CO- Dylan Redwine, 13, Vallecito, 19 November 2012 - #19

[mmmagique]

And that's exactly why I say it wasn't thought through and now they don't know what to do to get out of it.

So the mother and/or the brother who claim to be heartbroken over this are all lying? They put their friends and family through all of this to...what? Prove a point? This doesn't make any sense to me at all. Just...not at all.

 

[TxLady2]

I really wish more parents taught their kids to stand up for themselves and be proactive. Dylan is 13 years old, he's not a baby. If he really didn't want to visit his dad he should have been told that flat out refusal was an option. You can't put a kicking screaming teenager on an airplane and the judge wouldn't toss his mother in jail for violating a court order, if he stood his ground.






Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I agree with you there.

It may depend on the judge, but I know of a few cases where the NCP has been refused visitation occasionally, and nothing was done about it. If it happens consistently, the mother gets a contempt of court and a fine. If the child is over 12, I think they legally have a choice. If they refuse to go with the NCP, and if they are not coerced by the mother in making that choice, then I don't think the courts can force them to go.

I'm going to guess that Dylan was either not given a chance to speak up, or chose not to tell the judge that he didn't want to go. Or maybe he wasn't all that upset over going in the first place.

One question in my mind is, did Elaine just develop these ideas that Mark might have done something to Dylan AFTER he went missing, or did she always have these fears? Reason I question that is, IF she thought all along that he was capable of this and thought Dylan's life was in danger, then why on earth did she put him on that plane? What is more important, risk having to go to court and possibly losing custody somewhere down the road.... or protecting your child from a potential death at the hands of his father, who you seem to despise?

I know which one I would choose. I would keep my child with me and go to court a thousand times and pay a fine every other week if it was necessary, to save my child's life. I am not criticizing or bashing her, it's entirely possible that she didn't know or wasn't told that Dylan had a say-so in these visitations. Or that these suspicions did not surface until he went missing. It could make a big difference.

 

[asyousay]

Dylan was supposed to arrive on Sat. He planned to visit friends on Sun.

Have you got a link where it says he did not have plans with friends on the Saturday ?

i just find it strange that Dylan never altered the plans to Monday as he had 24 hours to cancel Sunday night with friends if he wanted to when his trip got moved back a day to spend it with dad .

 

[asyousay]

So the mother and/or the brother who claim to be heartbroken over this are all lying? They put their friends and family through all of this to...what? Prove a point? This doesn't make any sense to me at all. Just...not at all.

Also to throw in this in as well



Also how did they manage to get all the way to Dylan's dad's house and not be picked up on any kind of cctv footage ( on this 6 hour car journey ( 12 if they did it there and back ) and then hot-tail it back home in time for the phone call to say Dylan is missing ?

 

[mmmagique]

I agree with you there.

It may depend on the judge, but I know of a few cases where the NCP has been refused visitation occasionally, and nothing was done about it. If it happens consistently, the mother gets a contempt of court and a fine. If the child is over 12, I think they legally have a choice. If they refuse to go with the NCP, and if they are not coerced by the mother in making that choice, then I don't think the courts can force them to go.

I'm going to guess that Dylan was either not given a chance to speak up, or chose not to tell the judge that he didn't want to go. Or maybe he wasn't all that upset over going in the first place.

One question in my mind is, did Elaine just develop these ideas that Mark might have done something to Dylan AFTER he went missing, or did she always have these fears? Reason I question that is, IF she thought all along that he was capable of this and thought Dylan's life was in danger, then why on earth did she put him on that plane? What is more important, risk having to go to court and possibly losing custody somewhere down the road.... or protecting your child from a potential death at the hands of his father, who you seem to despise?

I know which one I would choose. I would keep my child with me and go to court a thousand times and pay a fine every other week if it was necessary, to save my child's life. I am not criticizing or bashing her, it's entirely possible that she didn't know or wasn't told that Dylan had a say-so in these visitations. Or that these suspicions did not surface until he went missing. It could make a big difference.

It really depends on what state you're in, and more specifically, the judge you get. People lose custody if they refuse visitation often enough. It's not always just a matter of paying fines.

 

[NSS]

I tried to google it and came up with nothing...
If anyone saw the stuff I googled for missing children cases...

Try checking, UCCJEA or parental abduction. Lots of info about what happens if a child is abducted onto a Reservation.

 

[mmmagique]

I agree with you there.

