CO CO - Kelsey Berreth, 29, Woodland Park, Teller County, 22 Nov 2018 - #14 *ARREST*

[InvSmith]

They definitely went there to arrest him, warrant in hand.
MOO

I tied the timing to the amount of evidence and concerns for the daughter. They had to be enormously concerned irregardless of what they said publicly. What they said publicly was to keep him appeased while they investigated and had enough evidence to engage child protective services.

 

[1mtroyal]

Definitely obstruction of justice for misleading the investigation. Probably a lot more.

If he is cooperating with law officials, maybe nothing. PF might have told him some sort of lie about why to send the two texts and the individual might not have known it was to throw off the police, although this is doubtful.

 

[girlhasnoname]

A hole bigger than the house??? that's new. i would like to see this drone footage.....

Thanks Gojacks:

Something found in Kelsey's home is what led to the arrest of PF'. Momma F was briefly detained yesterday morning and she definitely walks with some type of physical limitation.

Noticed in the regards to the solicitation charges the DA specifically stated "soliciting someone else to do the crime".

I hope they nail every single person who knew, were involved, or who covered anything up to the wall.

Baby K, looks like a sweet little mini Kelsey IMO. I'm sure she will know what a wonderful person her mother was and will be surrounded by so much love and positivity with the Berreth family.

 

[1mtroyal]

I found it interesting that at the last confrontation at PF's gate with the press, PF did not say "This is a private road". The press probably found out that it was not PF's private road. All PF could do is give the press a cold stare.

 

[oviedo]

BBM. That's actually not really true. The best interest of the child is the standard in virtually every state in the nation when it comes to child custody determinations. Kids are removed in the context of family law cases due to the suspicion that they might've committed a crime, depending on what it is, frequently.

Kids are removed from parents every day in this nation after they've been arrested but not yet convicted. Because the parent is not able to care for them.

However, parental rights cannot be terminated altogether based on suspicion alone.

Of course in the absence of an arrest, without an on-going custody battle that predated a possible crime, and a party to that case able to litigate, OR in the absence of signs of child endangerment, parents suspected of a crime are going to retain custody. Like Josh Powell.

But we aren't talking about that kind of scenario. PF hasn't been merely accused. He's been arrested and not able to care for his child. So that's different.

That being said, parents who have been arrested for murder don't automatically lose the right to determine who their child will live with. In numerous cases we've seen them allowed to make major decisions about placement or at least to have their wishes strongly considered.

That's why I was fairly surprised by the announcement that the baby would go with Kelsey's family. Because while LE might want that to happen, as well as CPS, the court is going to make the determination. And unless he's deemed unfit, PF may play a part in that decision.

Moreover, who is able to care and provide financially for the child will be important as well as who the child is bonded with. They like to keep status quo. So if she can care for the baby, the court may consider PF's mother first.

Like you, all of this troubles me. Because it is terrible that at the worst moment of their lives, the last thing they have to cling to is often denied to families of murder victims.

In addition, as I stated before, I've seen the families of defendants acting in a punitive and cruel manner to the victim's family when it comes to contact with the child. And that's not good for the child either.

Finally, as I said, I'm biased against the families of defendants. As unfair as that can be. By I've seen too many families of murder defendants that are enmeshed enablers and otherwise dysfunctional. Jason Young's family. josh powell's family. Scott Peterson's family. Chris Coleman's family. Casey Anthony's family. CW's family. Drew Peterson's family. Michelle Parker's ex's family. And on and on and on.

I hope this gets reported on - I do not think she will be returned to the PF family but we know it has happened before - excellent post - thank you

 

[InvSmith]

They definitely went there to arrest him, warrant

This arrest demonstrated that he has been tracked since probably 12/2 or 12/3 to try to locate KB; however, LE needed enough evidence for an arrest for their charges and for protecting a very young vulnerable child. This had to weigh heavily on them. Physical evidence is one thing but your investigative instinct is completely another.

