GUILTY FL - Charles Kinsey, autistic caregiver, North Miami, July 2016 -guilty of misdemeanor

[kimlynn]

Very, very wrong. We can hear what's being said so I think it's safe to assume the officers did. We could also see it was a toy truck. The kid holds it up at one point - I don't know whether to show it off or to show it's not a weapon, but it's obviously not a gun.

“They realize this was something inappropriate regarding the shooting,” he said. “If police departments come out more and admit fault, that would probably go a long way,” toward improving relations with the public, he said.

The incident highlights how explosive a situation can get when cops already on edge are forced to confront someone with autism or a mental disability

BBM: This is key. This would be a good start.

Neither should have been shot,but why shoot the guy with his hands up?
Just when you start to feel sorry for them you see sh** like this.
Saw another vid yesterday (can't find it now) of several officers beating a guy that put his hands up and was lying on his stomach.Crazy. IMO

 

[SweetT]

Unfortunately this happens way too often here in the US. And from what I have seen it doesn't matter what color the person is. I've read about police showing up for a call about someone wanting to commit suicide and somehow they end up shot by LE. I have seen a young teen get his head slammed against brick wall for no apparent reason. I have seen my own daughter arrested for assaulting an officer when she really just defended herself from an abusive cop. (guess I'm lucky she didn't get shot) It happens, and they far too often get away with the abusive behavior. I totally respect most LE and feel they deserve all the respect in the world, but there are the few who make them look really bad. Those are the ones who need to lose their badges and be held responsible for their actions. IMO.

 

[Tillicum]

BBM on one of the threads here an LEO made a comment about officers focusing on the weapon (whether or not it was a gun) and they lose focus of what else is happening. They react to the weapon not to the situation or danger. Of everything I've read it makes the most sense - the officers react to this thing they think is about the kill them and they react to the perceived danger. If true that's one more thing we need to examine and fix.

Hey Blue there was a video I saw last night with a witness to the whole thing, beginning to end. Now I can't find it Anyhow he stated that it really did look like the autistic man was holding a gun, not a truck. Not that he was doubting it was a truck but just telling how it looked. There is no excuse IMO for what happened but if the officers did think they were seeing a gun that would fall in line with what you said. I will try to find that video and post a link.

 

[bwt42]

It was an accidental shooting. It could happen to black people, white people, brown people, old people, young people. Even invisible people. jmo

 

[CARIIS]

It was an accidental shooting. It could happen to black people, white people, brown people, old people, young people. Even invisible people. jmo

Could be. Charge manslaughter then , should be in jail however at this time .

<modsnip>

 

[CARIIS]

Hey Blue there was a video I saw last night with a witness to the whole thing, beginning to end. Now I can't find it Anyhow he stated that it really did look like the autistic man was holding a gun, not a truck. Not that he was doubting it was a truck but just telling how it looked. There is no excuse IMO for what happened but if the officers did think they were seeing a gun that would fall in line with what you said. I will try to find that video and post a link.

That could even be more scary. So we have a white person, looks like they are holding a gun, and they shoot the black person lying on the ground ? Oh my, not only do they need to quit target practice using AA mugshots, they need to improve their shooting skills.

They were like 9 feet away, it was a "stationary" event, and they shot a human being with arms in the air, while a person that "might" have a gun sits there.

Our problems maybe deeper than we imagine!!!!!

But we do have to give some credit where credit is do. At least when asked why he was shooting at people he said something like I dont really have a clue or something. So at least that is honest!!

 

[Woodland]

It was an accidental shooting. It could happen to black people, white people, brown people, old people, young people. Even invisible people. jmo

Was this the trigger (no pun intended) needed for the next unstable person to unleash more havoc on LE? Who are they? Where are they? When might they strike?

Imo, this cop could have possibly put a target on the backs of other cops. Not intentionally - but that is the trend these days. When will LE wake up? How many deaths will be necessary?

 

[bluesneakers]

Could be. Charge manslaughter then ,should be in jail however at this time.

IMO not an accident. Maybe attempted manslaughter? Police always shoot with the intent to kill (according to everything I've read about the issue).

Why did they shoot the man with his arms in the air and not the one sitting up and holding the truck?

 

[ohreally]

I don't see how he can be placed in jail yet. This case has been turned over to the state attorneys office. People do not want local law enforcement offices investigating their own officers. Guilty or not. So how can they arrest him, since they cannot be involved in his innocence or guilt. Often when the states attorney is involved they do allow citizens to stay out of jail until their investigation is complete. The department seems to of turned this over to the state attorney office quickly. I don't see how there is any favoritism being shown.
Everything I have seen indicates to me the police department and states attorney are following protocol in this case.
I am not defending the officer, but police officers are investigated is quite different than other arrests to make sure that it is not their own agency deciding the officers guilt or innocence.

 

[SweetT]

It was an accidental shooting. It could happen to black people, white people, brown people, old people, young people. Even invisible people. jmo

So Respectfully how was this an accident? And no it couldn't happen to invisible people as they would not see them to be able to shoot them. But agree it happens to all colors. I just do not see how shooting someone with their hands in the air already could be an accident. You have to aim, shoot. No need in this case IMO.

 

[Betty P]

This might be a situation where better community policing would help. With community policing, the officers would have been familiar with the neighborhood, would have known there was a home for mentally impaired adults there, might even be familiar with the residents and the employees who worked there.

If they were in the community every day, they would have recognized the autistic man and his caregiver.

I really hope LE starts moving in this direction. It makes so much difference when police know the people and businesses in their precinct, etc.

 

[ohreally]

IMO not an accident. Maybe attempted manslaughter? Police always shoot with the intent to kill (according to everything I've read about the issue).

