Couple who adopted 12 children shot to death #2

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suepersleuth said:
Probably not, if there are stolen car connections. This email also is linked to a website titled duomeili.com which is oriental and seems to sell everything under the sun; including car equipment, parts, etc....

Could very well be items bought at import prices....but hmmm....
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I don't know a lot about car audio systems but I seem to remember rockford fosgate speakers having pretty good bass. It just made me think of the guys at Fifth Dimension with the crazy systems in the trunks. Not speakers that you'd just put in a car to sell in a used car lot.
 
here is a bit more information about all the liens and weird documents.


The filing of frivolous lawsuits and liens against public officials, law enforcement officers and private citizens, on the other hand, has remained a favorite harassing strategy. These paper "attacks" intimidate their targets and have the beneficial side effect of clogging up a court system that sovereign citizens believe is illegitimate. Frivolous liens became such a problem in the 1990s that a majority of states were forced to pass new laws to make filing them illegal, their removal easier, or both. Today, eager sovereign citizens can use the Internet to download a variety of boilerplate forms and documents to wield against the government. More adventurous types can matriculate at "schools" such as the Erwin Rommel School of Law; additionally, a number of activists, ranging from David Wynn Miller to The Aware Group, hold seminars around the country to teach people -- for a price -- about the latest tactics and weapons.
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source:http://www.adl.org/Learn/ext_us/SCM.asp?xpicked=4&item=20

still reading ...
 
Either I am totally losing it or I may have just connected some dots, at least with the Billings.....Need to do more research...:waitasec:
 
elainebenice said:
After reading more about this trademark/copyright docuement, I think it is a pretty good chance that the Billings had some "non-mainstream" views on government. The language of the document was briefly discussed earlier, but I haven't really read anything about the beliefs that led to the document being drafted and how/if these beliefs manifested themselves in other aspects of the victims' lives. Please don't get me wrong, I am not implying or think that whatever beliefs the Billings had about government, religion, life or anything else caused their deaths.....I just can't quit going back to how out of the ordinary it is to come across someone who actually legally executed and filed something like this, not to mention the odds of that person being brutally murdered in such a unique act of violence.

I will try and find some more concise links, but here is one I have found so far. Sort of scary if you ask me.... http://www.freedomfraternity.com/
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Wow, elaine, I went to that link and read about 1/4 of the page. That is some convoluted thinking, although I do understand what they are saying.

I agree that it is extraordinary that someone would actually execute these documents, thereby implying that they subscribe to this way of thinking.

I want to continue reading the rest of the page that you linked (it will have to wait till morning), but my impression, thus far, is that it is scary and spooky that there are laws on the books that permit this type of thinking--and that people can legally prevail by implementing and/or utilizing these "rights."

Rhetorically speaking, does this in some way relate to the murders of these two people? It will be interesting to see what the Feds decide upon conclusion of their investigation.

Thanks for sharing your thoughts.
 
suepersleuth said:
Okay...A check of these links I found from the Better Business Bureau in regards to two of the Billings companies:
http://www.bbb.org/northwestern-flo...o-financial-services-in-pensacola-fl-90002967

and

http://www.bbb.org/northwestern-flo...s/markham-auto-sales-in-pensacola-fl-16002418

reveals some crazy info that I have just begun to uncover. The following email address is listed for Melanie: ash888@aol.com; but now think it belongs to daughter Ashley.

When googled I come up with this:
http://melaniebillings.blogspot.com/2008/04/we-are-going-home-nikki-has-finally.html

The title of this blog is troublesome to say the least...
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Bolded by me...

I can see why you would take it the wrong way, but my impression of the title of that blog was that Nikki was very sick and Melanie thought that she was going to die, but Nikki pulled through, so she was not going to die and thus, was not going to become an angel.

Nothing troublesome there at all.
 
I have been sleuthing vicariously through all of you since I discovered WS regarding the Coleman murders, then the McNair/Sahel murder/suicide, and currently the Billings (obviously). I had time to "cool off" before my account was activated and never submitted the post below. I just chalked my suspicions up to the late hour, but I have to admit when I have looked at the MS and/or FB accounts of some of the last arrested, I keep expecting to see Sahel's ex, Keith Norfleet, an aspiring rap singer, as a "friend" because the language, tastes, etc. are so similar. Also, comments on guns and cars remind me of the McNair/Sahel case. Some believe that the reason so much time elapsed between the discovery of their bodies by a roomate and his 911 call was that a substantial number of guns stored there were being removed.

