DNA revisited in light of James Kolar’s book

[wonderllama]

Soon enough Mr. Beckner is going to explain why they are not looking at a Ramsey as the killer. Mr. Kolar wrote a really good book. But the DNA is something he doesn't understand or chose to ignore to make a buck. And I look forward to the day when they explain it to you.

Big claim there Roy.
Is this another "trust me" post?
And how come we keep hearing from other people actually involved in the case who seem to be dismissing the Intruder Theory when they are all supposedly looking at the same evidence?

 

[Roy23]

Big claim there Roy.
Is this another "trust me" post?
And how come we keep hearing from other people actually involved in the case who seem to be dismissing the Intruder Theory when they are all supposedly looking at the same evidence?

Yeah, I reckon it is just another trust me post. If Law Enforcement wanted to turn this case back on the Ramsey's they could. That is one thing we all agree on. why haven't they? Kolar is making a buck based basically against Lou Smit's theory. Feel free to assume i am wrong. When we hear something from the people who matter let's see what they say.

 

[BOESP]

Yeah, I reckon it is just another trust me post. If Law Enforcement wanted to turn this case back on the Ramsey's they could. That is one thing we all agree on. why haven't they? Kolar is making a buck based basically against Lou Smit's theory. Feel free to assume i am wrong. When we hear something from the people who matter let's see what they say.

Just to keep things in balance, have you ever considered how many bucks the Ramseys made off their two books?

Have you ever considered that it is the judicial and executive end of things who put most of the cogs in the wheel, not law enforcement?

For those who may not know, John Ramsey made the statement he hired lawyers to keep himself out of jail. That was his right and I'd uphold anyone to using their rights but where are all those people he hired to find that Intruder?

It is a real shame this country no longer seeks justice in cases like this but instead depends on criminal defense lawyers to get their client off the hook or, at worst, get the least sentence possible.

 

[cynic]

Yeah, I reckon it is just another trust me post.

So do I, because it is un-sourced.
(BTW, I am still waiting for a source for your smear against Kolar regarding DNA.)

If Law Enforcement wanted to turn this case back on the Ramsey's they could. That is one thing we all agree on. why haven't they?

Steve Thomas explained rather well why it wasn’t prosecuted in the early going, fear and “politics,” just to name two.
The Ramseys are no longer cleared, but no one is going to be prosecuted.
With respect to Kolar's impact, I think he sums it up nicely here:
"I have undertaken this work not because I believe a prosecution of any perpetrator of this crime will likely result from it, but because I believe it will move public perceptions of this case closer to the truth."
Foreign Faction, Who Really Kidnapped JonBenet, James Kolar, page xii

Kolar is making a buck based basically against Lou Smit's theory. Feel free to assume i am wrong.

This is yet another completely un-sourced, baseless smear against Jim Kolar.
Here is the truth:

Carol McKinley has told us:
“Jim Kolar says it’s taken him months of introspection and much of his retirement savings to launch his self-published book.”

Tricia Griffith has told us:
“This man took his retirement money out and published the book at great personal risk.”
“Kolar used his own money to publish this book, to hire lawyers, to do everything. He will not make his money back.
Plus there is the very real possibility he will be sued which will cost him a lot. Although you can't win a lawsuit when someone is telling the truth it doesn't mean it won't stop a lawsuit. Just can't win it.”

How exactly is he going to “make a buck” as you allege?
If he manages to recoup the money he has spent on the project, further proceeds, if there are any, will go to the National Center for Missing and Exploited Children.
http://www.ncmec.org/missingkids/servlet/PublicHomeServlet?LanguageCountry=en_US&

When we hear something from the people who matter let's see what they say.

Are you saying that people such as Jim Kolar don’t matter?
This is the type of statement that you have made on a number of occasions.
I have always looked at the evidence and drawn my own conclusions and it’s not clear to me why you are waiting for someone specifically to come out and provide you with what you are to believe.
In terms of a “person that mattered,” who would that have been in 2005 as an example?
I guess that would be someone who was exclusively in charge of the JonBenet Ramsey case and had access to the 60,000 page case file.
Would you have listened to him then, as a “person that mattered?”
In terms of a “person that mattered,” who would that have been in 2009?
Would it be someone who was formerly in charge of the JonBenet Ramsey case and attended an extensive review of the evidence by a multi-agency Task Force, including the latest DNA evidence?
I guess he’s not a person that matters because he’s not IDI.

