GUILTY Canada - Jasmine Lovett, mid 20s, and daughter, 2, Calgary, 16 April 2019 *Arrest*

[MistyWaters]

To be clear, I said that there is no chance of this case fading from the public eye. Certainly not. There have been a number of multiple murders in southern Alberta involving children in recent years. The Saretsky, Garland and Downey trials did not fade away quietly in the media, and this one has international coverage. Balfour Der is not afraid of high-profile cases. In fact, any trial involving him becomes high profile. Out on the streets, he is more well known than any other lawyer I can think of. He is a divisive figure. People have feelings one way or another, and there is little middle ground. I think he will defend his client to the utmost. A guilty plea? Not happening, in my opinion. There is always a chance that the client could run out of money, though, and decide to cut it short. We'll see.

I wonder if the condo is being held as security for the lawyers' fees. WRT the divorce and matrimonial property, does anyone know if the former spouse's share would be preserved, or how this works? If the spouse's share is not protected...

Sometimes convicted criminals are not deported. In this case, it took an appeal to reduce the sentence in order for this one to stay.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/calg...a-belakziz-appeal-decision-sentence-1.4897267

It's highly unlikely in a case involving a double murder. Six months? No.

The way I see this playing out? A not guilty plea, or an NCR plea. Der will ask for a psychiatric assessment for his client, and possibly an extension of the assessment prior to trial.

Once the trial begins, the British media will be all over it. They may even release details of a preliminary hearing that is under publication ban, as they did in the Bernardo-Homolka proceedings. Der would use this to his advantage, if it happened. Never underestimate Balfour Der.

Public opinion will not steer the court proceedings. The law will.

On the topic of deportation, you’re referring to after the felon has served their sentence? According to your earlier link -

“”The policy of the government is that if you’re convicted of a criminal offence, you pay the price first. You have to serve your time,” Greene said.

"“That prevents people from getting deported say, just after they’re convicted and then walking free on the streets and never having to serve a penalty.”"

 

[MistyWaters]

Yes. Spring meltwater from the mountains happens in June. Hard to believe, but true.

As I've pointed out, it is difficult to dig any time of year out there. through tree roots and the rock under the thin layer of soil. Rocky Mountains, aptly named.

I agree, that’s not a likely location for digging. That initial request by CPS, asking for people to be aware of mulch piles may still prove relevant.

 

[Gina20]

On the topic of deportation, you’re referring to after the felon has served their sentence? According to your earlier link -

“”The policy of the government is that if you’re convicted of a criminal offence, you pay the price first. You have to serve your time,” Greene said.

"“That prevents people from getting deported say, just after they’re convicted and then walking free on the streets and never having to serve a penalty.”"

We don't have felons here.

 

[otto]

Or maybe because every time an innocent person is judicially murdered because someone in the police or prosecution messed up or chose to arrest and/or prosecute the wrong person, we all commit wilful, gleeful murder?

I’d rather be murdered myself than see the death penalty exist. God does not forgive judicial murder.

Wrongful convictions were far more common in the last century, when tunnel vision or eye-witness identification had validity. I don't think there have been any wrongful convictions since the use of DNA in the 1990s and national awareness of the dangers of tunnel vision.

 

[MistyWaters]

We don't have felons here.

We don’t?

FELON | meaning in the Cambridge English Dictionary

a person who is guilty of a serious crime

Synonyms
criminal
malefactor formal

 

[Gina20]

We don’t?

FELON | meaning in the Cambridge English Dictionary

a person who is guilty of a serious crime

Synonyms
criminal
malefactor formal

Is a DUI a Felony in Canada? - Determining Admissibility

The term "felon" is not one we commonly use, no.

 

[MistyWaters]

Is a DUI a Felony in Canada? - Determining Admissibility

The term "felon" is not one we commonly use, no.

I’m Canadian, was born here! I think it’s acceptable to use that word.

