CO- Dylan Redwine, 13, Vallecito, 19 November 2012 - #47

[SuperMom1995]

ok, maybe I'm an idiot but I've been checking thread #44 for the past 2 weeks to see when it's going to re-open. It states the thread is closed and there was never a link posted for the next new thread. I thought this discussion has been shut down for 2 weeks. Now i realize I missed 3 threads.
Might be good to update thread #44 for those of us who are oblivious.
TIA

Good to see you! I am not able to be on as much as I was but I was wondering what happened to you...

 

[SCHMAE]

ok, maybe I'm an idiot but I've been checking thread #44 for the past 2 weeks to see when it's going to re-open. It states the thread is closed and there was never a link posted for the next new thread. I thought this discussion has been shut down for 2 weeks. Now i realize I missed 3 threads.
Might be good to update thread #44 for those of us who are oblivious.
TIA

Awww, welcome back. I was thrown off for a bit as well .

 

[RANCH]

Choking someone would not leave any physical evidence behind. I can think of several ways someone could be killed without leaving physical evidence behind.

I'm not so sure about that. Back in 1997 my employers son was murdered. His body was recovered in the Sacramento river after six weeks. The coroner was able to tell that he was choked until unconscious and then thrown into the river where he then drowned.

I'm not an expert so I don't know if an autopsy would be able to show the same thing after 5 months in the water vs six weeks. MOO.

 

[SuperMom1995]

I wouldn't say there is no evidence regarding the parents, it just isn't enough to ensure a verdict given the Post CSI courtroom atmosphere and the leeway given to defence. Investigators and DA's often feel it is better to wait to prosecute years from now than to prosecute and let the suspect walk.

But to answer your question, I think it is very likely parents can disappear their children and get away with it. They follow the rules: Blame an abductor, don't talk, lawyer up, hide the body where it won't likely be found, don't report the child missing when they actually go missing.

ETA: This is all just my own opinion!

....and buy a fishing pole...:Banane49:

 

[Leader6518]

There aren't an arrests thus far, in any of those cases, nor any purported POIs or suspects named by LE. It's entirely possible that NONE of these parents are guilty of anything other than not waking upon someone entering their home.

Just FYI, IIRC Madaline McCann's parents left her and her two younger siblings alone in their hotel room while they went to eat in a nearby restaurant.

 

[scorekeeper]

I am confused as to what you are saying here. Are you saying they knew in advance there wouldn't be a scent to follow and that is why they did not use the scent articles immediately? I do not see how that is possible if they didn't have a good scent article to begin with, how they would arrive to that conclusion.


Including link again: http://durangoherald.com/article/201...late=mobileart


BBM

So in first few days they didn't have a scent article in which they could attempt to track him with, that is my understanding.

La Plata County Search and Rescue members searched for Dylan Monday night in areas off County Road 500

http://durangoherald.com/article/20121120/NEWS01/121129996/-1/News

What if the dogs picked up "a scent" from the truck to house and back to truck and no where else in the area?

I'm sorry I am having trouble saying what I want or mean to say....been a very trying personal day. :seeya:

 

[scorekeeper]

ok, maybe I'm an idiot but I've been checking thread #44 for the past 2 weeks to see when it's going to re-open. It states the thread is closed and there was never a link posted for the next new thread. I thought this discussion has been shut down for 2 weeks. Now i realize I missed 3 threads.
Might be good to update thread #44 for those of us who are oblivious.
TIA

good to see you!

Well, thread #30 has been missing for a long time also....

wonder why we have missing threads?

 

[Money Girl]

It does make sense and it made me feel stupid when I read it because I had not really thought about it. It may not of played a part in this case, but IMO I believe it is another potential factor decreasing the odds that Dylan was abducted by a stranger.

But there were more people than usual in that area, so the odds would not be decreased.

 

[SCHMAE]

But there were more people than usual in that area, so the odds would not be decreased.

