Details Emerge: Casey/Cindy Fight - Part 2

[reeseeva]

Clearly, Casey thought she was smarter than her parents.

I think it's obvious Cindy snooped because she did not believe her little "sweetheart". She also called up Ryan P. way before Caylee went missing regarding Casey's employment (Sport's Authority, Universal) to try and figure out the truth. Ryan flat out told her Casey never worked with him at Sport's Authority. Ryan said she told him Casey was a sociopath. Some of the worst statements about Casey have allegedly come from the mouths of Cindy and George.

Now that Casey is facing some consequences for her actions from the State of Florida, all of a sudden she is/was the "Mother of the Year" and someone for whom George would be "proud". :clap::clap:

Bold mine.

Talk about words that will come back to haunt them.:hand:
Or maybe it will never come out at trial?? Would this be hearsay?

 

[ZubenElSchemali]

IMHO, the exact route she took isn't all that important other than suggesting that she had a change of plans along the way (as speculation posted earlier).

At the risk of boring the bageezus outta everybody...sometimes when I'm drivin' late @ night and I have a few options to make that left turn...I'll just keep driving 'till I get a green-light/or flashing light so I don't hafta stop my lazy arse...it was 5AM...

Be interested if you come up w/ something.

Good morning Bond. I've been thinking about this because I think it is important. Casey has to wind down at some point even though she can drive with only 4 hours of sleep on most nights. She wouldn't take the long way home without a reason after being up this many hours, IMO. Assuming she is half way between Colonial and Lake Underhill on Semoran at 4:30 am, I think she may have been headed to Conway and went to Sawgrass. If she went straight home, after leaving Sawgrass she would have taken Gatlin, Dixie Belle, Pershing, Goldenrod, Quail Pond, jogging around, hitting Anthony Lane (probably one of her favorites) along the way, to get home. but she wouldn't have hit that tower at 5:04am. So far she is only about 11 minutes from the last ping.

There is a McDonalds on the corner of Conway and Hoffner, hours 5am-2am. If she went there after, she would likely take Hoffner home and would ping this tower at 5:04. There is a 24/7 McDonald's at 1505 S Semoran too but if she was headed to Sawgrass she might wait till after to pick up food. She potentially has until 5:19 to get past Hoffner and Semoran where the next tower will pick up her phone. This is 49 minutes total. This is much to much time to simply stop by McDonalds. It would take maybe 6 minutes to make the short trip from Sawgrass to Mcdonalds because she'd have to head north, then Uturn. It takes 16 minutes to drive from McD to home, taking Gatlin, jogging back, hitting Anthony lane (likely her favorite road) on the way.

I'm speculating that she went to Sawgrass, then McD's at Hoffner where the cell pinged at the Semoran-Beechline tower at 5:04 while waiting for her biscuits, fresh out of the oven. 35 minutes- 11 for the drive to Sawgrass leaves 24 minutes to kill, too much to simply be thinking of going to Rico's then changing her mind, wasting gas. I think she brought breakfast home for the family after doing something at Sawgrass. If she was setting at the drive thru at 5:04 she still had more than enough time to get home or near for the next ping. She would likely take the route mentioned above and the trip takes 16 minutes, the next ping being at 5:19, 15 minutes later. Ok, I have to give her credit for speeding enough over Google Earth's timing to shorten the trip by one minute, not unreasonable.

Again, she had communications with her mother or father earlier and I think there is a good chance she is bringing them breakfast which doesn't fit with a fight on the 7th, probably even the 8th. Both parents were off from work and if she wanted to dump her daughter on them she could have just stayed away. Maybe right after Casey uploaded the flag party pics is a more likely time.

This is off topic of the fight but someone mentioned the lower left hand side of town and this brought some thoughts. Keeping in mind that Casey mentions the lower left hand side of town, the map of Orlando city limits showing George's work, Andrews International, is at the most lower left portion of Orlando. Most people look at a map with North at the top so the SW would be the lower left. The Anthony's live right or East of the lower right of the city limits. It would take 20 minutes if she were headed to Andrews International or somewhere near there. This is the lower left of town. I see Jesse Grund's parents not far to the West (also could be considered the lower left hand side of town). She would go by Universal Studios is slightly West, Sea World slightly South. There is even a Kinder Care. But it takes another 18 minutes to get back near the ping 6 tower and another 15 minutes to get from there to home. So she didn't go that far that morning, but this is the lower left side of town and could be important since she emphasizes this part of town. The airport is the extreme lower right side of town.