One of the most interesting things that I found in Kolar’s book is that a pivotal moment in his journey to RDI came from the interviews conducted with the Ramseys, something that we’ve had available to us publically for many, many years.
It’s not necessary for someone to tell us what we should believe.
We don’t have 60,000 pages of case file from which to draw our conclusions but we have a lot, and it points straight to the Ramseys, IMO, as Kolar found out, and as many on this forum and elsewhere have found out.

 

[cynic]

For those who may not know, John Ramsey made the statement he hired lawyers to keep himself out of jail. That was his right and I'd uphold anyone to using their rights but where are all those people he hired to find that Intruder?

It is a real shame this country no longer seeks justice in cases like this but instead depends on criminal defense lawyers to get their client off the hook or, at worst, get the least sentence possible.

Here is the quote:
Q. Then what was, basically, your association with the private investigation of the potential suspects in the murder of JonBenet Ramsey?
A. The investigators were retained by our attorneys, and they stated to me that the principal purpose of those investigators was to prepare a defense in the case that the police might bring a charge against me. I hoped that they would also follow up on leads that came to us, but I was frequently reminded by our attorneys that their principal role was to prepare a defense should that be necessary.
Deposition of John Ramsey, December 12, 2001

 

[UKGuy]

Here is the quote:
Q. Then what was, basically, your association with the private investigation of the potential suspects in the murder of JonBenet Ramsey?
A. The investigators were retained by our attorneys, and they stated to me that the principal purpose of those investigators was to prepare a defense in the case that the police might bring a charge against me. I hoped that they would also follow up on leads that came to us, but I was frequently reminded by our attorneys that their principal role was to prepare a defense should that be necessary.
Deposition of John Ramsey, December 12, 2001

cynic,
Guilty or innocent JR was always going to lawyer up. What is interesting is that the preparation of a defense should be necessary, in advance of any charges.


This suggests JR considered the forensic evidence might be interpreted to his disadvantage.

Why so, if the case is IDI as he always promotes in his interviews, surely there can be no question of JRs innocence?



.

 

[DeeDee249]

Yeah, I reckon it is just another trust me post. If Law Enforcement wanted to turn this case back on the Ramsey's they could. That is one thing we all agree on. why haven't they? Kolar is making a buck based basically against Lou Smit's theory. Feel free to assume i am wrong. When we hear something from the people who matter let's see what they say.

In addition, didn't LW make a tasteless comment about making "more money off the Ramsey case than you made in your whole law career"?

 

[Charterhouse]

Hello everyone. I am new to posting on WS but I have been reading here for a very long time. I must admit this is the prime place to read and get information on the JBR case.

I am so glad that Mr. Kolars book came out and sparked some new interest and discussion in this case.

Being new, I don't know if I am allowed to ask this; but, is Mr. Kolars book worth purchasing? It is a little pricey. I had hoped to get a little more information on the webcast rather than so much advertising. That kind of turned me off on purchasing the book. Although I do agree he does deserve every penny he makes because he used his retirement money to write and publish the book and could possibly be looking at a law suit.

I am in the RDI camp but change my mind of who did what.

I just wanted to introduce myself and let you know that there are many of us out here who have never registered that are still very interested in this case.

Keep up the good work. I enjoy hearing both sides.

 

[cynic]

In addition, didn't LW make a tasteless comment about making "more money off the Ramsey case than you made in your whole law career"?

Hey DeeDee, yes that was from the deposition of Gideon Epstein during the Wolf v Ramsey case with Lin Wood being his sweet self.


MR. WOOD: You can take the word of anybody that's ever had the opportunity to go up against me in a courtroom. I'll talk to people you've -- if we can find somebody.
MR. HOFFMAN: Lin, this sounds like rank speculation on your part. Just drop it.
MR. WOOD: Let me tell you something, if I am lucky enough, you will have your day with me, sir.
MR. HOFFMAN: Oh, I hope so, and I hope --
MR. WOOD: And it will be the pleasure of my career when I take you down, and that day may yet come because you still run your mouth to the media so much that you're going to get yourself sued eventually, you're going to get your experts sued eventually, so
you just keep the business coming, Darnay. It's really good for my pocketbook. I'm taking a
recess.
MR. HOFFMAN: I know in this case that the Ramseys aren't paying a penny, the insurance company is paying you finally, okay, which is nice --
MR. WOOD: Hey, I made more money handling the Ramsey case than you've made in
your whole damn career practicing law, Darnay.
MR. HOFFMAN: -- instead of settling for chump change, which you've done in all these other cases, you're actually getting paid a decent --
MR. WOOD: I've made more money in the Ramsey case than you've made in your entire career as a lawyer, you want to bet on that?
MR. HOFFMAN: You mean you've made more than a hundred dollars?
MR. WOOD: Yes, I have made more than a hundred dollars, Darnay.
MR. HOFFMAN: -- in this case. Well, good.
MR. WOOD: I'd just like to know the poor person that paid you the hundred
dollars. Maybe we'd have a good legal malpractice claim.
MR. HOFFMAN: All right. Are we ready?
MR. RAWLS: Do we want to take a short recess?
MR. ALTMAN: Maybe we ought to.

