CO CO - Kelsey Berreth, 29, Woodland Park, Teller County, 22 Nov 2018 - #13 *ARREST*

[AgeofAquaruis]

Thanks Harmony !

I'm betting LE would like to have a sit down and chat with her .......

Interesting.

 

[Kapua]

This is a lot more complex and involved than I thought it would be. I thought it would be nasty argument, violent man kills her, hides body, shuts up and it's year or never before justice can be had.

That's exactly what I was thinking. Poor Kelsey.

 

[jillianelaine]

Premeditation. Maybe this had nothing to do with love and babies and custody issues. Is it possible that she got a hold of some illegal activity he was involved in and he needed to silence her.

 

[GraceG]

Correct. In most cases it's for LE safety.

Here are some examples as to why the woman with grey hair was handcuffed IF she hadn't been arrested (which I think is undetermined at this time). Officers can handcuff someone

• When executing a warrant. The U.S. Supreme Court affirmed the right of police officers to use handcuffs to detain occupants of premises being searched pursuant to a search warrant in Muehler v. Mena in 2005. The Court had previously found in Michigan v. Summers (in 1981) that handcuffing an occupant during a search of the premises was not a violation of the Fourth Amendment’s prohibition on the unreasonable seizure of a person.

• For officer safety purposes. The same rationale that allows officers to handcuff occupants of premises being searched also applies to other situations in which an officer feels he or she may be at risk. The handcuffing of an arrestee is not based on rigid criteria. It is determined by the nature of each situation as perceived by the officer.”If an officer feels that placing a person in handcuffs is the best way to ensure his or her own safety, then a court would not likely find that the officer had violated the rights of the person being detained.

• While a person is in custody. A person who has already been arrested and taken into custody may be handcuffed while in custody, even while appearing in court.

• When there is probable cause to place you under arrest. Although police are not obligated to place a suspect who is being arrested into handcuffs or other restraints, officers may do so if they feel that it is necessary for their own protection.

 

[Cherokee]

IIRC it was someone related to PF who started posting on WS a few days ago about his family and her health.

They may have said they were related, but were they?

As I recall, the original post was speculation. It was based on the fact PF lived with his mother on the ranchette. They speculated he may have lived there to help his mother if she was disabled or in bad health.

That is where the rumor came from. If I am wrong, I will gladly correct my statement.

Not everyone lives with their parent because the parent needs help. There is such a thing as failure to launch.

 

[Inthedetails]

The date/s of alleged solicitation will be most interesting. Is this something that happened Thanksgiving eve & due to her work needed to be completed that weekend?

Did the solicited person haul her body off on a horse/cattlevtrailer, possibly? PF might have drafted a text & someone (with or w/o body) pushed “send”.

I hope PF had his Xmas shopping finished & that his mom can return hers. What an outrageously sad situation.

I'm VERY curious about the date of solicitation. WHEN did he get the ball rolling on this?! I have a feeling we will learn the details, thanks to technology.

So creepy to think of someone actually plotting murder.

jmo

 

[SandyQLS]

Agree. But if you're not under arrest. Then why the handcuffs and taken away?

Because I wouldn't want cops telling me that I'm not under arrest while cuffing me and hauling me in. Jmo.

So imo. She was under arrest at first. Jmo

It's a safety measure. In a emotionally charged situation like an arrest, LE doesn't want some other person getting excited, hitting an officer, grabbing a gun. You see it a lot on Cops, then the other(s) are simply let go. LE talks to the person the whole time, explaining the safety issue, makes sure they are calm and safe, and officers are safe. MOO.

 

[K9Enzo]

And to control the situation. For all we know, she was saying things to the officers - maybe like "Let me get the baby!" or "You're making a big mistake - get out of here!" and they needed to make sure she wasn't going to interfere with the arrest or make sudden moves. They might not know if she was armed, either, or if she and PF had some plan to resist arrest. Better to control the situation and proceed safely.

jmo

Yes, all the things you mentioned are possible scenarios. The action of handcuffing her is for the safety of officers, everyone. Emotions are running high, people can be unpredictable.