Now, if she was picturing from the center of town back toward her house, looking South she might still say lower (South) left but mean SE part of town which would fit Conway and Sawgrass. Facing South the Eastern side would be on the left side of town. This thought occurred to me because I know a couple of people very well that have the same strong Pisces energy she does and they often describe things backwards according to right and left or direction. One has his Mercury (brain function) at the same exact degree as Casey and he often seems to be lying where some simple, clear questions reveal he is simply seeing things backwards. Sometimes he answers the question he thought I was going to ask rather than the actual question too. Yes, I'm sure there is some undiagnosed learning uniqueness that is called a disability. He never gets lost though. He knows the streets, even without knowing their names, like the back of his hand. He simply feels his way through.

My final point that ties in here is that Conway is the plaza she got busted for going through without paying a toll on June 8 at 7:02pm. She was headed East bound and got off at Conway. This is the Sawgrass road and only goes South, toward Sawgrass, from the toll road. She was texting at the same moment she ran this toll. It's apparently hard for her to do three things at once well. IF she was again headed to Sawgrass, about the time she would have gotten there she stops her texts to Tony and Amy to direct her attention to Rico. This again brings to mind the fact that he has a Zan, Jennifer, Jen, etc in his cell memory. No, I'm not trying to put anyone under the bus, just get to the facts. Something interests her on Conway and she isn't texting or calling her Sawgrass friends or fighting with her mom at this point.

Yes, I do believe they had words somewhere along the line. Jean (I thought it was a female because of the spelling) was sure it was an afternoon and on the weekend but said yes to May, wouldn't commit to June. But if all the focus is on when this fight was, assuming the only possibility is that this triggered a fit of rage that led to Caylee's death, at the expense of everything else then something more important may be overlooked. As long as people imagine what might have gone on and only focus there as if the jury is back that Casey committed 1st degree murder, justice can't be served. Conway wouldn't be the most likely way home coming from Rico's or anywhere in that direction, would it? If not, there is something on Conway that has her attention before June 16.

 

[beach]

Talk about words that will come back to haunt them.:hand:
Or maybe it will never come out at trial?? Would this be hearsay?

Not hearsay, if Ryan testifies to it himself. He heard it directly.

 

[Muzikman]

That "lower left side of town" statement KC to LA has been driving me really crazy!! Thank goodness someone brought it up. Who was it? Bond?

I don't think it's this, but if you fact the A house, Caylee's remains were on the lower left corner of their block.

Anyway, ideas? IIRC, Lee seemed to know exactly what she meant.

To me, living here, that has always meant the Universal area. If you look at a map of Orlando (city limits) Universal is in the lower left part of town.

The Grunds live out that way too, but they're north of Universal a few miles.

 

[BondJamesBond]

Good morning Bond. I've been thinking about this because I think it is important.

*snipped*

Clearly you HAVE been doin' some thinking AE.

This seems like a good one to take over to the ping thread in the Case Analysis Forum for the date. Be happy to comment on it over there if you're interested.

...guess I have no one to blame but myself for the "Lower Left Side..." creeping into this thread. My apologies all... :blushing:

 

[debs]

*brilliantly written and so respecfully snipped*

Conway wouldn't be the most likely way home coming from Rico's or anywhere in that direction, would it? If not, there is something on Conway that has her attention before June 16.

Casey has an obsessive personality. By that, I mean she takes the bull by the horns on any new thing she's endeavored to concentrate on. She's not quite done with Ric, she's not quite committed to TonE, depending on how his interest plays out. My guess is she's had nothing but time to watch the comings and goings of people she wonders about and I would not hesitate to think that her odd driving patterns weren't simply random, but specific. Just as you've stated here, something on Conway has her attention. I'll go further and say someONE on Conway has her attention.

Remember Glenn Close in Fatal Attraction? She'd show up in places and surprise her prey. She attempted to ingratiate herself into his family life. She took up his interests. Head games, great sex, psycho behavior. I will bet all my favorite coffee shop's beans that she was stalking either another guy, or some girl who was in Ric's or TonE's life. The obsessive behavior eats at a person until the compulsion to ACT on it is stronger than the strength to control it. She has nothing but time. All she does is think about how she's going to manipulate things in her life in order to get exactly what it is she wants. Driving a few miles out of her way to scope out the competition or the next dupe isn't anything to her. It's everything.

I wonder who it was, not what it was.

