CANADA Canada - Audrey Gleave, 73, Ancaster ON, 30 Dec 2010 #10

[No_Stone_Unturned]

Yes, I recall PK telling us that he showed LE all around inside the house.

 

[Bobbi Pearl]

I think the only reason LE published the perp's identity in the CJ case, was because it seemed like it was pretty much a 'slam dunk' case, with the perp's semen having been found on CJ's underwear which was also found at the scene with her remains. .... and there is really no other explanation for that, other than... he'd had occasion to be doing that around her underwear... I think it doesn't have to 100% mean he was the killer, but the fact that he had been doing that at any point in time, was gruesome enough to let it out. He sure would've had difficulty explaining that away, had he still been alive. In other cases, such as say 'Marianne Schuett' (sp?).. police have thought they've known the perp for many years, but without a body and without evidence, they have not publicized his name... and to me, nor should they. To me, it seems unfair to make horrible accusations without absolute proof, even after death. The family still has to live with such accusations, which could be devastating. If alive, a perp would get a trial, and have to be found guilty, before being deemed guilty, so to reveal a name without that taking place, is going down a slippery slope, imo.

I would want to know too, personally,... but... those genealogy sites where people send in their DNA, and from which LE have discovered perps such as the killer of CJ.. they have changed all of that so that it now has to be an express permission granted by the owner of the DNA to allow LE to use it in that way. The last time (a long while ago) I read about that, it seemed that many did not sign up for that. I guess many people don't trust that method, and/or are afraid of accusations being made unfairly? Who knows?

IMO that would mean you think all cases should be dealt with differently and addressed with individual emotions. It cannot be that he may not 100% be the killer - that is why they will not release the name of the man they think 100% took and killed MS is that not how CJ's initial murder investigation went and they arrested the wrong guy? That is why I think they released it, they made huge mistakes in that case and had to save face so they released his name. I do not think our Canadian courts would allow them to release and close the case if there was any doubt he was not the person responsible. Courts do not operate with things that can not be proven with facts.

In the MS case, the man was labeled a suspect, and interviewed on the subject matter, ready to be arrested - then committed suicide - a lot more than C. Hoover ever had, he was never questioned, never investigated.

IMO that equates to a similar threshold and the MS suspect's name should be released.

 

[Bobbi Pearl]

Was there a reason for this rapid clean up? My gut says YES. And the rapid cremation. WHO escorted the body for cremation?

I am not sure it was really that fast. The autopsy was complete, they had determined the manner of death and released the body for funeral services. If cremation was her wish then this would be done before the service in most cases it is the urn displayed at the service, not the body in a coffin. Who and why would you hold onto the remains? for what purpose?

 

[No_Stone_Unturned]

Here is a full timeline of Audrey’s life and death

Canada - Audrey Gleave, Ancaster, Dec. 2010 *** MEDIA/TIMELINES *** NO DISCUSSION ***

1937 Feb 3 Audrey was born Otte Wilma Doveika to Antanas (Tony) and Marie (Mary?) Doveika. Tony was an engineer at Greening Wire Co 1950s Audrey changed her name as a teenager (date n/a). She did not get along with her mother 1953 Audrey (16 y.o.) married her first husband, surname...

www.websleuths.com

 

[Gina20]

1. Apparently the dogs were quiet inside the house. Drug tests showed that the dogs weren't drugged.
2. From what PK told us, he was the one and only person AG let into her house. He and she sat on the couch together, inside.
3. I think we know that Audrey went to LV's home for dinners but LV and AG remained outdoors at AG's house.

Strangely enough, another person claimed to have been welcomed in Audrey's home. It was posted in an online memorial tribute to Audrey. I don't know how long before Audrey's death that was.

 

[Gina20]

I am not sure it was really that fast. The autopsy was complete, they had determined the manner of death and released the body for funeral services. If cremation was her wish then this would be done before the service in most cases it is the urn displayed at the service, not the body in a coffin. Who and why would you hold onto the remains? for what purpose?

Sometimes the remains are not released this quickly by the coroner's office. I guess it depends on where you live and how much of a backlog there is for autopsies. Do the police also have a say in when a body is released in murder cases? Murder cases have a higher priority than other cases in the queue.

