FL- 12 Story Condo Partial Building Collapse, many still unaccounted for, Miami, 24 June 2021

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I forsee years of litigation in the courts over this condo building collapse.

I believe that years from now after the root causes of this catastrophic condo building collapse have been determined, there will be more stringent standards concerning the development and construction of high rise buildings in coastal areas.

I truly hope these residents and family members of victims take their time and get the right legal counsel. Too many unethical lawyers absolutely swarm around tragedies like these and prey upon victims who have already suffered the worst imaginable losses. And people go with bad lawyers because they are in a panic and desperate and vulnerable. I just hope they get good advice before making any decisions on selecting legal representatives. A trustworthy competent attorney versus one of the ambulance chasers will make such a difference in their fight going forward. I hope along with the FEMA help, resources, etc., they also get help and guidance with finding and selecting attorneys. It's such a big issue around emergency situations and tragedies yet isn't ever really a focus.

 

[GatorFL]

I'm in Sarasota and it is being developed much too quickly - farmlands west of I-75/east of Rt 41 being sold for housing (am thinking of the Rt 681 connector). All of these nice, decent sized houses crammed together as you say, with zero privacy and next to no yard between each house. Granted, there are some people who do not want to deal with the taxes and cold winters up north (I'm from CT myself). And of course it's always on the coast where this building seems to be taking place.

At the height of the pandemic, my husband and I took a few road trips through the south-central part of the state which is quite beautiful, unspoiled, lots of farmland, cattle. Last week we were down in Venus (outside of Punta Gorda) and to me if felt like how Florida was about 50 + years ago. The Venus Project, Archbold Biological Station....it was like being in another world.

Real Paradise.

You should make the drive to Starvation Slough in Okeechobee County. Absolute paradise, old Florida. You can hike for 5-10 miles underneath huge old live oak trees and see lots of wildlife including bald eagles. Worth the drive from Sarasota for sure. Ping me when it cools off in December we can all hike it together.

 

[Antimony]

Restrictions, regulations and rules are useless if not enforced.
Cross someones palm with silver and the violations will go away.
Maybe they will be secret until after the crooks have moved on, maybe not.
A collapse like this is rare, not because of building inspectors, but in spite of them.
Buildings in China and Korea collapse all the time.
I saw a documentary on the internet where, In Korea, supposedly solid concrete walls
were filled with empty tin cans to save on costs. And I never did see any rebar.
This is just my opinion but I have a very lo opinion of building inspectors, Mine inspectors
and whoever does Boeing's software.

 

[GatorFL]

I wonder if the earthquake off Jamaica that was felt in Miami in early 2020 had something to do with the collapse? Lots of high rises were evacuated.

 

[LadyL]

4 Canadians possibly caught in Miami building collapse from 3 families: Global Affairs

 

[Chelly]

At least 9 dead, 156 missing

Florida condo collapse in Surfside: Live updates on death toll and survivors

• At least nine people are dead, officials said Sunday during a news conference.
• There are at least 156 people missing after a residential building partially collapsed in Surfside, Florida, Thursday. Search and rescue teams are racing to find survivors.
• Emergency officials are also asking people to call 305-614-1819 if they have relatives who are unaccounted for.
• The cause of the collapse is still unknown.

 

[Herat]

Surfside Official Told Residents Their Building Was Safe, Despite Engineer's Warning

Just one month after an engineering report warned of "major structural damage" that required immediate repair, a Surfside, Fla. official assured residents of Chaplain Towers South that their building was sound.

NPR has obtained minutes of a Nov. 2018 meeting that shows a Surfside town inspector met with residents of the building, and assured them the building was "in very good shape." That directly conflicts with an engineering report from five weeks earlier, which warned that failed waterproofing in a concrete structural slab needed to be replaced "in the near future."

The engineering report was dated Oct. 8, Residents were given a reassurance2018. At a Nov. 15 board meeting of the Champlain Tower South Condominium Association, a building official from the town of Surfside, Ross Prieto, appeared to discuss that report. "Structural engineer report was reviewed by Mr. Prieto," the meeting minutes say. "It appears the building is in very good shape."
Surfside Official Told Residents Their Building Was Safe, Despite Engineer's Warning

As a layperson, hearing the word "waterproofing" at first sounds like a minor issue, almost like a decorative or lamdscaping problem.

It's also really disturbing to think the
basic structural integrity of the entire building and the lives of all those there depend on a repair that is not a highly scheduled regular maintenance and inspection standard. Something that is required to be inspected and replaced every 10 years or so.

 

[SouthAussie]

I truly hope these residents and family members of victims take their time and get the right legal counsel. Too many unethical lawyers absolutely swarm around tragedies like these and prey upon victims who have already suffered the worst imaginable losses. And people go with bad lawyers because they are in a panic and desperate and vulnerable. I just hope they get good advice before making any decisions on selecting legal representatives. A trustworthy competent attorney versus one of the ambulance chasers will make such a difference in their fight going forward. I hope along with the FEMA help, resources, etc., they also get help and guidance with finding and selecting attorneys. It's such a big issue around emergency situations and tragedies yet isn't ever really a focus.

Could be that the residents will file a class action suit, using one set of competent attorneys.