 

[cynic]

Hello everyone. I am new to posting on WS but I have been reading here for a very long time. I must admit this is the prime place to read and get information on the JBR case.

I am so glad that Mr. Kolars book came out and sparked some new interest and discussion in this case.

Being new, I don't know if I am allowed to ask this; but, is Mr. Kolars book worth purchasing? It is a little pricey. I had hoped to get a little more information on the webcast rather than so much advertising. That kind of turned me off on purchasing the book. Although I do agree he does deserve every penny he makes because he used his retirement money to write and publish the book and could possibly be looking at a law suit.

I am in the RDI camp but change my mind of who did what.

I just wanted to introduce myself and let you know that there are many of us out here who have never registered that are still very interested in this case.

Keep up the good work. I enjoy hearing both sides.

Hey Charterhouse, welcome aboard.
Kolar’s book has come down in price, but I don’t regret spending over $40 for the book, it has a wealth of information and worth every penny, IMO.

 

[OpenMind4U]

Hello everyone. I am new to posting on WS but I have been reading here for a very long time. I must admit this is the prime place to read and get information on the JBR case.

I am so glad that Mr. Kolars book came out and sparked some new interest and discussion in this case.

Being new, I don't know if I am allowed to ask this; but, is Mr. Kolars book worth purchasing? It is a little pricey. I had hoped to get a little more information on the webcast rather than so much advertising. That kind of turned me off on purchasing the book. Although I do agree he does deserve every penny he makes because he used his retirement money to write and publish the book and could possibly be looking at a law suit.

I am in the RDI camp but change my mind of who did what.

I just wanted to introduce myself and let you know that there are many of us out here who have never registered that are still very interested in this case.

Keep up the good work. I enjoy hearing both sides.

Welcome Charterhouse! IMO, Kolar's book is important for many reasons. One of them is to gain knowledge of existing evidence(s). ...and who knows, maybe this IS THE BOOK which will start the 'revolution' to finally get justice.

 

[Charterhouse]

Thanks for the responses about the book. I would have probably ended up buying it but this makes me feel better about spending the money,

Thank you also for the warm welcome!

 

[otg]

(snipped for space)

Hello, Charterhouse -- and welcome.

If you want to hold off a bit before ordering the book, there is a lot of information from it posted here and on WS's sister forum, [ame="http://www.forumsforjustice.org/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=6"]FFJ[/ame], thanks to all our considerate, industrious, and dedicated posters. I haven't gotten mine yet, but I believe it is worth the investment (if you are really hardcore :wink.
.

 

[otg]

Hey DeeDee, yes that was from the deposition of Gideon Epstein during the Wolf v Ramsey case with Lin Wood being his sweet self.


MR. WOOD: You can take the word of anybody that's ever had the opportunity to go up against me in a courtroom. I'll talk to people you've -- if we can find somebody.
MR. HOFFMAN: Lin, this sounds like rank speculation on your part. Just drop it.
MR. WOOD: Let me tell you something, if I am lucky enough, you will have your day with me, sir.
MR. HOFFMAN: Oh, I hope so, and I hope --
MR. WOOD: And it will be the pleasure of my career when I take you down, and that day may yet come because you still run your mouth to the media so much that you're going to get yourself sued eventually, you're going to get your experts sued eventually, so
you just keep the business coming, Darnay. It's really good for my pocketbook. I'm taking a
recess.
MR. HOFFMAN: I know in this case that the Ramseys aren't paying a penny, the insurance company is paying you finally, okay, which is nice --
MR. WOOD: Hey, I made more money handling the Ramsey case than you've made in
your whole damn career practicing law, Darnay.
MR. HOFFMAN: -- instead of settling for chump change, which you've done in all these other cases, you're actually getting paid a decent --
MR. WOOD: I've made more money in the Ramsey case than you've made in your entire career as a lawyer, you want to bet on that?
MR. HOFFMAN: You mean you've made more than a hundred dollars?
MR. WOOD: Yes, I have made more than a hundred dollars, Darnay.
MR. HOFFMAN: -- in this case. Well, good.
MR. WOOD: I'd just like to know the poor person that paid you the hundred
dollars. Maybe we'd have a good legal malpractice claim.
MR. HOFFMAN: All right. Are we ready?
MR. RAWLS: Do we want to take a short recess?
MR. ALTMAN: Maybe we ought to.

