CANADA Canada - Billionaire Couple Barry & Honey Sherman Murdered at Home, Toronto, 15 Dec 2017 #23

[Lexiintoronto]

Since the alarm had to be deactivated in order to enter the house undetected, HS had to arrive home first to turn off the alarm. Then, the NW had to gain entry into the house after the alarm was off. Was it someone HS knew and let in or was it someone who came in through an unlocked backyard door after the alarm was turned off? Was the NW waiting in the backyard for HS/BS to come home and turn off the alarm upon HS/BS entering their house?

I noticed a pattern in the alarm company details.

At first the media reported that the Shermans did not have an alarm system or if they did they didn’t use it. But after the murders an alarm company worker arrived at the home in full view of the media and he identified himself. There were many ways to get that person into the home undetected. Maybe the police wanted it to be caught on video and reported.

Then in the warrant documents the information about the alarm system is at first fully redacted and then progressively revealed to indicate what I’ve posted above.

I think everything the police are doing is strategic and there’s something about the alarm system that is key, imo. It’s in the affidavits so it’s helping to establish grounds to obtain a warrant, but I’m not sure for what. And why reveal it?

 

[Bobbi Pearl]

I assume like you the last code entry that is all redacted, time and date is HS arriving home.

What if the alarm system was disabled without a code by the perp, anytime after HS left at 4:34.

Would HS be concerned it was not on when she came in? Wonder if power was on when she got in?

From the looks the alarm pattern is turn on when go to bed turn off when get up. Yes the beeps still sound when a door opens but otherwise maybe help staff did not always need to enter a code if someone had already disarmed for the day?

 

[Lexiintoronto]

Do we know 100% that she actually bought anything at BV? She shopped, maybe found nothing and got cash out for the kids gifts?

Maybe the wallet left out was part of the staging, showing it was not a robbery, maybe HS did not put it there?

KD wrote that Alex K’s husband showed him a statement to show she made a purchase or purchases.

That’s a good point about the wallet, maybe it was part of the staging.

 

[WINDSOR]

Sorry see the post now with these details thanks RHR

Or the perp knew the code to disarm or technically knew how to disarm it, remember the Friday housekeeper noticed it was not active when she entered the home, a first for her it appears as she had to enter her code all other entries.

Curious if LE know the last codes used and when.

To me, it seems reasonable that the criminals knew the codes or had other methods to de-activate the alarm system. Based on their other activities, they left nothing to chance, and were extremely well prepared for most eventualities.

If the TPS has determined that the usual code was used to de-activate, it implies to me at least, the criminals had 'inside help' who provided them with the codes
People who likely had the code would be staff, some friends/neighbours and/or family. Should not be a long list.


I wonder if the alarm system had a 'master-code program' to be used by alarm service staff when servicing the system. This would preclude the need by the criminals of knowing Sherman's code.

 

[RHR]

To me, it seems reasonable that the criminals knew the codes or had other methods to de-activate the alarm system. Based on their other activities, they left nothing to chance, and were extremely well prepared for most eventualities.

If the TPS has determined that the usual code was used to de-activate, it implies to me at least, the criminals had 'inside help' who provided them with the codes
People who likely had the code would be staff, some friends/neighbours and/or family. Should not be a long list.


I wonder if the alarm system had a 'master-code program' to be used by alarm service staff when servicing the system. This would preclude the need by the criminals of knowing Sherman's code.

The WM was, i'm pretty sure was spotted on Forest Heights. There is a house directly behind OCR with very easy access through the back of OCR.
There was a window open to air the smell of paint out.
I don't believe the lockbox was used. I think the murderer had a key or was aware there was an open side door or window.
Someone earlier asked us to consider that the murderer was able to get access
into the house and was hiding somewhere in wait . I have considered that thought to myself that i don't think it's so crazy.
I also believe that someone had access to HS's emails.




















earlier

 

[atomicsciencegal]

KD wrote that Alex K’s husband showed him a statement to show she made a purchase or purchases.

That’s a good point about the wallet, maybe it was part of the staging.

