Canadian hostage, wife & children freed from Afghanistan, Oct 2017 #1

[Fairy1]

I am troubled by this thread. I do not understand why our members are not giving Boyle and Coleman the same respect that WS usually demands be given to victims. At this point, neither Boyle nor Coleman have been named as suspects of a crime. So, how is it that we are allowed to attack them? Why aren't we giving them the same compassion that we give to other victims?

Perhaps we should wait until more official information is released. It seems unkind to disparage this couple without having true knowledge of their motivations for their actions. Until LE informs us of any wrongdoing, I think we should restrain from attacking this couple.

Am I alone in this thinking? I just think we should wait until we actually learn more.

It might be helpful, in terms of people's feelings about Joshua, to look back at the beginning of this thread. Certainly opened my eyes! I do feel that Caitlan and the babies are victims. IMO.

 

[LietKynes]

"When I was young I discovered I was neither God nor Satan. I was so disappointed in myself......," he (Joshua Boyle) wrote in his Rockway yearbook in 2002.
https://www.therecord.com/news-story/7611269-freed-man-was-raised-in-region/

BBM
What the ...... SMDH.

Boyle, now 33, was never involved in many extracurricular programs, liked to thumb his nose at authority.....

After university, Boyle bounced between jobs. The last time Edwards saw him in person, he said he was working as an airport parking lot attendant. Later, he took a job as clerk at a small town hall in New Brunswick.
https://www.therecord.com/news-story/7611269-freed-man-was-raised-in-region/

He also worked at a call center. He wasn’t exactly raking in the money, especially when he was married with a stepdaughter.. that’s three mouths to feed.

Who paid for their trip overseas? Honestly if his family helped fund it, that would be super disappointing for me considering they knew he was so into terrorism. JMO

SABBM

Yes. Alrighty then.
That sounds like a person prepared to support 12 children. *cue extreme sarcasm*
The more info that comes out about this man... the more 'eye rolls' I'm doing. He is (imo) nuts !
:moo:

 

[LietKynes]

It might be helpful, in terms of people's feelings about Joshua, to look back at the beginning of this thread. Certainly opened my eyes! I do feel that Caitlan and the babies are victims. IMO.

BBM

That ^^^^
To force a heavily pregnant woman to a dangerous country is incomprehensible to most.
:moo:

 

[Gunslinging Granny]

The difficulties of the marriage are referred to in an article above, regarding work and residency status, which seems to have kept them traveling.

The REAL reason Joshua and Caitlan had to travel to be together was not related to residency status. I've know 4 American-Canadian couples living in NY that never had any problem residing together. Joshua was likely not allowed to come across the border into America because of his very scary terrorism ties. I don't know what excuse he told Caitlan to keep her from living with him in Canada after they were married.

 

[Gunslinging Granny]

Read through the earlier posts. This post from 2013 is brilliant. Josh couldn't fly directly into Afghanistan or Pakistan from Canada because of his scary terrorism ties. He had to fly into Russia and walk there. His previous travels to
S. America with Caitlan may have been to establish themselves as "aid workers". IMO, Caitlan was set up. Josh used her to try to meet his nefarious, selfish, personal goals inside Afghanistan.

In most cases, marriage facilitates work & residency. Maybe Boyle wanted to join the Taliban, but given his former wife's politics, applying to the Canadian authorities to travel there would have aroused suspicion. As the husband of an American "aid worker," however, getting into Afghanistan would have been easier.

 

[Gunslinging Granny]

On Wednesday, Boyle’s family beseeched media to consider the context surrounding his comments. “We beg of the media to be ethically aware that statements made are coming from someone who has been tortured, given no ability of free thinking for five years and desperately requires intensive medical care, both physically and emotionally.”
They worried that the string of interviews was not in his or his family’s best interests. “We call upon your ethics to recognize that every word can cause potential harm to Josh and his family, whether he understands that or not right now.”
Note: This article was altered after clarification from the family of Joshua Boyle.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...n-hostage-family-joshua-boyle-caitlan-coleman

Josh’s parents can’t shut him up, so they are seriously trying to guilt the media to stop interviewing him and publishing his emails. Good luck, Mr. and Mrs Boyle, trying to remove a narcissist from the spotlight.

