Canadian hostage, wife & children freed from Afghanistan, Oct 2017 #1

[Miss Magnolia]

This family is dependent on JB's parents and hopefully Boyle Sr. will have some insight into the needs of not only his son, but his daughter in law and grandchildren, and hopefully he is in contact with Cait's parents too. I don't know what kind of relationship JB has with his Father, but isn't Boyle Sr. a tax attorney or Judge? I would think the family would also have a lot of questions for him and that they see to it that they all seek some kind of help.

Didn't Elizabeth Smart start some sort of foundation after her kidnapping?

 

[Bodhi]

The group who held Coleman and Boyle never asked for ransom, as I understand it. They wanted an exchange of the North Americans for captured comrades.

The pregnancies in captivity were not an effort to protect Caitlan from rape by captors, according to Joshua. He said in a letter to his parents that they hid the second pregnancy from the captors until the second son was born.

 

[bears10]

[bbm]

it's actually quite possible ... no one said the captors are swift

I think it was pretty well known at the time that the US doesnt negotiate with terrorists. Especially for ransom money. Did the captors even try to reach out to the families for money?

I apologize if this has been discussed, it’s been yet another long day. CCs parents recorded videos pleading for the captors to let them free. Her mom even wore a head covering in the video to be respectful I suppose. The US helped with the rescue and attempted to transport them out of the Middle East (which JB refused). Did his family do the same as CCs family? Also, what was the Canadian governments take on their captivity? Were they trying to get them back home? How did they feel about the Pakistanian and US govt orchestrating their release?

anything I said above is not meant to be judgemental at all. I am genuinely curious about Canada’s stance in all of this. It doesn’t seem like they made much of an effort to get JB home (and i certainly don’t blame them considering his ties to terrorism) and am wondering if they approve of the US getting involved, especially since the end result was JB ending up back in their country.

 

[bears10]

The group who held Coleman and Boyle never asked for ransom, as I understand it. They wanted an exchange of the North Americans for captured comrades.

The pregnancies in captivity were not an effort to protect Caitlan from rape by captors, according to Joshua. He said in a letter to his parents that they hid the second pregnancy from the captors until the second son was born.

So that would mean she received no prenatal medical care during her pregnancy. Wow.

 

[bears10]

That's true, except what woman in her twenties is worried about a ticking clock? He's lying. Her clock was not ticking. His child was not murdered. I highly doubt his wife was raped. He's too fat to be a hostage of five years. He's currently exploiting his wife by publishing hospital photos of her.

We accepted that he was a victim, but everything that comes out of his mouth makes me doubt that. Why is he embellishing if he really was a victim?

I never said I disagreed with you. I think he’s selfish and narcissistic AF.

 

[JLD333]

She had a liver condition BEFORE she became pregnant. Due to her obesity at that time, she likely had NAFLD (Non-alcoholic Fatty Liver Disease).

Any liver disease comes with risks during pregnancy, I would imagine. Pregnancy is hard on even a healthy mothers liver.

NAFLD is associated with negative outcomes during pregnancy: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/26114995/

If she developed pre-eclampsia, which she would've been at risk for due to the NAFLD, it could've easily resulted in a stillbirth.


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[MaryG12]

That's true, except what woman in her twenties is worried about a ticking clock? He's lying. Her clock was not ticking. His child was not murdered. I highly doubt his wife was raped. He's too fat to be a hostage of five years. He's currently exploiting his wife by publishing hospital photos of her.

We accepted that he was a victim, but everything that comes out of his mouth makes me doubt that. Why is he embellishing if he really was a victim?

The way I see it - CC and her children were the real victims, while Boyle may be trying to play "professional" victim.

 

[Gunslinging Granny]

As a teenager, Boyle was an aspiring writer. His Rockway classmates (high school) picked him as most "likely to have their novel on the NY Times Bestsellers".
https://www.therecord.com/news-story/7611269-freed-man-was-raised-in-region/

 

[Gunslinging Granny]

I never said I disagreed with you. I think he’s selfish and narcissistic AF.

"When I was young I discovered I was neither God nor Satan. I was so disappointed in myself......," he (Joshua Boyle) wrote in his Rockway yearbook in 2002.
https://www.therecord.com/news-story/7611269-freed-man-was-raised-in-region/

 

[Gunslinging Granny]

Boyle, now 33, was never involved in many extracurricular programs, liked to thumb his nose at authority.....