It may depend on the judge, but I know of a few cases where the NCP has been refused visitation occasionally, and nothing was done about it. If it happens consistently, the mother gets a contempt of court and a fine. If the child is over 12, I think they legally have a choice. If they refuse to go with the NCP, and if they are not coerced by the mother in making that choice, then I don't think the courts can force them to go.

I'm going to guess that Dylan was either not given a chance to speak up, or chose not to tell the judge that he didn't want to go. Or maybe he wasn't all that upset over going in the first place.

One question in my mind is, did Elaine just develop these ideas that Mark might have done something to Dylan AFTER he went missing, or did she always have these fears? Reason I question that is, IF she thought all along that he was capable of this and thought Dylan's life was in danger, then why on earth did she put him on that plane? What is more important, risk having to go to court and possibly losing custody somewhere down the road.... or protecting your child from a potential death at the hands of his father, who you seem to despise?

I know which one I would choose. I would keep my child with me and go to court a thousand times and pay a fine every other week if it was necessary, to save my child's life. I am not criticizing or bashing her, it's entirely possible that she didn't know or wasn't told that Dylan had a say-so in these visitations. Or that these suspicions did not surface until he went missing. It could make a big difference.

Sorry to keep quoting you but I just saw the bolded part. I don't think very many people would consider their ex capable of harming/killing their own child. Your mind, just doesn't go there, no matter how bad of a person you think your ex is, unless they've done something similar in the past, the normal person just doesn't think that way.

 

[mmmagique]

Also to throw in this in as well



Also how did they manage to get all the way to Dylan's dad's house and not be picked up on any kind of cctv footage ( on this 6 hour car journey ( 12 if they did it there and back ) and then hot-tail it back home in time for the phone call to say Dylan is missing ?

Well, it was a text (which is generally done to cell phones) so, conceivably, (I guess) they *could* have still been there.

But the mind just boggles trying to make those pieces fit. And they just don't. (imo)

 

[TxLady2]

I'm not sure why Jaycee stayed in that backyard all of those years. But what ever the reason was, it was strong. Do you think that something as strong as that could be keeping Dylan trapped somewhere?

Did you ever read her book? Very interesting.
She was an 11-y.o. girl, scared out of her mind. For a period of time she was chained, and had a very limited space she could move around in. She was threatened, brainwashed and eventually just accepted life the way it was. She gave birth to her 1st child at 13, I think, and the 2nd one two or three years later. By the time the possibility of escaping opened up, she knew she had to find a way to make sure they were protected. She was not going to leave unless she could take them with her. She was a very strong and brave young lady.
Interesting, too, that her mother never gave up hope, never let herself think of the possibility that Jaycee was dead. Eighteen years after she was kidnapped, Jaycee came home, and the mother's prayers were answered. Think about it... 18 years!!! Can any one of us imagine what that would be like?

 

[TxLady2]

The first thing LE does is account for and interview all family members when a child is missing in the midst of major custodial battles, if they are at all competent.

I find it impossible to believe that either parent has someone devoted enough to risk prison just to get Dylan out of a holiday visit. And the weeks of school that Dylan has missed are among the few during the year that can be generally fun for kids, holiday parties, etc. not to mention midterms, if they still have those.

I too think it is possible Dylan was seen on foot that morning and later it was ruled out, although I cannot see why he would take off and especially not use his phone, but am willing to consider it at least, far more than the idea of him being stashed. Many people thought Kyron had been stashed, I wonder if they still do.

Okay. But what if someone was convinced that his life was in danger, or that he was abused by his father, mentally or physically, or both? What if that someone just acted on impulse and really didn't consider the consequences?

People commit crimes all the time, knowing they risk going to jail, and prison, it still doesn't prevent them from doing them. Not everybody listens to their practical side.

 

[asyousay]

Did you ever read her book? Very interesting.
She was an 11-y.o. girl, scared out of her mind. For a period of time she was chained, and had a very limited space she could move around in. She was threatened, brainwashed and eventually just accepted life the way it was. She gave birth to her 1st child at 13, I think, and the 2nd one two or three years later. By the time the possibility of escaping opened up, she knew she had to find a way to make sure they were protected. She was not going to leave unless she could take them with her. She was a very strong and brave young lady.
Interesting, too, that her mother never gave up hope, never let herself think of the possibility that Jaycee was dead. Eighteen years after she was kidnapped, Jaycee came home, and the mother's prayers were answered. Think about it... 18 years!!! Can any one of us imagine what that would be like?

Nope and in my case i would rather of been killed and that says a lot as i hate the thought of dying. But that is basically hell on earth so better to die and be in a better place IMO .MOO.

