testifying, she said one of the little outbuildings (one of the ones referred to as 'south outbuildings'), 'belonged to Alvin'. Perhaps it wasn't so unlikely that Alvin had access to the acreage?

Lucie Edwardson @MetroLucie (Day#2):

Doreen confirms Alvin Liknes did keep one thing, she believes part of the pump, on their property in garage. #Garland #yyc

Doreen says far right south outbuilding belonged to Alvin Liknes, the other was Douglas' trailer. #Garland #yyc

Defence is now asking Doreen about dimensions of the building, which she is unclear about. Says buildings much smaller than garage. #Garland

 

[deugirtni]

Any idea why, through actual comparison on my computer screen, I notice the white paper measuring scales that are placed beside each shoe print are also different lengths? #13 appears to be about 20% longer than #14. If the photo of the shoe print is deemed to be different sizes, to be accurately compared, shouldn't each of the white paper scales in the photo be exactly the same length as each other?

I'm probably not explaining myself well but that's the reason I think the size variance of the shoe prints is due to photo distortion. The witness has the opportunity of examining the actual shoe prints, not a photograph taken from a slanted angle.

I understand what you're saying. To my eye, the papers don't look all that different, other than the paper marker at marker#13 seems to be 'wider' (rather than longer) - look at the depth of the white space underneath the words on the white strip; also if you compare each strip's white space in relation to how much there is on either side of the ruler, they don't seem to all be the same. I get the impression that the white strips are to just show the ruler, which would presumably be exact, but the actual size of the paper that the ruler is ON, may be meaningless.

In any case, one reporter seemed to get *all* of the testimony that day in that one sentence Gallen was saying about the shoe prints of certain footprints being a match, and it is bizarre that not *all* of the prints matched, those being all of the right foot prints, and again also at the front door, when all three markered footprints were reported to be matching the test pair of shoes for shape and size, but all three were the 'left foot'. It seems it was only the left foot prints that matched. Now someone here has noticed the visual wide discrepancy in size between right and left shoe prints, and it just so happens that this visual impression matches with the testimony where it's only saying that certain ones matched. Otherwise, the shoeprint expert would not have left out footprint #s 14, 15, and 18 (which were all right foot impressions).

Ina Sidhu ?@CTVInaSidhu Jan 20
"Impressions 13, 16, 17 - made by left shoe of delta 2, size 13, or any other shoe of the same shape and size - Gallen"

ETA: Why would DG's lawyer not have picked up on this? Or did he pick up on it and it was one of those times when whatever was discussed needed to be left out for some reason? I doubt however, that something like that could be left out, since it would be extremely relevant if say, DG were known to have 2 different sized shoes (at time of arrest, say), or if he were known to have 2 different sized feet. Also relevant if he did NOT have 2 different sized shoes and/or feet.

 

[Hatfield]

Did anyone notice how during the trial at one point, it mentioned that a lot of size 13 WOMENS shoes had been found at the G property?

Also, earlier, I had noticed something odd about the prints found at the front door of the L home.

It was the testimony from Gallen the Shoeprint Expert (Day#5)

Nancy Hixt ?@NancyHixt
"Gallen-3 prints Liknes tile floor &#8220;they were made by the left shoe of a Delta 2 size 13 or another shoe of the same shape or size&#8221; #garland" (deugirtni's note: the 'tile floor' is only found (imo) at the front door entryway, there are 3 prints there marked '1', '2', and '3'. All three were of the left shoe.)

Ina Sidhu ?@CTVInaSidhu Jan 20
"Impressions 13, 16, 17 - made by left shoe of delta 2, size 13, or any other shoe of the same shape and size - Gallen" (deugirtni's note: markers 13 through 18 were in the garage. It is being noted by Gallen that 13, 16, and 17 were made by the left shoe. At the time, I had wondered why there was no reference made to marker numbers 14, 15, and 18!!! Notice how it is not fitting the Prosecution's storyline if they were to mention the difference in shoes, so they left that out?)

Also notice how only a couple of the reporters even bothered to tweet about the mention of the left and no mention of the right?

IMO
This is really bizarre. 13 does seem to be different size than 14 from just looking at the photo and expanding. Same type of difference in the other.

I wonder if he did have different size shoes on. I have a couple thoughts on why that could be.

Could his injury to his leg have occurred on a different day which made his foot swell.
Maybe wore two sizes on purpose because of that.

Or maybe he had bought a womens size 13 and a men size 13 in those shoes and he got the boxes mixed up and grabbed the wrong shoes. The latter you would think he would have noticed when putting them on but if he was in a rush he may have not had time to correct them.

The other strange thing is just left prints in the other area. If he was limping around due to hurt foot maybe he had something he was using as a crutch which made him not put down the other foot.

Its really bizarre.

 

[Hatfield]

Here are pics of DG's shoes, the shoes he was wearing at time of arrest, and the shoes worn by him (which were testified to as looking like Delta 2s) at Princess Auto (deug's note: to me, in the PA video, it looks like the right foot is larger, if anything):

These are the shoes DG was wearing upon arrest (which do not match the sole prints found in the L home); Do they look to be the same size, and further, if they were NOT the same size, would that peculiar note not have been mentioned at trial, considering the prints found at the crimescene were also different sizes?

IMO
The Princess Auto photo does look to be the opposite of the garage photos as far as the size differences. In the princess auto photo the right looks larger than the left. In Garage print photos the left looks larger than the right.

This would be consistent if he assume he wore the other two at the different places.

Such a bizarre anomaly.

 

[Coldpizza]

Good morning. New thread for closing arguments. This one will close in 20 minutes.

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...Brien-5-grandparents-Alvin-and-Kathy-Liknes-7

 

[PrincessButtercup]

IMO
This is really bizarre. 13 does seem to be different size than 14 from just looking at the photo and expanding. Same type of difference in the other.

I wonder if he did have different size shoes on. I have a couple thoughts on why that could be.

Could his injury to his leg have occurred on a different day which made his foot swell.
Maybe wore two sizes on purpose because of that.

Or maybe he had bought a womens size 13 and a men size 13 in those shoes and he got the boxes mixed up and grabbed the wrong shoes. The latter you would think he would have noticed when putting them on but if he was in a rush he may have not had time to correct them.

The other strange thing is just left prints in the other area. If he was limping around due to hurt foot maybe he had something he was using as a crutch which made him not put down the other foot.

Its really bizarre.

I think it's just an optical illusion otherwise it would have been raised in court.

Sent from my SM-G920W8 using Tapatalk

 

[otto]

According to one reporter's tweets when Doreen was testifying, she said one of the little outbuildings (one of the ones referred to as 'south outbuildings'), 'belonged to Alvin'. Perhaps it wasn't so unlikely that Alvin had access to the acreage?

Lucie Edwardson @MetroLucie (Day#2):

Thanks! Yes, it sounds like Alvin put a shed on the property (since it's smaller than a garage). If I were the defence lawyer, I would have asked whether he paid rent (I'm doubtful) as it offers insight into the business dealings between Liknes and Garland.

 

[Hatfield]

I think it's just an optical illusion otherwise it would have been raised in court.

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IMO
I thought that at first but 13 and 14 are so close together it doesnt matter where the photo was taken. Its pretty obvious they are different to me.

And I think that is why the evidence mentioned in the courtroom focused on just the left foot.

I dont think it changes much other than I do think he had on two different sizes

 

[Coldpizza]

Closing up now, I'll bring some posts over.

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...Brien-5-grandparents-Alvin-and-Kathy-Liknes-7