 

[ZubenElSchemali]

Casey has an obsessive personality. By that, I mean she takes the bull by the horns on any new thing she's endeavored to concentrate on. She's not quite done with Ric, she's not quite committed to TonE, depending on how his interest plays out. My guess is she's had nothing but time to watch the comings and goings of people she wonders about and I would not hesitate to think that her odd driving patterns weren't simply random, but specific. Just as you've stated here, something on Conway has her attention. I'll go further and say someONE on Conway has her attention.

Remember Glenn Close in Fatal Attraction? She'd show up in places and surprise her prey. She attempted to ingratiate herself into his family life. She took up his interests. Head games, great sex, psycho behavior. I will bet all my favorite coffee shop's beans that she was stalking either another guy, or some girl who was in Ric's or TonE's life. The obsessive behavior eats at a person until the compulsion to ACT on it is stronger than the strength to control it. She has nothing but time. All she does is think about how she's going to manipulate things in her life in order to get exactly what it is she wants. Driving a few miles out of her way to scope out the competition or the next dupe isn't anything to her. It's everything.

I wonder who it was, not what it was.

Her attention by this time is cleary toward Tony and fading from Rico, although she didn't want to cut him off cold turkey. She obviously cared something about him, as shown by her texts and comments to Amy. She was weaning him off her. So I highly doubt that he had a love interest anywhere but in Casey. Tony said in one of his statements he had never heard of Sawgrass and knew no one over there.

 

[debs]

Her attention by this time is cleary toward Tony and fading from Rico, although she didn't want to cut him off cold turkey. She obviously cared something about him, as shown by her texts and comments to Amy. She was weaning him off her. So I highly doubt that he had a love interest anywhere but in Casey. Tony said in one of his statements he had never heard of Sawgrass and knew no one over there.

Casey had TonE's interest, had Rico as a string-man, had the cop online just in case, and had the Marine believing they were going to really have something, as well as Jesse who she treated as a puppy dog. Casey wasn't committed to anyone, and her attention in Tony was still in the nascent stage. There are enough men in her life for her to take any one of them and decide at any time that she is going to check out what he does when he's not with her. Or who. She may be tying her life up in Tony's likes and dislikes, his job, his friends, whathaveyou, but what she is ALSO doing is stringing all these other men along.

Until Casey is ready to let someone go, they're still hers. When she's done, she's done. Her relationship with JPC? That's the one I'm interested in. He doesn't like her, wants nothing to do with her, wants her nowhere near his stuff. He was done. Was she?

 

[Muzikman]

Debs, I think you've got a great angle here that bears looking at!

I have known women like you describe, and I think you're spot on with her being like this too.

 

[Pink Panther]

Casey had TonE's interest, had Rico as a string-man, had the cop online just in case, and had the Marine believing they were going to really have something, as well as Jesse who she treated as a puppy dog. Casey wasn't committed to anyone, and her attention in Tony was still in the nascent stage. There are enough men in her life for her to take any one of them and decide at any time that she is going to check out what he does when he's not with her. Or who. She may be tying her life up in Tony's likes and dislikes, his job, his friends, whathaveyou, but what she is ALSO doing is stringing all these other men along.

Until Casey is ready to let someone go, they're still hers. When she's done, she's done. Her relationship with JPC? That's the one I'm interested in. He doesn't like her, wants nothing to do with her, wants her nowhere near his stuff. He was done. Was she?

I completely agree with you Debs and I am so curious about JPC! I wonder why we have heard nothing (NOTHING) about him at all!

MOO

 

[faefrost]

Talk about words that will come back to haunt them.:hand:
Or maybe it will never come out at trial?? Would this be hearsay?

It would be heasay if used directly against KC at trial. So they cannot use this testimony as evidence that she is a sociopath. So the SA cannot call Ryan as a direct witness against KC, and use this testimony that way...

HOWEVER

It will all depend on what Cindy says on the stand. While this is hearsay for direct use against KC, it is a direct first person conversation when used to impeach Cindy's testimony. So if Cindy goes on the stand and does the mother of the year routine that she has been doing in public, Ryan may be called to the stand and may fully relate his conversation with Cindy in order to prove what her actual thoughts and suspicions of her daughter really was well before Caylee went missing. And that gets mom calling KC a sociopath into the juries ears.

 

[eddeva]

Her relationship with JPC? That's the one I'm interested in. He doesn't like her, wants nothing to do with her, wants her nowhere near his stuff. He was done. Was she?

