EVIDENCE - Pro and Con

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Madeleine74 said:
Absolutely correct -- it wasn't up to Heather to say "no" to SM, as he was the one in the marriage, he was the one who made vows, and he was the one who committed adultery whether his wife cared or not (she claimed not to care but that was a lie). It was his job as a husband to maintain the boundaries of fidelity when given the opportunity to cheat, unless he and TM had an explicit agreement to have an open marriage.

I think the state can help take the wind out of the defense's sails by bringing up Heather's independent spirit and adult status and her attraction and her talking about her sexual feelings in social media. It's right there, so someone is going to bring it up...might as well be the state first. Why is this important and why does it matter? Because it's part of who Heather was, she published these things publicly, it's behavior and language that some members of a jury might find objectionable for a 20 yr old, particularly if there are older folks on the jury, and even though that's how many 20-somethings talk. A young woman writing that she is in lust with a man (who just so happened to be married) at her workplace and talking about someday dragging him into the mop closet to have her way with him, and the jury learning they did indeed begin an affair, could put the victim in a bad light. I know it's not fair, but life isn't fair, and a victim's behaviors do get brought up by defense teams. It is what it is. However, an affair does not give anyone the right to commit murder, and that's what the state will need the jury to focus attention on.
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Agreed, that will all be brought up. I think TM's social media will be brought up as well and it was quite cringe worthy. I really hope that the jury can take into account the difference in age between SM and Heather as well as the fact that Heather was not the one who was married. I hope the jury understands that SM and Heather both decided to to have an affair but it was SM who was cheating and TM who said she would find Heather.
 
Madeleine74 said:
Well I was answering the question you posed above, "was Heather SM's first affair or not?" Obviously I don't know, but I mentioned that Heather pursued him first, because if this was his first time cheating on his wife, then he wasn't necessarily looking to cheat, but he didn't turn down the opportunity when the opportunity arose.

And, just to be clear, I'm not blaming Heather here. There's no reason that makes it ok to be murdered in cold blood.
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Well - if we believe what was presented at the first bond hearing - there were things like "open marriage" and TM "having sex online with a boyfriend" - one might assume that this wasn't a FIRST "affair" for either of them?

It has always bothered me that TM wanted everyone to know they had an open marriage etc - because that sure doesn't match up with her ANGER towards Heather. Unless Heather was distinctively 'different' to SM - and TM felt that SM somehow cared much differently for Heather (she wasn't just a hookup) - and that she WAS afraid SM was going to leave her for Heather. That sure would make the motive strong to want to permanently remove Heather.
 
hoppy said:
Well - if we believe what was presented at the first bond hearing - there were things like "open marriage" and TM "having sex online with a boyfriend" - one might assume that this wasn't a FIRST "affair" for either of them?

It has always bothered me that TM wanted everyone to know they had an open marriage etc - because that sure doesn't match up with her ANGER towards Heather. Unless Heather was distinctively 'different' to SM - and TM felt that SM somehow cared much differently for Heather (she wasn't just a hookup) - and that she WAS afraid SM was going to leave her for Heather. That sure would make the motive strong to want to permanently remove Heather.
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I don't think they had an open marriage. TM's rant,that was shown at the bond hearing,started with SM cheating on her,then her rage filled comments about that and Heather and then turned into TM not caring because she already had a bf. I think that was a mix of TM's pride,wishful thinking and her trying to say that she'd have no reason to kill Heather because hey,she's not jealous at all. Poor attempt. JMO
 
I just got back from River Oaks Apartments not too long ago. I didn't take any pictures of the apartments but, I got out and walked around a little. I saw absolutely NO cameras.

HE/BW's apartment was on the first level (ground floor) to the right of unit.

Before I went to White River Drive though, I stopped at the Kangaroo phone on 10th Avenue. The phone did not work. I was going to call my mobile phone with it and then call it back but... no luck. The phone was nasty! I felt dirty after touching it. Gross!:sick:

I then went inside and made a small purchase. I paid in cash so the cashier didn't give me a receipt. That made me think Heather probably used her bank card or credit card to make her purchase. Or, if she bought gas and paid at the pump, that would have produced a receipt.

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From the Kangaroo, I drove to River Oaks Apartments. I timed the trip and it took me 4:45 to get there. There was some traffic too and I drove the speed limit/normal.

After I stopped at the apartments, I drove to the McDonalds at Towne Center Parkway/International Drive. Lots of cameras there! Right away, I notice 2 on the side of building overtop of a door that was probably used for employees. There were two drive-thus and both had dome CCTV's above the ordering stations. Surely, these cams caught Heather when she was there but don't know how they'll help much?

