CO CO - Kelsey Berreth, 29, Woodland Park, Teller County, 22 Nov 2018 - #33 *ARREST*

[CarolinePolly]

So since we can speculate on the cattle sales, with that amount of cattle, even at rock bottom prices, he had to have made around $100,000, or more, jmo. Interesting that this newest motion on his part took place two days after the sale of said cows. So are these funds off limits to the Berreth's?

I watched this auction live and this particular P-F (pronounced P Bar F) herd offered as “a complete dispersal” was a total of 79 head sold for $106,000. Although there were 85 head listed in the original commision sheet.
};o moo y’all

 

[MassGuy]

KB bought her own place a few months prior to September. We don't know how PF felt about that.

Purchasing a home usually incurs new expenses, i.e., homeowner's insurance, etc.

*Speculation only: child support agreements were likely very loose and informal b/t KB and PF. KB may have broached the subject of needing increased financial support and/or seeking court-ordered child support if PF was not contributing in a consistent or substantial way to Baby K's expenses. IMO, that would have enraged PF.

I think money lies at the root of this crime somehow. I might very well be entirely wrong.

I do think LE and the DA have a working theory as to motive based on evidence they've gathered.

JMO.

They don’t need to know the motive, but it certainly helps in the courtroom, as the the jury likes to know why.

We all do.

I too, think money probably played a role here. Child custody as well.

 

[mtnlites]

I would say the reporter is an urban person with little understanding of the AG business. PF has some cows at the 35-acres. They can be seen in the pipe pens and in his dog videos. But you don't "run" cattle on that home acreage which is also 2/3 forested. PF "runs" his cattle business from the 35-acres, but the herd of cattle is "running" on BLM land elsewhere.

Is this somehow complicated? Beef cattle are out "running" all over the western states. No one feeds them daily or checks on them.

IMO it is also an urban-suburban mentality that finds it strange that adult children in any AG family continue to live at home. That's the norm, multi-generational family on one farm or ranch. They build more housing as needed.

BBM

I simply asked if the article was wrong.

 

[Hatfield]

KOAA's report on PF's motion

Patrick Frazee files motion to dismiss wrongful death lawsuit
Frazee’s attorney argues her parents do not have legal standing under Colorado law as Berreth has a surviving child. The motion filed in federal court claims state law only allows parents to file a wrongful death lawsuit if “the deceased is an unmarried minor without descendants or an unmarried adult without descendants and without a designated beneficiary.”

The motion also claims the parents cannot claim infliction of emotional distress because “they were not the targets of the alleged actions causing the wrongful death of Kelsy (sic) Berreth nor were they physically present or physically injured on the occasion of the alleged wrongful death.”

Berreth’s parents, Cheryl and Darrell Berreth, filed the lawsuit on Jan. 4. The causes of action in their lawsuit included wrongful death, negligence per se, civil conspiracy and intentional infliction of emotional distress.

JMO
I am appalled at this part:

The motion also claims the parents cannot claim infliction of emotional distress because “they were not the targets of the alleged actions causing the wrongful death of Kelsy (sic) Berreth nor were they physically present or physically injured on the occasion of the alleged wrongful death.”

First off its obvious PF still to this day does not realize his actions had dire consequences and has hurt other people besides KB. Secondly, his lawyers argument about not being physically present or physically hurt is a direct contradiction to what the suit says.

The claim of emotional distress is what it means. Emotional distressing and emotional pain and suffering due to the death of their daughter. Of course they were not physically present or physically killed like KB was, but her death has caused them tremendous emotional pain and suffering as it would any parent of a murdered child. And I would even go as far to say there is some physical pain and illnesses that will materialize as they work through their grief even though the lawsuit is only claiming for emotional distress.

I hope PF and all his counter claims are thrown out by the courts and I hope it all backfires on him and is used against him in his criminal trial.

 

[jaspermac]

So since we can speculate on the cattle sales, with that amount of cattle, even at rock bottom prices, he had to have made around $100,000, or more, jmo. Interesting that this newest motion on his part took place two days after the sale of said cows. So are these funds off limits to the Berreth's?

I doubt he would have made $100k once you subtract the livestock loan (that is the norm) and health and maintenance costs plus whatever it cost him to buy the cattle in the first place.

