Found Deceased CO - Gannon Stauch, 11, Colorado Springs, El Paso County, 27 Jan 2020 *Arrest* #53

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Re-posting KDVR NR's 8/25/22 tweets from hearing that were lost to new thread #53.
https://twitter.com/FierroNicole
Nicole Fierro
@FierroNicole

STAUCH STATUS CONFERENCE: Just sat down in the courtroom. Gannon’s biological family is all here, some flew in for this status conference. We should be getting an update on the results of #LeteciaStauch third mental evaluation. Will live tweet thread here
@KDVR


Image

12:31 PM · Aug 25, 2022 from Colorado Springs, CO

@FierroNicole

Letecia is walking in the courtroom now.
12:33 PM · Aug 25, 2022

@FierroNicole

Replying to
@*************
She has long wavy brown hair and is wearing an orange jumpsuit from the El Paso County jail.
12:35 PM · Aug 25, 2022

@FierroNicole

Judge is starting now. He says report came back and we are here for a trial setting.
12:36 PM · Aug 25, 2022·

@FierroNicole

Judge Werner says there's a motion for a second evaluation for the defense but he says he needs to set a date for trail [trial] and he'll deal with the logistics on that.
12:37 PM · Aug 25, 2022

@FierroNicole

Letecia's attorney is asking for the second evaluation before. Judge says since this is a sanity evaluation rather than competency hearing it's different and court rules say after getting sanity evaluation you need to set a trail date immediately.
12:39 PM · Aug 25, 2022·

[Tweet deleted by author].

@FierroNicole

Judge says defense does not have much obligation to disclose what they are doing but because they requested a second evaluation, judge says he needs to know who it is, whoever does the evaluation has to be paid by the state and be state grade.
12:43 PM · Aug 25, 2022·

@FierroNicole

Defense says they have a right to it, and what they can tell the court is they retained a psychiatrist from out of state and they need to figure out the logistics for it. He says they will not be requesting the state to pay for it.
12:44 PM · Aug 25, 2022

@FierroNicole

Defense also requested an EEG monitor for 72 hours, but the jail can't do that. Judge can order her to state hospital but doesn't think he has the authority to order the conditions under which she will be housed or evaluated by a second evaluation.
12:45 PM · Aug 25, 2022·

@FierroNicole

Defense's request is that Letecia goes to the state hospital to be monitored on an EEG machine for 72 hours. Her attorney says they will bring their own equipment and staff to the hospital to have it done, they just want to use the location and won't use state hospital staff.
12:49 PM · Aug 25, 2022·

@FierroNicole

Judge says he's not inclined to order this without getting input from CMHIP, state hospital, on this request. He's not questioning his authority to order a second evaluation but he's concerned about the 72 hour portion and bringing in outside equipment/people to CMHIP for it.
12:51 PM · Aug 25, 2022·

@FierroNicole

Judge says other issue you need to look at is the wait time on doing this. There were many months of delays in getting this sanity evaluation. Judge says even if they don't use the CMHIP staff to do these tests, she is still going to be going there.
12:53 PM · Aug 25, 2022

@FierroNicole

Judge set next court date for Sept. 15th at 1:30 pm. He is going to take a closer look at the statute to set a trial date and hopes to get input from CMHIP. There's confusion because of the second evaluation request. Trail date may be delayed until "distribution" of second eval.
12:56 PM · Aug 25, 2022·

@FierroNicole

Defense says the psychiatrist they want to use from out of state is hopeful to have results on a second evaluation within 30 days of conducting it.
12:57 PM · Aug 25, 2022·

@FierroNicole

Judge is explaining to Letecia, saying she already had one sanity evaluation at CMHIP and that her attorney plans to challenge it by selecting someone else to do a second examination. It has to be recorded (video and audio) and it has to be provided to the prosecution.
12:59 PM · Aug 25, 2022·

@FierroNicole

Anything she says during the evaluation can be used by prosecution.
12:59 PM · Aug 25, 2022·

