CO - The Stalking and Mysterious Death of Morgan Ingram #2

[MayraMM]

Does anyone know the address of the house?

<modsnip>, Carbondale

 

[jjw]

Not if he fears being seen as a suspect if he does.

If it was a neighbor....

What if someone else ID's them? They will definitely be a suspect if they are not honest w/investigators. Not alerting authorities would be a big mistake, imo.

 

[alwaysonmymind]

Where are you getting numerous bottles?

Bottles is plural.

 

[MayraMM]

If it was a neighbor....

What if someone else ID's them? They will definitely be a suspect if they are not honest w/investigators. Not alerting authorities would be a big mistake, imo.

It's possible he wasn't aware his picture was taken. Or figured people would recognize him. The point is, we don't know who it was in that picture.

Does anyone else have Google Earth? I just punched in the address, wanting a street view (no luck), but I did notice that 2 doors down someone mowed their lawn in a way that looks like letter: PUTU. It's in the backyard, 2 houses closer to the main road than M's house.

 

[mnegri1973]

http://www.postindependent.com/article/20120901/VALLEYNEWS/120839978

Several different people were viewed as suspects, she said.

&#8220;At this time we don't have enough evidence to go through with arrests for any of those people,&#8221; she added.
And that is lacking in this case. No evidence.

Jumping off of your post concernedmother.....

Before reading the article I assumed, which I know not to do, that the "she" was a spokesperson for either the local PD or the SO. However, it is the mom. That is misleading to me since how does she know who the suspects are/were and how can she say there is not enough evidence to make an arrest. In all honesty she really doesn't know what LE is doing since they won't share info with her.

Then the article goes on to say that the dad was researching on his own and was sending his theories to the ME. Then when the ME comes up with findings that go along with what the dad sent in, the parents don't believe the findings and come out IMO, bashing the doctor and the report.

Now in regards to the drugs found in Morgan's system at the time of her death. I thought that I had read in the prior thread, she has been diagnosed with having migraines dating back to when she was being treated for CO poisoning. What's to say Morgan went to see a doctor that her parents did not know about and that is when se was prescribed the Flexeril. I know from my own experiences that it can be prescribed for migraines. Just because her parents say she nor anyone in the house was taking it, she was a 20 year old woman, she was not a minor where the doctor would notify the parents of what was prescribed.

There are just so many things about this that just do not make sense to me and I'm not the most patient of peeps to have to wait day to day for new info. /sigh

Mel ~


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

 

[twinkiesmom]

Bottles is plural.

I don't agree that you can assume "numerous" from that.

 

[mnegri1973]

I don't agree that you can assume "numerous" from that.

The article that was posted says the Morgan had old pill bottles, in the plural, in her room at the time of her death. I would post the link but not sure how to copy it from my iPad, but it is quoted by me two posts up.

HTTH's. ;-)

Mel ~


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

 

[Herding Cats]

I have "numerous" pill bottles at my house, from my recent surgery and also from ongoing medical treatment. I also had (but have recently disposed of) many dozens of pill bottles from my Dad's final illness.

In Morgan's home, I'm sure there were several pill bottles. However, one was amitriptyline, and the dosage was not disclosed. The pill bottle was rx'd +/- 2 years ago, and apparently Morgan had not used all of the meds.

There was NO flexeril in the house whatsoever.

Yet, between the amitriptyline (present in the house) and the flexeril (not found in the house), what was in her stomach contents was...flexeril.

Changing thoughts...

I am not patient either, though I have resigned myself to being patient with this case. Which is tough, of course, for those of us who are impatient. LOL.

I wish she'd put up the first autopsy report...just so we have something to compare it with. I'm wondering if it has been released yet...???

Best-
Herding Cats

 

[alwaysonmymind]

I don't agree that you can assume "numerous" from that.

Then we'll disagree.

 

[alwaysonmymind]

Can someone post a link stating it was 1 bottle of Elavil?

