Found Deceased CO - Shanann Watts (34), Celeste"Cece" (3) and Bella (4), Frederick, 13 Aug 2018 *Arrest* #24

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Hey Everyone,

I am training a new mod. Please welcome Whiskers16. Do not tell her the truth about moderating, please. I want her to think it is all fun and laughter and love. LOL

<Modsnip - off topic>
 
Well fit is such a pom expression! Lol!

absolutely, we're both from the UK, so I added extra Vicky Pollard ( Little Britain character)

ETA: never explain a joke or satire but maybe it's needed. This is Vicky Pollard, she's a satirical character & teenaged delinquent from a noughties TV comedy who uses certain phrases. Another typical riposte is - " you're just jeal!"
 
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I agree - it doesn't look good for him. But, like I've said, we don't have enough FACTS to convict him of murdering his 2 daughters. That's a fact and it's your choice if you want to ignore it.

I disagree. I've listed those facts. There are even more. I think they constitute powerful evidence that he is guilty of three first degree murders beyond a reasonable doubt.

I think I know something about evidence and reasonable doubt and burdens of proof. Reasonable minds may differ. That's understandable. My word isn't law.

But for someone to say it's a fact (as opposed to opinion), that we don't have enough facts to convict him, I think is incorrect and unreasonable.

That's your opinion. It's not fact.
 
We have a few facts that point towards his potential guilt, imo.

For one, his statements about the event do not seem credible. Hard to believe that he could see on the monitor, that his child was blue. That is very questionable.

And if he did see a blue child, even harder to believe that he didn't call 911 and/or scream loudly for help. He said nothing about trying to revive either child.

Sadly, I have known several parents who have found an unresponsive child or spouse. Trying to immediately REVIVE their loved one is the immediate priority. Calling 911, screaming for help from neighbors, doing CPR, would be his response, if he really saw a child sprawled on her bed, blue in the face. He didn't do anything of the sort.

His other child was in the process of being strangled. She had a great chance to be saved if he had tried to do so. But he said nothing about trying to save her. Instead, he spent precious long minutes strangling his wife, and thus killing his only surviving child in the process.

These facts point to his potential guilt, not his potential innocence, in my opinion.

Nothing in his story makes much sense. Why would they be having a deep emotional discussion 2 hours after she arrived home, from a long delayed flight. She was ill, pregnant and exhausted. She would have been asleep if she had her choice.

And he said he asked for a separation and she snapped. But our VI said he had asked for a separation repeatedly, with little response from her. Why would a pregnant woman, thrilled about the little boy she had already named, brutally slaughter her babies, over a proposed separation, that she knew about for weeks or months?
BBM
Yes, exactly!
 
It sounded to me like his story was that Bella was "spread out" and blue, as seen on the monitor, which would lead me to not consider that they were both in bed together that night. But who knows.
Re: CW’s statement that BW looked “blue” - a lot of discussion in prior threads about how fast bodies turn blue after death... but there’s another possibility. (I was an EMT prior to becoming a lawyer... and am still fascinated by medicine)

We don’t yet have the official COD from the postmortem, and we don’t have any description of how they were strangled (or even confirmation that BW was also strangled). My understanding is that in a ligature strangulation, the victim’s face can turn blue - and remain that way - until the ligature is loosened... I’m *not* saying C.W. is telling the truth - just that strangulation *can* cause the face to turn blue, and it’s possible the color was significant enough to show up on the monitor. We just don’t know that yet.
 
With what we know right now, I don't think it looks good for CW. I'm not ready to say either one is responsible for the girls deaths.
No, it definitely does not look good for him. He may have very well backed himself into a corner with all of his lies, actions, and deceitfulness. Even if he were telling the truth it would be hard to believe , based on his actions alone. Jmo
 
Covering up a crime does show evidence of guilt. And an implausible confession, which was given only when he knew that they had found the location of the bodies so as to mitigate his charges. At every turn, every action and word is that of a guilty man. This is what juries look at when physical evidence is lacking. And the confession lacks plausibility. A loving father, or really any stranger, would try to recisitate two dead children (having died within minutes of “finding” them) with the help of 911. Not start packing them up to go hide them and messaging your deceased wife like she is alive.

Plus, we do have physical evidence: All three bodies. Just where he admits he put them.
 
If we are meant to withhold judgment and remain neutral without forming an opinion until everything has been laid out at the trial, then what is the purpose of even discussing the case on this site?

Innocent until proven guilty is a legal concept and is applicable to the jury. I'm not on said jury; in the court of Mtnlites, when considering the circumstantial and physical facts, CW killed all 4.
Im just waiting to see his emails and texts and Internet searches during the discovery process.

:)
 
I'm trying my best to be open minded because we don't have all the facts, mostly speculation and opinions.

IF, and only IF, it happened as CW said: I would understand if he ONLY disposed of SW body because he killed her;
but WHY disposed of the babies bodies in such a repugnant way? when, allegedly they were strangled by SW?

why keeping the charade ? why bargain to disclose the babies lifeless bodies location?

BBM I agree, it is difficult until we know more. The defence imo is going to have to essentially put SW on trial if they go with his story. So they better have some solid evidence or the jury will be insulted enough to give him the max.
 
To strangle your own very young children suggests anger to me. CW used that word so I can assume the children were strangled. This wrecks my theory that the whole thing was premeditated. If he planned it, smothering them with a pillow would have been easier and he wouldn’t have to look into their eyes. I can’t get past that shrouded doll laid out like a corpse.
 
I know, beyond all doubt, that I would not be able to throw my dead babies in the back of my truck, and dump them in a vat of crude oil. NO POSSIBLE WAY.

I could absolutely kill someone, anyone, who was strangling my baby. No question about that. But I would make it a higher priority to revive my children.

I certainly can't argue with that.
 
I just watched one of CW interviews again. Where he talks about going out to look for them. The police tell him not to, he wouldn't know what to look for. How odd. When my beagle has escaped the first thing I do is slip on shoes, grab a leash and hop in the car. What am I looking for? I think the police deterred him for a reason. Most likely IMO to see if he would comply. A concerned person looks, tries anything, everything. If the dog catcher tried persuading me that I wouldn't be successful doesn't mean I wouldn't try!
 
To strangle your own very young children suggests anger to me. CW used that word so I can assume the children were strangled. This wrecks my theory that the whole thing was premeditated. If he planned it, smothering them with a pillow would have been easier and he wouldn’t have to look into their eyes. I can’t get past that shrouded doll laid out like a corpse.
I can't get past the oil, the smiling, preening interviews and the fact that he was sneaking around with numerous affair partners.
 
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