Christmas Day Significance

[snowblossom2]

DeeDee249,
I would bet the house on this assertion: A Ramsey, with premeditation, planned the molestation of JonBenet on Christmas Night!

The date 12/25/1996 was highly significant for JonBenet's killer, not for us who cannot fathom why.

One of the significant reasons, is I reckon, opportunity, because once on vacation, divorced from their normal abusive surroundings the fetishtic molestation of JonBenet would not be possible!

Your assertion regarding the size-12's is not the only interpretation. It may have been the case that either JR or BR wanted JonBenet to have the same day of the week as the size-6 underwear she wore to the White's.

After all why bother with underwear if you then hide it with longjohns. As I've remarked before the Day Of the Week only mattered to JonBenet's killer, because that person was attempting to present JonBenet as she was dressed at the White's.

If Patsy had redressed JonBenet in those size-12's she would never have told her interviewer that the remaining size-12's were in JonBenet's underwear drawer.

Why because she fetched them, she removed the size-6 pair, she dressed JonBenet in the size-12's, then she removed or hid the remaining size-12's. Patently she is not going to leave them lying around.

So if you wish to claim PR redressed JonBenet in the size-12's, you must explain her version of events about the size-12's as related to the BPD detectives.


.

I agree. I'm reading PTPM (only started reading all of these threads about a month ago) and something struck me - JB told a teacher (or a friend's mother) that Santa said he was going to have an extra special visit for her, after Christmas. The person she told was initially confused - asking JB do you mean Christmas? And JB clarified that Santa said it would be after (e.g. my interpretation - once everyone went to sleep).

 

[UKGuy]

I agree. I'm reading PTPM (only started reading all of these threads about a month ago) and something struck me - JB told a teacher (or a friend's mother) that Santa said he was going to have an extra special visit for her, after Christmas. The person she told was initially confused - asking JB do you mean Christmas? And JB clarified that Santa said it would be after (e.g. my interpretation - once everyone went to sleep).

snowblossom2,
Yes you could be correct. That was Barbara Kostanick who told that story. Her daughter Megan played with JonBenet and went to the same school.


It might have just been talk with JonBenet since the conversation was all about Santa, Megan had just visited. So possibly JonBenet did not want left out?

I would interpret what JonBenet said as either talk and one-upmanship, or she was expecting a visit after Christmas, which for JonBenet probably meant any time after gifts were exchanged and opened.

So actually the secret santa visit plays right into the premeditation theme, even better we have JonBenet citing the right timeline, after Christmas, which is what indeed happened.

That conversation between Barbara Kostanick and JonBenet took place on December 24th 1996, the day after the Ramsey's Christmas Party.

So it appears after the fallout from the Ramsey's Christmas Party, someone had promised JonBenet a special visit, probably to keep her silent, regarding events of the 12/23/1996?

.

 

[snowblossom2]

Thanks UKGuy for the info. I started reading the "Coincidences" thread and the McReynolds family seems too suspicious (their daughter getting kidnapped and forced to watch another girl get sexually molested on Dec 26 in the 70s, the wife writing a play re a girl being murdered and placed in a basement). I still think a RDI, particularly John, after sexual abuse, but the McReynolds...Since a Santa Claus suit was found in the basement and IIRC John often dressed up as Santa, JDI would also play into the latter theory you stated. But again, as you said, it could have been a more innocent case of one up man ship

 

[UKGuy]

Thanks UKGuy for the info. I started reading the "Coincidences" thread and the McReynolds family seems too suspicious (their daughter getting kidnapped and forced to watch another girl get sexually molested on Dec 26 in the 70s, the wife writing a play re a girl being murdered and placed in a basement). I still think a RDI, particularly John, after sexual abuse, but the McReynolds...Since a Santa Claus suit was found in the basement and IIRC John often dressed up as Santa, JDI would also play into the latter theory you stated. But again, as you said, it could have been a more innocent case of one up man ship

snowblossom2,
Yes quite a coincidence for the McReynolds, but they were cleared. JDI would be my preferred choice, but BR, by virtue of the forensic evidence linking him to JonBenet, means he remains a suspect too.