Why did they shoot the man with his arms in the air and not the one sitting up and holding the truck?

As bad as it sounds I do think it is possible he may of been aiming for the one with the truck. The man was shot one time in the leg (two other bullets missing) and his legs are close to the one in the truck. JMO

 

[Cobra Jet]

Do we know if there is video of the moment the police shot him but they are just not showing it because it’s too graphic? The reason I ask is because I’m concerned that people are going to start saying this calm level headed man must have all of a sudden for no apparent reason started acting in a manner that justifies him getting shot. I will wait until all the evidence comes out but from looking at the demeanor of the man lying on his back it seems highly unlikely he started acting threating to the police.

 

[ohreally]

Do we know if there is video of the moment the police shot him but they are just not showing it because it&#8217;s too graphic? The reason I ask is because I&#8217;m concerned that people are going to start saying this calm level headed man must have all of a sudden for no apparent reason started acting in a manner that justifies him getting shot. I will wait until all the evidence comes out but from looking at the demeanor of the man lying on his back it seems highly unlikely he started acting threating to the police.

I agree I don't at all see him all of a sudden making the wrong move. I can however see the autistic man not even comprehending what is going on making the wrong move and the officer reacting.

 

[Betty P]

I'm wondering who called 911 and why.


http://www.cbsnews.com/news/florida...med-caregiver-of-autistic-man-victim-account/

Yes, it would be helpful to know that. They certainly misread the situation, badly. Do the people in that neighborhood not know there's a residence there for mentally challenged adults? There was a residence like this in the last neighborhood I lived in. Everyone knew it was there. Everyone knew who the people and workers were, saw them outside on a regular basis. LE knew them, too. I don't get this.

ETA: LE in this news story should visit this home, meet the residents and workers, maybe even take the residents some little toys - trucks, stuffed animals, etc. This is a no brainer. If there's ever an emergency (fire, accident, etc.), it would help for the residents to be familiar with LE, uniforms, etc. and know not to fear them. I recall LE and firemen used to do this when my kids were in school. Visit, show them their gear and uniforms, etc.

 

[bwt42]

So Respectfully how was this an accident? And no it couldn't happen to invisible people as they would not see them to be able to shoot them. But agree it happens to all colors. I just do not see how shooting someone with their hands in the air already could be an accident. You have to aim, shoot. No need in this case IMO.

We'll have to wait for the officers version. With what we know, I think some charge should be brought. I think it absurd that the officer would shoot just because he could. jmo

 

[SweetT]

We'll have to wait for the officers version. With what we know, I think some charge should be brought. I think it absurd that the officer would shoot just because he could. jmo

Me too, waiting for an explanation.

 

[CARIIS]

Me too, waiting for an explanation.

Isn't always interesting how it takes LE a week to release an explaination.

Yes, it would be helpful to know that. They certainly misread the situation, badly. Do the people in that neighborhood not know there's a residence there for mentally challenged adults? There was a residence like this in the last neighborhood I lived in. Everyone knew it was there. Everyone knew who the people and workers were, saw them outside on a regular basis. LE knew them, too. I don't get this.

ETA: LE in this news story should visit this home, meet the residents and workers, maybe even take the residents some little toys - trucks, stuffed animals, etc. This is a no brainer. If there's ever an emergency (fire, accident, etc.), it would help for the residents to be familiar with LE, uniforms, etc. and know not to fear them. I recall LE and firemen used to do this when my kids were in school. Visit, show them their gear and uniforms, etc.

Even just common sense, for someone supposedly trained , ought to be able to "know" and conclude that they were observing someone obviouluy struggling with some malady, that is not threatening. He was swooshing his toy around in the air, not making eye contact (That is autism) How these guys felt threatened is qctually indicative of the climate they have created by shooting unarmed people for the last year.


And noone going to jail is escalating everything to the place where we are now imo

I agree I don't at all see him all of a sudden making the wrong move. I can however see the autistic man not even comprehending what is going on making the wrong move and the officer reacting.

But then we have a cop , 8 feet away, shooting the wrong person. THAT is another whole issue imo- its not like it was a chaotic scene, at least as far as we know now moo

As bad as it sounds I do think it is possible he may of been aiming for the one with the truck. The man was shot one time in the leg (two other bullets missing) and his legs are close to the one in the truck. JMO

OK, that is an option, but its "ok" having never held or seen a real gun if I made a mistake like that! Trained people with two people out in the middle of nowhere - thats concerning, just like doctors who accidenlty amputate the wrong limb --bothersome!


shortened:


I am not defending the officer, but police officers are investigated is quite different than other arrests to make sure that it is not their own agency deciding the officers guilt or innocence.[/QUOTE]


that is only recent and still rare. Freddie started it - up till then -- each dept investigated itself, found itself fine, and here we are moo

 

[kodi]

Yes, it would be helpful to know that. They certainly misread the situation, badly. Do the people in that neighborhood not know there's a residence there for mentally challenged adults? There was a residence like this in the last neighborhood I lived in. Everyone knew it was there. Everyone knew who the people and workers were, saw them outside on a regular basis. LE knew them, too. I don't get this.

ETA: LE in this news story should visit this home, meet the residents and workers, maybe even take the residents some little toys - trucks, stuffed animals, etc. This is a no brainer. If there's ever an emergency (fire, accident, etc.), it would help for the residents to be familiar with LE, uniforms, etc. and know not to fear them. I recall LE and firemen used to do this when my kids were in school. Visit, show them their gear and uniforms, etc.

BBM

:goodpost:

 

[JLSChook]

https://www.facebook.com/miamiherald/videos/10154398371602300/?permPage=1

Frustrating presser, IMO. Hard to hear and not much to go on...yet.