Ebola outbreak - general thread #5

[SeekingJana]

Okay but if Ebola is as serious as it appears, it should have been considered a National Issue.....National Health Emergency......Homeland Security Issue...Maybe the Hospital thought they had it under control but the experts at the CDC should have immediately arrived and had a group meeting with Hospital, Mayor, Governor, Texas Health Dept. The CDC cannot blame others if they are the experts and didn't at least try to do something. The CDC is a federal agency under the Department of Health and Human Services. They had the authority or at least could have gotten the authority to take control of the care of Mr. Duncan and they should have done that. So who does the CDC report to?

CDC " reports to" the parent agency which is the United States Department of Health and Human Services.

Edited to add a verifiable link for this info:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Centers_for_Disease_Control_and_Prevention

 

[WichitaFalls]

See that's what bothers me the most. Presby has not been transparent, their story has changed numerous times, the ER is open - not open. Excuses have been made, edited and made again. Presby has not responded to requests for comments/information on specific stories for days. MOO but whom ever is making the highest level decisions and making statements to the press is failing everyone - their staff, the public, the patients, the CDC, patients loved ones, and the community at large.

It's really hard for me to trust much of anything Presby puts out in the press at this point. It feels like a management/pr/board issue versus the hard working staff. Someone is making some very bad decisions, very bad.

 

[SeekingJana]

See that's what bothers me the most. Presby has not been transparent, their story has changed numerous times, the ER is open - not open. Excuses have been made, edited and made again. Presby has not responded to requests for comments/information on specific stories for days. MOO but whom ever is making the highest level decisions and making statements to the press is failing everyone - their staff, the public, the patients, the CDC, patients loved ones, and the community at large.



It's really hard for me to trust much of anything Presby puts out in the press at this point. It feels like a management/pr/board issue versus the hard working staff. Someone is making some very bad decisions, very bad.

I wouldn't even watch their hospital/ corporate talking heads at the pressers. I KNOW THS ( Texas Health Systems) lies and lies and lies.

I DO NOT think the CDC wants us to die, to be sick, to put a burden on our country's health care system. It is in the CDC's best interest to get people well and keep people well from communicable diseases.

 

[SeekingJana]

A lot of the biohazard gear is becoming difficult to acquire on the markets as they are being snapped up by hospitals. There is already some gear we can't get our hands on should the need arise in my unit.

This is not a comment specific to your facility but I hope that any hospital which lacks supplies will step forward and say so now, not later like Dallas Presby. did.

 

[okiedokietoo]

I swear I read somewhere today that the CDC had 10 people there the day after he was admitted. Anyone else see that?

If that's true then staff & protocol was observed by CDC ---------------example: if John's brother, a law office librarian, wants to represent him in court re: a felony DP charge, the Judge jumps in and says "sorry" you have to have an attorney, a lawyer that is an expert in DP cases...well something like that. CDC is the expert, a federal agency...
Going to sleep, ya think I need to? haha I still believe the CDC dropped the ball. Isn't the reason to have government agencies, like health and Human Services is so they can oversee everything?

 

[okiedokietoo]

I wouldn't even watch their hospital/ corporate talking heads at the pressers. I KNOW THS ( Texas Health Systems) lies and lies and lies.

I DO NOT think the CDC wants us to die, to be sick, to put a burden on our country's health care system. It is in the CDC's best interest to get people well and keep people well from communicable diseases.

I agree with you about CDC but that being said it doesn't mean they didn't drop the ball.

 

[SeekingJana]

If that's true then staff & protocol was observed by CDC ---------------example: if John's brother, a law office librarian, wants to represent him in court re: a felony DP charge, the Judge jumps in and says "sorry" you have to have an attorney, a lawyer that is an expert in DP cases...well something like that. CDC is the expert, a federal agency...

I'd like to see a verifiable link that the CDC was present and observed " protocol".. or lack thereof.. I'm NOT sure that the CDC has jurisdiction over what a hospital does unless the hospital ASKS them though.

It's like the FBI being a federal investigative agency. They will step in if a local LE agency asks them to, and they have jurisdiction over some crimes classified as federal offenses, but the FBI does not oversee local or state LE. And in most states, state LE cannot walk in and take over a local LE investigation into a crime..
Trying to put this into a more familiar perspective for WS'ers.