We would probably need fibers from the Santa Suit to be found on JonBenet or her in her bedroom for that theory to take off.


.

 

[Nom de plume]

Thanks UKGuy for the info. I started reading the "Coincidences" thread and the McReynolds family seems too suspicious (their daughter getting kidnapped and forced to watch another girl get sexually molested on Dec 26 in the 70s, the wife writing a play re a girl being murdered and placed in a basement). I still think a RDI, particularly John, after sexual abuse, but the McReynolds...Since a Santa Claus suit was found in the basement and IIRC John often dressed up as Santa, JDI would also play into the latter theory you stated. But again, as you said, it could have been a more innocent case of one up man ship

There are some very strange coincidences. As UK said, they were cleared. If anything, I think the Rs used those things to frame the McReynolds.

ITA with JR being the "secret Santa". He had the suit, had played Santa in the past, and IMO was the one molesting JB. Sounds like something a sick pedophile would say to intice her to cooperate.

 

[midwest mama]

snowblossom2,
Yes quite a coincidence for the McReynolds, but they were cleared. JDI would be my preferred choice, but BR, by virtue of the forensic evidence linking him to JonBenet, means he remains a suspect too.

We would probably need fibers from the Santa Suit to be found on JonBenet or her in her bedroom for that theory to take off.


.

The 4 fibers found on the duct tape were red. There were other red fibers found in the paint tray, the garrote tie, on JB's shirt. These red fibers were said to be "consistent with" Patsy's jacket fibers.

But, I find it interesting that there were no references to the gray or black jacket fibers that her fleece jacket also contained, since the jacket was a red/black/gray checked fleece jacket. Why only the red fibers?

This is from a "48 Hours"collection by Erin Moriarty of interviews information of Patsy and with Lou Smit:

Bruce Levin: To Lin Wood - "We believe the fibers from her jacket were found in the paint tray, were found tied into the ligature found on JonBenét's neck, were found on the blanket that she was wrapped in, were found on the duct tape that was found on the mouth.
To Patsy: I have no evidence from any scientist that suggests that those fibers are from any source other than your red jacket.
Lin Wood:Well, come on, what other sources did they test.
Patsy's attorney, Lin Wood asked prosecutors to produce the evidence
and when they wouldn't, he refused to let Patsy go on the record."

Erin Moriarty: "Is the fact that there were fibers that were consistent with Patsy Ramsey's jacket
incriminating?"
Lou Smit: "Sure."
Erin Moriarty: "But does that shake your faith that the Ramsey's were not involved?"
Lou Smit: "No, you just can't rely on fiber evidence because fibers could come off the jacket or something similar to the jacket."

OK, now don't bash me because I'm posting something from Lin Wood and Lou Smit! The statements from both of these guys could have easily been used in a trial proceeding. If you were on the jury, and the Santa Suit was taken into evidence, the reports of JB getting a 'secret Santa' visit were validated on the stand, and the forensic evidence did not produce tests that showed the Suit was tested - and ONLY the red fibers from Patsy's multi-colored jacket showed up for "consistent with" testing, would you be able to say, beyond a reasonable doubt,, that those red fibers had to have come from Patsy's jacket??

Me neither.

 

[OpenMind4U]

The 4 fibers found on the duct tape were red. There were other red fibers found in the paint tray, the garrote tie, on JB's shirt. These red fibers were said to be "consistent with" Patsy's jacket fibers.

But, I find it interesting that there were no references to the gray or black jacket fibers that her fleece jacket also contained, since the jacket was a red/black/gray checked fleece jacket. Why only the red fibers?