After university, Boyle bounced between jobs. The last time Edwards saw him in person, he said he was working as an airport parking lot attendant. Later, he took a job as clerk at a small town hall in New Brunswick.
https://www.therecord.com/news-story/7611269-freed-man-was-raised-in-region/

 

[Lilibet]

With all the things JB has said and e-mailed to media in the past week, I can safely say he is the last person I would what to be stuck in a cell with for 5 years. One of his sisters said JB boasted in a letter he wrote during captivity that he kept them the family entertained by telling the history of WWII for 18 hours.

His sister also said that Joshua told them in a letter that the oldest child loved to play International Space Station with a blanket. Sounds cute, building forts with blankets. Now he says the child had never seen the sun.So how would a 4-year-old in a cell have any concept of earth or space if he'd never experienced anything beyond the cell. I think he has been disassociated from reality for a long time.

https://www.thestar.com/news/insigh...e-describe-being-hostage-to-helplessness.html

I believe he said it is the younger boy who has never seen the son, but I’m too lazy to go link hunting. I’m not sure when the older boy would have gained a concept of earth and space though. Maybe Dad explained it for 18 hours.
:hills:

[bbm]

it's actually quite possible ... no one said the captors are swift

True that! But now that I think of it, since they wanted prisoners released in exchange for JB and CC, the captors may have been thinking of the prisoners who were released to get Bergdal’s freedom. So it is possible that they did figure a pregnant CC was their ticket. All the more reason for anyone with any awareness of current events to avoid Afghanistan, pregnant or not.

 

[otto]

Yes he said both her clock was ticking and they had a lot of time on their hands

“We're sitting as hostages with a lot of time on our hands," Boyle told The Associated Press in an email Monday. "We always wanted as many as possible, and we didn't want to waste time. Cait's in her 30s, the clock is ticking."

https://www.google.com/amp/abc7chic...5-years-says-wife-rushed-to-hospital/2543904/

Yes, she is all of 31 years old today, and he is attempting to explain five pregnancies between the ages of 26 and 31 with "she's in her thirties", and "clock was ticking". That's complete nonsense.

I think it's disgusting to state that while they were kidnapping victims for five years they had a lot of time on their hands so they filled it with sex. What about raising the three children, teaching them, making games, telling stories, and all the so much more important things they should be doing with all that time?

 

[bears10]

Boyle, now 33, was never involved in many extracurricular programs, liked to thumb his nose at authority.....

After university, Boyle bounced between jobs. The last time Edwards saw him in person, he said he was working as an airport parking lot attendant. Later, he took a job as clerk at a small town hall in New Brunswick.
https://www.therecord.com/news-story/7611269-freed-man-was-raised-in-region/

He also worked at a call center. He wasn’t exactly raking in the money, especially when he was married with a stepdaughter.. that’s three mouths to feed.

Who paid for their trip overseas? Honestly if his family helped fund it, that would be super disappointing for me considering they knew he was so into terrorism. JMO

 

[bears10]

Yes, she is all of 31 years old today, and he is attempting to explain five pregnancies between the ages of 26 and 31 with "she's in her thirties", and "clock was ticking". That's complete nonsense.

I think it's disgusting to state that while they were kidnapping victims for five years they had a lot of time on their hands so they filled it with sex. What about raising the three children, teaching them, making games, telling stories, and all the so much more important things they should be doing with all that time?

I’m sure they weren’t enjoying their time in a dirt hole. What makes them think an innocent baby would? Sorry I’m just really passionate about children who never asked to be brought into this world being deprived of a normal life. I pray they will prosper, but those innocent children have major potential to have developmental delays. If not health issues on top of that. Never seeing the sun for the first years of your life? If that’s true, that’s heartbreaking. I am very worried about CC and the kids. In a sense, part of me is hoping the govt can swoop in and “distract” JB for long enough for CC to come back to the US with the kids.

 

[human]

BBM. Apparently, ISIS jihadis have no problem at all with birth control, and frequently force it on women they imprison and enslave.

That is both revolting and perplexing, in the framework of this particular case.

Taliban soldiers force captive women (sex slaves) to take oral birth control pills, or forced depo provera injections. This is because if a woman becomes pregnant, an obscure islamic scripture says they cannot have sex with her. Preventing pregnancy with forced contraception allows them to rape the women more often.