 

[deugirtni]

Did we even ever hear an actual COD from the coroner?

 

[deugirtni]

I am not sure it was really that fast. The autopsy was complete, they had determined the manner of death and released the body for funeral services. If cremation was her wish then this would be done before the service in most cases it is the urn displayed at the service, not the body in a coffin. Who and why would you hold onto the remains? for what purpose?

I guess in my mind, they shouldn't ever be allowed to cremate a body when it is an unsolved murder. How many times in Canada and the USA in the past 20 years have they exhumed a body to check something? They should have to be kept on ice or something, until it's solved, or buried instead of cremated. That's just my opinion of course, but it always makes me shudder when I hear of someone being cremated after a cold blooded and unsolved murder. I also hate it when they release the crime scene, just in case. There seems to be so many times when it's discovered the cops had tunnel vision, and the vision was wrong. Personally, I don't trust them to take every due diligence with evidence in the way they should, if they seem set on a particular outcome, etc.

 

[deugirtni]

Strangely enough, another person claimed to have been welcomed in Audrey's home. It was posted in an online memorial tribute to Audrey. I don't know how long before Audrey's death that was.

I have to wonder though... people are seriously such nutbars.. is it possible the woman wrote that message on AG's memorial site, when she actually hadn't ever been invited inside - perhaps she didn't realize it was the same way for *everyone* (except for PK), so she didn't want to look like she was the odd man out, or something?

Then again... how do we know? All we know is that PK says he went inside all the time.. and LV says she was never invited inside.. but for all we know, maybe AG let a lot of people inside, but those people didn't speak up at the funeral, or get interviewed by the news? I hope the cops made that part of their questioning of neighbours (if they even did any).. because how do they even know that LV isn't lying, etc? So many assumptions. And it's disturbing that the one neighbour was upset that he called the cops and never received a callback.

 

[No_Stone_Unturned]

Did we even ever hear an actual COD from the coroner?

Not that I can recall.

 

[No_Stone_Unturned]

Speaking for myself only, the rapid nature includes everything:
- body found
- LE called
- cremation
- memorial service
- dogs housed elsewhere
- house cleaned out
- house sold

ALL of this done without a formal Cause of Death, the wrong person arrested/released, no formal Time of Death, vague notions of who had been inside the house, taking PK's word as gospel truth. On and on............ It seems to be unfinished business.

 

[deugirtni]

Not that I can recall.

Me either???????? Is that not odd? I mean, I know it was reported she was stabbed... AND beaten... and that there was a 'sexual component' (whatever that means, and was it just a staging or an 'actual component'???).. but.. I do not believe we have ever heard an official report from the ME saying what the official COD was.. to me, that is bizarre? Or am I just assuming that is always part of murder cases? But she could've died due to stabbing, or due to beating.. right???

 

[deugirtni]

Speaking for myself only, the rapid nature includes everything:
- body found
- LE called
- cremation
- memorial service
- dogs housed elsewhere
- house cleaned out
- house sold

ALL of this done without a formal Cause of Death, the wrong person arrested/released, no formal Time of Death, vague notions of who had been inside the house, taking PK's word as gospel truth. On and on............ It seems to be unfinished business.

The only thing on that list that is understandable to have been so rapid, for me, is calling 911. But you're right, everything was on massive overdrive. Not that mine was a normal case, but it actually took me and my brother years to finally be done with our father's stuff. I wonder how unusual it is for an estate to be settled and house already sold in just over a month - one month and nine days! SOLD! Did it even go on the market??? Or was it a private deal that never bothered to seek the highest potential bidder? In fairness, I guess with a regular family, it might take some time to know what to do with a loved one's possessions after death... whereas it perhaps was an easier decision for LV to just dispose of all of it, and especially considering she did not have to consider any other beneficiary complaining about not getting perhaps full value for everything? But still.

I don't think we've heard anything about police having taken prints inside the home, to help determine if the killer may have went inside? Maybe I missed it? I'm only assuming they did so in the garage. Did they hire a forensic IT specialist to examine AG's computer(s) and router/modem, and her internet account, etc., to see if it's possible those emails could've been tampered with on the Monday evening? Did police even bother to hang about during both the candlelight vigil and the memorial service to see if there may have potentially been a perp showing up to be in the midst of things? I know they showed up to wave afterwards and say hello, we're present, we're on it... but .... ???? To me, they thought they had their man all wrapped up with a tag and a bow, and they didn't need to do any of the usual work. Easy Peazy.