I've been wondering about that since last night. Were there more people actually verified ? Or is it that the holiday week generally brings more people each year , so more people were expected? Because if it's the latter, then I would suspect most of the ' more ' people did not arrive until Monday sometime, scattered throughout the day. Of course some would have arrived on the weekend, but some people think of a week as M-F , so would not have come on the weekend. Just thinking out loud.

 

[RANCH]

La Plata County Search and Rescue members searched for Dylan Monday night in areas off County Road 500

http://durangoherald.com/article/20121120/NEWS01/121129996/-1/News

What if the dogs picked up "a scent" from the truck to house and back to truck and no where else in the area?

I'm sorry I am having trouble saying what I want or mean to say....been a very trying personal day. :seeya:

This article explains the scent trail that people leave behind and I found this part of particular interest.

How long will a scent trail remain?

It might remain for weeks or scatter beyond recognition very quickly if the scent rafts are few in number, as they are when coming through the ventilation system of a car. Also, some environmental factors--wind, temperature, humidity, and terrain-- affect how long a good scent trail will stay together. At some point, regardless of how incubating the conditions are, the scent trail will disappear. This is due to the very biological process which beget the scent trail: the bacteria feeding off the dead or dying skin cells complete their feast, eliminate their by-products, and go on to digest other things. So, it’s smart to bring in a well trained, scent-discriminating bloodhound as soon as possible after an abduction of a child occurs.

BBM

I still wonder why LE waited so long to get good scent items for the search dogs.

http://www.jimmyryce.org/ScentCollection.html

 

[Psychic Sleuth]

I'm not so sure about that. Back in 1997 my employers son was murdered. His body was recovered in the Sacramento river after six weeks. The coroner was able to tell that he was choked until unconscious and then thrown into the river where he then drowned.

I'm not an expert so I don't know if an autopsy would be able to show the same thing after 5 months in the water vs six weeks. MOO.

Sorry I wasn't very clear. I meant crime scene evidence rather than physical evidence on the body. Yes choking can leave physical evidence on the body.

 

[Seajay]

Money Girl and SeaJay, I agree that something like this could happen. But I'm curious, why do you think LE has ruled this out? They've made several statements that this is a criminal investigation haven't they? So, do you think that LE is just being incompetent? I'm not saying that snarkily, I think sometimes professionals drop the ball and screw up. I'm just not clear on how your thoughts about LE and this investigation inform your theory about a possible accident? If you put a lot of faith in LE statements, this theory would be hard to accept. But if you don't, then perhaps you just think they are overlooking the obvious?

Also, if cadaver dogs were brought in, wouldn't they in all likelihood be able to track an accident? Well I guess tracking dogs would too, right? I mean they could follow Dylan's scent to the forest and the cliff or the mine, wouldn't they? If he was going out for an innocent explore/adventure and had a terrible accident, it wouldn't be too far from home. Do you put a lot of faith in the dogs, or not so much? All those questions makes it hard for me to accept an exploring/adventure/accident scenario. JMO

I do believe LE for the most part. I believe LE when they say that MR is not a suspect or a POI, even though that's not accepted by many others.

I don't know what to believe as far as the hits on the lake by the dogs, because LE has discounted those.

I do not know why LE has ruled out DR being a runaway. To me, that's still a viable option. It doesn't matter what DR's life looks like to the outsider, it's what was going on inside of him.

DR's friends also said he and his father were close and Dylan loved his father. So I feel if we are going to take Dylan's friends words for how great his life was with his mother, then why aren't we taking it for his father was well??

IMO it's dysfunctional when you have a son on National TV screaming at his father "I hate you, you are less than a father to me." That's dysfunctional. That Jerry Springer. That's not a family that works, not with the divorce included. I honestly do not excuse it and think it's justified the way it was done.

Air time is precious. Very precious. Why was it spent trashing Mark??? Why wasn't it spent talking about Dylan's likes, dislikes, his character, his personality, his interests in school??? Why was it about nailing Mark??? Why did that have to be done??? How would that find Dylan?? If Mark needed to be nailed, it needs to be done by LE, not the family on National TV.

