CO - James Holmes Trial - *Closing Arguments* *Verdict Watch*

[Chelly]

(Credit link below from The Denver Channel)


2) If they do move to the next phase, jurors will be asked to hear mitigating factors presented by the defense. At this point, they're likely to hear from family and friends of the convicted shooter who could testify about his life. They are also likely to present information about his mental illness.

Mitigating factors under Colorado law that could be included in this case are:

The defendant's capacity to appreciate wrongfulness of the defendant's conduct or to conform the defendant's conduct to the requirements of law was significantly impaired, but not so impaired as to constitute a defense to prosecution
The defendant was under unusual and substantial duress, although not such duress as to constitute a defense to prosecution; or
The emotional state of the defendant at the time the crime was committed
The absence of any significant prior conviction
The extent of the defendant's cooperation with law enforcement officers or agencies and with the office of the prosecuting district attorney
The good faith, although mistaken, belief by the defendant that circumstances existed which constituted a moral justification for the defendant's conduct
The defendant is not a continuing threat to society
Any other evidence which in the court's opinion bears on the question of mitigation.

After hearing those presentations, the jury needs to deliberate again to decide if the mitigating factors outweigh the aggravating factors. If they do not, the case will move to the third phase.


http://www.thedenverchannel.com/new...ter-shooting-case-to-decide-james-holmes-fate

 

[Chelly]

3) Credit link below form The Denver Channel:

In that third and final phase, the jury will be asked to judge the defendant's character against his crime. They need to decide if the prosecution has proven beyond a reasonable doubt if the death penalty is the appropriate penalty.

If at any point in the process the jury decides not to move to the next phase, the gunman would be sentenced to life imprisonment without the possibility of parole. Also, the vote must be unanimous to deliver a death sentence.

All of the 12 jurors and seven alternates will continue to be in court for the next phase.

 

[zoey]

Tricia Griffith ‏@websleuths · 35m35 minutes ago
Will convicted #theatershooting JH testify at his sentencing?
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...lmes-Trial-*Closing-Arguments*-*Verdict-Watch …*

 

[corundogs]

Based on what Shelly posted and the 82 guilty verdicts handed down yesterday in the "extreme indifference" charges, there is no doubt they will move on to the mitigating factors. That was what was said in court, and the guilty verdicts is unequivocally proof of that.

Will his mitigating factors move this jury? I am VERY doubtful.

Him cooperating with LEO and telling them about his apartment after the fact...meh! He had a plan it didn't work. He didn't care after that. It wasn't because he didn't want anyone else to die. It was because he didn't care if it worked after that. And IMO, he also WANTED them to see how brilliant he was, since it didn't work as planned. It wasn't HIS fault it didn't explode...but go see how meticulously I planned this out!! (Of course, this is my opinion. Others may feel differently about this point)

I would be really surprised if we get anything other than the Death Penalty in this case. The Prosecution without a doubt showed this jury what really happened. And this jury believed them. They could have found him not guilty on the extreme indifference charges, and still found him guilty on the 1st Degree charges. They didn't.

This tells me where their mindset is. And I don't think JH will have strong enough mitigating factors to sway them.

 

[MissHaley]

Tricia Griffith ‏@websleuths · 35m35 minutes ago
Will convicted #theatershooting JH testify at his sentencing?
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...lmes-Trial-*Closing-Arguments*-*Verdict-Watch …*

This will be interesting to talk about. Hope to see some posters thoughts with this issue.
On one hand, he absolutely should stand up in front of the court! Express his remorse, say he's sorry & own it! And plead with the jury to spare his life.

The defense tried so hard to show mental illness in the guilt phase; they didn't give argument or proof he was 'legally insane." They used their mitigation arguments (mental illness) already. Now, they'll have to repeat the mental illness & appeal for sympathy by using his friends & parents.

So, on the other hand, thinking about what they did -they really made it almost impossible for him to stand up for himself. Since they believed that he was so mentally ill, that he was legally insane; There's really no way he can allocate for himself! How CAN he stand up and show remorse & say he's sorry he did it? For they already claimed he was legally insane when he did it! For him to do a proper allocution, then it would be to deny the very things they claimed previously! See? They would have to do a whole 180 about their defense theory.

And, let's face it- he is no jodi arias- who loves to talk, talk, talk. Before the shooting & after, even on meds, he never spoke more than short sentences to the docs privately. Do you think, he'd really stand up in front of a whole court room and say he's sorry for what he did!???

