Canada - Terry, 27, & Hailey Blanchette, 2, Blairmore, AB, 14 Sept 2015 #2

[Snowglobe]

IIRC, it was reported somewhere (I don't have a link at the moment) that the property was vacant at the time. I believe it was reported that it was used as seasonal residence during the summer months.

Many people in Blairmore work out of town during the week. Many properties are unoccupied for extended periods. Even Randall Hopley knew this. Heck, he changed the locks and refurnished the place before he was found.

http://www.ctvnews.ca/mobile/record-shows-hopley-was-a-skillful-cabin-squatter-1.697663

 

[Alison]

Many suspect that he took Hailey alive from her home. However if this was the case would he not have been charged with kidnapping as well?

 

[OutOfTheDarkness]

Many suspect that he took Hailey alive from her home. However if this was the case would he not have been charged with kidnapping as well?

That would most likely be part of the 1st degree murder charge.

 

[Jasper52]

Many suspect that he took Hailey alive from her home. However if this was the case would he not have been charged with kidnapping as well?

Alison, this was discussed earlier and IIRC, the 1st-degree murder charge and indignity to a body over-ride the kidnapping charge.

Personally, I want him convicted of 1st-degree murder and indignity to a body, rather than kidnapping. JMO

 

[KatieLiz]

Everyone seems to have this notion that DS took Hailey at 3:00 am and took her straight to his aunts property and had a bonfire with her remains. I question that because given the proximity, it would be too risky that the aunt would be awakened. My theory is that DS didn't show up at the aunts until Monday morning when he knew she would be at work and he would not have to worry about the glowing fire being noticed in the middle of the night.


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I'm not sure when DS took Hailey up to his aunts property. What you say makes a lot of sense, but that is assuming that this is his aunts main residence. I don't think we have established if this is where the aunt lives or if it is just a recreational property used on weekends and in summer.

If we could find that out it could put a few more things into perspective. I think at first I just assumed this was their hunting, camping, atv'ing property. I live in a small town and many of my family and friends live in town but have properties just outside of town for such activities. But then again, I shouldn't be making any assumptions. You know what they say when you assume...

It does appear there are two homes or cottage type buildings on the property, so they very well could live there year round I suppose. In which case he likely
Would have waited until morning. But then where was he all night? His apartment? He would have had to sneak Hailey back out to his van in the daylight then. Unless she was already deceased in the van at that time.

I guess he effectively had until 11:00 Monday morning do anything he wanted without suspicion before they found Terry.

I still think it was likely an empty property that he knew he could go to undetected. There had to have been a comfort level there to do whatever he did...

 

[Alison]

Alison, this was discussed earlier and IIRC, the 1st-degree murder charge and indignity to a body over-ride the kidnapping charge.

Personally, I want him convicted of 1st-degree murder and indignity to a body, rather than kidnapping. JMO

Why can they not tack on a kidnapping as well? I understand that murder 1 can be used when a death takes place during a kidnapping but what I do not understand is why can it not be all 3 charges? I tried googling an answer but can not find one.

 

[spinnaweb]

I think committing an indignity to a body carries a maximum 5 year penalty.
DS's aunt was an official of the QuadSquad, IIRC.

 

[Jasper52]

Why can they not tack on a kidnapping as well? I understand that murder 1 can be used when a death takes place during a kidnapping but what I do not understand is why can it not be all 3 charges? I tried googling an answer but can not find one.

Alison, I don't have the answer to that. Maybe it's better that it's not included so it gives the jury one less option if you know what I mean. One lone jurer may be swayed by the judges instructions, whatever they may be.

 

[Matzoh]

Everyone seems to have this notion that DS took Hailey at 3:00 am and took her straight to his aunts property and had a bonfire with her remains. I question that because given the proximity, it would be too risky that the aunt would be awakened. My theory is that DS didn't show up at the aunts until Monday morning when he knew she would be at work and he would not have to worry about the glowing fire being noticed in the middle of the night.

Interesting theory!

 

[ElleElle]

Many suspect that he took Hailey alive from her home. However if this was the case would he not have been charged with kidnapping as well?

I suspect she screamed and then died in the home. He then took her away to try to hide her.

 

[ElleElle]

Why can they not tack on a kidnapping as well? I understand that murder 1 can be used when a death takes place during a kidnapping but what I do not understand is why can it not be all 3 charges? I tried googling an answer but can not find one.

"Hijacking, sexual assault or kidnapping

(5) Irrespective of whether a murder is planned and deliberate on the part of any person, murder is first degree murder in respect of a person when the death is caused by that person while committing or attempting to commit an offence under one of the following sections:
(a) section 76 (hijacking an aircraft);
(b) section 271 (sexual assault);
(c) section 272 (sexual assault with a weapon, threats to a third party or causing bodily harm);
(d) section 273 (aggravated sexual assault);
(e) section 279 (kidnapping and forcible confinement); or
(f) section 279.1 (hostage taking)."

Source ~ http://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/acts/C-46/page-123.html?texthighlight=kidnapping#s-231.

 

[ElleElle]

Alison, I don't have the answer to that. Maybe it's better that it's not included so it give the jury one less option if you know what I mean. One lone jurer may be swayed by the judges instructions, whatever they may be.

BBM ~ Jodi Arias? :tantrum:

I think that 1st degree murder x 2 supersedes kidnapping, but i'm no criminal lawyer.

 

[KatieLiz]

Why can they not tack on a kidnapping as well? I understand that murder 1 can be used when a death takes place during a kidnapping but what I do not understand is why can it not be all 3 charges? I tried googling an answer but can not find one.

