Found Deceased CO - Shanann Watts (34), Celeste"Cece" (3) and Bella (4), Frederick, 13 Aug 2018 *Arrest* #29

[gitana1]

The thing is from our view now, knowing who he is and what he did, it's really hard to be objective about how he was before. I think we want there to be clues because the idea this came out of nowhere by someone no one would ever suspect is freaking terrifying. How can any of us know and feel safe?

Yes. And yet it happens every year.

What signs were there with Chris Coleman? Neil Entwhistle? Christian Longo? Scott Peterson? Jason Young? Mark Hacking? Ross Harris? Michael Blagg?

Over and over and over again we are presented with these cases of good family men. No history of mental health issues or criminal charges or domestic violence or drug or alcohol issues. Peaceful men. Good dads.

And then boom.

And not with one of them is there evidence of psychosis or dissasociative fugue or any other mental health crisis to explain the seemingly sudden eruption of violence.

But so often we find that these apparently good family men had something else going. Something hidden. Something dark. They just wanted to be free. Totally free. Without going through the shame or hassle or ugliness of a divorce or custody battle.

And yet people contort trying to find something outside of these men to explain what they did.

Regardless, the answer always lies in the men (typically males for some reason) who do these things. Since it seems to come out of nowhere, it's inexplicable but it always has to do with them and their characters.

Because normal people without defects of their souls and without darkness of their minds, they react to unwanted pregnancies or financial issues or affairs or unhappy marriages...differently.

And still? Countless people keep searching for an answer outside of the murderers themselves.

Because you're right. It is terrifying. It's horrible to think that nothing anyone can do can prevent a monster from committing murder. And that in some sinister cases there is no way of knowing that the person sleeping next to you, is actually just such a monster, and capable of such sudden, soul cracking violence.

 

[MassGuy]

Oh for cryin' out loud. Do we need to bring in a psychologist to define abuse or something? I will go find one! MOO

She was being sarcastic.

 

[katydid23]

Being angry is different than losing it on someone or DV.

Of course it is. That is my point. Some are saying they never see their friends or loved ones angry because reasonable respectful people don't get angry in public. And I am disagreeing. Anger can be a healthy response, imo.

 

[MollyDDD]

That is very strange!

ETA- Especially because it's not just once that it happens, it's a few times in that document. Makes me wonder if it was done on purpose

Could it be her friend who dropped her off that morning?

 

[FlossyMay]

@FlossyMay, I agree on principal with you that I don't think there were any overt signs of abuse prior to the murders according to some of SW and CW friends and through SM presence but we have to take into account that (in part) an emotionally abusive relationship is one in which a partner undercuts a person's foundational self confidence and love of self and replaces it with confusion about self worth and value. It doesn't have to be overt abuse it can also be masked and imperceptible.
Not implying SW was abusive to CW just making a distinction about abuse can be overt and/or concealed

I know what emotional abuse is as I've spent many nights sitting in a women's shelter in therapy sessions for that very reason. So again, I haven't seen any signs that either one of them were being abused before the murders, except for his cheating which is a betrayal of trust and would certainly cause a person to become confused about their self worth and value.

 

[PommyMommy]

Delete...n/m

 

[MassGuy]

Could it be her friend who dropped her off that morning?

It was a simple error that was repeated throughout the document. Only CW was listed as the defendant. There is nothing going on here other than a mistake.

 

[gitana1]

Question for the attorneys out there (@gitana1), during the funeral mass for SW/BW/CW, it was mentioned the family does not wish to seek death & punishment but life and justice ( something to that effect). Since the services were held in a Roman Catholic Church I'm assuming that is their religion. Again, assuming only, that SW's family does not believe in the DP, due to religious or personal beliefs, in your opinion, how much do you think that would weigh in on the DA's decision? Would he have to NOT go for it if they asked.... or have to GO for it even though the family is against it? I know that may be a loaded question and differs in each case, but I've been curious since I heard it during the service! TIA ( you have been amazing in not only in your wealth of information, but also the time you have taken to answer so many! BIG thanks!)

Not speaking for the other attorneys, IMO, a lot. I think if that's how they continue to believe, we won't see the DA seeking that penalty.

 

[MassGuy]

My bad! So, who was abused and how?

The kids and Shanann, as they were murdered. Facebook videos prove nothing.

 

[Whiteorchids]

Yes. And yet it happens every year.

What signs were there with Chris Coleman? Neil Entwhistle? Christian Longo? Scott Peterson? Jason Young? Mark Hacking? Ross Harris? Michael Blagg?

Over and over and over again we are presented with these cases of good family men. No history of mental health issues or criminal charges or domestic violence or drug or alcohol issues. Peaceful men. Good dads.

And then boom.

And not with one of them is there evidence of psychosis or dissasociative fugue or any other mental health crisis to explain the seemingly sudden eruption of violence.

But so often we find that these apparently good family men had something else going. Something hidden. Something dark. They just wanted to be free. Totally free. Without going through the shame or hassle or ugliness of a divorce or custody battle.

And yet people contort trying to find something outside of these men to explain what they did.

Regardless, the answer always lies in the men (typically males for some reason) who do these things. Since it seems to come out of nowhere, it's inexplicable but it always has to do with them and their characters.

Because normal people without defects of their souls and without darkness of their minds, they react to unwanted pregnancies or financial issues or affairs or unhappy marriages...differently.

And still? Countless people keep searching for an answer outside of the murderers themselves.