 

[stx722]

Just my general observation about these types of cases. In terms of how long we are here on this earth, these violent senseless acts take relatively little time. The devastation they cause, and the number of other lives touched is vast. I can grasp what happened, and maybe the why in terms of someone's twisted thinking.

I've read cases and seen cases on TV that will truly make your mouth drop. But I just don't understand how people get to that place, where the best plan they can come up with, is to take someone out. The level of arrogance is truly astounding.

 

[sunshineandlove]

Has someone looked into if Colorado is a joint custody or maternal primary custody state by default?

Colorado has "parenting time" rather than custody and it's not assumed-

Yes, all the things you mentioned are possible scenarios. The action of handcuffing her is for the safety of officers, everyone. Emotions are running high, people can be unpredictable.

Agree, and as ranchers it's likely they had firearms in their vehicle.

 

[Herat]

Maybe the accomplice didn't actually perform the murder, but assisted in the coverup

As in transporting the body and the phone.

Are they looking for her body as well as her phone in Idaho?

He would have an alibi for his time in Colorado and could re-direct LE to the area in Idaho as if she took off to her Mother's in Idaho where someone else attacked her.

 

[KALI]

Add to that they probably told her that they were taking the baby as well. She could have started a scene.

It was an intense scene. I have seen it before. But she might have been carrying on OR they had reason to believe she would harm anyone coming for her precious.

 

[SharonNeedles]

What I don’t get (along with everything else) is how PF could go to such extremes establishing that he was nowhere near Kelsey, yet he couldn’t “act innocent” and plead publicly for her safe return? One would think he would at least go through the motions after how much he already had invested in establishing his innocence.

 

[Elley Mae]

Just a thought.

Had she just found out she was pregnant.

 

[Trudie]

Yes, this is what I was trying to articulate earlier. This is exactly what I think happened. I don't think it was about custody - I think it was about getting rid of Kelsey. I agree with you that I think he resented her and that was the motive.

jmo

I agree. It’s beyond comprehension for us. We’ve all been furious with someone but we know we can’t kill them! For one, the thought of LWOP scares the he77 out of us. We know we would literally have no chance of outsmarting LE.
So what is dif’ with these guys?
I have horses, participated in many rodeos (barrels/poles,), I would never consider doing something that would prevent me from doing things I love .
Women commit crimes, obviously. But stats are much less. Omg, if I went to prison I would literally have a heart attack worrying about my house, my animals, my possessions. Lol. I’d want to know who is rummaging thru my things, where do they ultimately wind up? Not to mention what my act would do to my family.
Do these guys become so he77 bent on killing their brain stops. The idea is so alluring they can think of nothing else?

 

[Mom24]

Wow, I missed the PC, but thanks to those who posted here so I could see it. So happy the baby is with the Berreths. The solicitation charge? I would guess that would be the phone being taken to ID. I can't even begin to guess who would have taken it there for him.

 

[Madison418]

Ugh! Hate the fact that we share the same birthday, just a different year. lol

Same! My birthday is 4/18

 

[alucardsdream]

What I don’t get (along with everything else) is how PF could go to such extremes establishing that he was nowhere near Kelsey, yet he couldn’t “act innocent” and plead publicly for her safe return? One would think he would at least go through the motions after how much he already had invested in establishing his innocence.

I really think that PF assumed he was smarter than LE and they weren't going to find out what happened to KB. He was too arrogant to stand in front of cameras and plead for information about his missing fiancee because it would mean he had to act like KB left him, not he got tired of KB. MOO.

 

[Stazzyboo]

In my long life and experiences, whenever I've known a man who
was mean or abusive to animals, turns out they were also mean
and abusive to people in their life. Every time.

Very true! The FBI has found that a history of cruelty to animals is one of the traits that regularly appear in its computer records of serial rapists and murderers so much so that FBI now tracks and puts animal abusers on a list. If you are willing to be cruel to a defenseless animals the chances of the person doing it to humans goes up.

 

[sunshineandlove]

Just a thought.

Had she just found out she was pregnant.

That is my thought too. I hope they can recover her remains as that would lend to motive.