@FierroNicole

Hearing is over. DA won't be doing interviews.
1:00 PM · Aug 25, 2022·

@FierroNicole

We asked Letecia’s attorney for clarification if the report deemed Letecia sane. He said it is restricted, so he can’t say but the defense is planning to challenge it.
1:09 PM · Aug 25, 2022 from Colorado Springs, CO

@FierroNicole

Can’t imagine what Gannon’s biological family is feeling right now. Landen, Gannon’s mom, has to take off work and fly from SC to come to these court appearances. His aunt has to fly here too. Al, Gannon’s Dad, tells me everyone’s support is something that keeps him going.
1:18 PM · Aug 25, 2022 from Colorado Springs, CO
 
Objective Documentation of Child Abuse and Dissociation in 12 Murderers With Dissociative Identity Disorder

Table 1 presents the subjects’ dissociative symptoms in childhood and adulthood and the corroborative documentation. Among the most common symptoms and signs were trances, amnesias for circumscribed periods of time and/or particular behaviors, changes in voice and demeanor, and auditory hallucinations.

As can be seen in table 1, the amounts of information available on the subjects’ childhoods varied. We were able to obtain objective evidence that during childhood, eight of the 12 subjects had trances and amnesias, nine had experienced auditory hallucinations, and 10 had vivid and long-standing imaginary companions who seemed to be precursors of their alternate personality states.

Ten subjects experienced trance-like states in adulthood that were also observed by others. Two described their ability to remove themselves from situations as “astral projection.” Others described their trance-like states as blanking out, spacing out, or transporting themselves to imaginary places in their heads. Seven reported being able to block out physical pain.

All 12 subjects, as adults, had impaired memory for both violent and nonviolent behaviors. For example, subject 5 pulled out his own toenails at night and, in the morning, did not know how this had happened. Subjects 4, 5, and 11, all of whom had female alternate personalities, found women’s clothing in their possession and did not know how it got there. Subject 4, at trial, insisted that the bloodstained suit he had been wearing at the time of his arrest belonged to someone else because it was too big to be his.

All 12 subjects were described by others as having voice changes and/or marked changes of demeanor. For example, three people reported that subject 9, the only woman in the study group, periodically sounded like an aggressive male, and male subjects 4 and 11 at times reportedly sounded like women. Subjects 5 and 6 were noted to have alternate personality states with different visual acuities, and the lawyers for subject 4 reported that he did not recognize his own voice on tape-recorded police interviews and insisted it was the voice of someone else. All 12 subjects had used different names at different times, not in the context of avoiding arrest or responsibility.

All 12 subjects had histories of experiencing auditory hallucinations that, during psychiatric evaluation, were recognized by the examiner as being voices of alternate personalities.

In all cases, examiners were able to speak with at least one alternate personality.

Because the histories of abuse of both patients with dissociative identity disorder and murder suspects are often questioned, we call special attention to table 2, which presents objective documentation of the nature and extent of physical and sexual abuse of 11 of our 12 subjects.

The term “abuse” does not do justice to the quality of maltreatment these individuals endured. A more accurate term would be “torture.”
 
NCWatcher said:
Yes, that certainly could explain some people's frustration. But what the defense is doing IMO is what any competent attorneys would likely do. And the first 2 evals were for competency, not sanity AND were requested by the attorneys she had from the public defender's office, not her current attorneys.

There have been delays. But some of those were due to COVID and some due to lack of staffing at Pueblo too. And she is in jail.
JMO
Click to expand...

To be clear, the previous competency evaluations were an order of law and are not an issue at this date or time.

The fact is that Judge Werner was prepared to set a trial date at the hearing on 8/25 but was essentially cut off at the knees by the surprise motion by the defense that IMO amounts to no more than "doctor shopping."

It's rubbish to even suggest that the defendant is not receiving due process or that LS was somehow under-represented by her public defenders.