In the wee hours of 7/13 my pondering was "like a fire shut up in my bones", so I wanted to register to ask aloud: FL LE is alluding to a story that is multi-state and like something from a movie script: could the perps and/or the Billings' auto biz be connected to McNair/Sahel. Kazemi "Jenny" Sahel, McNair's mistress, and her on again, off again ex-bf, Keith Norfleet, moved from FL to TN. She was making payments on a vehicle other than the one she co-purchased with McNair and was stressed out because a deal to sell it didn't pan out and she didn't know how she could pay on both. Around the same time she told her brother she didn't like being alone and they discussed the purchase of a gun. Finally, Wayne Coldiron lived in TN at one time. Absolutely bizarre deduction I know, but FL LE seems to think whatever has occurred in the Billings case is way out there, plus I have to confess, the final outcome of the McNair/Sahel investigation--murder/suicide rather than double homicide--still doesn't add up for me. I defer to the experience and wisdom of the forum membership.

"I like living. I have sometimes been wildly, despairingly, acutely miserable, racked with sorrow, but through it all I still know quite certainly that just to be alive is a grand thing."--Agatha Christie
 
grace60 said:
Interesting article about Leonard Patrick Gonzales Jr here today. http://tinyurl.com/n2yutk
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In that article, Rebecca Herkel said she has not been contacted by law enforcement about these killings and she says she has no reason to believe that there's a connection between L Patrick Jr.'s stalking them and the Billings murders.

Why wouldn't LE talk to her?? That just seems so odd. :waitasec: She's a big player in L Patrick Jr.'s rantings on MySpace. Wouldn't you think that she would be one of the first people contacted???

Then again, Rebecca also said that they contacted the Sarasota LE about the cyberstalking and was told there was nothing it. But Sarasota LE has no record of meeting with the Herkel's about Gonzalez. So who's telling the truth? (FWIW, so there's no record of meeting with them about Gonzalez, which may mean they have met/encountered the Herkel's on other matters. Hmm... just saying.)

Well, think about it. If you had an ex-son-in-law who was THAT crazy, wouldn't you be in contact with LE... like ALL the time?? Something hinky about those Herkel's.

Even if the murders are not connected to Bella, I just find it suspicious that no LE has talked to Rebecca Herkel about the Billings murders!! :waitasec:
 
lisa0477 said:
well, I got a phone call tonight and was told that a friend of mine's husband has been arrested for this murder. I am shocked right now, beyond words. I have not read what all has been posted, but I knew you guys would be discussing this. The one I know that was arrested is D. Stallworth.
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Gosh, Lisa....I am sorry to hear that this horrible crime has touched your life too.
 
LaceSprocket said:
In that article, Rebecca Herkel said she has not been contacted by law enforcement about these killings and she says she has no reason to believe that there's a connection between L Patrick Jr.'s stalking them and the Billings murders.

Why wouldn't LE talk to her?? That just seems so odd. :waitasec: She's a big player in L Patrick Jr.'s rantings on MySpace. Wouldn't you think that she would be one of the first people contacted???

Then again, Rebecca also said that they contacted the Sarasota LE and was told there was nothing they could do about L Patrick's cyberstalking. But Sarasota LE has no record of meeting with the Herkel's about Gonzalez. So who's telling the truth? (FWIW, so there's no record of meeting with them about Gonzalez, which may mean they have met/encountered the Herkel's on other matters. Hmm... just saying.)

Well, think about it. If you had an ex-son-in-law who was THAT crazy, wouldn't you be in contact with LE? Like ALL the time?? Something hinky about those Herkel's.

Even if the murders are not connected to Bella, I just find it suspicious that no LE has talked to Rebecca Herkel about the Billings murders!! :waitasec:
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I don't doubt their story. I have known a couple of people over the years who were theatened by someone else, and when reporting it to police were told there was nothing they could do about it. That was before the current stalking laws. One was even told she could have him committed for a mental evaluation but they would probably only keep him a couple of days and let him go because he appeared normal most of the time. Sometimes it means your hands are tied unless they do something violent. It is scary and shouldn't be that way, but sometimes it is.
 
gazelletime said:
I guess my fear just comes from the fact that this would be considered "slanderous" by some, although I fully intend it to be viewed as a window into a possible deeper, darker past......

With no disrespect to the late Billings family, of course!
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IF you know for a fact what his prior " business" was, then telling the TRUTH is not slanderous. How can we find out more about the crime if you are withholding information? Whatever he " did ", he was not in prison for it, so how bad could it be??

