Ebola outbreak - general thread #8

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liljim said:
i dont understand why so many people in support of quarantines for asymptomatic people accept the 21 day quarantine, it clearly should be 42 days or even longer right?

even tho the infection rate in the 21-42 day period is much smaller we are still talking about ebola right? any risk is too great... 42 days or longer would be the safe way to go no?

and what about in the past, all the doctors and nurses, media people, clergy that have been in close contact with patients in areas where ebola has been present. any of those people who knew of the risks and did not self-quarantine for at least 21 days upon their return to the US... clearly negligent and dangerous right?
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This NEJM editorial explains why the quarantine of health care workers is overkill.

We have very strong reason to believe that transmission occurs when the viral load in bodily fluids is high, on the order of millions of virions per microliter. This recognition has led to the dictum that an asymptomatic person is not contagious; field experience in West Africa has shown that conclusion to be valid. Therefore, an asymptomatic health care worker returning from treating patients with Ebola, even if he or she were infected, would not be contagious. Furthermore, we now know that fever precedes the contagious stage, allowing workers who are unknowingly infected to identify themselves before they become a threat to their community.
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The Dallas nurses still don't know how they contracted the virus, while wearing protection, and still some think HCW's should not quarantine? This nurse was running a fever, is that enough to be considered a symptom? Are we to really trust the CDC who continues to stumble, or are we to look to the czar, who is an attorney and not a physician? TBH, I trust a 21 day quarantine more than the CDC or the czar..
 
If i took care of someone with ebola, I would have to put my self in quarantine. I would have too much of a guilty coninceus to go out about my daily life knowing that there might be a chance i could make someone sick. could I afford it, heck no. could i live with myself i caused someone to get sick, no.
 
Footwarrior said:
This NEJM editorial explains why the quarantine of health care workers is overkill.
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i understand that, my question was directed at people in support of the quarantines.

"i dont understand why so many people in support of quarantines..."
 
quueenie said:
The Dallas nurses still don't know how they contracted the virus, while wearing protection, and still some think HCW's should not quarantine? This nurse was running a fever, is that enough to be considered a symptom? Are we to really trust the CDC who continues to stumble, or are we to look to the czar, who is an attorney and not a physician? TBH, I trust a 21 day quarantine more than the CDC or the czar..
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unless you believe she is blatantly lying (many seem to believe just this) she was not running a fever. isnt this matter really a red herring tho? most seem to support the quarantine for people that are completely asymptomatic...
 
RJA00 said:
I would have too much of a guilty coninceus to go out about my daily life knowing that there might be a chance i could make someone sick.
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Of course, you would NOT have a guilty conscience if you knew you had no chance to make someone sick. And, like Kaci, you might not want to be confined against your will for weeks, just to satisfy others who were too stupid to realize you were not contagious and couldn't make anyone sick.
 
liljim said:
unless you believe she is blatantly lying (many seem to believe just this) she was not running a fever. isnt this matter really a red herring tho? most seem to support the quarantine for people that are completely asymptomatic...
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Ur right.... I agree with the quarantine whether symptomatic or not. They have yet to be able to control this virus in Africa, why should I think they can here? It takes one person to infect a child, who brings it to school and infects others... It could easily get out of control... Unless we put rules and guidelines in place to prevent it. We aren't asking for much... 21 days, or don't treat Ebola patients.
 
SteveS said:
Of course, you would NOT have a guilty conscience if you knew you had no chance to make someone sick. And, like Kaci, you might not want to be confined against your will for weeks, just to satisfy others who were too stupid to realize you were not contagious and couldn't make anyone sick.
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Ok let me rephrase that. I could not go out and about, Make people worry that their kids are going to sick because i was in the same room with them. people are not going to change. I know the chances are very slim or none. I am not going to make a business close because there customers are afraid to visit. It would just save a lot of needless worry to stay indoors 21 days. that is the Big problem people are not going to change. they are not going to want people at work that has been around somebody that has been around it. weather it to satisfy the stupid (using your words here) or not. people will lose money if they don't stay quarantined. wedding shop, bowling alley, restaurant will continue to have to close to do extra cleaning and some people probably wont go back. so who is going to save the business and people that live paycheck to paycheck (like me) that lose money becouse people would not stay in there house for 21 days.

I give great praise for the male models, my hometown doctor who came back a few weeks ago and stayed quarantined in his house for 21 days without be told and all others that have stayed indoors . they deserve all the praise for going to help oversees and keeping us safe too
 
right, like that little girl who was banned from her school for travelling to a country that was deemed ebola free, she will now likely be ostracized by other kids because adults gave in to hysteria and didnt base their decisions on facts. but that girls family should have quarantined themselves out of consideration for the people at the school that would be concerned even tho there was not a single valid reason to think that the girl or her father could possibly have ebola... because... because, ummm well because africa i guess.

http://www.wcvb.com/national/school-bars-girl-over-ebola-fears-suit-filed/29408412
 
liljim said:
right, like that little girl who was banned from her school for travelling to a country that was deemed ebola free, she will now likely be ostracized by other kids because adults gave in to hysteria and didnt base their decisions on facts. but that girls family should have quarantined themselves out of consideration for the people at the school that would be concerned even tho there was not a single valid reason to think that the girl or her father could possibly have ebola... because... because, ummm well because africa i guess.

http://www.wcvb.com/national/school-bars-girl-over-ebola-fears-suit-filed/29408412
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That is not even close to the same thing... This nurse treated and had direct contact with infected individuals...
 