It was LS that fired her attorneys, wanted to represent herself-- against the advice of the Court, and then changed her mind. She wrote to the court to state she disagreed with her lawyers' motion to enter any NGRI defense, period. Of course, 12 months later (Feb 2022) LS changed her mind, and here we are. MOO

Seattle1 said:
Judge is explaining to Letecia, saying she already had one sanity evaluation at CMHIP and that her attorney plans to challenge it by selecting someone else to do a second examination. It has to be recorded (video and audio) and it has to be provided to the prosecution.
12:59 PM · Aug 25, 2022·
Click to expand...
^^rsbm
 
IMO this evaluation is just another stall tactic. She was certainly sane enough to try to cover her tracks and invent different scenarios to explain Gannon’s injuries. That said, the last thing anyone wants is for her to have any recourse for appeal. It won’t help her. The “fog” didn’t work for Jodi Arias and it won’t work for this killer.
 
Found the reference to the expert the defense has had waiting in the wings:

www.9news.com

Letecia Stauch changes plea, asks to waive jury trial

The defense also filed a motion to waive a jury trial, but no decision was made on that during Friday's hearing.
www.9news.com www.9news.com

Updated: 4:07 PM MST February 11, 2022

EL PASO COUNTY, Colo. — During a hearing Friday afternoon, the defense for Letecia Stauch, who is charged with first-degree murder related to the 2020 death of her 11-year-old stepson Gannon Stauch, asked to change her plea to not guilty by reason of insanity.

Right after that, defense attorney Josh Tolini said they have an expert from out of state who recently agreed to assist and said that the expert believes there is a high likelihood of "psychosis."

[..]

He said they did not bring this up with the intent to delay the case, but said it was Stauch's best defense.

Prosecutors did not challenge the request but noted the decision not to challenge does mean they believe the claim.

[..]

He ultimately ruled to allow the change of plea which resets the date for a "speedy trial" to occur. However, that timeline won't start until after the court receives the initial evaluation, Werner said.

Werner told Stauch as a result of the new plea, she could be given a polygraph during the evaluation and said any confession she makes will be admissible in court. He also explained that by pleading not guilty by reason of insanity she's waiving any confidentially of previous mental health records.
 
Seattle1 said:
To be clear, the previous competency evaluations were an order of law and are not an issue at this date or time.

The fact is that Judge Werner was prepared to set a trial date at the hearing on 8/25 but was essentially cut off at the knees by the surprise motion by the defense that IMO amounts to no more than "doctor shopping."

It's rubbish to even suggest that the defendant is not receiving due process or that LS was somehow under-represented by her public defenders.

It was LS that fired her attorneys, wanted to represent herself-- against the advice of the Court, and then changed her mind. She wrote to the court to state she disagreed with her lawyers' motion to enter any NGRI defense, period. Of course, she later changed her mind. MOO


^^rsbm
Click to expand...
I never said she wasn't appropriately represented. But the idea that evaluations "keep being repeated to get a specific result" doesn't really describe the situation. The sanity eval is about to be repeated. That's one repeat. The other evals were for competency were ordered by the court after a request from different defense attorneys. Reporters though keep lumping all the evals into the same category. Several reporters billed the last eval as her "3rd evaluation." And while technically true, that makes it appear the same evaluation has been repeated 3 times. And that's obviously untrue. A second sanity evaluation is hardly unexpected. It was never the case the defense would just say "oh, never mind."
JMO
 
Based on the current apparent strategy by the defense, I think a bench trial would be a good thing -- let the Judge decide on LS's guilt or innocence and not burden a jury here.

Section 16-8-105.5 - Procedure after plea for offenses committed on or after July 1, 1995, Colo. Rev. Stat. § 16-8-105.5 | Casetext Search + Citator

Read Section 16-8-105.5 - Procedure after plea for offenses committed on or after July 1, 1995, Colo. Rev. Stat. § 16-8-105.5, see flags on bad law, and search Casetext’s comprehensive legal database
casetext.com

(2).... Every person is presumed to be sane; but, once any evidence of insanity is introduced, the people have the burden of proving sanity beyond a reasonable doubt.