 

[sun16]

Maybe PF will tell LE where Kelsey’s body is located, to avoid the death penalty (if it’s even on the table). I know it hasn’t been used in CO for 40 years, and might not be used again, but the death penalty would make PF’s life in prison, if convicted or no plea, much more difficult. Let’s see what PF does now or possibly says. I have a feeling he’s not the most cooperative person. I also wonder how he/whomever chose to dispose of Kelsey’s body. PF might not be willing to share that, or much of anything else. We’ve all seen him go into cold stare, get off my property, I’m not saying anything, shutdown mode.

 

[Hatfield]

JMO
Been watching all the main morning news this morning and just saw footage on GMA that showed the previous search of her home and they carried an aluminum ladder into her home. I had not known that till now. Very interesting.

Maybe they found evidence in the attic. Sometimes places have an attic that has a small door and maybe they used their own ladder to get up to the attic safely.

If he had killed her in the afternoon in her home and then came back after dark to do a better job of cleaning up then maybe some things were stashed in the attic till he got back to do a better job of cleaning up.

 

[jaspermac]

Yeah. You can obtain some data from the phone company, and potentially from the cloud.

You generally need the phone for things like text messages, and internet searches, though.

It would sure be great if they found it.

Yes, text message used to be easily obtained through the cell phone companies but they were getting called into court so often to testify on the cell records they stored and pulled up, they started shortening the length of time they stored text messages. So it depends on the cell company how many days of text messages the police can retrieve without having the actual phone. But if they have deleted them from the phone and the cell phone company doesn't have them stored, i don't think they can be retrieved but I could be wrong.

 

[dixiegirl1035]

BBM. That's actually not really true. The best interest of the child is the standard in virtually every state in the nation when it comes to child custody determinations. Kids are removed in the context of family law cases due to the suspicion that they might've committed a crime, depending on what it is, frequently.

Kids are removed from parents every day in this nation after they've been arrested but not yet convicted. Because the parent is not able to care for them.

However, parental rights cannot be terminated altogether based on suspicion alone.

Of course in the absence of an arrest, without an on-going custody battle that predated a possible crime, and a party to that case able to litigate, OR in the absence of signs of child endangerment, parents suspected of a crime are going to retain custody. Like Josh Powell.

But we aren't talking about that kind of scenario. PF hasn't been merely accused. He's been arrested and not able to care for his child. So that's different.

That being said, parents who have been arrested for murder don't automatically lose the right to determine who their child will live with. In numerous cases we've seen them allowed to make major decisions about placement or at least to have their wishes strongly considered.

That's why I was fairly surprised by the announcement that the baby would go with Kelsey's family. Because while LE might want that to happen, as well as CPS, the court is going to make the determination. And unless he's deemed unfit, PF may play a part in that decision.

Moreover, who is able to care and provide financially for the child will be important as well as who the child is bonded with. They like to keep status quo. So if she can care for the baby, the court may consider PF's mother first.

Like you, all of this troubles me. Because it is terrible that at the worst moment of their lives, the last thing they have to cling to is often denied to families of murder victims.

In addition, as I stated before, I've seen the families of defendants acting in a punitive and cruel manner to the victim's family when it comes to contact with the child. And that's not good for the child either.

Finally, as I said, I'm biased against the families of defendants. As unfair as that can be. By I've seen too many families of murder defendants that are enmeshed enablers and otherwise dysfunctional. Jason Young's family. josh powell's family. Scott Peterson's family. Chris Coleman's family. Casey Anthony's family. CW's family. Drew Peterson's family. Michelle Parker's ex's family. And on and on and on.

.. and the Taylor Wright case in Florida.

As Gunslinging Granny wrote earlier,

"His legal custody of Kelsey's baby must be terminated!
(Read Dr. Teresa Sievers' thread. Her poor mom and the children suffered immensely)"

Also, the media report, upthread about 15 posts, state in the video that the child custody was already in progress prior to her going missing.

I thought we had decided here that that was filed afterwards. Is this another case where the media hasn't been correct?

 

[jaspermac]

JMO
Been watching all the main morning news this morning and just saw footage on GMA that showed the previous search of her home and they carried an aluminum ladder into her home. I had not known that till now. Very interesting.