This is from a "48 Hours"collection by Erin Moriarty of interviews information of Patsy and with Lou Smit:

Bruce Levin: To Lin Wood - "We believe the fibers from her jacket were found in the paint tray, were found tied into the ligature found on JonBenét's neck, were found on the blanket that she was wrapped in, were found on the duct tape that was found on the mouth.
To Patsy: I have no evidence from any scientist that suggests that those fibers are from any source other than your red jacket.
Lin Wood:Well, come on, what other sources did they test.
Patsy's attorney, Lin Wood asked prosecutors to produce the evidence
and when they wouldn't, he refused to let Patsy go on the record."

Erin Moriarty: "Is the fact that there were fibers that were consistent with Patsy Ramsey's jacket
incriminating?"
Lou Smit: "Sure."
Erin Moriarty: "But does that shake your faith that the Ramsey's were not involved?"
Lou Smit: "No, you just can't rely on fiber evidence because fibers could come off the jacket or something similar to the jacket."

OK, now don't bash me because I'm posting something from Lin Wood and Lou Smit! The statements from both of these guys could have easily been used in a trial proceeding. If you were on the jury, and the Santa Suit was taken into evidence, the reports of JB getting a 'secret Santa' visit were validated on the stand, and the forensic evidence did not produce tests that showed the Suit was tested - and ONLY the red fibers from Patsy's multi-colored jacket showed up for "consistent with" testing, would you be able to say, beyond a reasonable doubt,, that those red fibers had to have come from Patsy's jacket??

Me neither.

When I read in Kolar and ST books that fibers have been found on the tape, inside of rope's knot, on the blanket, in the tray AND were CONSISTENT WITH Patsy's jacket, I fully take this as an evidence/fact. For me, the 'consistent with' = match of (at the minimum!):

- colors;
- physical attributes;
- chemical elements.

So, I have no doubts that this particular evidence was properly tested....and no wonder why both, LW and LS, were trying so hard to discriminate this evidence!!!

Here is part of interview with Patsy in August, 2000.

7 MR. LEVIN: I can state to you,
8 Mr. Wood, that, given the current state of
9 the scientific examination of fibers, that,
10 based on the state of the art technology,
11 that I believe, based on testing, that fibers
12 from your client's coat are in the paint
13 tray.
14 MR. WOOD: Are you stating as a
15 fact that they are from the coat or is it
16 consistent with? What is the test result
17 terminology? Is it conclusive? I mean, I
18 think she is entitled to know that when you
19 ask her to explain something.
20 MR. KANE: It is identical in all
21 scientific respects.
22 MR. WOOD: What does that mean?
23 Are you telling me it is conclusive?
24 MR. KANE: It is identical.
25 MR. WOOD: Are you saying it is
1 a conclusive match?
2 MR. KANE: You can draw your own
3 conclusions.
4 MR. WOOD: I am not going to
5 draw my own conclusions.
6 MR. KANE: I am saying it is
7 identical.
8 MR. WOOD: Well, what you are
9 saying in terms of how you interpret a lab
10 result may or may not be the lab result.

hahaha..............................nice try LW.

jmo

 

[UKGuy]

The 4 fibers found on the duct tape were red. There were other red fibers found in the paint tray, the garrote tie, on JB's shirt. These red fibers were said to be "consistent with" Patsy's jacket fibers.

But, I find it interesting that there were no references to the gray or black jacket fibers that her fleece jacket also contained, since the jacket was a red/black/gray checked fleece jacket. Why only the red fibers?

This is from a "48 Hours"collection by Erin Moriarty of interviews information of Patsy and with Lou Smit:

Bruce Levin: To Lin Wood - "We believe the fibers from her jacket were found in the paint tray, were found tied into the ligature found on JonBenét's neck, were found on the blanket that she was wrapped in, were found on the duct tape that was found on the mouth.
To Patsy: I have no evidence from any scientist that suggests that those fibers are from any source other than your red jacket.
Lin Wood:Well, come on, what other sources did they test.
Patsy's attorney, Lin Wood asked prosecutors to produce the evidence
and when they wouldn't, he refused to let Patsy go on the record."