For a family to even go there is dysfunctional. Dr. Phil does not have functional families on his show. I see a lot of abnormalities in that family and not just centered around our favorite subject.

That is my opinion. I have a right to it, same was the rest of you. I'm not trying to convince anyone of anything, gave up on that long ago. I'm just trying to survive this thread anymore until Dylan is found. I don't see why it should bother anyone that I see dysfunction in that family in more than MR. The way they've all behaved is not normal IMO.

And now I'm going to sign off because it's not my turn.

 

[rebeccaeee]

This article explains the scent trail that people leave behind and I found this part of particular interest.

BBM

I still wonder why LE waited so long to get good scent items for the search dogs.

http://www.jimmyryce.org/ScentCollection.html

I've just read the Durango Herald articles from the first week Dylan was missing from the bottom up.
http://www.durangoherald.com/articl.../SEARCH/Police-search-for-teen-near-Vallecito
"We're leaning towards him being a runaway." - Nov. 20
http://www.durangoherald.com/articl.../Missing-teen-may-have-been-upset-about-order
"Authorities suspect Dylan may have run away." - Nov. 21

On day 2, Bender was stating that Dylan probably ran away. Search and rescue teams were already active.

http://www.durangoherald.com/articl...H/Volunteers-organize-Thanksgiving-Day-search
"Members of La Plata County Search and Rescue searched for Dylan on Monday night and all day Tuesday using ground search teams and dogs." - Nov. 22nd. Article still talking about the postal worker sighting.

http://www.durangoherald.com/article/20121123/NEWS01/121129810/0/SEARCH/'He-would-have-called'

Finally, on Friday the 23rd, the FBI is called and Elaine starts telling everyonw who will listen that Dylan would not have runaway.

I think it is clear that LE did not think they NEEDED scent items because they assumed Dylan would turn up. When he didn't, they probably requested fresh items hoping to pick up something in the air or on the ground.

http://www.durangoherald.com/article/20121126/NEWS01/121129702/0/SEARCH/Frustration-mounting
And finally on the 26th with items in hand....

None of Dylan’s belongings that could carry his scent was available in the first days of the investigation. But the family had articles of the boy’s clothing delivered on the weekend.


“We have the clothes,” Bender said Monday. “We don’t need them here (at the reservoir), but can use them later.”
Elaine Redwine doesn’t believe her son is a runaway because it wasn’t his nature and because he was happy at his new school in Colorado Springs where he entered eighth grade this fall.
“It’s no comfort that they didn’t find anything in the water today,” she said Monday. “But just looking for your little boy in a lake is horrific.”
Bender said no search is planned for today, but searches will resume if new clues or leads develop."

So clothes in hand but no search one week later.

 

[scorekeeper]

This article explains the scent trail that people leave behind and I found this part of particular interest.

BBM

I still wonder why LE waited so long to get good scent items for the search dogs.

http://www.jimmyryce.org/ScentCollection.html

It's mind boggling, isn't it?

It's like they already knew what happened and where Dylan was/is.

And then again, they may have used the scent items brought from his home and have never released the findings or the scent trail????

Another piece of the puzzle we are missing.....:banghead:

 

[RANCH]

I've just read the Durango Herald articles from the first week Dylan was missing from the bottom up.
http://www.durangoherald.com/articl.../SEARCH/Police-search-for-teen-near-Vallecito
"We're leaning towards him being a runaway." - Nov. 20
http://www.durangoherald.com/articl.../Missing-teen-may-have-been-upset-about-order
"Authorities suspect Dylan may have run away." - Nov. 21

On day 2, Bender was stating that Dylan probably ran away. Search and rescue teams were already active.

http://www.durangoherald.com/articl...H/Volunteers-organize-Thanksgiving-Day-search
"Members of La Plata County Search and Rescue searched for Dylan on Monday night and all day Tuesday using ground search teams and dogs." - Nov. 22nd. Article still talking about the postal worker sighting.

http://www.durangoherald.com/article/20121123/NEWS01/121129810/0/SEARCH/'He-would-have-called'

Finally, on Friday the 23rd, the FBI is called and Elaine starts telling everyonw who will listen that Dylan would not have runaway.

