Family wants to keep life support for girl brain dead after tonsil surgery #3

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Um- get off the pot guy- since the agreement- she needs to go HOME now- immediately- 10 minutes ago- if there is no contract for outside facility. You wanted it- you got it.

ETA: that poor PICU staff; if the family thinks this is easy- they can do it, imo

http://www.mercurynews.com/breaking-news/ci_24840744/jahi-mcmath-mom-can-remove-brain-dead-daughter

An air ambulance company that had quoted a price for flying Jahi from Oakland to Long Island, where a facility agreed to take her, said Friday it had not been contacted by the family yet and no flight was imminent.
 
Someone was discussing a "transport vent" up thread. I wonder if the one in the hospital is too big for transfer?

The way I understand a vent- there is tubing in her mouth/trachea to the vent- seems like you disconnect vent from tube- hook new vent to it?

I mentioned one for transport, it would only be for a short time, the one in the hospital would be too big for transport. And she would need trach for long term, tube become displaced, the bulbs that contain air start to break down and leak, etc... so the ETT is short term.
 
Someone just pull the plug and get it over with..............
 
Well, I think the right answer on what the Constitution has to do with it is NOTHING. But Dolan is making any argument he can come up with. They're claiming that it's a violation of First Amendment religious freedom (they have a firm believe brain death is not true death) and the rights to privacy. Privacy is a weird one because it's implied, not explicit, so it's sort of read into other rights. I believe their argument was that it was a privacy right to make medical decisions regarding Jahi. I'm not sure how they're making religious freedom a federal issue, though. The statute on death is a state one and there's isn't a federal act declaring death, it's a state matter. So it shouldn't be strict scrutiny, but rather rational basis. I'm sure he has some reason in his mind for it, but personally I'm not seeing it.

The really absurd part of this is that as a legally deceased person, technically Jahi has no more standing, and the family can't bring claims on her behalf, only on their own. Doesn't seem like any of the courts are acknowledging that or dealing with that major major issue.

I followed his argumentation better in the first federal petition but I just can't see any connection between fetuses and the family's rights to make medical decisions for Jahi.

Anyway, I never thought that there is a privacy right to dictate to the doctors what treatments they should be prescribing. I thought you can refuse the treatments they recommend but if they don't want to prescribe a medication or order surgery and scans they don't consider medically indicated, you can't say that they have to because it's your religion.
 
So if her heart stops during flight is the family going to sue CHO?
 
uvulopalatopharyngoplasty, adenotonsillectomy and a bilateral submucous resection of inferior turbinates.

http://media.nbcbayarea.com/documents/childrens-hospital.pdf

Wow that was fast! Thank you for that information.


So all three were performed? Wow, that's definitely very different than a simple tonsillectomy. Uuvulopalatopharyngoplasty has a "serious" complication rate of 35.1 people per 1000 and a mortality rate of ~0.2%. But that's just that one procedure alone - not all three. Adenotonsillectomy has a major complication rate of 2.4%.

Source:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15091217
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22469495
 
http://www.mercurynews.com/breaking-news/ci_24840744/jahi-mcmath-mom-can-remove-brain-dead-daughter



An air ambulance company that had quoted a price for flying Jahi from Oakland to Long Island, where a facility agreed to take her, said Friday it had not been contacted by the family yet and no flight was imminent.


Probably because the family knew they'd never be moving her to New York. All a stall tactic.

They want her at CHO while they bash them in the press. IMO of course :)
 
Another thought.

Once Jahi's body leaves CHO, she can't be readmitted to any hospitals or health care facilities. She has a death certificate.

That is what I have been wondering about. If she took her home and decided to call ambulance to home to transfer her to a different hospital and try to force them to do the procedure. It would be a repeat of the same circus.
 
So if her heart stops during flight is the family going to sue CHO?


Probably could add that to the list of things they'll sue for BUT I don't think they ever plan/planned to move her in an air ambulance.
 
I followed his argumentation better in the first federal petition but I just can't see any connection between fetuses and the family's rights to make medical decisions for Jahi.

Anyway, I never thought that there is a privacy right to dictate to the doctors what treatments they should be prescribing. I thought you can refuse the treatments they recommend but if they don't want to prescribe a medication or order surgery and scans they don't consider medically indicated, you can't say that they have to because it's your religion.

So this is in Federal Court because of the issue of First Amendment and Privacy rights? Is that correct?

Excellent comment, the patient can't practice medicine and they can't dictate orders for tests, medications, procedures, etc to physicians.

I hope CHO is on top of that one.
 
Probably because the family knew they'd never be moving her to New York. All a stall tactic.

They want her at CHO while they bash them in the press. IMO of course :)

All smoke and mirrors.

Jahi loses all status as a living person once she leaves the hospital.

No insurance will pay for care, either.

The last thing Dolan wants is for her to leave now. He also has a substantially reduced platform because he would not be contesting anything with CHO and getting the tremendous judicial exposure he is now.
 
Matthias Gafni ‏@mgafni 1m
Big #JahiMcMath question: If transfer doesn't happen by Tues. 5pm, can @Hospital4Kids take her off ventilator? Getting clarification
 
So if her heart stops during flight is the family going to sue CHO?

They can't. Jahi's mother is responsible and has acknowledged that it is a risk.

I'm on my phone and can't quote. Can someone please be really kind and list the quote that stipulates Nailah accepts full responsibility?

TIA :)
 
So if her heart stops during flight is the family going to sue CHO?

I hope that, if and when Jahi is transferred out of CHO, they no longer have any liability for what happens to her. Jahi's mother will have total responsibility for her child's "health care". She shouldn't be able to blame Children's when her daughter is no longer a patient there. :moo:
 
So if her heart stops during flight is the family going to sue CHO?

One of the conditions for her leaving CHO is that mom assumes all responsibility for Jahi's state from then on, (I can't bring myself to say 'health') on the understanding that her heart might stop.
 
No more sympathy for this family for me..... ALL my sympathy is for this innocent young teenager who's being treated like a circus animal and not like a human being.

shame on the family and especially the mother for using this child they way they have.

JMO.
 
I followed his argumentation better in the first federal petition but I just can't see any connection between fetuses and the family's rights to make medical decisions for Jahi.

Anyway, I never thought that there is a privacy right to dictate to the doctors what treatments they should be prescribing. I thought you can refuse the treatments they recommend but if they don't want to prescribe a medication or order surgery and scans they don't consider medically indicated, you can't say that they have to because it's your religion.

No one is obligated to provide any treatment that they do not feel comfortable or competent in, or that they think is futile, or it goes against their beliefs. Of course, if you're a oncologist and you think prescribing chemo is against your beliefs, the state medical board may have something to say about that due to an unacceptable deviation from the standard of care. But in general, that doesn't apply here because the standard of care in this case is to in fact not to any surgeries on a deceased person.
 
So if her heart stops during flight is the family going to sue CHO?

I read up thread that one of the conditions of CHO was that the mother would take full and complete responsibility for the care of her daughter were she to leave the facility. I think that was done precisely in case of the scenario you described.
 
Totally insignificant but how old is Nailah? I think the Grandmother looks amazing for her age (she's 50 but looks at least 10 years younger). At first I thought photos of the grandma were Nailah.
 
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