Erin Moriarty: "Is the fact that there were fibers that were consistent with Patsy Ramsey's jacket
incriminating?"
Lou Smit: "Sure."
Erin Moriarty: "But does that shake your faith that the Ramsey's were not involved?"
Lou Smit: "No, you just can't rely on fiber evidence because fibers could come off the jacket or something similar to the jacket."

OK, now don't bash me because I'm posting something from Lin Wood and Lou Smit! The statements from both of these guys could have easily been used in a trial proceeding. If you were on the jury, and the Santa Suit was taken into evidence, the reports of JB getting a 'secret Santa' visit were validated on the stand, and the forensic evidence did not produce tests that showed the Suit was tested - and ONLY the red fibers from Patsy's multi-colored jacket showed up for "consistent with" testing, would you be able to say, beyond a reasonable doubt,, that those red fibers had to have come from Patsy's jacket??

Me neither.

midwest mama,
I think you are correct. Red fibers are well red fibers. And may have originated from the Santa Suit, any potential match here would make the Special Santa theory the front runner.

BPD never said that the red fibers attributed to Patsy's jacket did not match the Santa Suit, or did they?

.

 

[OpenMind4U]

MM,

I'm not in the 'pissing match' (forgive my language please) here in regards of fibers. What I'm trying to do is exectly what YOU've been asking others to do: don't shake the foundation of the prooven facts! This case is complicated 'as is', with many unknown factors/facts/evidences. If we'll start questioning every known fact then we'll shoot ourself in the foot, so to speak...and will never move forward to solve this case and/or get justice for JonBenet.

Is there other red fibers found in basement which do NOT belong to Patsy but matching SC suit? Possible. But we don't know about (yet)...We can speculate but we don't have 'foundation' for it, agree?

I keep coming back to Kolar book again and again. Why his book? Because he was the ONE who saw ALL evidences and knows ALL facts.

When Shiller wrote his PMPT, he couldn't know all LE 'secrets' and his book was written way before GJ finished their work. So, he wouldn't know about testimonies during GJ procedure.

With Steve Thomas book, he knew LE 'secrets' but had no idea about GJ testimonies...

With Kolar, he knew everything when he wrote his book. He read ALL GJ testimonies, he read all LE and DA documents. And I'm not surprized that after his book got published - we got 'GJ leak' indicating that BOTH Ramseys are guilty.


jmo

 

[UKGuy]

When I read in Kolar and ST books that fibers have been found on the tape, inside of rope's knot, on the blanket, in the tray AND were CONSISTENT WITH Patsy's jacket, I fully take this as an evidence/fact. For me, the 'consistent with' = match of (at the minimum!):

- colors;
- physical attributes;
- chemical elements.

So, I have no doubts that this particular evidence was properly tested....and no wonder why both, LW and LS, were trying so hard to discriminate this evidence!!!

Here is part of interview with Patsy in August, 2000.



hahaha..............................nice try LW.

jmo

OpenMind4U,
The phrase consistent with Patsy's jacket simply means to date, no test undertaken displayed any disimilarity.

This is not the same as saying we have an identical match, it comes pretty close. Yet tomorrow you might undertake a new test utilising the fibers birefringence properties and a laser.

This might show that the fibers from Patsy's jacket are no longer consistent.


.

 

[UKGuy]

MM,

I'm not in the 'pissing match' (forgive my language please) here in regards of fibers. What I'm trying to do is exectly what YOU've been asking others to do: don't shake the foundation of the prooven facts! This case is complicated 'as is', with many unknown factors/facts/evidences. If we'll start questioning every known fact then we'll shoot ourself in the foot, so to speak...and will never move forward to solve this case and/or get justice for JonBenet.

