FL FL - Daytona, WhtMale 2128UMFL, 11-21, near pond, denim jacket, May'72

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Diavola said:
Has he been suggested for genetic genealogy to anyone?
Click to expand...
I'm not sure if he's been suggested for genetic genealogy, but if he is, the labs have their work cut out for them. If I recall correctly, he was exhumed rather recently, like within the past 5 years, in an attempt to obtain a usable DNA sample, but they were unsuccessful. I think his remains were too degraded. Plus, exhumation is expensive, so I'm not sure they could justify doing it again. Unless they kept a sample from their last attempt, and it's a usable sample, or even hair, that can be used with today's techniques, genetic genealogy may not be feasible.
 
@othram textbook “DNA too degraded” … maybe a sample was retainers, though?

@Hochman gosh he’s just got those chubby cheeks of such a little boy in that recon. In a way I really hope he was older and had more reasons to be out on his own. How sad.
 
Alleykins said:
I'm not sure if he's been suggested for genetic genealogy, but if he is, the labs have their work cut out for them. If I recall correctly, he was exhumed rather recently, like within the past 5 years, in an attempt to obtain a usable DNA sample, but they were unsuccessful. I think his remains were too degraded. Plus, exhumation is expensive, so I'm not sure they could justify doing it again. Unless they kept a sample from their last attempt, and it's a usable sample, or even hair, that can be used with today's techniques, genetic genealogy may not be feasible.
Click to expand...
I've not reviewed the entire thread recently but Othram Labs doesn't need a large amount of DNA to solve a case. Tagging @othram just in case they're unaware and could possibly assist.

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Alleykins said:
Oh, my goodness! Has someone told @Ms Suzanne? She's gotta know.
I'm stunned. Have they announced anything officially yet? I'm near tears knowing this, thank you for posting.
Click to expand...
Yes, it's great! Here is hope for this precious child that is still not identified

OT (about another child. The boy in the box) but because you asked

From 1-12-2022 Philadelphia Police Set To Reveal Identity of 'Boy in the Box' Found Dead in 1957

Thanks to a breakthrough in DNA evidence, however, authorities have now been able to retrieve the boy's birth certificate and will next week tell the world his name, sources confirmed to NBC10 on Wednesday.
 
A few new details:

- When deputies first responded, they didn't see any signs of foul play, but later revised their assessment to state that he may have died from internal bleeding caused by a blow to the chest and was either murdered or was the victim of a hit-and-run. It was not until the autopsy was completed that the cause of death was determined to be from stab wounds. The victim was stabbed three times in the chest, three times in the leg, and once in the abdomen.

- The bike found at the scene had been reported stolen from a New Smyrna Beach home on May 3, but police determined it was unconnected to the case. A black wallet with blue and green paint on it, containing $6.17, was also found at the scene.

- Volusia County Sheriff Ed Duff stated that "the victim was unclothed from the waist down, and we think it is highly possible he may have been sexually attacked before the murder." His pants were still hanging from one of his legs and his pubic hair was reportedly shaved off.

- Although no murder weapon was recovered at the scene, police believe it was likely pocket knife sized.

- It is believed that the boy was killed elsewhere and his body later dumped in the isolated area, as no blood was found at the scene.

"Probe Launched After Body Found," Orlando Sentinel, 8 May 1972, 7A.
Probe Launched After Body Found_.jpg
Volusia County sheriff's deputies Sunday night were attempting to identify a body found by two motorcyclists Sunday afternoon in a wooded area near here.

According to Sheriff Ed Duff, the body of a man believed to be between 15 and 30 had been in the woods "for some time."

The body was found off Indian Lake Road west of Interstate 95 near the Volusia County juvenile home.

[...]

Deputies said Sunday night they have not been able to pinpoint the time of death. Deputies said there were no "immediate signs of foul play."

"Murder Possible In Teen's Death," Orlando Sentinel, 9 May 1972, 3A.
Murder Possible In Teen's Death_.jpg
Cause of death of a male teen-ager whose body was found in an isolated, wooded area near here Sunday was listed Monday as internal bleeding due to a severe blow to the chest.

Sheriff Ed Dugg, who said the badly decomposed body was found off Indian Lake Road west of I-95 by two motorcyclists, said the boy may have been murdered or the victim of a hit and run.