I think it is clear that LE did not think they NEEDED scent items because they assumed Dylan would turn up. When he didn't, they probably requested fresh items hoping to pick up something in the air or on the ground.

http://www.durangoherald.com/article/20121126/NEWS01/121129702/0/SEARCH/Frustration-mounting
And finally on the 26th with items in hand....

None of Dylan’s belongings that could carry his scent was available in the first days of the investigation. But the family had articles of the boy’s clothing delivered on the weekend.


“We have the clothes,” Bender said Monday. “We don’t need them here (at the reservoir), but can use them later.”
Elaine Redwine doesn’t believe her son is a runaway because it wasn’t his nature and because he was happy at his new school in Colorado Springs where he entered eighth grade this fall.
“It’s no comfort that they didn’t find anything in the water today,” she said Monday. “But just looking for your little boy in a lake is horrific.”
Bender said no search is planned for today, but searches will resume if new clues or leads develop."

So clothes in hand but no search one week later.

I don't understand why LE would focus on Dylan being a runaway when there is no evidence to support that at all. Even if he did run away, the search dogs may have been able to track him.

I still think that they should have gotten the scent items as soon as possible and used scent discriminating dogs at the earliest possible moment. MOO.

 

[NC Analyzer]

I do believe LE for the most part. I believe LE when they say that MR is not a suspect or a POI, even though that's not accepted by many others.

They haven't said he is not a suspect or POI. They haven't said anyone is a suspect or POI. In the latest press release, they pretty much discounted ER, CR and MH and said nothing about MR. LE rarely names a suspect or POI in most cases due to litigation possibilities.

I don't know what to believe as far as the hits on the lake by the dogs, because LE has discounted those.

I don't think LE has said much about the dogs that makes sense to anyone who knows about tracking dogs. Smokescreen, IMO.

I do not know why LE has ruled out DR being a runaway. To me, that's still a viable option. It doesn't matter what DR's life looks like to the outsider, it's what was going on inside of him.

LE clearly stated they ruled out "runaway" due to the amount of time that passed and the fact that there was no contact between Dylan and anyone else after Sunday night. His parents also clearly stated he had NOTHING to run away from and I'm sure they know better than anyone else.

DR's friends also said he and his father were close and Dylan loved his father. So I feel if we are going to take Dylan's friends words for how great his life was with his mother, then why aren't we taking it for his father was well??

I take Dylan's friends word for the fact that he only hitchhiked ONE time, in a snowstorm, in town, with a group of friends, so yes, I believe his friends are credible. I also believe Dylan's friends weren't privy to some of the concerns Dylan may have had about his father's activities as Dylan may not have revealed that particular side of those issues.

IMO it's dysfunctional when you have a son on National TV screaming at his father "I hate you, you are less than a father to me." That's dysfunctional. That Jerry Springer. That's not a family that works, not with the divorce included. I honestly do not excuse it and think it's justified the way it was done.

Yes, I agree, it's a real shame what MR has done to his children to provoke such anger and hatred. Unfortunately, the only person who can change that is MR, and he doesn't appear to be all that concerned about how his children or his ex's feel about him.

Air time is precious. Very precious. Why was it spent trashing Mark??? Why wasn't it spent talking about Dylan's likes, dislikes, his character, his personality, his interests in school??? Why was it about nailing Mark??? Why did that have to be done??? How would that find Dylan?? If Mark needed to be nailed, it needs to be done by LE, not the family on National TV.