“The term felony, in some common law countries, is defined as a serious crime. The word originates from English common law(from the French medieval word "félonie"), where felonies were originally crimes involving confiscation of a convicted person's land and goods. Other crimes were called misdemeanors. Many common law countries have now abolished the felony/misdemeanor distinction and replaced it with other distinctions, such as between indictable offences and summary offences. A felony is generally considered a crime of high seriousness, whereas a misdemeanor is not....”
Felony - Wikipedia

“Canada's legal system is based on the English and French systems. ... After the Battle of Quebec in 1759, the country fell under English common law, except for Quebec, which follows civil law. Canada's legal system is based on a combination of common law and civil law.Oct 16, 2017...”
Where our legal system comes from - About Canada's System of Justice

 

[Andreee]

I’m Canadian, was born here! I think it’s acceptable to use that word.

“The term felony, in some common law countries, is defined as a serious crime. The word originates from English common law(from the French medieval word "félonie"), where felonies were originally crimes involving confiscation of a convicted person's land and goods. Other crimes were called misdemeanors. Many common law countries have now abolished the felony/misdemeanor distinction and replaced it with other distinctions, such as between indictable offences and summary offences. A felony is generally considered a crime of high seriousness, whereas a misdemeanor is not....”
Felony - Wikipedia

“Canada's legal system is based on the English and French systems. ... After the Battle of Quebec in 1759, the country fell under English common law, except for Quebec, which follows civil law. Canada's legal system is based on a combination of common law and civil law.Oct 16, 2017...”
Where our legal system comes from - About Canada's System of Justice

Many non-Canadians probably don't realize this, but we (Canada) are part of the Commonwealth, so yes, we are under English common law. (except for Quebec

 

[SpanishMossAntiques]

Wrongful convictions were far more common in the last century, when tunnel vision or eye-witness identification had validity. I don't think there have been any wrongful convictions since the use of DNA in the 1990s and national awareness of the dangers of tunnel vision.

Actually there are people on death row who avoided the needle at the last minute due to someone finally running the case DNA which proves them to be innocent... But I suspect there are hundreds waiting to die who may be innocent of their crimes.

 

[Gina20]

Canadian police do not use "felon". I've heard them use many other terms, but never this one. Sometimes they have even called a suspect a "gentleman", when this was obviously not the case.

Use whatever language you like.

 

[Gina20]

Scammers are raising funds in the Lovett name.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/calgary/fake-fundraiser-for-lovett-murder-victims-1.5128055

 

[otto]

Scammers are raising funds in the Lovett name.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/calgary/fake-fundraiser-for-lovett-murder-victims-1.5128055

Given that the Alberta government provides $12,500 per person for funeral expenses, I'm surprised that the family is fundraising for another $30,000 for funeral expenses. Victim services would have reached out to the family to let them know what is available.

My impression of the other fundraising account is that friends of Aliyah's father are trying to help him. He must be a real mess, feeling responsible for Jasmine and Aliyah ending up with Leeming. If that is indeed the case, I don't think Aliyah's father has any less need than Jasmine's mother for assistance at this time.

 

[Snoop Sister]

Given that the Alberta government provides $12,500 per person for funeral expenses, I'm surprised that the family is fundraising for another $30,000 for funeral expenses. Victim services would have reached out to the family to let them know what is available.

My impression of the other fundraising account is that friends of Aliyah's father are trying to help him. He must be a real mess, feeling responsible for Jasmine and Aliyah ending up with Leeming. If that is indeed the case, I don't think Aliyah's father has any less need than Jasmine's mother for assistance at this time.

Agreed! I am totally surprised at the fund raising attempts. Just how much money do they need?

 

[otto]

Agreed! I am totally surprised at the fund raising attempts. Just how much money do they need?

The account was started by a friend of Jasmine's mother, perhaps unaware that victim's services covers the cost of funerals, but they should be aware of those benefits by now. I have heard of families taking a cruise to release ashes in the ocean. Maybe they are planning something more elaborate like a memorial cruise - something that would not be covered by victim's services.

 

[Snoop Sister]

The account was started by a friend of Jasmine's mother, perhaps unaware that victim's services covers the cost of funerals, but they should be aware of those benefits by now. I have heard of families taking a cruise to release ashes in the ocean. Maybe they are planning something more elaborate like a memorial cruise - something that would not be covered by victim's services.

