FL - 17-yo Teen Shot to Death by Neighborhood Watch Captain #4

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But if his client is claiming self-defense I would expect him to be publicizing those injuries high and low to support that claim.

I would have expected that he be examined by an MD, with x-ray to confirm the broken nose and to make sure there were no skull fractures, since he had a laceration to the back of his head.
 
their lawyer want to take Trayvon's girlfriend to ABC instead of LE <snipped>

I think we've been over this before, but do you have a source that their lawyer did not go to LE but instead to ABC?
 
So the commotion or fight happen blocks away and then GZ and Trayvon moved to near where this witness lives making no noise until the gunshot? That sounds a bit strange to me.

This woman said witnesses three houses away heard them fighting and this lady where TM was found dead right off her porch area said her kitchen window was open and they heard nothing until she said she heard a child whimpering almost pleading and then the shot. They heard no fighting, no wrestling as the other's claim they heard and saw.

So did GZ confront TM and TM knocked him down and tried to run away and GZ caught up with him and then shot him. GZ was on the bottom when the neighbor spotted them wrestling. The next thing is they are three houses down and one of them is whimpering but no fighting just a whimper described as if someone were pleading (why would it be GZ if he had a gun). Mary described it as sounding like a child whimpering and she was sure it was TM.

No homocide detective came to interview her. She made numerous calls that were unreturned. jmo
 
I'm sorry my post wasn't clear. Both quotes are attributed to the father - he claims he thought his son was at the movies, then he claims he son told him he was walking to the store to get some candy.


I'm not seeing the discrepency.
 
As is there no evidence he was wearing the hoodie you used as a link, or evidence if it was, Zimmerman saw him in a well lit room.

In fact there is evidence it was outdoors, in the rain at dusk/early evening when Zimmerman witnessed him hiding his face by pulling the hoodie up.

I don't have photoshop and even if I did I would not do that because there is no evidence any of that stuff happened unless you have a link to the angle he was standing and the lighting where he was standing.
 
This woman said witnesses three houses away heard them fighting and this lady where TM was found dead right off her porch area said her kitchen window was open and they heard nothing until she said she heard a child whimpering almost pleading and then the shot. They heard no fighting, no wrestling as the other's claim they heard and saw.

So did GZ confront TM and TM knocked him down and tried to run away and GZ caught up with him and then shot him. GZ was on the bottom when the neighbor spotted them wrestling. The next thing is they are three houses down and one of them is whimpering but no fighting just a whimper described as if someone were pleading (why would it be GZ if he had a gun). Mary described it as sounding like a child whimpering and she was sure it was TM.

No homocide detective came to interview her. She made numerous calls that were unreturned. jmo

I hear loud screams on 911 calls then a shot. The voice screaming sounds male, but they both were males. Neither one would sound like a child.
 
This woman said witnesses three houses away heard them fighting and this lady where TM was found dead right off her porch area said her kitchen window was open and they heard nothing until she said she heard a child whimpering almost pleading and then the shot. They heard no fighting, no wrestling as the other's claim they heard and saw.

So did GZ confront TM and TM knocked him down and tried to run away and GZ caught up with him and then shot him. GZ was on the bottom when the neighbor spotted them wrestling. The next thing is they are three houses down and one of them is whimpering but no fighting just a whimper described as if someone were pleading (why would it be GZ if he had a gun). Mary described it as sounding like a child whimpering and she was sure it was TM.

No homocide detective came to interview her. She made numerous calls that were unreturned. jmo

BBM
I'm not sure that it would be possible for GZ being on the ground and then running Trayvon down. JMO.
 
If he was in shock from what had happened he might have not realized his nose was broken. My husband was very sick ,I finally had EMT's rush him to the hospital.EMT took his blood pressure could not find it,as soon as he got into ER they took his blood pressure which was so low they ran and hooked him up to a medicine to raise his pressure.My husband was almost dead it went so low.EMT's never told the ER they could not find his blood pressure.He was on the highest dose for 4 days before his pressure was still very low but they slowly weened him off it.The ER Nurse saved him,IMO EMT's almost killed him by not doing anything when they could not find a reading.Not every EMT is on the ball IMO.Another ER nurse was fighting with me about my hubbys medicines,she insisted he took pills I knew he did not take.After fighting me for a half hour she looks at name on file it was NOT my hubby's file.In 8th grade I broke my finger,school nurse said it was fine.It swelled up and hurt like crazy as soon as I got home my mom saw it took me to Hospital it was broken and had started to set they wanted to re break it I refused.After seeing a dead teen,they may not have really cared too much if he did have a broken nose in the situation.Just saying.

Only parametics can administer meds. EMT's cannot. EMT's also take direction from the ER while in route. My guess is they were instructed to get there asap and to use try and revive him if they lost him in route. Glad to hear your hubby made it because it is scary when they come that close to death. jmo
 
I don’t think it was intent and motive.
I think it was HOT headedness and the need to be
in a "good guy roll" save the people.
Sadly Ego got in the way.

It was a sarcastic remark since GZ was the one that got away, hence referring to himself and not Tray.