-Tuesday, February 08, 2011
-“In the last month, Gleave’s Indian Trail house has been sold in an estate sale. Neighbour say the lights are on in the home all the time now.” It's been six weeks Audrey Gleave's murder and neighbours are anxious

 

[deugirtni]

I have to admit that I am really choked about the executor's arrangements (or lack thereof) for AG's beloved dogs. I mean, it's not like she just inherited half a million bucks or anything, just for being such a great friend, and possibly it was the least one could do under the special set of circumstances? Instead, they went to the pound, IIRC, and then AG's friendly veterinarian scooped them and gave them to a fellow who took them under his wing as his own, possibly the man who bred them? I mean, it's not even like that certain someone isn't a dog person, but as I understand it, she ALSO had had a dog, who had died in fact, so... what's the issue that one couldn't take in your dear friend of many years, beloved pets??? Oh man, my blood is starting to boil, I better check out a different thread.

ETA: I have to add to that... that not only was it the least one could do for a special friend who was murdered in a horrible manner, but... the dogs themselves were tortured, having been inside the home and unable to help and protect their owner. It's the least one could have done for the dogs as well, to give them a familiar place to stay and be loved, even if temporary until she herself could vet someone new to take them on fulltime, forever? Is that really too much to ask or even expect in this circumstance?

 

[No_Stone_Unturned]

I feel as you do about the dogs. It seems as though people wanted to get this entire thing over with. Like it all was a tremendous chore to have to be bothered with the remains of a life lived. To be honest, this hurts my heart and soul. It feels like a dismissal.

 

[No_Stone_Unturned]

Another thing. When was the will read? Were the dogs not in the will? My pets are in my will. Was there a will?

 

[deugirtni]

Another thing. When was the will read? Were the dogs not in the will? My pets are in my will. Was there a will?

There was a will, reportedly. I have heard no mention of the dogs being included, although LV had mentioned her special instructions regarding sneaking her ashes in with her previous dogs' ashes at the pet cemetery (but not sure that was in the will, or just a verbal thing beforehand (when??), or what??). I wonder if the will was a generic will purchased at Staples or something???? I don't believe there would've needed to be a reading of the will.. since LV was the only executor and the only beneficiary?

 

[deugirtni]

I feel as you do about the dogs. It seems as though people wanted to get this entire thing over with. Like it all was a tremendous chore to have to be bothered with the remains of a life lived. To be honest, this hurts my heart and soul. It feels like a dismissal.

To have even been of sound enough mind to have gotten everything together and organized SO quickly like that, is astounding, imho. I would have been devastated to learn that a friend had met her end that way. I would have been devastated to learn I may have been the last person known to have seen her alive (on that Monday the 27th, I think there is confusion as to whether AG's veterinarian friend visited with her that afternoon or whether that meeting took place before Christmas?). I would have been devastated to think about how badly the dogs would be feeling. I think I wouldn't have been quite on the ball for awhile afterward, if I had been the dear friend looking after the estate. But hey, let's gedderdun, as quick as possible. Seems kind of distasteful to me, considering also being the sole beneficiary. imo.

 

[No_Stone_Unturned]

I wonder why AG placed so much faith in LV to handle things and to do the right thing when she died. Did AG have a lawyer?

 

[Bobbi Pearl]

I have to wonder though... people are seriously such nutbars.. is it possible the woman wrote that message on AG's memorial site, when she actually hadn't ever been invited inside - perhaps she didn't realize it was the same way for *everyone* (except for PK), so she didn't want to look like she was the odd man out, or something?

Then again... how do we know? All we know is that PK says he went inside all the time.. and LV says she was never invited inside.. but for all we know, maybe AG let a lot of people inside, but those people didn't speak up at the funeral, or get interviewed by the news? I hope the cops made that part of their questioning of neighbours (if they even did any).. because how do they even know that LV isn't lying, etc? So many assumptions. And it's disturbing that the one neighbour was upset that he called the cops and never received a callback.

And it could be as simple as LV keeps an immaculate home and AG did not want her to see hers