Well apparently the mother’s go fund me account is now frozen as well as the scammers.

 

[MistyWaters]

The account was started by a friend of Jasmine's mother, perhaps unaware that victim's services covers the cost of funerals, but they should be aware of those benefits by now. I have heard of families taking a cruise to release ashes in the ocean. Maybe they are planning something more elaborate like a memorial cruise - something that would not be covered by victim's services.

Plus there’s a couple of advantages to donating to the Calgary Woman’s Shelter directly. One is they issue tax receipts for donations over $20 and secondly no fees or charges are deducted.

 

[mooliz]

Given that the Alberta government provides $12,500 per person for funeral expenses, I'm surprised that the family is fundraising for another $30,000 for funeral expenses. Victim services would have reached out to the family to let them know what is available.

My impression of the other fundraising account is that friends of Aliyah's father are trying to help him. He must be a real mess, feeling responsible for Jasmine and Aliyah ending up with Leeming. If that is indeed the case, I don't think Aliyah's father has any less need than Jasmine's mother for assistance at this time.

I don't think Aliyah's father should benefit financially from this tragedy. It's my understanding that Jasmine's mother is arranging the funeral services. Victims' services will give her around 25k toward those costs. So, most of the money raised through will end up going to charity; she inferred she wasn't keeping any of it beyond what the funeral cost.

 

[otto]

I don't think Aliyah's father should benefit financially from this tragedy. It's my understanding that Jasmine's mother is arranging the funeral services. Victims' services will give her around 25k toward those costs. So, most of the money raised through ******** will end up going to charity; she inferred she wasn't keeping any of it beyond what the funeral cost.

I'm not sure what I think about families of crime victims profiting through public fundraising. On the one hand, it seems wrong. On the other hand, it seems to normal. The hockey team that was hit by a truck raised a record amount of money through public fundraising. All victim families received some money regardless of whether it was needed to cover expenses (such as home renovations) or funeral costs plus some extra.

I see the father of Aliyah and the mother of Jasmine on equal footing here. Although Aliyah's father is not asking for funeral costs (covered by Alberta Victim Services), I do think he needs help. He is not responsible for the murders. He does seem to be struggling and might have substance abuse problems. Financial help might help him get on his feet in the same way that financial help might have made a difference in Jasmine's life.

 

[Snoop Sister]

Just how much money does everyone need? There is going to be a private memorial service and Victims Services will cover that as well as they can get additional monies.

The father can get community support for his addictions if that is an issue with him. Additionally, grief and loss support from community organizations. There are many available support services in Calgary, which Jasmine and the bio father can reach out to...their choice. And, imo, many such organizations have probably tried to reach out to them.

I think this has become a bit of a greed thing. If I want to support a shelter, I will donate directly.

ETA. Not trying to be insensitive...just too many needless go fund me accounts imo and who knows where and what the money is being spent on.
This was a reply to Otto’s post but it didn’t work

 

[Satchie]

I'm not sure what I think about families of crime victims profiting through public fundraising. On the one hand, it seems wrong. On the other hand, it seems to normal. The hockey team that was hit by a truck raised a record amount of money through public fundraising. All victim families received some money regardless of whether it was needed to cover expenses (such as home renovations) or funeral costs plus some extra.

I see the father of Aliyah and the mother of Jasmine on equal footing here. Although Aliyah's father is not asking for funeral costs (covered by Alberta Victim Services), I do think he needs help. He is not responsible for the murders. He does seem to be struggling and might have substance abuse problems. Financial help might help him get on his feet in the same way that financial help might have made a difference in Jasmine's life.

I think there's a trend towards trying to protect people from giving money away, thinking they're "doing good", when frequently the money is used quite differently than intended, and "does bad".

Quite aside from this particular situation, giving money to, eg, a drug addict, isn't a wise strategy for solving their problems, as the family of drug addicts quickly learn.

I think is yet another social media phenomenon, like Airbnb or Facebook, where the massive level of participation creates problems that no one anticipated.