Is anyone on here familiar enough with other cases to know this answer? In cases where someone has kidnapped a child and later murdered them, were they only charged with first degree or were kidnapping charges also prosecuted alongside a murder charge?. If other people have been charged with both kidnapping and murder then this may indicate whether HDB died in the home with her father or not.

 

[Jasper52]

Is anyone on here familiar enough with other cases to know this answer? In cases where someone has kidnapped a child and later murdered them, were they only charged with first degree or were kidnapping charges also prosecuted alongside a murder charge?. If other people have been charged with both kidnapping and murder then this may indicate whether HDB died in the home with her father or not.

RBBM,

I think this will all come out at trial.

As for the first part of your question, ElleElle posted this info which answers your question:

"Hijacking, sexual assault or kidnapping

(5) Irrespective of whether a murder is planned and deliberate on the part of any person, murder is first degree murder in respect of a person when the death is caused by that person while committing or attempting to commit an offence under one of the following sections:
(a) section 76 (hijacking an aircraft);
(b) section 271 (sexual assault);
(c) section 272 (sexual assault with a weapon, threats to a third party or causing bodily harm);
(d) section 273 (aggravated sexual assault);
(e) section 279 (kidnapping and forcible confinement); or
(f) section 279.1 (hostage taking)."

Source ~ http://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/a...dnapping#s-231.

 

[Snowglobe]

I think committing an indignity to a body carries a maximum 5 year penalty.
DS's aunt was an official of the QuadSquad, IIRC.

I find it interesting that a member of the QuadSquad worked as a professional tracker. Of all the people in the community who could find someone on the lam with a little girl, it would be him.

 

[Snowglobe]

I didn't know we were allowed to discuss the aunt. In any case, as I've said, many people work out of town and commute home to Blairmore on weekends.

 

[andreww]

RBBM,

I think this will all come out at trial.

As for the first part of your question, ElleElle posted this info which answers your question:

"Hijacking, sexual assault or kidnapping

(5) Irrespective of whether a murder is planned and deliberate on the part of any person, murder is first degree murder in respect of a person when the death is caused by that person while committing or attempting to commit an offence under one of the following sections:
(a) section 76 (hijacking an aircraft);
(b) section 271 (sexual assault);
(c) section 272 (sexual assault with a weapon, threats to a third party or causing bodily harm);
(d) section 273 (aggravated sexual assault);
(e) section 279 (kidnapping and forcible confinement); or
(f) section 279.1 (hostage taking)."

Source ~ http://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/a...dnapping#s-231.

That really doesn't answer the question. All that is saying, if I'm not mistaken, is that 2nd degree murder would become 1st degree murder if a kidnapping was involved. I highly doubt that the murder charge includes a kidnapping charge as one charge would put the jury in a difficult position. For instance, if the jury believed he killed them, but didn't see proof of kidnapping, they would have to find him not guilty because it's a single charge.

Again, there is no rush here. We know the forensic tests will take time, and DS ain't going anywhere. We don't know what he told police, beyond the location of the body, so it is quite possible that they are trying to piece this together.?

As far as the indignity charge goes, I believe that if he killed Hailey at her home and dumped her body in the woods, that in itself would warrant the indignity charge. My problem with that is that if he were simply dumping a body, why do it on a piece of property that could be directly linked to you? Obviously at some point those remains would be found.


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[Snowglobe]

That really doesn't answer the question. All that is saying, if I'm not mistaken, is that 2nd degree murder would become 1st degree murder if a kidnapping was involved. I highly doubt that the murder charge includes a kidnapping charge as one charge would put the jury in a difficult position. For instance, if the jury believed he killed them, but didn't see proof of kidnapping, they would have to find him not guilty because it's a single charge.

Again, there is no rush here. We know the forensic tests will take time, and DS ain't going anywhere. We don't know what he told police, beyond the location of the body, so it is quite possible that they are trying to piece this together.?

As far as the indignity charge goes, I believe that if he killed Hailey at her home and dumped her body in the woods, that in itself would warrant the indignity charge. My problem with that is that if he were simply dumping a body, why do it on a piece of property that could be directly linked to you? Obviously at some point those remains would be found.

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I doubt that DS will chose a jury trial. His lawyer is much more likely to suggest trial by judge alone.

 

[spinnaweb]

Mods- please edit or delete my previous post if necessary; thks.

 

[jbelle]

That really doesn't answer the question. All that is saying, if I'm not mistaken, is that 2nd degree murder would become 1st degree murder if a kidnapping was involved. I highly doubt that the murder charge includes a kidnapping charge as one charge would put the jury in a difficult position. For instance, if the jury believed he killed them, but didn't see proof of kidnapping, they would have to find him not guilty because it's a single charge.

Again, there is no rush here. We know the forensic tests will take time, and DS ain't going anywhere. We don't know what he told police, beyond the location of the body, so it is quite possible that they are trying to piece this together.?

As far as the indignity charge goes, I believe that if he killed Hailey at her home and dumped her body in the woods, that in itself would warrant the indignity charge. My problem with that is that if he were simply dumping a body, why do it on a piece of property that could be directly linked to you? Obviously at some point those remains would be found.


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I think he killed her after. I can't imagine toting one body around but not the other.

"why do it on a piece of property that could be directly linked to you?"
I have seen a lot of suspects willing to admit to murder, yet for some reason they refuse to admit to sexual assault. I think he may have known he was going to be caught so he wanted to hide evidence of that.

This is all just my opinion based on many other cases I have followed. Austin Sigg was one well know killer that admitted to the kill but not the sexual assault.