Is there other red fibers found in basement which do NOT belong to Patsy but matching SC suit? Possible. But we don't know about (yet)...We can speculate but we don't have 'foundation' for it, agree?

I keep coming back to Kolar book again and again. Why his book? Because he was the ONE who saw ALL evidences and knows ALL facts.

When Shiller wrote his PMPT, he couldn't know all LE 'secrets' and his book was written way before GJ finished their work. So, he wouldn't know about testimonies during GJ procedure.

With Steve Thomas book, he knew LE 'secrets' but had no idea about GJ testimonies...

With Kolar, he knew everything when he wrote his book. He read ALL GJ testimonies, he read all LE and DA documents. And I'm not surprized that after his book got published - we got 'GJ leak' indicating that BOTH Ramseys are guilty.


jmo

OpenMind4U,
Sure, but no fibers from the Santa Suit, does not rule out the Secret Santa Visit.

As you suggest the red fibers you discuss place Patsy in the wine-cellar, a location she said she never visited 12/25/1996.


.

 

[OpenMind4U]

OpenMind4U,
Sure, but no fibers from the Santa Suit, does not rule out the Secret Santa Visit.
As you suggest the red fibers you discuss place Patsy in the wine-cellar, a location she said she never visited 12/25/1996.


.

UKGuy,

How do you know that fibers from Santa Suit were there and WASN'T TESTED??? How do you know that? Maybe it was tested against all evidences LE had and match wasn't found, agree?...It was X-mas time and JB probably visited some stores with her parents...and maybe in some stores THE Santa was there, sitting with kids on his lap or walking around the store...maybe this Santa promissed JB that she'll have soon the special secret visit from Santa...who knows?....possible? I think so...

 

[Nom de plume]

When I read in Kolar and ST books that fibers have been found on the tape, inside of rope's knot, on the blanket, in the tray AND were CONSISTENT WITH Patsy's jacket, I fully take this as an evidence/fact. For me, the 'consistent with' = match of (at the minimum!):

- colors;
- physical attributes;
- chemical elements.

So, I have no doubts that this particular evidence was properly tested....and no wonder why both, LW and LS, were trying so hard to discriminate this evidence!!!

jmo
-

I agree that "consistant with" = a match. However, MM made a good point that it could leave a reasonable doubt in ones mind. It's odd that they didn't find any of the other colors of fibers from her jacket. If they had tested, or did test and we don't know it, the other items such as the santa suit, JB's red turtleneck & jumpsuit, etc. then it would eliminate doubt about the fiber evidence, at least IMO.

 

[OpenMind4U]

I agree that "consistant with" = a match. However, MM made a good point that it could leave a reasonable doubt in ones mind. It's odd that they didn't find any of the other colors of fibers from her jacket. If they had tested, or did test and we don't know it, the other items such as the santa suit, JB's red turtleneck & jumpsuit, etc. then it would eliminate doubt about the fiber evidence, at least IMO.

Let's try to find reasonable explation for 'reasonable doubts'.

1. Test of other RED fibers (santa suit, turtleneck, jumpsuit...)
- how do we know that all these items were NOT tested?
- if these items were collected by LE, properly identifed and documented in the 'evidence collected' list, what make us believe that LE didn't do their job and didn't test them?
- do we have the test results for ALL fibers tested by LE? NO!...
- how do we know about fibers from Patsy's jacket? Did we read LE lab test result? NO! We found about through books and interview.

2. Why only RED fibers from Patsy jacket (not black and not grey)?
- would you agree that garment like jacket is made from some kind of cloth?
- would you agree that cloth itself could consist of different kind of threads?
- would you agree that each threads could have different characteristic (heavy versa light; short versa long)?
- would you agree that these threads could be differently WEAVEN into cloth?
- in another words, would you agree that some threads could be easily SHED from the cloth while other wouldn't?

IMO, red fibers from Patsy jacket was light thread quality with easy shed ability.