Maybe they found evidence in the attic. Sometimes places have an attic that has a small door and maybe they used their own ladder to get up to the attic safely.

If he had killed her in the afternoon in her home and then came back after dark to do a better job of cleaning up then maybe some things were stashed in the attic till he got back to do a better job of cleaning up.

Possibly, but after they brought in the ladder they were seen carrying out large flat objects, possibly drywall pieces or cupboards. So it was surmised that the ladder was used to remove these. But it could have been for something else, darn police won't tell us anything, lol.

 

[jaspermac]

.. and the Taylor Wright case in Florida.

As Gunslinging Granny wrote earlier,

"His legal custody of Kelsey's baby must be terminated!
(Read Dr. Teresa Sievers' thread. Her poor mom and the children suffered immensely)"

Also, the media report, upthread about 15 posts, state in the video that the child custody was already in progress prior to her going missing.

I thought we had decided here that that was filed afterwards. Is this another case where the media hasn't been correct?

Sam Kraemar, from one of the tv stations, answered a tweet suggesting it was prior. He then said he was taking it back, deleted the tweet and is going to follow up and try and get the correct information.

 

[oviedo]

Kelsey Berreth case: Fiance of missing Colorado mom charged in her murder
Nothing new

 

[susiQ]

I guess he learned more about PF than he wanted to know!

Yes, like he's not likely to get paid for his work any time soon

 

[Hatfield]

Possibly, but after they brought in the ladder they were seen carrying out large flat objects, possibly drywall pieces or cupboards. So it was surmised that the ladder was used to remove these. But it could have been for something else, darn police won't tell us anything, lol.

Very good point.

From watching so much Forensic File episodes maybe they found blood splatter spots way up high on a wall and cut out the sheet rock to preserve the evidence.

 

[flightybird]

Very good point.

From watching so much Forensic File episodes maybe they found blood splatter spots way up high on a wall and cut out the sheet rock to preserve the evidence.

I wouldn’t at all be shocked if this were the case, based on them saying that they found evidence that led them to believe that KB was murdered in her home.

 

[dixiegirl1035]

Not sure if this has been posted.

@jaspermac

It was not the tweet that I was talking about, it was this YouTube that was posted that said the couple was expected to have a custody hearing.

Perhaps the confusion stems from the very beginning when law enforcement or was it just the media that said the last time she seen was " during a custody transfer"?

Is this the same station that Sam works for?

 

[susiQ]

Snip.

The judge granted the prosecution's request that Frazee have no contact with any witness or anyone else named in the sealed arrest affidavit, with the exception of his family.

Kelsey Berreth: Patrick Frazee, the fiancé of a missing mom in Colorado, is arrested and booked in her murder - CNN

Under the solicitation statute, a suspect would not only have discussed committing a crime with another person but would have taken steps to see it through, May said.

So, in essence they are telling us they have nothing on the family to implicate them as being involved in any part of this crime seeing he is not prohibited from speaking to them? It's either that or they are setting him up to reveal something? Or, for his family to have the opportunity to advise him to admit the deed so they are able to find Kelsey.

 

[Mom24]

JMO
Been watching all the main morning news this morning and just saw footage on GMA that showed the previous search of her home and they carried an aluminum ladder into her home. I had not known that till now. Very interesting.

Maybe they found evidence in the attic. Sometimes places have an attic that has a small door and maybe they used their own ladder to get up to the attic safely.

If he had killed her in the afternoon in her home and then came back after dark to do a better job of cleaning up then maybe some things were stashed in the attic till he got back to do a better job of cleaning up.

I don't know if that place has an attic. But the home has a loft like second floor, so the first floor is open to the second floor. Someone had wondered if they were taking out cabinet doors from the kitchen, but with fresh baked rolls on the counter, it doesn't seem likely that's the room that something happened in.
edited to add-somewhere back on the last page someone had posted pics of the interior of the home. If I find the link I'll post it.

 

[kirkassoc]

According to this news report from Fox 31 Denver, they located the phone in Twin Falls, ID. That statement is located near the 6 minute mark on video.