Time is precious to LE, the FBI and the CBI. Time is also precious to ER, CR, and MH. They are the people actively looking for Dylan. They are the people who understand that time is of the essence. Nothing WE, (we as in crime bloggers or DP audience members) talk about has any relevance to how this investigation is conducted. Time spent "trashing" MR is irrelevant. LE doesn't care about whether or not MR has been trashed by anyone and it certainly doesn't hamper their investigative efforts.

For a family to even go there is dysfunctional. Dr. Phil does not have functional families on his show. I see a lot of abnormalities in that family and not just centered around our favorite subject.

As an expert in family dysfunction, I can assure you EVERY family is dysfunctional in one way or another.

That is my opinion. I have a right to it, same was the rest of you. I'm not trying to convince anyone of anything, gave up on that long ago. I'm just trying to survive this thread anymore until Dylan is found. I don't see why it should bother anyone that I see dysfunction in that family in more than MR. The way they've all behaved is not normal IMO.

And now I'm going to sign off because it's not my turn.

My responses, above, in red. And that's MY OPINION.

 

[eileenhawkeye]

I do believe LE for the most part. I believe LE when they say that MR is not a suspect or a POI, even though that's not accepted by many others.

I don't know what to believe as far as the hits on the lake by the dogs, because LE has discounted those.

I do not know why LE has ruled out DR being a runaway. To me, that's still a viable option. It doesn't matter what DR's life looks like to the outsider, it's what was going on inside of him.

DR's friends also said he and his father were close and Dylan loved his father. So I feel if we are going to take Dylan's friends words for how great his life was with his mother, then why aren't we taking it for his father was well??

IMO it's dysfunctional when you have a son on National TV screaming at his father "I hate you, you are less than a father to me." That's dysfunctional. That Jerry Springer. That's not a family that works, not with the divorce included. I honestly do not excuse it and think it's justified the way it was done.

Air time is precious. Very precious. Why was it spent trashing Mark??? Why wasn't it spent talking about Dylan's likes, dislikes, his character, his personality, his interests in school??? Why was it about nailing Mark??? Why did that have to be done??? How would that find Dylan?? If Mark needed to be nailed, it needs to be done by LE, not the family on National TV.

For a family to even go there is dysfunctional. Dr. Phil does not have functional families on his show. I see a lot of abnormalities in that family and not just centered around our favorite subject.

That is my opinion. I have a right to it, same was the rest of you. I'm not trying to convince anyone of anything, gave up on that long ago. I'm just trying to survive this thread anymore until Dylan is found. I don't see why it should bother anyone that I see dysfunction in that family in more than MR. The way they've all behaved is not normal IMO.

And now I'm going to sign off because it's not my turn.

How would the show focusing on Dylan's interests and personality help to find Dylan? And no, I am not saying that "trashing Mark" is helping to find Dylan either. Just that I don't understand why the focus of the show should have been on Dylan, as a person. Yes, it would be sweet but Dr. Phil makes the show they think the audience will be most interested in.

 

[RANCH]

It's mind boggling, isn't it?

It's like they already knew what happened and where Dylan was/is.

And then again, they may have used the scent items brought from his home and have never released the findings or the scent trail????

Another piece of the puzzle we are missing.....:banghead:

Yes, I know the story. LE knows exactly what happened and Dylan is in the lake but they decided to wait until spring to recover his body.

I guess that it's possible but I'm not buying into that story at this point. MOO.

 

[Money Girl]

I thought there was originally a seperate thread for discussions of the Dr. Phil Show in which the Redwine family participated. It would be nice if that thread could be continued, because, now, on this thread, the Dr. Phil Show keeps popping up and preventing more constructive discussions.

All of us have our own opinions about the show, and I know that I do not wish to hurt anyone's feelings, and I'm sure others do not want to do so either.

 

[NC Analyzer]

It's mind boggling, isn't it?

It's like they already knew what happened and where Dylan was/is.

And then again, they may have used the scent items brought from his home and have never released the findings or the scent trail????

Another piece of the puzzle we are missing.....:banghead:

BBM: VERY, very possible. Top of the list, IMO.