I can’t think that the wallet was staged to look untouched when her phone was not, and neither were Barry’s items. They appeared left as though accosted/interrupted, scattered on the floor in unusual spots.
But who knows, maybe everything was staged. But would someone go to the trouble of staging their items, but not setting the alarm as they left? Who would or could do some of those things, if done, but not others? All imo, but share your thoughts please, people. I’d like to hear what you think.

 

[Expedited]

At 2 PM on Tuesday, December 12, 2017, a painter and his boss were at 50 Old Colony.

It appears that TPS did not take statements from these individuals, or if TPS did, they are redacted.

Does anyone know the name of this company, the painter and his boss?

 

[FPoulet]

Since the alarm had to be deactivated in order to enter the house undetected, HS had to arrive home first to turn off the alarm. Then, the NW had to gain entry into the house after the alarm was off. Was it someone HS knew and let in or was it someone who came in through an unlocked backyard door after the alarm was turned off? Was the NW waiting in the backyard for HS/BS to come home and turn off the alarm upon HS/BS entering their house?

Or, the perp knew the code. Maybe the redacted last alarm entry shows an entry at a time we know Honey was at Bayview. A second person on site? There *before* WM and Honey. Now that would be interesting. It may not be Honey’s arrival redacted. Unless there is a source I am forgetting, I don’t think we know.

PS I know they estimate Honey arrived 8/8:20 or something — but that could be based on Bayview data, not the alarm history.

 

[MerlinFalcon]

Or, the perp knew the code. Maybe the redacted last alarm entry shows an entry at a time we know Honey was at Bayview. A second person on site? There *before* WM and Honey. Now that would be interesting. It may not be Honey’s arrival redacted. Unless there is a source I am forgetting, I don’t think we know.

PS I know they estimate Honey arrived 8/8:20 or something — but that could be based on Bayview data, not the alarm history.

I wonder if different people had different codes. That would be a reason to redact it.

 

[wibbleflea]

At 2 PM on Tuesday, December 12, 2017, a painter and his boss were at 50 Old Colony.

It appears that TPS did not take statements from these individuals, or if TPS did, they are redacted.

Does anyone know the name of this company, the painter and his boss?

Can’t remember reading about this but perhaps I’ve forgotten. Do you have a link to a source?

 

[FromGermany1]

Afaik, there were some people in the home for certain work/maintenance. If they were there, when the home owners weren't at home, how did they manage the alarm system? Was it already defused beforehand? (Have no knowledge about alarm systems, sorry. I'm trying to learn.)
ETA: When was the electrician with his son (future husband of KS) at the home? I remember vague to have heard of them.

 

[Lexiintoronto]

At 2 PM on Tuesday, December 12, 2017, a painter and his boss were at 50 Old Colony.

It appears that TPS did not take statements from these individuals, or if TPS did, they are redacted.

Does anyone know the name of this company, the painter and his boss?

In affidavit 12 D Honey’s assistant SS said the company ‘Father and Sons’ were working at the home. Their company did home improvements, including painting.

Six weeks after the murders the police said they had interviewed 127 witnesses and that number grew, so only a few statements were used in order to obtain warrants. The police have said there is— or was— one person refusing to talk to them. But we don’t know who that is.

 

[FromGermany1]

In affidavit 12 D Honey’s assistant SS said the company ‘Father and Sons’ were working at the home. Their company did home improvements, including painting.

Six weeks after the murders the police said they had interviewed 127 witnesses and that number grew, so only a few statements were used in order to obtain warrants. The police have said there is— or was— one person refusing to talk to them. But we don’t know who that is.
View attachment 487209

"Sheila has only met Honey's son Kaelan and another son Noah and does not know ......."

What kind of nonsense is this???

Kaelan is HS' daughter and Noah is at most her nephew, if not someone else. Afaik.

 

[Lexiintoronto]

"Sheila has only met Honey's son Kaelan and another son Noah and does not know ......."

What kind of nonsense is this???

Kaelan is HS' daughter and Noah is at most her nephew, if not someone else. Afaik.

I don’t know. But Noah was using Honey’s credit card and knew the card information. SS took care of paying the bills so I wondered if there was something other than a typo or mistake by misidentifying him as Honey’s son.