Or is it your opinion?

tia

 

[gitana1]

But where I take issue is with Dr Kurtzman being adamant her dying of natural causes and citing porphyria as a diagnosis..that diagnosis completely incorrect and never was given Morgan along with the family as well as other physicians of morgans adamantly disageeing with Morgan having died of natural cuases..

It is that type "errors"(and imo thats the most polite way to put it) to begin with that makes me not hold Dr.Kurtzman in high esteem..add to that the family's asking for others opinions and stating they strongly believed that their daughter did not die of natural causes(and we all know the ruling was incorrect and that it was not natural causes) he was angry and uncooperative to put it in the nicest of terms(imo more accurately would be he acted in the highest of unethical and even illegal ways in actually threatening the Ingrams to back off with their disagreeing with the COD=natural causes or he'd change it alright..he'd change it to ruling it a suicide if they didnt back off)..

Which as we also know the Ingrams did not back off in the least and held firm that they didnt believe COD=natural causes and without so much as even their being notified that Kurtzman was going about revising their daughters autopsy..they learned with shock that Kurtzman absolutely followed thru with his threat and had now slapped the revised COD=suicide..

I understand fully that there are some who are highly suspicious of and some even do not believe what the Ingrams state..but in my humble opinion even if you take out believeing the Ingrams accounting of kurtzman maki g such deliberate threats and thereby making good on those threats...imo even when you remove that allegation from the facts you still have a highly questionable autopsy by a doctor who quite obviously got alot wrong and/or just didnt bother with various different standard testing and drew what was his logical conclusion of Morgans COD=natural causes..

Such egregious errors and negligence imo on the part of Dr. KURTZMAN truly has his words of very little value if one is looking for the true and accurate facts concerning what was his job to do on the deceased..

All jmo,tho..

If he actually threatened them in that way, I agree. And I do get your point about the changing diagnosis. That does say something about his ability.

However, I want to point out that what they may have viewed as a threat might have been in a context we don't get. I can see an ME saying "natural causes" if they feel it is more than likely a suicide but want to spare the family's feelings. Probably not a wise thing to do, but I get it. I can also see and ME being subject to extraordinary pressure, emotionality and even hostility from the family of people they have examined.

I can imagine that ME eventually stating, "Listen, I actually think the signs pointed more towards suicide but I did not report that in order to spare you. However, if you keep insisting that I change my report, that's what I will likely be changing it to because that's really what the signs point to. It was on the cusp for me, though, so I chose natural causes. I just don't see homicide, however."

An excitable and grieving family member could easily take that as a vicious threat, though.

Now, I;m not saying such a scenario would engender any confidence in me for such an ME, but I can see that as a stronger possibility than an ME threatening to fabricate a report in order to punish a relative. Seems farfetched to me.

But I do take your point about this ME seriously and understand why you would not have as much faith in him as in the second coroner.

I never understood why you would rule a 20 yr old without a history of health problems a natural causes to begin with. I agree with the last report. Undetermined. Until they can decide how those drugs got into her system you cant determine murder or suicide.I do think that part got all screwed up. That is why I do think a new investigation into this case needs to be done. I sure wish she had not been cremated.

I have seen it in several cases when they just aren't sure. There have been a few murder cases that started out as natural causes until the body was exhumed or a new coroner took a look, or whatever.

I think they sometimes don;t want to be seen as not having an answer. Especially the old school guys.

What motive does the mom have in lying? None! She is writing her blog and going off of notes which in any court of law her notes would hold up as evidence.

I don't think she's lying and I don't think anyone is accusing her of that. Perception cn be clouded, however, by circumstance.

BBM

If it was a neighbor, wouldn't they have come forward by now?

Not if they don't realize it's them on tape. That image is unrecognizable. if it;s a neighbor, they could be unaware the image is themself and could think it is an unknown stalker. They could be fuzzy on when they left.

Why would the neighbor be carrying something under his arm and a pack under the shirt.

How you can tell that someone is carrying something under their arms and a pack under their shirt from that image is truly beyond me. And I have great eyes.