SStarr33 said:
There's always skype
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I'm with you on this one......with all the technologyis in this day and age!! why not be cautious! I am actually amazed at the protocols that have been put in place by western countries, I really don't think we are being cautious enough.

And yes as someone mentioned above, only 4 people outside of Africa have died..............however everytime someone goes into a country from West Africa and symptoms appear, there always is subsequent isolation and "watching" of many more people that the person has been in contact with. Stricter protocols need to be put into place where it is mandatory that if anyone, especially health workers have been in contact or in the area of ebola outbreaks, they need to be quarantined for the 21 day period. If it is money they are worried about, then maybe the government needs to be paying them the equivalent of their pays for the 3 weeks.

We have been fairly lucky so far, but if this disease prevails, then eventually it will happen that someone affected will go into a public area and may affect many other people. And every caution must be taken that this never happens!! I don't understand anyone thinking any other way.

I have mentioned this before on here, but I am at the top of Australia and above us is Papua New Guinea, the Torres Strait Islands, Solomon Islands, remote aboriginal island communities etc....... they have very basic living conditions.....and in some cases similar to Africa (there are still primitive type tribes in New Guinea). We have people travelling in and out of all of these places constantly, especially with the mining in New Guinea. If this disease was to reach any of these places, it would be catastrophic for these areas and would be impossible to contain.

I look at the region around the US, imagine it getting into central and south America, where the living conditions are basic in some areas of those countries......or the likes of Haiti, Dominica or even Cuba........

So, yes I think the nurse is selfish, especially if she knows she is setting some sort of precedent for the future. If it was me I would be thinking the opposite, " I have just been working with a deadly disease, knowing how contagious it is and how utterly awful it was..............I would do everything to ascertain I was not responsible for anyone else getting it."

While there is media hysteria I do agree...........I for one want the world to be OVER cautious when dealing with this disease, because one slip and who knows............and the truth is, no one does really know...

ps. I have only read a couple of posts that mention that the nurse was to be isolated in some form of a horrible tent. Now this I don't agree with, these people have been where most of us don't want to go, they should be paid whilst in isolation and isolated in total comfort. Surely the government can afford this.
 
faw720 said:
Why didn't they throw her into a tent?
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The unnamed Austin area nurse was and is currently asymptomatic. The Ebola response policies of most states that have put one foreword - including New Jersey - allow an at risk, but asymptomatic HCW coming from west Africa to either self monitor or quarantine at home.

I realize that a key part of Kaci Hickox's narrative is the implication that she was thrown into some sort of substandard camping tent in a parking lot, but that is simply NOT accurate. As detailed in a previous post, Ms Hickox was temporarily housed in a large room inside the University hospital that was outfitted with a negative pressure isolation tent inside the room. The details are provided in post #413. This was done BECAUSE she was considered potentially symptomatic (fever) by the CDC screener at Newark Liberty Airport.
 
When the events in Dallas happened my first thought was the US will be able to prevent ebola from spreading here. Now I am very alarmed to see the hysteria that has already taken over the country. More than the inconvenience of a 21 day quarantine keeping medical people from volunteering in Africa, but the stigma and demonization going on here will definitely keep people at home. Even here it is going to be hard to get nurses to work with ebola patients. If we are going to quarantine people returning from Africa, then surely we need to quarantine the nurses who work with ebola here. I am now afraid ebola will soon be at our door in epidemic proportions. How many nurses can afford to give up 3 weeks pay?
 
Re being more educated about this disease. I for one have been reading about it for about 6 months. MOst of my family and friends have read up about it a lot as well. Not everyone just reads the media hysteria...........google ebola and there are a lot of articles that aren't just from the media. Most people I know here aren't too worried about it and it certainly isn't affecting their everyday lives worrying about it, especially now since the nurses in America and Spain have survived the disease from the blood of survivors and also because there is constant press about a vaccine on its way....

No I think what the Joe Schmows as you called it are worried about is an outbreak occurring that gets out of hand. People are wanting to know that their governments and medical authorities are taking every precaution to ensure this doesn't happen..
 
liljim said:
unless you believe she is blatantly lying (many seem to believe just this) she was not running a fever. isnt this matter really a red herring tho? most seem to support the quarantine for people that are completely asymptomatic...
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Fortunately, running a fever is not a matter of opinion. There was a thermometer reading and she WAS running a fever. As to the matter of whether she was "lying" - I believe - based on her actions, her threats, her demeanor, etc. that she would lie without compunction to get whatever she wanted. I also know for a FACT that the doctor lied and the truth about his actions (running around New York) only came out because they checked his Metro card/credit cards, etc. So if a licensed Dr. and a Registered (I assume) nurse would lie to avoid self quarantine - are we going to trust Joe Blow who just flew in from Liberia to stay in his house???
 
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