 

[Lexiintoronto]

The WM was, i'm pretty sure was spotted on Forest Heights. There is a house directly behind OCR with very easy access through the back of OCR.
There was a window open to air the smell of paint out.
I don't believe the lockbox was used. I think the murderer had a key or was aware there was an open side door or window.
Someone earlier asked us to consider that the murderer was able to get access
into the house and was hiding somewhere in wait . I have considered that thought to myself that i don't think it's so crazy.
I also believe that someone had access to HS's emails.




















earlier

I think it’s possible a killer was in the home before Honey arrived. There were a few people in and out of the home that day and for the most part Honey and her assistant were upstairs.

A small detail that bugs me that may be connected to the alarm system recording when doors were opened and closed—

In the Friday Housekeeper’s statement she said she opened the door and swept out dried leaves. I’m not sure how dried leaves got tracked into an urban home in winter, or why she wouldn’t sweep them into a dustpan instead of sweeping them outside again.

Why is that detail in an affidavit for a search warrant? There are other details of what she did that day that are just routine, but maybe the police were trying to chart each time the doors or window were opened and closed on Wednesday through Friday.

 

[RHR]

Or, the perp knew the code. Maybe the redacted last alarm entry shows an entry at a time we know Honey was at Bayview. A second person on site? There *before* WM and Honey. Now that would be interesting. It may not be Honey’s arrival redacted. Unless there is a source I am forgetting, I don’t think we know.

PS I know they estimate Honey arrived 8/8:20 or something — but that could be based on Bayview data, not the alarm history.

Maybe the alarm was off when Honey arrived home. It's possible she thought she forgot to put it on.

 

[Lexiintoronto]

I cannot edit my post to add this. I’m not accusing the Friday housekeeper and no one else has. I just don’t understand her actions that Friday.

 

[Expedited]

Can’t remember reading about this but perhaps I’ve forgotten. Do you have a link to a source?

It's mentioned in several iterations of the ITOs (Information to Obtain a Search Warrant). Do you know a link for that collection?

There is a company mentioned, "Father and Sons" which was there, from what I understand, to do some repairs. I'm not sure if this particular company was involved in painting the basement room where the window was found partially open on December 15, 2017. <modsnip>

 

[dotr]

2019

WARMINGTON: 'Window was left open' as Sherman home painted

Since it was a “targeted” double homicide, it was logical that Toronto Police interviewed some house painters who were in the Sherman mansion sometime in the…

torontosun.com

'Since it was a “targeted” double homicide, it was logical that Toronto Police interviewed some house painters who were in the Sherman mansion sometime in the day before the heinous slayings'

'And that a window was left open after they left'.
It’s not saying they are suspects, but those who can assist police with information few others could.
“The window was left open to clear the smell of the paint from the area,” explained a family friend.'

Five years later, inside the Barry and Honey Sherman murders

After a billionaire couple are found hanged by the railing of their indoor pool, a look back at the calm before the storm, the immediate finger pointing that left a family divided and the police still struggling to find a killer

www.thestar.com

'Wednesday, Dec. 13, 2017
With Old Colony for sale, the home was a buzz of activity. There was one offer on the table from 20 recent showings. Painters were doing touch-ups, including a basement room where there had been some water damage.''

 

[Expedited]

A witness statement referred to in several of the ITOs suggests that the painter's boss visited at 2 PM on Tuesday, December 12, 2017, at which time it was mentioned the painter would return on Monday, December 18, 2017.

It stands to reason that the painter or his boss would inform the homeowner that a window would be left open to air out the room being worked on in the basement and it would be prudent for someone to close this window later that evening on December 12, 2017 or the next day on December 13, 2017. Obviously, the painter and his boss would be concerned that failing to close the window could allow cold air and moisture into the room and damage the fresh paint.

Sidebar: It should be noted that the ADT alarm that 50 Old Colony was equipped with, would likely remain operational, even with the basement window open. I'm inclined to think the basement was divided into multiple protection zones and the area where the window was left open would be automatically shunted when the alarm was activated - therefore only this zone would be left unprotected.