Caitlan’s parents should be allowed to take the children to PA away from Josh whom his parents stated desperately requires intensive emotional and physical treatment.

 

[Bodhi]

I believe he said it is the younger boy who has never seen the son, but I’m too lazy to go link hunting. I’m not sure when the older boy would have gained a concept of earth and space though. Maybe Dad explained it for 18 hours.
:hills:



True that! But now that I think of it, since they wanted prisoners released in exchange for JB and CC, the captors may have been thinking of the prisoners who were released to get Bergdal’s freedom. So it is possible that they did figure a pregnant CC was their ticket. All the more reason for anyone with any awareness of current events to avoid Afghanistan, pregnant or not.

I've read the sun anecdote about each of boy. IDK if that's a mistake by different reporters or JB telling it about different boys at different times.

 

[otto]

On Wednesday, Boyle’s family beseeched media to consider the context surrounding his comments. “We beg of the media to be ethically aware that statements made are coming from someone who has been tortured, given no ability of free thinking for five years and desperately requires intensive medical care, both physically and emotionally.”
They worried that the string of interviews was not in his or his family’s best interests. “We call upon your ethics to recognize that every word can cause potential harm to Josh and his family, whether he understands that or not right now.”
Note: This article was altered after clarification from the family of Joshua Boyle.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...n-hostage-family-joshua-boyle-caitlan-coleman

Josh’s parents can’t shut him up, so they are seriously trying to guilt the media to stop interviewing him and publishing his emails. Good luck, Mr. and Mrs Boyle, trying to remove a narcissist from the spotlight.

Caitlan’s parents should be allowed to take the children to PA away from Josh whom his parents stated desperately requires intensive emotional and physical treatment.

Her parents have no more rights to take the children than his. Social services can step in and take the children, but that would probably cause more damage to them. Social services can't provide in-house support without consent from Boyle and his wife. At least she is in hospital seeking medical care, which will hopefully help her recover to the extent that she can care for the children. When she is well enough, she should return to her parent's care.

Would she receive free health care with her parents? If not, she's better off staying in Canada until she is fully recovered, and the children are probably better off with her than with strangers.

 

[iliketotalk15]

Joshua Boyle described the second prison cell where they were detained as being the size of a bathtub. Imagine procreating in a bathtub with several children in the bathtub with you and your spouse. This is very disturbing.

Urgh. Didn't even think of this. I'm sure he'll have some explanation for it in coming days.

 

[iliketotalk15]

As a teenager, Boyle was an aspiring writer. His Rockway classmates (high school) picked him as most "likely to have their novel on the NY Times Bestsellers".
https://www.therecord.com/news-story/7611269-freed-man-was-raised-in-region/

He's been trying to live up to this for fifteen years, and it looks like he just might!

 

[Gunslinging Granny]

Here is the "bathtub" link:
http://www.npr.org/2017/10/15/55786...mily-endured-in-years-held-by-haqqani-network

 

[Gunslinging Granny]

Her parents have no more rights to take the children than his. Social services can step in and take the children, but that would probably cause more damage to them. Social services can't provide in-house support without consent from Boyle and his wife. At least she is in hospital seeking medical care, which will hopefully help her recover to the extent that she can care for the children. When she is well enough, she should return to her parent's care.

Would she receive free health care with her parents? If not, she's better off staying in Canada until she is fully recovered, and the children are probably better off with her than with strangers.

Caitlin's sensible parents have no rights regarding the children while they are in Canada. Caitlan would temporarily be diagnosed as having a psychological disability (anxiety, depression, PTSD) and would qualify for free medical care. Her children would be covered under CHIP insurance. Her spiritual care could be provided by her family's priest.

 

[Gunslinging Granny]

He's been trying to live up to this for fifteen years, and it looks like he just might!