(3) When the affirmative defense of not guilty by reason of insanity has been raised, the jury shall be given special verdict forms containing interrogatories.

The trier of fact shall decide first the question of guilt as to felony charges that are before the court. If the trier of fact concludes that guilt has been proven beyond a reasonable doubt as to one or more of the felony charges submitted for consideration, the special interrogatories shall not be answered.

Upon completion of its deliberations on the felony charges as previously set forth in this subsection (3), the trier of fact shall consider any other charges before the court in a similar manner; except that it shall not answer the special interrogatories regarding such charges if it has previously found guilt beyond a reasonable doubt with respect to one or more felony charges.

The interrogatories shall provide for specific findings of the jury with respect to the affirmative defense of not guilty by reason of insanity. When the court sits as the trier of fact, it shall enter appropriate specific findings with respect to the affirmative defense of not guilty by reason of insanity.
 
It seems to me this woman is severely disturbed, but sane in legal sense.

She hated her stepson.

As many stepparents hated their stepchildren before her.

How many similar cases have I followed here?
Daniel P., Arthur LH, Logan M., Star, Sebastian K.
And many other terrible cases.

This phenomenon even has got a name:
*Cinderella Effect*.

MOO
 
Seattle1 said:
Found the reference to the expert the defense has had waiting in the wings:

www.9news.com

Letecia Stauch changes plea, asks to waive jury trial

The defense also filed a motion to waive a jury trial, but no decision was made on that during Friday's hearing.
www.9news.com www.9news.com

Updated: 4:07 PM MST February 11, 2022

EL PASO COUNTY, Colo. — During a hearing Friday afternoon, the defense for Letecia Stauch, who is charged with first-degree murder related to the 2020 death of her 11-year-old stepson Gannon Stauch, asked to change her plea to not guilty by reason of insanity.

Right after that, defense attorney Josh Tolini said they have an expert from out of state who recently agreed to assist and said that the expert believes there is a high likelihood of "psychosis."

[..]

He said they did not bring this up with the intent to delay the case, but said it was Stauch's best defense.

Prosecutors did not challenge the request but noted the decision not to challenge does mean they believe the claim.

[..]

He ultimately ruled to allow the change of plea which resets the date for a "speedy trial" to occur. However, that timeline won't start until after the court receives the initial evaluation, Werner said.

Werner told Stauch as a result of the new plea, she could be given a polygraph during the evaluation and said any confession she makes will be admissible in court. He also explained that by pleading not guilty by reason of insanity she's waiving any confidentially of previous mental health records.
Click to expand...

I don't believe him for a second about not bringing it up to delay the case. I seem to recall when they presented the judge with a motion to have her sanity evaluation he said it was only for events directly following Gannons death,ie the disposal of his body,and that they would not be attempting to change her plea to not guilty by reason of insanity. That's what Josh Tollini told the judge in one of many hearings and then as soon as they are given an inch,they take way more than a mile. JT straight up lied to Judge Werner Imo, seems to me he and his client are well suited.
All this is JMO because its late and I can't look for the links right now.
 
imstilla.grandma said:
Objective Documentation of Child Abuse and Dissociation in 12 Murderers With Dissociative Identity Disorder

Table 1 presents the subjects’ dissociative symptoms in childhood and adulthood and the corroborative documentation. Among the most common symptoms and signs were trances, amnesias for circumscribed periods of time and/or particular behaviors, changes in voice and demeanor, and auditory hallucinations.

As can be seen in table 1, the amounts of information available on the subjects’ childhoods varied. We were able to obtain objective evidence that during childhood, eight of the 12 subjects had trances and amnesias, nine had experienced auditory hallucinations, and 10 had vivid and long-standing imaginary companions who seemed to be precursors of their alternate personality states.