If it was a neighbor....

What if someone else ID's them? They will definitely be a suspect if they are not honest w/investigators. Not alerting authorities would be a big mistake, imo.

I don't see how anyone could be ID'd from that image. Really. It displays zero discernible features, no definitive clothing detail, nothing.

 

[sascha]

Hi , i'm a new member but a long time reader. English isn't my first language so please forgive . I am wondering if anyone has tried to find out more about the neighbor ? I may have found someone that would match .What bothers me is after i google the name and town ,a video pops up taken on Morgans street. may be a coincidence ,but i thought worth sharing

 

[twinkiesmom]

I have "numerous" pill bottles at my house, from my recent surgery and also from ongoing medical treatment. I also had (but have recently disposed of) many dozens of pill bottles from my Dad's final illness.

In Morgan's home, I'm sure there were several pill bottles. However, one was amitriptyline, and the dosage was not disclosed. The pill bottle was rx'd +/- 2 years ago, and apparently Morgan had not used all of the meds.

There was NO flexeril in the house whatsoever.

Yet, between the amitriptyline (present in the house) and the flexeril (not found in the house), what was in her stomach contents was...flexeril.

Changing thoughts...

I am not patient either, though I have resigned myself to being patient with this case. Which is tough, of course, for those of us who are impatient. LOL.

I wish she'd put up the first autopsy report...just so we have something to compare it with. I'm wondering if it has been released yet...???

Best-
Herding Cats

The other thing we don't know is when the fatal dose was administered. Because amytriptyline hangs around in the body, and they detected significant levels of the active metabolite nortriptyline, we can't assume the drug was administered in the home that night. It could have been earlier...If it was administered orally, it not only had to pass through the stomach and small intestine but also be broken down in the liver.

And for those thinking she was frightened to death, the drug could have caused her heart to go into a fatal arrhythmia.

 

[itsreenw]

Since it's likely that Morgan was being stalked before the initial window incident, and it would not be unlikely for a stalker to mess with a family/victim's pet, what do you think the odds are that he(she?) had something to do with the death of the pet? Very peculiar to me, would love to have more info on how the poor baby passed

BBM, didn't her ferret (or another small pet) die too? I recall a post where Mr. I asked M what time she was coming home so they could bury it.

 

[koalabear]

Can someone point me in the right direction to find a last name for E? I'm at a loss.

 

[concernedmother]

frustrated. I wanted to get a street view of the neighborhood but I cant find a map to give me one.

 

[alwaysonmymind]

Hi , i'm a new member but a long time reader. English isn't my first language so please forgive . I am wondering if anyone has tried to find out more about the neighbor ? I may have found someone that would match .What bothers me is after i google the name and town ,a video pops up taken on Morgans street. may be a coincidence ,but i thought worth sharing

Welcome! Is it a video of someone climbing a tree?

 

[aussie_girl88]

Have been doing some reading on carbon monoxide poisoning.

First of all I'm interested in the details.

Her Age hen this happened....did the rest of the family get it?

How long was she potentially exposed to the carbon monoxide?

What were her symptoms?

Was reading and carbon monoxide can cause heart damage and potentially lead to a shorter life span.

So very interested in having these questions answered.

 

[sascha]

no no video of any climbing Just a short video showing the road

 

[MayraMM]

Have been doing some reading on carbon monoxide poisoning.

First of all I'm interested in the details.

Her Age hen this happened....did the rest of the family get it?

How long was she potentially exposed to the carbon monoxide?

What were her symptoms?

Was reading and carbon monoxide can cause heart damage and potentially lead to a shorter life span.

So very interested in having these questions answered.

She was 12 and the pathologist described it as chronic exposure. She did receive hyperbaric treatment, which means it was severe. He also said she suffered headaches and cognitive impairment and the treatment helped alleviate some of the symptoms (which means not all of them).

I have yet to find out if anyone else was poisoned by the CO, and that really bothers me. How could she have been the only one poisoned when it was a faulty flue?