In regards of Santa fibers (and/or other fibers), I have no reason to believe that they're not tested by LE. And the reason why we didn't hear much about these test results through the books and interviews is because IMO they're not 'remarkable' or they're part of the 'secrets'....(and if they're part of the 'secrets' today then during the court procedure in the future (hope so!!!) , we, the jury, will hear all these 'secrets' and shouldn't have reasonable doubts....makes sense?

jmo

 

[UKGuy]

UKGuy,

How do you know that fibers from Santa Suit were there and WASN'T TESTED??? How do you know that? Maybe it was tested against all evidences LE had and match wasn't found, agree?...It was X-mas time and JB probably visited some stores with her parents...and maybe in some stores THE Santa was there, sitting with kids on his lap or walking around the store...maybe this Santa promissed JB that she'll have soon the special secret visit from Santa...who knows?....possible? I think so...

OpenMind4U,

How do you know that fibers from Santa Suit were there and WASN'T TESTED???

I do not. This is the point.

Is it possible that BPD were using the fiber analysis, i.e. red fibers to put pressure on Patsy, because they wanted her as a prosecution witness?

Saying the fibers are consistent is not the same as saying we have an exact match. Also it would not be illegal for BPD to question PR in this manner.

Maybe it was tested against all evidences LE had and match wasn't found, agree?

This could have happened, if so, it would be nice of the BPD to release the results.

Consider all the other own goals by the BPD, e.g. size-12 underwear, no more said; barbie doll, no more said, pink barbie nightgown, no more said and the rest.

How do we know that the Santa Suit is exempt?

p.s. definitely a question for Kolar if he ever does another interview?

.

 

[Nom de plume]

Let's try to find reasonable explation for 'reasonable doubts'.

1. Test of other RED fibers (santa suit, turtleneck, jumpsuit...)
- how do we know that all these items were NOT tested?
- if these items were collected by LE, properly identifed and documented in the 'evidence collected' list, what make us believe that LE didn't do their job and didn't test them?
- do we have the test results for ALL fibers tested by LE? NO!...
- how do we know about fibers from Patsy's jacket? Did we read LE lab test result? NO! We found about through books and interview.

2. Why only RED fibers from Patsy jacket (not black and not grey)?
- would you agree that garment like jacket is made from some kind of cloth?
- would you agree that cloth itself could consist of different kind of threads?
- would you agree that each threads could have different characteristic (heavy versa light; short versa long)?
- would you agree that these threads could be differently WEAVEN into cloth?
- in another words, would you agree that some threads could be easily SHED from the cloth while other wouldn't?

IMO, red fibers from Patsy jacket was light thread quality with easy shed ability.
In regards of Santa fibers (and/or other fibers), I have no reason to believe that they're not tested by LE. And the reason why we didn't hear much about these test results through the books and interviews is because IMO they're not 'remarkable' or they're part of the 'secrets'.

jmo

OM4U, if you go back and read my post you will see where I said, " or did test and we don't know it".

I'm not arguing that the red fibers DIDN'T come from PR's jacket. I'm convinced they did, but in a court of law it's proof beyond a reasonable doubt that must be considered. Without knowing if LE tested fibers from the other items or not, then I believe it could leave doubt in some people's minds.

As to only red fibers from the jacket being found, I do find that unusual. I have clothing woven from different colors, but typically they ARE the same TYPE of thread i.e. all cotton, or all silk, etc. I know clothing is often made of a blend, but mostly all the fibers will be the same blend, not some cotton, some wool, some polyester. Yes, you are correct that some clothing has threads of different diameter, and characteristics. And yes, it's possible that this could account for only the red fibers being shed. I can't remember....did we ever see pictures of the jacket or was it only a written description?

 

[OpenMind4U]

OM4U, if you go back and read my post you will see where I said, " or did test and we don't know it".