I think you should either tell what you know, or remain silent altogether if you can simply " hint" at some kind of impropriety.
 
Booking photos provided by the Escambia County Sheriff Department, Pensacola, Fla., Tuesday, July 14, …

1 hr 53 mins ago

ENSACOLA, Fla. – An ex-convict who taught self-defense to children. A day laborer who served prison time for killing a man in a fight. An Air Force staff sergeant attached to an elite special operations unit.
Somehow, authorities say, they ended up part of a loosely connected group of seven men charged in the shooting deaths of Byrd and Melanie Billings, a wealthy Florida Panhandle couple known for adopting children with special needs.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090714/...hhcmdlZHdpdGg-


This shows some of the video footage of the monsters going up to the house.

http://cosmos.bcst.yahoo.com/up/play...26713&src=news
 
lisa0477 said:
He did like to Rap, did like to rebuild cars, their daughter babysat for me. I did not know him before he married my friend, and you never know anyone that well I guess. I wonder when they will release who did the shooting.
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Maybe if he got mixed up with the wrong crowd - he'll cooperate with the authorities and help with the investigation.

My heart goes out to his wife and children.
 
LiveLaughLuv said:
Booking photos provided by the Escambia County Sheriff Department, Pensacola, Fla., Tuesday, July 14, …

1 hr 53 mins ago

ENSACOLA, Fla. – An ex-convict who taught self-defense to children. A day laborer who served prison time for killing a man in a fight. An Air Force staff sergeant attached to an elite special operations unit.
Somehow, authorities say, they ended up part of a loosely connected group of seven men charged in the shooting deaths of Byrd and Melanie Billings, a wealthy Florida Panhandle couple known for adopting children with special needs.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090714/...hhcmdlZHdpdGg-


This shows some of the video footage of the monsters going up to the house.

http://cosmos.bcst.yahoo.com/up/play...26713&src=news
Click to expand...

The links don't work for me. Articles not found. :waitasec:
 
LaceSprocket said:
In that article, Rebecca Herkel said she has not been contacted by law enforcement about these killings and she says she has no reason to believe that there's a connection between L Patrick Jr.'s stalking them and the Billings murders.

Why wouldn't LE talk to her?? That just seems so odd. :waitasec: She's a big player in L Patrick Jr.'s rantings on MySpace. Wouldn't you think that she would be one of the first people contacted???

Then again, Rebecca also said that they contacted the Sarasota LE about the cyberstalking and was told there was nothing it. But Sarasota LE has no record of meeting with the Herkel's about Gonzalez. So who's telling the truth? (FWIW, so there's no record of meeting with them about Gonzalez, which may mean they have met/encountered the Herkel's on other matters. Hmm... just saying.)

Well, think about it. If you had an ex-son-in-law who was THAT crazy, wouldn't you be in contact with LE... like ALL the time?? Something hinky about those Herkel's.

Even if the murders are not connected to Bella, I just find it suspicious that no LE has talked to Rebecca Herkel about the Billings murders!! :waitasec:
Click to expand...


I was stalked and got very little help from LE. It was random and I took matters into my own hands. That should not be read as a vigilante approach... but I traced the clues... found the person... and got his family involved in stopping him.

Yesterday they spent so much time rounding up the perps... they may be getting to Rebecca Herkel in the next round or so. I would assume much energy thus far has been spent tracking down clues to find the suspects and ascertain how many were involved.
 
sharlie said:
My point of posting what I did was just to make point. That while a person may seem to be a great all around guy IF he is capable of commiting a horrendous crime of murder, MAYBE he wasn't who you thought he was.And that in itself should be something we keep in mind when dealing with new people in our lives. A Sociapath can fool even the smartest of psychiatrists so they are not easy to spot, sadly for some until it is too late.
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I watched Jr during his bail hearing. Every other one of the accused was quiet, or hung head, etc. Junior, OTOH, was vocal, vocifierous, claimed "they" were all out to get him, and even when he was being totally quiet, he moved his head from side to side slightly, indicating a lack of acceptance of his circumstances.

Picture yourself in his shoes, either wrongly accused or rightly accused -- most people would be shaking in their boots, totally different demeanor... he thinks if he denies something long enough and strongly enough, it just goes away.... well, not this one.
 
Oh, as to the "5th Dimension" car detailing biz --

Yup, looks to be an 'off the books' operation -- so obviously not gathering/submitting taxes? Naughty naughty. In addition, one of the articles had photos of the door being locked, and the text of the article stated the business was being evicted from the building. Maybe I'll look up the RE records and see who actually owns the location.
 
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