Ten subjects experienced trance-like states in adulthood that were also observed by others. Two described their ability to remove themselves from situations as “astral projection.” Others described their trance-like states as blanking out, spacing out, or transporting themselves to imaginary places in their heads. Seven reported being able to block out physical pain.

All 12 subjects, as adults, had impaired memory for both violent and nonviolent behaviors. For example, subject 5 pulled out his own toenails at night and, in the morning, did not know how this had happened. Subjects 4, 5, and 11, all of whom had female alternate personalities, found women’s clothing in their possession and did not know how it got there. Subject 4, at trial, insisted that the bloodstained suit he had been wearing at the time of his arrest belonged to someone else because it was too big to be his.

All 12 subjects were described by others as having voice changes and/or marked changes of demeanor. For example, three people reported that subject 9, the only woman in the study group, periodically sounded like an aggressive male, and male subjects 4 and 11 at times reportedly sounded like women. Subjects 5 and 6 were noted to have alternate personality states with different visual acuities, and the lawyers for subject 4 reported that he did not recognize his own voice on tape-recorded police interviews and insisted it was the voice of someone else. All 12 subjects had used different names at different times, not in the context of avoiding arrest or responsibility.

All 12 subjects had histories of experiencing auditory hallucinations that, during psychiatric evaluation, were recognized by the examiner as being voices of alternate personalities.

In all cases, examiners were able to speak with at least one alternate personality.

Because the histories of abuse of both patients with dissociative identity disorder and murder suspects are often questioned, we call special attention to table 2, which presents objective documentation of the nature and extent of physical and sexual abuse of 11 of our 12 subjects.

The term “abuse” does not do justice to the quality of maltreatment these individuals endured. A more accurate term would be “torture.”
Click to expand...
Thank you posting that, very informative. (And OT excluding murder, some parts of it made me think of Anne Heche.) Jmo
 
LS mental health timeline:

6/8/2020 - Order [D15] Competency Evaluation

9/16/2020 - Order for 2nd Competency Evaluation by Dr. Grimmett.

11/5/2020 - Order [D22] Extend Deadline for 2nd Competency Evaluation

11/17/2021 - [P27] Peoples Brief Addressing Defense Notice of Intent to Present Evidence of LS Mental Health

12/3/2021 - Defense Response to Brief [and hint to limited use].

8/4/2022 - Order [O23] - Receipt of Sanity Report and Order to set Hearing
[last ROA entry date 8/11/2022].

Seattle1 said:
' They used the NGRI (to get a hearing) knowing I’m Not Guilty to cover up their lack of representation. Although, I had “bouts of insanity” and still do, I did not murder or abuse anyone nor would that be a defense because it’s my understanding that you actually did do it.
Click to expand...
^^rsbm per LS 2/2021 letter as reported by MSM 3/2021

Seattle1 said:
Updated: 4:07 PM MST February 11, 2022

EL PASO COUNTY, Colo. — During a hearing Friday afternoon, the defense for Letecia Stauch, who is charged with first-degree murder related to the 2020 death of her 11-year-old stepson Gannon Stauch, asked to change her plea to not guilty by reason of insanity.
Click to expand...
^^rsbm - LS formally enters NGRI plea Feb 2022

Kiranerys said:
That's what Josh Tollini told the judge in one of many hearings and then as soon as they are given an inch,they take way more than a mile. JT straight up lied to Judge Werner Imo, seems to me he and his client are well suited.
Click to expand...
^^rsbbm

Relative to the delays using the mental health of LS under the control of the defense, take note that under Colorado law, the not guilty by reason of insanity plea must be entered at the time of arraignment but could be changed later if there is "good cause."

IMO, the Court was certainly gracious here when LS provided evidence that an NGRI change of plea was being discussed as far back as Feb 2021, if not earlier, and again in December 2021 -- but never entered the plea in court until a year later or February 11, 2022.