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Motherof5 said:
I don't think they had an open marriage. TM's rant,that was shown at the bond hearing,started with SM cheating on her,then her rage filled comments about that and Heather and then turned into TM not caring because she already had a bf. I think that was a mix of TM's pride,wishful thinking and her trying to say that she'd have no reason to kill Heather because hey,she's not jealous at all. Poor attempt. JMO
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I agree. I'm not buying the open marriage or the pregnancy/miscarriage.
 
PeterThomasFan said:
I just got back from River Oaks Apartments not too long ago. I didn't take any pictures of the apartments but, I got out and walked around a little. I saw absolutely NO cameras.

*Snipped for Brevity*
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Thanks for checking all out and letting us know PTF.
 
I just looked at that property and it would be the perfect place to hide or bury a body. Looks like the house hasn`t been lived in for quite some time and even the places nearby look creepy. Easy to get there from the Myrtle Beach area too. I hope they have checked this out. I know a lot of times someone will dispose of a body in an area that they were familiar with. Like the Hannah Graham from C-Ville case. JM was familiar with that area and disposed of her body behind that house.
 
Dixie E said:
I just looked at that property and it would be the perfect place to hide or bury a body. Looks like the house hasn`t been lived in for quite some time and even the places nearby look creepy. Easy to get there from the Myrtle Beach area too. I hope they have checked this out. I know a lot of times someone will dispose of a body in an area that they were familiar with. Like the Hannah Graham from C-Ville case. JM was familiar with that area and disposed of her body behind that house.
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I don't know if that's it but if it is,that would explain why SM didn't want to live there.
 
PTF. Awesome job. I was hoping for cameras to answer a few questions. I am now left to wonder how they know she drove there alone or at all.


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CarmonCayman said:
PTF. Awesome job. I was hoping for cameras to answer a few questions. I am now left to wonder how they know she drove there alone or at all.


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Me too!

Another thing I didn't mention was the position of CCTV at the Kangaroo. I notice before when driving by and also from Google map. The camera doesn't exactly point down at the pay phone. It points out towards the parking lot. So, not sure how video shows SM on the phone? Thinking this is why he would have parked behind dumpsters. To stay out of view from camera.

Also wondering when phone stopped working and if the phone company repairs them regularly?

Still wondering too what "proof" LE has that Heather drove to PTL? I just don't see that a social media message or text message could be 100% accurate to prove in court.

Yes @Madeleine74, LE has evidence we are not privy to. :/


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LOL!

Assuming the Solicitor & others on the case are reasonably smart and sane people, there's got to be a reason why they believe Heather drove herself to PTL. If all they've got is rank speculation on that, well... I guess rank speculation is all that will exist and those who believe the M's snuck over to HE's apt and one or both killed her there will continue to be convinced of that scenario. How would you prove such a thing if no evidence exists?

Then again, does it somehow make the 2 defendants less culpable if the crime played out a bit different to what the state claims? These 2 either did it or they didn't do it. If there's enough evidence to allow a jury to conclude they did, then why is Heather's travel to PTL an issue at all?

If the solicitor can clearly put Heather in the same path as the M's at or around the same time, and have other evidence to show in addition, an inference can be made about who caused Heather to disappear.

(Also another way Heather's presence in her own apt and being alive up to 3:25am could be corroborated is if she used a computer there in those early morning hours, aside from her phone, and if she logged into an account in which a password is required).
 
I guess the bigger question to me is whether she drove there on her own accord, drove with SM, or was she totally coaxed?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk. Sorry for any typos!
 
How does that change the charge of murder?

I don't think it does.

We might never know exactly how this thing played out down to the level of detail desired. A conviction can still be obtained though.
 
PeterThomasFan said:
Me too!

Another thing I didn't mention was the position of CCTV at the Kangaroo. I notice before when driving by and also from Google map. The camera doesn't exactly point down at the pay phone. It points out towards the parking lot. So, not sure how video shows SM on the phone? Thinking this is why he would have parked behind dumpsters. To stay out of view from camera.

Also wondering when phone stopped working and if the phone company repairs them regularly?

Still wondering too what "proof" LE has that Heather drove to PTL? I just don't see that a social media message or text message could be 100% accurate to prove in court.

Yes @Madeleine74, LE has evidence we are not privy to. :/


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk. Sorry for any typos!
Click to expand...

I swear I read somewhere there are three cameras across the street that point at the pay phone.
 
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