A bicycle, stolen from a Daytona Beach home early last week, was found near the scene, as was a number of empty beer cans.

Dr. Arthur Schwartz, Volusia County medical examiner, said Monday the body had been dead at least four days when he was found.

"Unidentified Man Victim Of Murder," Orlando Sentinel, 10 May 1972, 2B.
Unidentified Man Victim Of Murder_.jpg
An unidentified young man, whose body was found Sunday in an isolated area near here, was definitely murdered, Volusia County sheriff Ed Duff said Tuesday.

According to autopsy reports, the victim, believed to be about 20 years old, was stabbed three times in the chest, three times in the leg and once in the abdomen.

"We have a murder case on our hands," Duff said, "and right now we need to identify the body so we can start working on leads to find the murderer."

[...]

When found Sunday afternoon by two motorcyclists off India [sic] Lake Road west of I-95, he was wearing a blue jean jacket, purple and grey tweed-type pants, black loafers and a short-sleeve, pull-over knit shirt. The shirt is maroon and white.

[...]

According to Dr. Arthur Schwartz, Volusia County medical examiner the boy had been dead about four days when his body was found. He was carrying a black, leather wallet containing $6.17 but no identification.

"Youth Victim Of Sex Killer," Orlando Sentinel, 11 May 1972, B2.
Youth Victim Of Sex Killer_.jpg
The body of a young man found Sunday in a wooded area near here remained unidentified Wednesday as Volusia County sheriff Ed Duff said he believes the man was the victim of a sex killer.

"The victim was unclothed from the waist down," Duff said, "and we think it is highly possible he may have been sexually attacked before the murder."

Jackie Van Hoose, "Unidentified Body Baffles Sheriff's Investigators," Orlando Sentinel, 14 June 1972, B2.
Unidentified Body Baffles Sheriff's Investigators_.jpg
Art Dees of the sheriff's office said Tuesday, "We are still getting some very strong leads, but today we can't put our finger on a single one that exactly fits the facts we already have in the case."

The strongest lead seemed to be a bicycle found at the death scene.

Reported stolen from a New Smyrna Beach home on May 3, just four days before the body was discovered by two motorcyclists it seems now to have no connection in the case, Dees said.

The victim was stabbed seven times, according to the medical examiner. Three times in the chest, three times in the left leg and once in the abdomen. No weapon has been recovered but it is believed to be pocket knife size.

Found unclothed from the waist down on May 7, the youth's trousers still hung from one leg, authorities said.

[...]

"We have sent all details of the case to the FBI Washington files and have fingerprinted the victim's hands. Although badly decomposed they have not indicated he had a crime record."

Ron McIntosh, "3-Month-Old Murder Baffles Deputies," Orlando Sentinel, 25 July 1972, V1.
3-Month-Old Murder Baffles Deputies_.jpg
Nearly three months ago, the battered and badly decomposed body of a young man was found floating in a stream in a wooded area off Indian Lake Road, near Daytona Beach.

[...]

When found, a pair of purple and grey tweed effect pants was dangling from his ankle. Blue jeans jacket, black loafers and a short sleeve pull-over knit shirt also were found in the area.

In addition, deputies said they found a black leather wallet, with blue and green paint on it, containing $6.17.

[...]

"We believe he was the victim of a sex attack," Duff said, "and it probably was something of a homosexual nature.

"He had been disrobed, and all the hair on his lower body had been shaved off," Duff said.

According to Investigator Art Dees, deputies are working on the theory the young man was killed somewhere other than in the wooded area, but brought to the area after his death.

"We are fairly sure he was not killed where we found him," Dees said, "as we found no signs of a struggle or any fresh blood."

[...]

"We keep running into dead ends," Dees said. "We believe the young man was a transient who probably stole the bicycle and was heading north when he met his murderer.

"But we do not have anything other than theory, and a few bits and pieces of information to go on," Dees said.
 
citizen_sleuth said:
A few new details:

- When deputies first responded, they didn't see any signs of foul play, but later revised their assessment to state that he may have died from internal bleeding caused by a blow to the chest and was either murdered or was the victim of a hit-and-run. It was not until the autopsy was completed that the cause of death was determined to be from stab wounds. The victim was stabbed three times in the chest, three times in the leg, and once in the abdomen.

- The bike found at the scene had been reported stolen from a New Smyrna Beach home on May 3, but police determined it was unconnected to the case. A black wallet with blue and green paint on it, containing $6.17, was also found at the scene.