Defense will have to pull a trick to say that due to his mental illness, the defendant cannot speak to the court! For him to speak, to say 'I'm sorry' to the victims & families- will prove the whole 'legally insane' was a sham!

MOO. I just don't think he will do it.
What do you folks think?

 

[Maisiebelle]

I agree with you. I can't see how he can stand up and speak after that defence.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[borndem]

Thank you for sharing this. What a nice ending to a tough lengthy trial.

This is such a big relief as we can now head into the Penalty Phase knowing that no matter what happens in that phase at least we know JH will never be allowed to hurt anyone else ever again.

And JH's parents, although horrified and who will probably be second-guessing themselves for the rest of their lives, can go to sleep at night knowing he is in a safe place and in a place where he cannot hurt others.

 

[sumzero]

I agree with you. I can't see how he can stand up and speak after that defence.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

He contended that he was insane at the time of the crime, not that he is insane now. That said, I doubt that he'll speak. He's a coward.

 

[MissHaley]

He contended that he was insane at the time of the crime, not that he is insane now. That said, I doubt that he'll speak. He's a coward.

I guess that's right. But King & Gur claimed he is still living with the 'delusion' that killing people will give him value & that he still believes that! So after 3 years he's still delusional even on meds? But, that's his only delusion? If he still believes that, he can't apologize for killing the people. MOO

 

[borndem]

Originally Posted by MsJosie

Questions

Will there be any live streaming video of today, Monday and Tuesday as the court irons out the next phases?

Who are the witnesses the State will be calling from the East Coast?

We've been able to watch all of the proceedings so far. It's been broadcast every time the judge has met with the attorneys for conferences.

I am curious about the witnesses from out of state too. Maybe Dr Reid again to reinforce that the shooter is not as mentally ill as his defence team will say he is.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Several of the MSM who have been streaming say that they will carry the courtroom goings-on on Monday & Tuesday -- I wonder if proceedings will spill into Tuesday? Anyway, it should be carried by the usual streamers.

We are learning a lot about these things -- now we will get a peek into pre penalty-phase doings.

In my view, the streaming MSM have done a great job of keeping up with things. Very good work, I must say.

 

[borndem]

I'm relieved at the verdict. I did have some concern that the jury might struggle to reach a guilty verdict based on the amount of mental health evidence.

My biggest relief is knowing that the shooter won't one day walk free and hurt someone else.

Knowing how much people make him anxious I don't think he would attack someone in prison. He preferred to do his killing at arms length. This means prison guards should be safe from him.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I think, in addition, he will be seen by prison mental health professionals and he will be medicated -- so that should also keep him to himself. And as we have all agreed, he prefers that anyway. I hope, after all this is over, we will not hear his name ever again.

 

[borndem]

Based on what Shelly posted and the 82 guilty verdicts handed down yesterday in the "extreme indifference" charges, there is no doubt they will move on to the mitigating factors. That was what was said in court, and the guilty verdicts is unequivocally proof of that.

Will his mitigating factors move this jury? I am VERY doubtful.

Him cooperating with LEO and telling them about his apartment after the fact...meh! He had a plan it didn't work. He didn't care after that. It wasn't because he didn't want anyone else to die. It was because he didn't care if it worked after that. And IMO, he also WANTED them to see how brilliant he was, since it didn't work as planned. It wasn't HIS fault it didn't explode...but go see how meticulously I planned this out!! (Of course, this is my opinion. Others may feel differently about this point)

I would be really surprised if we get anything other than the Death Penalty in this case. The Prosecution without a doubt showed this jury what really happened. And this jury believed them. They could have found him not guilty on the extreme indifference charges, and still found him guilty on the 1st Degree charges. They didn't.

This tells me where their mindset is. And I don't think JH will have strong enough mitigating factors to sway them.

bbm

I was gonna put up a similar post, corundogs, but yours is a good one. After reading what Chelly so kindly posted about the 3 phases, I don't see where there will be much of a choice. The only mitigators I could give him would be his cooperation with LE (but then I think about his booby-trapped apt. which was certainly planned and laid by JH with LE in mind -- no doubt in my mind) and his lack of priors. That's not much, IMO. Nearly all the aggravators, essentially and IMO, would have a "yes" beside them. SMH. The scales of that weighing, IMO, would be about 20 to 2.
JMHO

 

[borndem]

This will be interesting to talk about. Hope to see some posters thoughts with this issue.
On one hand, he absolutely should stand up in front of the court! Express his remorse, say he's sorry & own it! And plead with the jury to spare his life.