They are also forced to convert to Islam, and an article below describes the Yazidi women being taken before an islamic cleric to validate their conversion, and establish their status as a "lawful" sex slave for the ISIS fighters.



http://www.independent.co.uk/news/w...-they-can-continue-to-rape-them-a6928546.html



http://www.news.com.au/world/middle...m/news-story/089f906e8b5a6aa8b8f337db6821b9f7

NYT article:





https://www.nytimes.com/2016/03/13/...-of-sex-slaves-isis-pushes-birth-control.html

BBM

Caitlan's situation obviously doesn't fit the same pattern as the young Yazidi women. But it appears that there was no desire on the part of their captors to prevent her repeated pregnancies, regardless of who biologically fathered her children. I don't think her consent, or lack of consent, to intercourse and repeated pregnancies was a concern to either her husband, or her captors. IMO, she had no choice. I have no doubt that if her ISIS jihadi captors wanted to put Caitlan on birth control, they would have been willing and able to do that.

This whole situation is a very perplexing picture of "why", on so many levels. The circumstances of how and why the couple went to Afghanistan remind me a lot of the Roxana Saberi debacle.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roxana_Saberi

I know Roxana. To say her circumstances were the same is positively revolting. She is a brave, honorable woman.

 

[Gunslinging Granny]

In public interviews, Joshua Boyle’s first wife, Zaynab Khadr has stated:
“I’m not saying suicide bombing is the best thing ... [but] these people who go and kill themselves are doing it for a reason. They are trying to tell the world something. They have been trying to say it for a long time. It's just people won't listen, so sometimes you just have to do things in a way you don't like because it's the only way left.”

“If I was to choose for my daughter to live a life of no meaning or to die a martyr, I would choose for her to die a martyr.... I'd love to die a martyr. It's a desire that I believe that any Muslim would have or should have.”

Zaynab became well known to Canadians after the arrest of Omar for the death of an American medic in 2002, and the death of her father in a firefight near the Afghanistan-Pakistan border in 2003.
When she arrived in Toronto from Pakistan in February 2005, RCMP officers met her at the airport with a warrant. In her baggage, they found a Toshiba laptop computer with al-Qaida videos, information about weapons, video clips from the Chechen conflict zone and the 2003 bombing of a British/American civilian compound in Riyadh, Saudi Arabia, and songs with such translated titles as I am a Terrorist and Strike and Kill the Infidels.

A memo from he Royal Canadian Mounted Police dated August 23, 2005, reveals that it uncovered Al-Qaeda files on the laptop computer Zaynab Khadr carried into the country in February 2005, including "material dealing with bomb making, ricin, techniques of assassination, chemicals, poisons, silencers, etc; incoming and outgoing e-mails of Zaynab Khadr." The hard drive also contained "some sort of military operational plan to infiltrate Burma and establish an al-Qaeda base, curriculum for religious studies at al-Faruq training camp, techniques to invade prisons, contract for immoral acts; administrative letters from [Osama bin Laden], ETC."
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/khadr/family/
http://www.danielpipes.org/blog/2004/04/the-khadrs-canadas-first-family-of-terrorism
http://www.ctvnews.ca/canada/keeping-up-with-the-khadrs-a-family-tree-1.976666

 

[Gunslinging Granny]

I know Roxana. To say her circumstances were the same is positively revolting. She is a brave, honorable woman.

There is nothing similar about Roxana's imprisonment by Iran and Josh's imprisonment. Roxana was an Iranian citizen (and an American citizen). She was a legitimate journalist with a journalism degree. She had worked for numerous entities as a international correspondent including NPR, PBS and Fox News.
'
Josh had no ties to Afghanistan except for his terrorist first wife Zaynab. He had no legitimate reason to be in Afghanistan. His purpose for traveling into Afghanistan is extremely suspicious.

 

[human]

I don't have such a link. But, this material maybe a safe start: http://www.islamawareness.net/Marriage/marriage_article001.html I would also recommend adding an even more conservative slant to it.

There are some really good things in there until the obedience part. Sounds like a lot of Evangelical religions here in the US

 

[Gunslinging Granny]

Yes, she is all of 31 years old today, and he is attempting to explain five pregnancies between the ages of 26 and 31 with "she's in her thirties", and "clock was ticking". That's complete nonsense.

I think it's disgusting to state that while they were kidnapping victims for five years they had a lot of time on their hands so they filled it with sex. What about raising the three children, teaching them, making games, telling stories, and all the so much more important things they should be doing with all that time?

Joshua Boyle described the second prison cell where they were detained as being the size of a bathtub. Imagine procreating in a bathtub with several children in the bathtub with you and your spouse. This is very disturbing.

 

[otto]

Joshua Boyle described the second prison cell where they were detained as being the size of a bathtub. Imagine procreating in a bathtub with several children in the bathtub with you and your spouse. This is very disturbing.

Crazy, isn't it - either he is completely lying, or he made very bad decisions in the presence of his children.