"these *advertiser censored******** always get away"
 
911 call from the witness who said the two of them were "wrestling" is not second-hand. The woman (MC) might have not heard any punching or anything, but that doesn't mean the two of them weren't fighting, it only means she didn't hear it.

More then one of the 911 calls stated that the men were wrestling.The long 911 where the woman was very upset,said IIRC they started by one neighbor and ended 3 or 4 neighbors away by her back area.

ETA http://www.wftv.com/videos/news/teen...lls-1-3/vGZnj/

http://www.wftv.com/videos/news/teen...-4-to-6/vGZrB/
 
I believe that was a different witness. The one I am referring to said she heard nothing of the sort. See my post above with link to her interview.

BEM: Seems rather odd since I can hear the yelling myself for a full 45 seconds of the second 911 call I added to my previous post.

Different witnesses at the same shooting, one heard something, the other did not - one can't prove there wasn't a fight because one didn't hear or see it.... trees in the forest and all that :)
 
I saw an article that claim 13 year old saw a man in red (Zimmerman) on the ground. But on 911 call nothing is said about what the man he saw was wearing.

From memory so it may not be accurate - in several newspaper reports there was a young man who saw part of the altercation and said a man on the ground. I don't know if it was the same young man who was on the 911 call with his sister. Both were described as walking dogs.

I don't have links to any of the articles that quoted the young man. If I remember correctly he was the one who was traumatized because he identified with TM as a young black man.
 
It's a gated high end condo complex, not an apartment complex. I doubt if it had a laundry room, or was open late on a Sunday evening - I have no link to prove that, it's just my opinion based upon the gated condo community I live in east of Orlando.


A clubhouse is an unoccupied building now? Our clubhouse, in my gated apartment complex, certain areas are open until 10pm. The laundry room, the pool, and the gym.

ETA: It was only 7:00pm?
 
It's a gated high end condo complex, not an apartment complex. I doubt if it had a laundry room, or was open late on a Sunday evening - I have no link to prove that, it's just my opinion based upon the gated condo community I live in east of Orlando.

Ours is open until 10pm every night, 7 days a week. I live in a private home in a gated community with security.
 
It was a sarcastic remark since GZ was the one that got away, hence referring to himself and not Tray.

"these *advertiser censored******** always get away"

The gated community had some break ins where the perps got away and they were teenagers.So yes some *advertiser censored******** did get away with robbing in that area.
 
To me, and at least one other person.

BBM




And to you they MAY be suspicious, but the fact of the matter is, that I can go outside and do as many suspicious things as I want to, I can burn clothes in my barbeque grill, and I can dig grave sized holes in my yard....I can put on a ski mask in the summer, or long sleeves, and lurk around my neighborhood....but as long as what I am doing is not illegal, then nobody except LE can require that I answer their questions, and if I choose to simply ignore them and leave they can't shoot me....

IMO, JMHO and stuff, All the rhetoric about how TM just MUST have attacked Zimmerman in some manner makes absolutely no sense at all, I think Zimmerman must have been parked in an area that TM path to where he was staying brought him alongside on the sidewalk, or closer to him, and that's where he thought TM was "checking him out" When TM realized he was being followed he attempted to get away, and told his girlfriend that he thought he has lost his follower, and then bam, there he was again. The fact that he asked GZ "why are you following me" leads me to believe that when he realized that Zimmerman was still there or was back again, that Zimmerman was much closer than TM was comfortable with, and the next thing we hear is "What are you doing around here" and common sense tells me (particularly in light of the fact that it is apparent that Zimmerman was thoroughly invested in this chase because A$$&** always get away) that the next thing that happened was that TM turned and attempted to actually get away, and Zimmerman attempted to restrain him in some manner, by grabbing him, and got bopped in the nose, and maybe surprised so much by that that he slipped in wet grass and fell flat on his fanny and smacked the back of his head in the bargain causing an abraison, (I totally discount that there was a cut or gash, because he would have been taken to ER for stitches and CT scan otherwise, and yes, if he was not transported he did have to sign a release for emt's very similar to the release against medical advice, so that he could not at a later date sue them if he did have a subdural hematoma or something and was seriously injured. If he had a "broken" nose, then he would have required extensive medical since a broken nose can result in some very serious medical complications due to swelling in some cases, and he could not have been questioned under those circumstances. This is what my common sense and the little information we have leads me to believe, and it is what I will believe until there is concrete information that refutes it once again IMO, JMHO and stuff.
 
I'm sorry my post wasn't clear. Both quotes are attributed to the father - he claims he thought his son was at the movies, then he claims he son told him he was walking to the store to get some candy.

No. Absolutely wrong.

The article you posted that says his son told him he was going to the store DOES NOT quote the father or even attribute that statement to him.
 
BEM: Seems rather odd since I can hear the yelling myself for a full 45 seconds of the second 911 call I added to my previous post.

Different witnesses at the same shooting, one heard something, the other did not - one can't prove there wasn't a fight because one didn't hear or see it.... trees in the forest and all that :)

The yelling is loud and clearly heard on some of the 911 calls.
 
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