And he'll be able to sell the movie rights.

 

[bears10]

Her parents have no more rights to take the children than his. Social services can step in and take the children, but that would probably cause more damage to them. Social services can't provide in-house support without consent from Boyle and his wife. At least she is in hospital seeking medical care, which will hopefully help her recover to the extent that she can care for the children. When she is well enough, she should return to her parent's care.

Would she receive free health care with her parents? If not, she's better off staying in Canada until she is fully recovered, and the children are probably better off with her than with strangers.

Since she has no income she would quality for free healthcare. Not to mention even if she didn’t, I am sure there are plenty of charities who would cover costs of her care. People here in the US are very sympathetic to victims of terrorism in my experience.

 

[otto]

Since she has no income she would quality for free healthcare. Not to mention even if she didn’t, I am sure there are plenty of charities who would cover costs of her care. People here in the US are very sympathetic to victims of terrorism in my experience.

Thanks. Excluding donations from charities, what does free health care include in PA? Does it cover medical tests, hospital stay, and the ongoing specialists care (e.g.: psychiatrist) that she needs? Does it cover treatment for the children? I'm trying to get a sense of whether she is entitled to the same quality of care as someone with full health care benefits, or whether there is an upper limit to care because she has no benefits.

 

[bears10]

Thanks. Excluding donations from charities, what does free health care include in PA? Does it cover medical tests, hospital stay, and the ongoing specialists care (e.g.: psychiatrist) that she needs? Does it cover treatment for the children? I'm trying to get a sense of whether she is entitled to the same quality of care as someone with full health care benefits, or whether there is an upper limit to care because she has no benefits.

She would have benefits. Since she has no income, she would be eligible for Medicaid and the kids would qualify for CHIP (child health insurance program) and medicaid as well I believe. These are state and federally funded insurance health insurance insurance programs for low income families.

You can read a bit about it here. https://www.medicaid.gov/medicaid/access-to-care/index.html

 

[otto]

She would have benefits. Since she has no income, she would be eligible for Medicaid and the kids would qualify for CHIP (child health insurance program) and medicaid as well I believe. These are state and federally funded insurance health insurance insurance programs for low income families.

You can read a bit about it here. https://www.medicaid.gov/medicaid/access-to-care/index.html

That looks like a bit of a mess to navigate - no clear: here's the services available to you category, but rather documents quoting legal precedents, and lots of substance abuse info. I doubt Caitlin would be able to navigate that to determine whether she is eligible for anything. I suppose it's assumed that anyone who needs this type of care has someone to assist with interpreting the information.

 

[Datchery]

In both the US and Canada, I suspect the normal laws simply aren't going to work in this situation. The kids are all eligible for citizenship of both countries, but there is no official record that they were born at all. I don't know how insurance works in Canada, but in the US, as far as I know, even if you qualify for medicare and medicaid, you have to have signed up. What happens in these kinds of (thankfully) rare cases - does anyone know, for instance, how the medical needs of the women and children held by Ariel Castro were handled?

 

[bears10]

That looks like a bit of a mess to navigate - no clear: here's the services available to you category, but rather documents quoting legal precedents, and lots of substance abuse info. I doubt Caitlin would be able to navigate that to determine whether she is eligible for anything. I suppose it's assumed that anyone who needs this type of care has someone to assist with interpreting the information.

Of course she would be eligible - she has no income. Maybe this is clearer - here are a list of benefits provided by medicaid:

https://www.medicaid.gov/medicaid/benefits/list-of-benefits/index.html

PA has offices in each county to assist with filling out the forms for government assistance.

Contact your county assistance office and a trained staff member will determine what programs may be available to you.

http://www.dhs.pa.gov/citizens/healthcaremedicalassistance/index.htm

 

[Bodhi]

CHIP expired several weeks ago because Congress has not re-authorized it. Covers healthcare for 9 million children.

The end-date of CHIP services may not have been reached yet and Congress could decide to re-authorize before it does. But I doubt new children can be enrolled.