*resp. snipped.
you're humming my favourite tune now debs.

 

[MAMABEAR]

Boy, I sure missed something. KC stopped at McDonalds and bought the family breakfast?

I feel like I have stepped in quicksand. There is a rumor of a d-dump and I'm not sure I can hang on long nuff for it. I would guess that the McD breakfast was a peace offering for being away from home for so long? Had CA called her and told her to stop by McD? Maybe she was gonna stop at LA's apt and eat breakfast with him? I thought the family fast food was pizza. Maybe she gobbled it down on her way home. Did they find anythang from McD in the trash in the trunk? So many details---so few brain cells here.

 

[MAMABEAR]

*resp. snipped.
you're humming my favourite tune now debs.

Has he had an interview? JPC

 

[countzero]

Casey had TonE's interest, had Rico as a string-man, had the cop online just in case, and had the Marine believing they were going to really have something, as well as Jesse who she treated as a puppy dog. Casey wasn't committed to anyone, and her attention in Tony was still in the nascent stage. There are enough men in her life for her to take any one of them and decide at any time that she is going to check out what he does when he's not with her. Or who. She may be tying her life up in Tony's likes and dislikes, his job, his friends, whathaveyou, but what she is ALSO doing is stringing all these other men along.

Until Casey is ready to let someone go, they're still hers. When she's done, she's done. Her relationship with JPC? That's the one I'm interested in. He doesn't like her, wants nothing to do with her, wants her nowhere near his stuff. He was done. Was she?

Nope. Agree, add this to your theory. KC wants a man who will mimic her dad. One that doesn't question her; obeys her every word. She wants to be the one to end any relationship that she feels is getting close to unearthing the "real KC". She has been groomed by CA as the only way she knows a "real family interaction" is.

She may state she hates her mother, but she loves and wants the power her mother has. Over GA, LA, Caylee and anyone who comes into contact with CA. She has had years to observe, learn and practice. Witnessing the fights between CA/GA, participating in those fights and ignoring the fights that won't gain her needs at the moment.

As for CA saying to JM there wasn't a fight. Hummm, matter of degree in her mind. When there is a disagreement between parties, it can be low toned or escalate into a screaming match and physical altercations. Just because the "fight" between CA/KC wasn't observed by others to be physical, doesn't mean it wasn't.

 

[eddeva]

Has he had an interview? JPC

not a peep from this peep mamabear

 

[MAMABEAR]

not a peep from this peep mamabear

Do we even know if he had an interview? If not---why. Did he have one and it is being held back? Hmmmmmmm

 

[eddeva]

Do we even know if he had an interview? If not---why. Did he have one and it is being held back? Hmmmmmmm

i can't imagine why they would have chosen not to interview him: he lived w/ her ex-boyfriend (slept in the same apartment where caylee slept), admits to hating casey and looks exactly like caylee. i'd wanna talk to him, wouldn't you?

 

[Phumi]

Boy, I sure missed something. KC stopped at McDonalds and bought the family breakfast?

I feel like I have stepped in quicksand. There is a rumor of a d-dump and I'm not sure I can hang on long nuff for it. I would guess that the McD breakfast was a peace offering for being away from home for so long? Had CA called her and told her to stop by McD? Maybe she was gonna stop at LA's apt and eat breakfast with him? I thought the family fast food was pizza. Maybe she gobbled it down on her way home. Did they find anythang from McD in the trash in the trunk? So many details---so few brain cells here.

If Casey had EVER brought breakfast home for the family, George and Cindy would have been screaming it out at their depositions as evidence of her contribution to the household.

 

[warbuckle]

Wait... wait... wait... Hold up a minute here.
Seriously, you've got to ask yourself why the Sam Hill didn't LE hook that car up on the night of the 15th and seize it then? They left it in the A's custody for 24+ hrs? This is what annoys me more so than what GA did/didn't do!!

I agree. I keep thinking that maybe Caylee was still in the car. Does anyone know if the outside bag was the laudrey bag or was it a trash bag. The reason I am asking it because I could see this happening.

Dad and tow guy open the truck expecting to see a dead body but see the real trash bag. They assume that was the source of the smell and through it over the fence, however, caylee was actually triple bagged in the laudrey bag. GA drove home and then had up to 24 hours to do something with the body. So he doesn't know what to do so he places the bag inthe backyard by the play house. After GA cleans the trunk he later disposes of the body.