 

[scdiv]

Developers of doomed Fla. tower were once accused of paying off officials: report

Developers of Fla. tower were accused of paying off officials

The developers of the Miami condo tower that collapsed were once accused of paying off local officials to get permits for the site — which needed $15 million in repairs just to bring it to code, a new report says.

Building rivals claimed that the partners behind Surfside Champlain Towers South were receiving preferential treatment when it came to getting through the permit system as the site was being built in 1981, the Washington Post said.

 

[SuziQ]

At the below link is an interesting graphic showing the possible sequence of collapse. As poster's here have already theorized, the pool deck went, then the middle, and then the end of the building.

https://www.miamiherald.com/news/local/community/miami-dade/miami-beach/article252396233.html

 

[GatorFL]

As a layperson, hearing the word "waterproofing" at first sounds like a minor issue, almost like a decorative or lamdscaping problem.

It's also really disturbing to think the
basic structural integrity of the entire building and the lives of all those there depend on a repair that is not a highly scheduled regular maintenance and inspection standard. Something that is required to be inspected and replaced every 10 years or so.

Waterproofing is a big issue here. If you have leaks you can have structural damage or black mold which is a silent killer.

 

[SuziQ]

Could be that the residents will file a class action suit, using one set of competent attorneys.

I wonder who they will sue. Themselves? I have no idea how this works except each condo unit is individually owned. What a legal mess.

 

[GatorFL]

Developers of doomed Fla. tower were once accused of paying off officials: report

Developers of Fla. tower were accused of paying off officials

The developers of the Miami condo tower that collapsed were once accused of paying off local officials to get permits for the site — which needed $15 million in repairs just to bring it to code, a new report says.

Building rivals claimed that the partners behind Surfside Champlain Towers South were receiving preferential treatment when it came to getting through the permit system as the site was being built in 1981, the Washington Post said.

I can't speak for all of them, but the rumor behind many developers here in South Florida is that they pay off public officials.

 

[GatorFL]

I wonder who they will sue. Themselves? I have no idea how this works except each condo unit is individually owned. What a legal mess.

The insurance companies. The building will have a policy. The HOA may have its own. Each unit will also have a policy. Add in the city for the inspection issues, the engineering firms, the contractors, the developer (if they are still around) and anyone else who strolled through that building doing an inspection or repairs and there are a lot of business entities backed by liability insurance to sue.

 

[Dontknow?]

John Lavre
@photo_journ
4m

"Surfside Mayor Charles Burkett has previously said the report was likely not read by town officials at the time, and Miami-Dade County Mayor Daniella Levine Cava insisted her camp “knew nothing” of it.

 

[SuziQ]

As a layperson, hearing the word "waterproofing" at first sounds like a minor issue, almost like a decorative or lamdscaping problem.

It's also really disturbing to think the
basic structural integrity of the entire building and the lives of all those there depend on a repair that is not a highly scheduled regular maintenance and inspection standard. Something that is required to be inspected and replaced every 10 years or so.

My husband said it is very frustrating trying to explain to a lay person why they can't just patch up concrete over rusted rebar cheaply and need to do an expensive reconstruction.

 

[SouthAussie]

I wonder who they will sue. Themselves? I have no idea how this works except each condo unit is individually owned. What a legal mess.

If it was me, I would start with the town planning board - for allowing the construction in the first place. Pylons driven into porous limestone, tall building constructed upon shifting sands and organic fill.

I once knew a lady who applied for (and got) a position with a council town planning board. The position she was in at the time? A receptionist for a nursing agency. With no planning qualifications at all. Just an 'in' (known contact) with the said town planning board.

These boards have a lot to account for. IMO

 

[Dontknow?]

Everyone is hiring engineers.

Surfside hires engineer to consult on fatal condo collapse, check nearby buildings

Allyn Kilsheimer, founder and chief executive of KCE Structural Engineers, has been hired by the town of Surfside,,,

The firm will be working with Meuser Rutledge Consulting Engineers, a geotechnical engineering specialist, and other consultants and surveyors.

The Champlain Towers North condominium association has informed the town it will hire its own structural engineering firm to investigate the building further.

https://www.miamiherald.com/news/lo....html?utm_source=pushly&intcid=pushly_1127137

 

[Antimony]

At the below link is an interesting graphic showing the possible sequence of collapse. As poster's here have already theorized, the pool deck went, then the middle, and then the end of the building.

https://www.miamiherald.com/news/local/community/miami-dade/miami-beach/article252396233.html

This sounds reasonable. Several pillars in the section next to the pool were pushed inward (toward the main structure) and If I remember correctly, There was a "shear wall" directly under the major side of the 2nd part of the structure to collapse. The other part of the building was likely saved by the shear wall common to the elevator shaft and the fire escape stairs, which would have been the strongest part of the entire structure. The pool section could have failed and pushed the roof of that parking building into the shear wall after breaking some pillars.
In my untrained opinion, that could have caused the entire catastrophe.

 

[GatorFL]

If it was me, I would start with the town planning board - for allowing the construction in the first place. Pylons driven into porous limestone, tall building constructed upon shifting sands and organic fill.

I once knew a lady who applied for (and got) a position with a council town planning board. The position she was in at the time? A receptionist for a nursing agency. With no planning qualifications at all. Just an 'in' (known contact) with the said town planning board.

These boards have a lot to account for. IMO

These are elected officials in FL and have immunity for their decisions which they are elected to make.