Still, my guess is whatever funds are left wouldn't be frozen so he could spend them (on his civil defense attorney) before another suit gets filed on behalf of little K. (if this one is indeed dismissed)

 

[InvSmith]

Since state lines were crossed does that mean this is a Federal Prosecution? I keep hearing everyone talk about WP LE ... are feds involved? Sorry I read so many cases, I’ve forgotten if this has been stated.
And I didn’t know this ...
Immunity in Exchange for Testimony
This website states Feds do not offer “transactional immunity” - which (I think) would protect KK but still leave her open for prosecution.
“Use and derivative use immunity is more common (used by both state and federal prosecutors) and narrower than transactional immunity. It prevents the prosecution from using the witness’s statements (“use”) or any evidence derived from those statements (“derivative use”) against the witness in a criminal prosecution. In theory, use and derivative use immunity provides as much protection as the witness not testifying.”

Either way ... Would she even be arrested?
Would she have to go to trial OR just admit guilt and receive lesser or no sentence?
I’m still not sure I understand the difference

She has a right to a speedy trial and not to bear witness against herself. I am willing to bet she had an attorney once the "ping" was discovered. Obviously, she had told her best friend that had told other people, plus discussed on social media. The U.S. has immunity but our distinction is state and federal cases offering immunity not necessarily types. She has not been charged so no one here knows her legal status and need for immunity offer.

<modsnipped >

 

[GordianKnot]

They don’t need to know the motive, but it certainly helps in the courtroom, as the the jury likes to know why.

We all do.

I too, think money probably played a role here. Child custody as well.

Yep, I had just gone back in and edited my post to add custody arrangements/(dis)agreements to my post.

I actually think that was the toxic formula: Monetary + Custody Issues = PF's Twisted Motive. JMO.

 

[InvSmith]

Whose property is this?

It was in MSM that the mother owned three properties, one or more could be in his name if someone is researching.

 

[MassGuy]

I doubt he would have made $100k once you subtract the livestock loan (that is the norm) and health and maintenance costs plus whatever it cost him to buy the cattle in the first place.

Still, my guess is whatever funds are left wouldn't be frozen so he could spend them (on his civil defense attorney) before another suit gets filed on behalf of little K. (if this one is indeed dismissed)

Yeah, it’s important to keep in mind is that this is gross, and not net profit.

Ha! “Health and maintenence cost.”

The advertisement probably should have read:

“Lightly abused, slightly emaciated cattle for sale.”

Still treated better than Kelsey though...

 

[GordianKnot]

*Deleted.

Unnecessary comment.

 

[skycountry]

JMO
I am appalled at this part:

The motion also claims the parents cannot claim infliction of emotional distress because “they were not the targets of the alleged actions causing the wrongful death of Kelsy (sic) Berreth nor were they physically present or physically injured on the occasion of the alleged wrongful death.”

First off its obvious PF still to this day does not realize his actions had dire consequences and has hurt other people besides KB. Secondly, his lawyers argument about not being physically present or physically hurt is a direct contradiction to what the suit says.

The claim of emotional distress is what it means. Emotional distressing and emotional pain and suffering due to the death of their daughter. Of course they were not physically present or physically killed like KB was, but her death has caused them tremendous emotional pain and suffering as it would any parent of a murdered child. And I would even go as far to say there is some physical pain and illnesses that will materialize as they work through their grief even though the lawsuit is only claiming for emotional distress.

I hope PF and all his counter claims are thrown out by the courts and I hope it all backfires on him and is used against him in his criminal trial.

He is finally starting to show his cards, someone on here called it, he will file motion after motion to delay justice for the Berreth family. The man is arrogant, no surprise, verbally abusive men usually think they are perfect, and above reproach. JMO

 

[Aydrianna523]

Why is he filing in federal court? I thought the Berreths filed in state court? And secondly, in that mugshot PF looks like Scooby Doo.

Sorry had to laugh at the SD part...

 

[Aydrianna523]

They don’t need to know the motive, but it certainly helps in the courtroom, as the the jury likes to know why.

We all do.

I too, think money probably played a role here. Child custody as well.

I'm with money and his being plain evil as the motive(s).

 

[MassGuy]

He is finally starting to show his cards, someone on here called it, he will file motion after motion to delay justice for the Berreth family. The man is arrogant, no surprise, verbally abusive men usually think they are perfect, and above reproach. JMO

I think we need to avoid reading too much into the civil suit.