 

[TxLady2]

I do not get why people do not believe Elaine when she said Dylan did not want to visit his dad.

This is the same child who landed and texted mum with a unhappy frown face .

The same child who had made plans to spend the first night with friends instead of dad.

The same child who when was not allowed to visit that night made plans for 6.30am the following morning .

IMO Dylan could not want to get away from MR first thing.

None of these actions speak of Dylan wanting to spend time with dad !

MOO,IMHO

And there's the rub. Why didn't he refuse to go, then? Why didn't he assert his rights and just put his foot down and say, "I'm not going and you can't make me!!" As Linda said, nobody is going to put a kicking, screaming teenager on a plane and send him 5 hours away.

Maybe he didn't want to see Dad, but he obviously wanted to be with his friends. So whether he wanted to be with his dad or not is not the issue. The issue is, he went and then he disappeared. Maybe he was forced to go. Maybe he went willingly, or grudgingly. Who knows? If his mom says he didn't want to go, then why did she make him? At 13, he has the right to refuse, if he wants to.

 

[mmmagique]

If anyone in this scenario is an impulsive type, it's MR. He's the one who had sex under ER's window with a neighbor. (In the front yard and where his children could see)

He was the one who got his child for Thanksgiving, but had no plans.

I don't remember ER's exact job description, but I do remember it's with a school, and has something to do with finances. (I think) That type is generally *not* impulsive. (imo)

 

[cluciano63]

Nope and in my case i would rather of been killed and that says a lot as i hate the thought of dying. But that is basically hell on earth so better to die and be in a better place IMO .MOO.

I read an interview yesterday where Steven Stanger said that what he endured for four years was worse than death. I can't find the link now. But I have to agree, at least for myself. Not everyone can recover to any sort of a life after years of assault, etc. I don't think my survival instinct would be that strong under such conditions. I can't bring myself to think this is among Dylan's best chances for being alive.

 

[mmmagique]

And there's the rub. Why didn't he refuse to go, then? Why didn't he assert his rights and just put his foot down and say, "I'm not going and you can't make me!!" As Linda said, nobody is going to put a kicking, screaming teenager on a plane and send him 5 hours away.

Maybe he didn't want to see Dad, but he obviously wanted to be with his friends. So whether he wanted to be with his dad or not is not the issue. The issue is, he went and then he disappeared. Maybe he was forced to go. Maybe he went willingly, or grudgingly. Who knows? If his mom says he didn't want to go, then why did she make him? At 13, he has the right to refuse, if he wants to.

He did not have the right to say no to a court ordered visitation.

 

[cluciano63]

If anyone in this scenario is an impulsive type, it's MR. He's the one who had sex under ER's window with a neighbor. (In the front yard and where his children could see)

He was the one who got his child for Thanksgiving, but had no plans.

I don't remember ER's exact job description, but I do remember it's with a school, and has something to do with finances. (I think) That type is generally *not* impulsive. (imo)

I think some believe that he hid Dylan. For what purpose, I cannot imagine. Fast track to no visitation at all, IMO.

 

[Linda7NJ]

IMO most children are raised believing they don't have a choice. They live under contact authority of others, never taught how to think for themselves.

Lets face it, assertive children are few and far between. Most behave like sheep.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Malini2001]

And there's the rub. Why didn't he refuse to go, then? Why didn't he assert his rights and just put his foot down and say, "I'm not going and you can't make me!!" As Linda said, nobody is going to put a kicking, screaming teenager on a plane and send him 5 hours away.

Maybe he didn't want to see Dad, but he obviously wanted to be with his friends. So whether he wanted to be with his dad or not is not the issue. The issue is, he went and then he disappeared. Maybe he was forced to go. Maybe he went willingly, or grudgingly. Who knows? If his mom says he didn't want to go, then why did she make him? At 13, he has the right to refuse, if he wants to.

Dylan could not refuse court-ordered visitation. If he tried that, his mother would be found in contempt of court. I went through a similar situation. My daughter could not refuse a visit until she was 18.

 

[mmmagique]

IMO most children are raised believing they don't have a choice. They live under contact authority of others, never taught how to think for themselves.

Lets face it, assertive children are few and far between. Most behave like sheep.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

In cases of court ordered visitation, they really don't have a choice. Unless there is an *unusual* type of problem such as sexual or physical abuse; in which case they would need to get CPS involved.

 

[TxLady2]

Well, yes it can. My step-granddaughter has refused for 4 years, since she was 9 years old. Consistently. My stepdaughter has never been charged with contempt and has never been in jail for it and has not lost custody of her.