Because you're right. It is terrifying. It's horrible to think that nothing anyone can do can prevent a monster from committing murder. And that in some sinister cases there is no way of knowing that the person sleeping next to you, is actually just such a monster, and capable of such sudden, soul cracking violence.

^^^^This^^^^Great post^^^^

 

[Bill Carson]

@Bill Carson, that is reassuring that they are being thorough and diligent but why would the defense team let an error of "she" versus "he" in a document? I guess I am questioning too much.

Sorry, I'm not caught up on the thread. I don't know what you are referring to. If you want to point that out to me, or summarize it, then I'll give you my opinion.

 

[Best of What's Around]

Idk, it's possible he didn't intervene because he didn't want to face the wrath. I didn't see anything with him initiating roughness or impatience with the kids. IMO

Respectfully, we have seen no evidence that wrath is what he would face.

 

[Deleted member 230544]

Hopefully he wasn't practicing on the alleged AP who allegedly said he tried to strangle her during intercourse. MOO.

Hi @nwmouse, I was hesitant to bring this subject up because I don't have any clinical knowledge in this field nor do we know if it is even a true report, but your post gave me a segway to at least query it. If this report is accurate and CW acted out animalistic sex acts on a sex partner, I question why CW would behave in this manner. Was CW sexually repressed? Was CW angry? Was there a neurological explanation for this aggression? Was there a psychological explanation for this aggression? Was this an area in CW's life where he felt he had some control whereby other areas of his life he felt powerless? It would be helpful to know if the report was true. A very sensitive and touchy subject.

 

[Whiteorchids]

I know what emotional abuse is as I've spent many nights sitting in a women's shelter in therapy sessions for that very reason. So again, I haven't seen any signs that either one of them were being abused before the murders, except for his cheating which is a betrayal of trust and would certainly cause a person to become confused about their self worth and value.

Hugs FlossyMay. I’m so sorrry you had to suffer mental abuse. Emotional can hurt worse then the physical.

 

[nwmouse]

Yes. And yet it happens every year.

What signs were there with Chris Coleman? Neil Entwhistle? Christian Longo? Scott Peterson? Jason Young? Mark Hacking? Ross Harris? Michael Blagg?

Over and over and over again we are presented with these cases of good family men. No history of mental health issues or criminal charges or domestic violence or drug or alcohol issues. Peaceful men. Good dads.

And then boom.

And not with one of them is there evidence of psychosis or dissasociative fugue or any other mental health crisis to explain the seemingly sudden eruption of violence.

But so often we find that these apparently good family men had something else going. Something hidden. Something dark. They just wanted to be free. Totally free. Without going through the shame or hassle or ugliness of a divorce or custody battle.

And yet people contort trying to find something outside of these men to explain what they did.

Regardless, the answer always lies in the men (typically males for some reason) who do these things. Since it seems to come out of nowhere, it's inexplicable but it always has to do with them and their characters.

Because normal people without defects of their souls and without darkness of their minds, they react to unwanted pregnancies or financial issues or affairs or unhappy marriages...differently.

And still? Countless people keep searching for an answer outside of the murderers themselves.

Because you're right. It is terrifying. It's horrible to think that nothing anyone can do can prevent a monster from committing murder. And that in some sinister cases there is no way of knowing that the person sleeping next to you, is actually just such a monster, and capable of such sudden, soul cracking violence.

BBM:
"But so often we find that these apparently good family men had something else going. Something hidden. Something dark. They just wanted to be free. Totally free. Without going through the shame or hassle or ugliness of a divorce or custody battle."

Yes, it denotes utter selfishness and ruthlessness. They are prepared to do anything for their freedom regardless of what it entails and the horrific ripple effect on friends and family. Ironically, most of these family murderers never see freedom again.

 

[katydid23]

Anger is considered to be a secondary emotion, It is based on other emotions such as fear.

Maybe so, but I am not feeling 'fear' when I see my neighbor's dog fresh poo on my lawn in the morning. I am feeling anger.

 

[Lady Justice21]

IMO no one here except perhaps a VI who knows them well could say that either of them was. To be clear just being a VI wouldn't mean they would know one way or another IMO.

I mentioned several threads back, and I've intentionally ignored this topic since, IMO I see red flags of at minimum verbal abuse. The red flags I personally see do NOT tell me with any certainty IF either of them is being abused or with any certainty WHO the abuser is.

All my own opinion

Eta this was supposed to be a reply to someone asking who was being abused. Sorry!

 

[mtnlites]

Maybe so, but I am not feeling 'fear' when I see my neighbor's dog fresh poo on my lawn in the morning. I am feeling anger.

Same here. When I see another kid calling my kid names, anger is definitely my first emotion, not a secondary one.

 

[FlossyMay]

Hugs FlossyMay. I’m so sorrry you had to suffer mental abuse. Emotional can hurt worse then the physical.

That's very sweet of you. Thank you. All abuse is hateful, horrible and uncalled for, but that was eight years ago. I learned quite a lot from that experience and am now in a very happy and healthy marriage.

 

[MollyDDD]

Whaaa? What in the world does that mean? The AP?
I am, again, 4 pages behind.
So I will most likely be reading the answers when I reach the end. Lol
Thanks in advance for the answers.

Thanks, because I too am confused sometimes when I get back in here. Sorry about that. So this shows that SW got a Protection From Abuse order from CW? Her family had to know something especially since she spent five weeks there without him. OMG.