He has lawyers working on his behalf, and they are the ones fighting this for him.

It’s not like these actions are unusual. When a person is sued, it is up to their lawyers to fight for him.

They are doing that.

His actions prove that he is a terrible person, but pointing to this lawsuit and saying that it serves as evidence of that, is probably a weak argument.

 

[MyBelle]

I doubt he would have made $100k once you subtract the livestock loan (that is the norm) and health and maintenance costs plus whatever it cost him to buy the cattle in the first place.

Still, my guess is whatever funds are left wouldn't be frozen so he could spend them (on his civil defense attorney) before another suit gets filed on behalf of little K. (if this one is indeed dismissed)

I don't care how much PF netted but I do hope the court orders some of it go to baby K for child support and to pay the B's attorneys fees.

From the beginning I have believed PF's motive was all about money and child custody so he wouldn't have to pay child support. I'm all for the B's dishing it right back at 'em.

JMO

 

[nwmouse]

An extremely over protective and controlling mother. Not unlike most of us who have children, but willing to turn a blind eye to the misdeeds and anger issues of her son.

Enmeshment. Its very unhealthy and I speak from my own experience as a child.

PF's latest move to have the wrongful death lawsuit dismissed is so calculated and cold.

I don't think this guy is capable of empathy or compassion.

His attitude/behavior sickens me. Playing cat and mouse with a grieving family.

MOO

 

[nwmouse]

The dangers of “hooking up” online are no greater than with traditional means. You have to do your research on dates no matter how you meet. 70% of today’s young generation are using dating sites to meet people. It’s the norm and we are well past the taboo of it. I just wish KB would’ve waited to have a baby with him.

I think one of the issues these days is that many people overshare on social media and its easy to get an overall picture of their strengths, weaknesses etc.

Its easy for stalkers or dubious people who are internet dating to look up someone's profile on FB/twitter/instagram and find out too much info. Then they use it to manipulate or groom that person.

I have learned that sometimes people online project a very different persona to what their true colors really are. Buyer beware. Email guy can seem like a sweet, caring, considerate knight in shining armor. But that is not who they are. Its just a tool for them to justify their own selfish ends.

MOO

 

[gitana1]

Yes, we do. @gitana1, @riolove77, @Mercedes

I don't know if anyone has answered yet. Does anyone have a link to a copy of the complaint?

At first blush I would think federal law would apply but I might be wrong. Feds have jurisdiction because the litigants are from different states. So CO state law likely applies.

I'm not sure how this works. It's not my area of law. But it seems the Berreth's attorneys would know the law on this before filing?

 

[nwmouse]

JMO
I am appalled at this part:

The motion also claims the parents cannot claim infliction of emotional distress because “they were not the targets of the alleged actions causing the wrongful death of Kelsy (sic) Berreth nor were they physically present or physically injured on the occasion of the alleged wrongful death.”

First off its obvious PF still to this day does not realize his actions had dire consequences and has hurt other people besides KB. Secondly, his lawyers argument about not being physically present or physically hurt is a direct contradiction to what the suit says.

The claim of emotional distress is what it means. Emotional distressing and emotional pain and suffering due to the death of their daughter. Of course they were not physically present or physically killed like KB was, but her death has caused them tremendous emotional pain and suffering as it would any parent of a murdered child. And I would even go as far to say there is some physical pain and illnesses that will materialize as they work through their grief even though the lawsuit is only claiming for emotional distress.

I hope PF and all his counter claims are thrown out by the courts and I hope it all backfires on him and is used against him in his criminal trial.

Me too.

Its so COLD. Speaks of his character.


moo

 

[Lhughessk]

Of course she could be wheeled out in suitcase or duffel. KB was only 5'3," and 100lbs, and it's been done many times before!

Woman busted smuggling lover out of prison in a suitcase

Of course she could be wheeled out in suitcase or duffel. KB was only 5'3," and 100lbs, and it's been done many times before!

Woman busted smuggling lover out of prison in a suitcase

Respectfully disagree. First the picture in your link is not of a small suitcase. Looks like a full-size one to me.

Second, it’s one thing for a living person to contort themselves to fit in a small space. It’s another thing to try to make a corpse fit that isn’t cooperating with you.

Even if you did get it to fit, the suitcase would be so overstuffed that it would look super suspicious to an onlooker, thus defeating the purpose, IMO