What an A-hole.
.

 

[midwest mama]

Welcome Charterhouse - nice to have some company in the Newbie camp.

DO get the book - you won't regret it.

Much like you on reading for a while before deciding to register, but I was on the fence after all the years of browsing over articles of all types about the case. Then I learned that Burke was refusing to cooperate with new requests for interviews with the BPD, and upon seeing JR's new book come out (which just seemed over the top in seeking out more attention to feed his quest for public empathy), my desire to learn more about the case really began to fire up.

Lucky for me the radio webcast was scheduled also, and Kolar's book was just becoming available. I am off the fence for good now, in the RDI camp for sure, in agreement with many others that BDI. Will confess, though, there is something deep inside me that makes me want to find more info than I can on JAR - even if he has been "cleared". Crazy, huh?

Enjoy your book - then come on back with more posts!!:Banane37:

 

[OpenMind4U]

Welcome Charterhouse - nice to have some company in the Newbie camp.

DO get the book - you won't regret it.

Much like you on reading for a while before deciding to register, but I was on the fence after all the years of browsing over articles of all types about the case. Then I learned that Burke was refusing to cooperate with new requests for interviews with the BPD, and upon seeing JR's new book come out (which just seemed over the top in seeking out more attention to feed his quest for public empathy), my desire to learn more about the case really began to fire up.

Lucky for me the radio webcast was scheduled also, and Kolar's book was just becoming available. I am off the fence for good now, in the RDI camp for sure, in agreement with many others that BDI. Will confess, though, there is something deep inside me that makes me want to find more info than I can on JAR - even if he has been "cleared". Crazy, huh?
Enjoy your book - then come on back with more posts!!:Banane37:

LOL...In this case, you can count BOTH of us to be 'crazy'. Few days ago I posted my thoughts regarding JAR and the known timeline. IMO, JAR has all apportunities to get to Boulder from Atlanta and back ON TIME. He would have plenty of time to make these trips due to Time Zones difference between EST and MST....jmo

 

[txsvicki]

I guess touch dna rules out the theory of the barbie gown being washed and dried with the blanket and getting to the wineroom by static cling. Washing should have removed the dna of patsy and burke and any intruder dna should also be there.

 

[DeeDee249]

I guess touch dna rules out the theory of the barbie gown being washed and dried with the blanket and getting to the wineroom by static cling. Washing should have removed the dna of patsy and burke and any intruder dna should also be there.

Yes- intruder DNA that matched the touch DNA should have been on the blanket, especially in the areas that were pulled over her torso. The fact that there was no matching touch DNA on that blanket - a major part of the crime - should tell anyone with a brain that the touch DNA is artifact and not associated with the crime at all.
I still think it is possible that the pink nightie may have come out of the dryer clinging to the blanket. JR slipped when he told LE (after being shown a photo of the blanket, tape and nightie in situ on the basement floor) and he said "That wasn't supposed to be there" referring to the pink nightie.

 

[midwest mama]

Open Mind-
I left a mention on another thread post tonite re: JAR. Glad to know I'm not the only one with weird vibes about him coming and going in the house during his college years!
And, yes, the time frame could fit, IMO, especially given the fact that family had two private planes at their disposal that did not have to file flight plans. And would be ready at a quick request of JR.

 

[midwest mama]

Open Mind-
I left a mention on another thread post tonite re: JAR. Glad to know I'm not the only one with weird vibes about him coming and going in the house during his college years!:what:

I agree the time change would allow for the time frame fit, especially given the fact that family had two private planes at their disposal. And would be ready at a quick request of JR, if he needed to get JAR back and forth quickly for any reason.

Forgot to ask - Can someone advise of best info source on JAR?