The defense tried so hard to show mental illness in the guilt phase; they didn't give argument or proof he was 'legally insane." They used their mitigation arguments (mental illness) already. Now, they'll have to repeat the mental illness & appeal for sympathy by using his friends & parents.

So, on the other hand, thinking about what they did -they really made it almost impossible for him to stand up for himself. Since they believed that he was so mentally ill, that he was legally insane; There's really no way he can allocate for himself! How CAN he stand up and show remorse & say he's sorry he did it? For they already claimed he was legally insane when he did it! For him to do a proper allocution, then it would be to deny the very things they claimed previously! See? They would have to do a whole 180 about their defense theory.

And, let's face it- he is no jodi arias- who loves to talk, talk, talk. Before the shooting & after, even on meds, he never spoke more than short sentences to the docs privately. Do you think, he'd really stand up in front of a whole court room and say he's sorry for what he did!??e

Defense will have to pull a trick to say that due to his mental illness, the defendant cannot speak to the court! For him to speak, to say 'I'm sorry' to the victims & families- will prove the whole 'legally insane' was a sham!

MOO. I just don't think he will do it.
What do you folks think?

IMO, there is no way he will allocute -- First, to this day, I don't think he is sorry for what he did to the victims and their families or to the other people in the theater or to LE or to the EMTs or the hospital personnel, all who prolly worked well beyond their shifts to take care of so, so many.

He, like so many, is prolly sorry he got caught -- I am sure he didn't consider his work done. Who could script what he ought to say? What words? Let his mother or father plead for him -- they would be honest in their pleadings, IMO. This person has very few in his corner, but let them speak and hope for the best.

This may not be as tuff a phase as I had initially thought...

 

[sumzero]

I guess that's right. But King & Gur claimed he is still living with the 'delusion' that killing people will give him value & that he still believes that! So after 3 years he's still delusional even on meds? But, that's his only delusion? If he still believes that, he can't apologize for killing the people. MOO

Whatever he does, he'll do it only if it helps James Holmes. Not because it's the right thing to do. And not, IMO, because he feels remorseful.

 

[atthelake]

IMO, there is no way he will allocute -- First, to this day, I don't think he is sorry for what he did to the victims and their families or to the other people in the theater or to LE or to the EMTs or the hospital personnel, all who prolly worked well beyond their shifts to take care of so, so many.

He, like so many, is prolly sorry he got caught -- I am sure he didn't consider his work done. Who could script what he ought to say? What words? Let his mother or father plead for him -- they would be honest in their pleadings, IMO. This person has very few in his corner, but let them speak and hope for the best.

This may not be as tuff a phase as I had initially thought...

Yes ..his parents.

When they speak I anticipate opening my heart to them as much as the other victims we have heard from. i anticipate hearing the words of broken hearts ..broken souls ..just bottom line:-.......

broken.

:moo: I will be bawling when they speak . I know some disagree with their words ..but I just will have pain listening .

 

[borndem]

I agree, atthelake -- His parents will be second-guessing themselves for the rest of their lives -- could've, should've -- why didn't we... -- And when they go out -- if they go out -- where will they go so as not to run into someone they know? Do they have a pastor or a rabbi or just someone they can visit to help them understand and stand up straight again? How can they help him now? They may never be able to hug or kiss him again -- it may all be through plexiglass and a telephone receiver. They can't bring him a hamburger or pizza. Will he even want to see them?

And yes, these two parents can still talk to and see their son -- send a birthday card -- they know that the other parents, spouses children, etc., can never see their loved ones again. What a burden for these two people.

Enuff.

 

[cujenn81]

Thank you for the info on psych central. I am interested in this and have bookmarked the forum. cujenn81, this is the second great tip you have given me. (I am now coloring....lol). THANKS! :loveyou:

Yay! I feel so loved and appreciated!

 

[MissHaley]

Hi All!
A prayer vigil will be held today. Let us pray.
http://www.thedenverchannel.com/new...rks-aurora-movie-theater-shooting-anniversary

A couple hours to see what the lawyers will hash out today.

 

[borndem]

Yay! I feel so loved and appreciated!

You are indeed loved and appreciated!!!:loveyou:

 

[Chelly]

You are indeed loved and appreciated!!!:loveyou:

Yes, indeed!