It's the trier of fact (either Jurors or the Judge) that will determine if LS was insane or not when she committed stipulated acts in her charging documents, and not the state or defense hand-picked evaluator.

This 2nd evaluation may take months, most likely pushing any possible trial date far into 2023. :eek:

Keep your seatbelt fastened, the ride is nowhere near over. MOO






 
Dotta said:
A lawyer is doing his job.
That is what he does for a living.
Lawyers swear an oath to support the LAW.

MOO
Click to expand...
I actually think he is doing the best for his client and not just throwing things out to delay the trial.

We've known from the beginning that TS is 'not quite right,' so this is not a surprise. She could have multiple psychiatric disorders and still be found guilty. I doubt any jury will fall for her manipulative antics.

It's important she gets a fair trial so that afterwards she can't appeal for ineffective council.

This must be extremely frustrating for Gannon's parents. I hope it will be worth the wait when Letecia is found guilty. If that day ever comes...
 
MsBetsy said:
I actually think he is doing the best for his client and not just throwing things out to delay the trial.

We've known from the beginning that TS is 'not quite right,' so this is not a surprise. She could have multiple psychiatric disorders and still be found guilty. I doubt any jury will fall for her manipulative antics.

It's important she gets a fair trial so that afterwards she can't appeal for ineffective council.

This must be extremely frustrating for Gannon's parents. I hope it will be worth the wait when Letecia is found guilty. If that day ever comes...
Click to expand...
Right.
"Postponement is not abandonment" :)
 
I recommend reading the entire article for an excellent report on the entirety of the affirmative defense NGRI, specifically in Colorado, and evaluations at CMHIP. Posting below only the last section or comments by an experienced evaluator/expert witness.

www.9news.com

Explaining a Not Guilty By Reason of Insanity plea

9NEWS Psychologist Dr. Max Wachtel explains the Not Guilty By Reason of Insanity Plea.
www.9news.com www.9news.com

4/27/15

[..]

I have conducted sanity/mental condition evaluations in Colorado. I have testified as an expert in these cases for both the prosecution and defense. Here are a few issues I have learned over the years:

The sanity evaluators from the mental hospital in Pueblo were not hired by the prosecution or the defense. They are supposed to be neutral parties with objective opinions.

Depending on the opinions of the Pueblo evaluators, their testimony will be either pro-prosecution (i.e. they think the accused is sane) or pro-defense (i.e. they think the accused is insane).

The prosecution will almost definitely call experts of their own who have analyzed the Pueblo reports and who will say the accused is sane. They will also try to lessen the credibility of any experts who are friendly to the defense. This will be difficult to do, since some of those friendly defense experts will not testify until after the prosecution rests its case.

The prosecution will not have any privately-hired experts who directly evaluated the accused—they are not legally entitled to have access to the defendant in that way.

The defense likely has at least one private expert who has met with the defendant and conducted a private sanity evaluation. In fact, there have probably been several private sanity evaluations—all defense experts slated to testify will say the accused is insane.

The defense may have hired private evaluators who thought the accused is sane. If that is the case, we will never hear from those experts. The defense is not required to disclose that information to anyone. This is why it is a guarantee that any expert witnesses they call will be friendly to the defense.

The prosecution will likely request to call rebuttal expert witnesses to directly rebut testimony from defense experts called during the defense's case. This would happen after the defense rests. These witnesses would only be allowed to rebut testimony offered under direct examination—no new evidence could be admitted at that point in the trial.

If the prosecution calls rebuttal witnesses, the defense can ask the judge to allow them to also call rebuttal witnesses to rebut the prosecution's rebuttal witnesses. This is called surrebuttal.

[..]

It is the job of the direct examiner to get the expert to quickly tell his/her story.

It is the job of the cross examiner to impeach the credibility of the expert (example: "Is it not true, Dr. X, that you wet the bed until you were 13?") and/or to get the expert to make concessions (example: "But you were unable to speak to the victim's mother about his mental state at the time of the offense, right Dr. X?")
 
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