I'm not arguing that the red fibers DIDN'T come from PR's jacket. I'm convinced they did, but in a court of law it's proof beyond a reasonable doubt that must be considered. Without knowing if LE tested fibers from the other items or not, then I believe it could leave doubt in some people's minds.

As to only red fibers from the jacket being found, I do find that unusual. I have clothing woven from different colors, but typically they ARE the same TYPE of thread i.e. all cotton, or all silk, etc. I know clothing is often made of a blend, but mostly all the fibers will be the same blend, not some cotton, some wool, some polyester. Yes, you are correct that some clothing has threads of different diameter, and characteristics. And yes, it's possible that this could account for only the red fibers being shed. I can't remember....did we ever see pictures of the jacket or was it only a written description?

No pictures, only description, as much as I know. If we could see pictures from White's party - we could see her jacket.

I'm very much interesting to see this jacket as well, but for different reason. My interests are in jacket's bottons and their location.

jmo

 

[Nom de plume]

No pictures, only description, as much as I know. If we could see pictures from White's party - we could see her jacket.

I'm very much interesting to see this jacket as well, but for different reason. My interests are in jacket's bottons and their location.

jmo

That's interesting. What are your thoughts about the buttons? Anything to do with the marks on JB's body?

 

[midwest mama]

Wow, guys! :chillout: The point I hoped to make is simply that with the only red fiber information being released as being "consistent with" Patsy's jackets, and none of the other red items testing results ever being released, we focus on just the one item, which keeps us on a rather narrow path when looking at clues of the case.

OM, just one thought about the colored fibers of Patsy's jacket, as I wondered just what you did - that maybe the red ones were of different type and might have been shedders. But her jacket was "fleece". Usually fleece fabrics are very consistent, even when dyed different colors, so I dismissed the thought of different consistencies of the 3 colors of fibers in Patsy's jacket. And that is also why I wonder why there were no references to the other colors of fibers. If we were on a jury, I'm sure we'd see actual samples of the fibers, so that would help us.

Everyone is right - we have no way of knowing if ANY of the other red fibers were tested. It would have been ridiculous to at least not have used them as comparisons when testing Patsy's jacket fibers. And as OM pointed out, Michael Kane did refer to 21 scientific results, and use the word "identical".
That has credibility, and along with Kolar's info, we should trust it.

I just would be more comfortable if I knew the Santa Suit had been tested and we were told the fibers were NOT "consistent with" any of the others found on the crime items. :moo: Especially if the Santa Suit was fleece.

The only way we ever stand a chance of seeing any justice for JB is to remember that indeed, BOTH Ramseys were indicted. Just because Patsy is gone, it does not mean JR is home free.

If he gets subpoenaed by a new GJ, and charges would be brought against him, the prosecution will have to at least "neutralize" the Patsy jacket red fiber evidence as best it can. The more they can plant in the jury's mind that JR had the same chance of wrapping that cord around the paintbrush handle as Patsy did, the stronger their chances of getting a guilty verdict.

At the very least, they will have to bring in the "transference" factor, if there are no others test results of the red items taken into evidence that show they are NOT matches to the fibers found in the incriminating places - paint tray, garrote, duct tape. And though "transference" is not a popular option for most in the forum as an excuse for Patsy's jacket fibers being present, Dr. Lee's opinion, and that of other forensic scientists would confirm the possibility. Hard as that is to accept, it is a fact. And, as UKGuy says, I'd bet my house on the fact that there would be a least one juror who would not be swayed away from that information, and one juror can create a hung jury. Bad news for Justice4JB!

 

[OpenMind4U]

That's interesting. What are your thoughts about the buttons? Anything to do with the marks on JB's body?

Yes, exectly!...on JB's cheek. This round one, 'burn'-like, so called 'abrasion' by AR. Was it made by ring which Patsy used to wear with the stone inside her palm?; or by the botton from her jacket when JB was carry-on or straggled or strangled?...very much interesting to know the dimention and position of these buttons.