 

[1&2&3]

It all comes down to the hospital saying they are ready for an Ebola patient in responding to forms/questionnaires that their corporate and/or CDC have sent. They know the equipment they have on hand, with all the staff and surprise cases that pop into their ER on a daily basis, they can handle anything, so, no big deal! And, who in Texas is going to get Ebola?

This is probably the mindset of the majority of the hospitals across the country. We've got it, we can wing it! Ummm,, no, do not think it works that way!

My opinion only!

 

[kimi_SFC]

Did you see the one where they made them wrap tape around their necks to protect it???

:gasp:

How do you get that off safely???

ETA, I would LOVE to listen to that conference call. Hopefully it will get posted.

This one I can answer - I think:

PDI Adhesive Tape Remover Pads, B16400

http://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B003XCV6X2?pc_redir=1411900776&robot_redir=1#


Extrapolate this on an industrial strength level, but you get the idea. Hospitals have access to supplies that can do the job.

We use this to remove tape without blistering / breaking the skin when attaching electrodes for sleep studies for 8+ hours. This is the exact adhesive remover used in acute care facilities, and it is sterile until you open it (like an alcohol prep pad).

I'm not saying that's how they did it, but a possibility. JMO....


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[okiedokietoo]

I'd like to see a verifiable link that the CDC was present and observed " protocol".. or lack thereof.. I'm NOT sure that the CDC has jurisdiction over what a hospital does unless the hospital ASKS them though.

It's like the FBI being a federal investigative agency. They will step in if a local LE agency asks them to, and they have jurisdiction over some crimes classified as federal offenses, but the FBI does not oversee local or state LE. And in most states, state LE cannot walk in and take over a local LE investigation into a crime..
Trying to put this into a more familiar perspective for WS'ers.

I was replying to poster that was not sure if they were or weren't thus my post starting "if that's true". This is a National Health Issue.
To answer your question:

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/10/15/us/cdc-says-it-should-have-responded-more-quickly-to-dallas-ebola-case.html
C.D.C. Says It Should Have Responded Faster to the Dallas Ebola Case
By MANNY FERNANDEZ and JACK HEALYOCT. 14, 2014

“I wish we had put a team like this on the ground the day the patient, the first patient, was diagnosed,” Dr. Thomas R. Frieden, director of the C.D.C., said at a news conference Tuesday. “That might have prevented this infection. But we will do that from today onward with any case, anywhere in the U.S.”
He added, “We could have sent a more robust hospital infection-control team and been more hands-on with the hospital from Day 1.”

Credit where credit due - you are absolutely correct about Federal /State Level Authority

The statement said hospital officials allowed nurses who interacted with Mr. Duncan at a time when he was vomiting and had diarrhea to continue their normal duties, “taking care of other patients even though they had not had the proper personal protective equipment while providing care for Mr. Duncan that was later recommended by the C.D.C.”

Told of the statement, a spokeswoman for the C.D.C. said the agency would not be looking at the situation from a regulatory perspective. “That oversight comes from the health department at the state level,” the spokeswoman said.

 

[chipmunk]

o/t My brother in law contracted chikumgunya virus just last week. I had never heard of it before.

Sent from my SCH-S720C using Tapatalk 2

Do you mind saying if he got it while in a southern state?

 

[Muffet]

I swear I read somewhere today that the CDC had 10 people there the day after he was admitted. Anyone else see that?

DALLAS — A patient in a Dallas hospital was confirmed Tuesday to have the deadly Ebola virus, the Centers for Disease Control said Tuesday. Within hours, a team of CDC investigators arrived in North Texas to begin working on the first-ever case of this strain of the Ebola virus confirmed in the U.S.

http://www.wfaa.com/story/news/heal...an-hospital-ebola-patient-isolation/16460629/

 

[jjenny]

DALLAS — A patient in a Dallas hospital was confirmed Tuesday to have the deadly Ebola virus, the Centers for Disease Control said Tuesday. Within hours, a team of CDC investigators arrived in North Texas to begin working on the first-ever case of this strain of the Ebola virus confirmed in the U.S.

http://www.wfaa.com/story/news/heal...an-hospital-ebola-patient-isolation/16460629/

Yes, they arrived, but as I recall their goal was to trace contacts. They weren't checking as to what this hospital was doing. CDC didn't even assume the hospital workers were at high risk of getting infected.

 

[SeekingJana]

DALLAS — A patient in a Dallas hospital was confirmed Tuesday to have the deadly Ebola virus, the Centers for Disease Control said Tuesday. Within hours, a team of CDC investigators arrived in North Texas to begin working on the first-ever case of this strain of the Ebola virus confirmed in the U.S.

http://www.wfaa.com/story/news/heal...an-hospital-ebola-patient-isolation/16460629/

Thank you, sadly.
The CDC AND Dallas Presby. are at fault, unless the CDC did not go into the isolation room and observe the status of isolation and see the waste room with biohazardous waste piled to the ceiling. If the CDC did not go into the patient care area, then I'd say they were negligent for not observing and obviously, not teaching. I don't know whether they were there for pressers, or to actually help with hands on care.
I saw them on TV very frequently for a man to be so sick and needing their help upstairs.

 

[SeekingJana]

Yes, they arrived, but as I recall their goal was to trace contacts. They weren't checking as to what this hospital was doing. CDC didn't even assume the hospital workers were at high risk of getting infected.

That's what I thought. See my post. I think we posted at the same time. I hope the CDC knows better now.. IF the attending physicians will let them in... Doctors are the most territorial people in the world, as a general rule.

 

[jjenny]

That's what I thought. See my post. I think we posted at the same time. I hope the CDC knows better now.. IF the attending physicians will let them in... Doctors are the most territorial people in the world, as a general rule.

That hospital should have been saying "we are clueless" instead of "we are ready."

 

[SeekingJana]

I'm sure nurse Tran wishes they had. ( I don't know her first name, so am referring to her more formally).

 

[WichitaFalls]

http://bigstory.ap.org/article/a669...llas-nurses-cite-sloppy-conditions-ebola-care

Read it and weep. It will be a miracle if we don't seen multiple new cases in the coming days/week.

 

[CARIIS]

just getting caught --the only wotdf that comes to mind is atrcious -- I understand learning curve might have had a role, but this BS, it sounds like Admin did not want to admit hey we really do feel compfortable taking this pt lets get he to one of the 4 centers have that have done well

Its not like there were no beds avail. Sounds like they would have had problem with basic isolation issues. Appaling and shame on govt officials , this started over there in March, I foollowed it a short time for MAL 307, and DCD was blabbing about here all is good.

Do I beleive we are headed like nation wise for serous outbreak but this is simple malpractive. Appaling and some admin heads should be rolling shortly, It was the first case - there would have been nothing wrong no wait -- criminal not to have sent Mr Duncan elsewhere - if we can fly people from Africa over , safely there is no reason on earth the same should not have been done for him

angry, embarrsing on the world stage , and once again we just flopped - totally, so not ok YUK

 

[Muffet]

Seriously, folks, there were a LOT of agencies involved in every step.

I am mortified by what I'm reading, and wouldn't begin to excuse any of it if it's true, and any and all who dropped the ball deserves all the fire they get.

But in general, there are a lot of variables that go into our judgement of any individual experience with a hospital. I've had way more than my share with almost all of them in the area, from various ones within the Parkland system, 2 Baylors, Medical City, and 3 of Presby's.

In every case, I've had good and bad. Sometimes it depends on the individual hospital, or the department, or the year, or the days of the week, even down to the shift or specialty.

Some have been outstanding one week, then awful the next.

I left that specific Presby to change OB. Didn't like their L&D.

Love Baylor. But I was with a relative there for a week, and it was so bad I made an official complaint.

Even the story that ranked Presby as #15 in Texas still said it ranked just beneath the ones ranked best in the country. (see upthread)

I'm politically independent except for a contempt for bureaucracy and agendas of any sort - private or government. I acknowledge that bias, so I could be wrong, but I would still bet that's what winds up being the culprit.