- Volusia County Sheriff Ed Duff stated that "the victim was unclothed from the waist down, and we think it is highly possible he may have been sexually attacked before the murder." His pants were still hanging from one of his legs and his pubic hair was reportedly shaved off.

- Although no murder weapon was recovered at the scene, police believe it was likely pocket knife sized.

- It is believed that the boy was killed elsewhere and his body later dumped in the isolated area, as no blood was found at the scene.

"Probe Launched After Body Found," Orlando Sentinel, 8 May 1972, 7A.
View attachment 393153
Volusia County sheriff's deputies Sunday night were attempting to identify a body found by two motorcyclists Sunday afternoon in a wooded area near here.

According to Sheriff Ed Duff, the body of a man believed to be between 15 and 30 had been in the woods "for some time."

The body was found off Indian Lake Road west of Interstate 95 near the Volusia County juvenile home.

[...]

Deputies said Sunday night they have not been able to pinpoint the time of death. Deputies said there were no "immediate signs of foul play."

"Murder Possible In Teen's Death," Orlando Sentinel, 9 May 1972, 3A.
View attachment 393154
Cause of death of a male teen-ager whose body was found in an isolated, wooded area near here Sunday was listed Monday as internal bleeding due to a severe blow to the chest.

Sheriff Ed Dugg, who said the badly decomposed body was found off Indian Lake Road west of I-95 by two motorcyclists, said the boy may have been murdered or the victim of a hit and run.

A bicycle, stolen from a Daytona Beach home early last week, was found near the scene, as was a number of empty beer cans.

Dr. Arthur Schwartz, Volusia County medical examiner, said Monday the body had been dead at least four days when he was found.

"Unidentified Man Victim Of Murder," Orlando Sentinel, 10 May 1972, 2B.
View attachment 393156
An unidentified young man, whose body was found Sunday in an isolated area near here, was definitely murdered, Volusia County sheriff Ed Duff said Tuesday.

According to autopsy reports, the victim, believed to be about 20 years old, was stabbed three times in the chest, three times in the leg and once in the abdomen.

"We have a murder case on our hands," Duff said, "and right now we need to identify the body so we can start working on leads to find the murderer."

[...]

When found Sunday afternoon by two motorcyclists off India [sic] Lake Road west of I-95, he was wearing a blue jean jacket, purple and grey tweed-type pants, black loafers and a short-sleeve, pull-over knit shirt. The shirt is maroon and white.

[...]

According to Dr. Arthur Schwartz, Volusia County medical examiner the boy had been dead about four days when his body was found. He was carrying a black, leather wallet containing $6.17 but no identification.

"Youth Victim Of Sex Killer," Orlando Sentinel, 11 May 1972, B2.
View attachment 393159
The body of a young man found Sunday in a wooded area near here remained unidentified Wednesday as Volusia County sheriff Ed Duff said he believes the man was the victim of a sex killer.

"The victim was unclothed from the waist down," Duff said, "and we think it is highly possible he may have been sexually attacked before the murder."

Jackie Van Hoose, "Unidentified Body Baffles Sheriff's Investigators," Orlando Sentinel, 14 June 1972, B2.
View attachment 393163
Art Dees of the sheriff's office said Tuesday, "We are still getting some very strong leads, but today we can't put our finger on a single one that exactly fits the facts we already have in the case."

The strongest lead seemed to be a bicycle found at the death scene.

Reported stolen from a New Smyrna Beach home on May 3, just four days before the body was discovered by two motorcyclists it seems now to have no connection in the case, Dees said.

The victim was stabbed seven times, according to the medical examiner. Three times in the chest, three times in the left leg and once in the abdomen. No weapon has been recovered but it is believed to be pocket knife size.

Found unclothed from the waist down on May 7, the youth's trousers still hung from one leg, authorities said.

[...]

"We have sent all details of the case to the FBI Washington files and have fingerprinted the victim's hands. Although badly decomposed they have not indicated he had a crime record."

Ron McIntosh, "3-Month-Old Murder Baffles Deputies," Orlando Sentinel, 25 July 1972, V1.
View attachment 393168
Nearly three months ago, the battered and badly decomposed body of a young man was found floating in a stream in a wooded area off Indian Lake Road, near Daytona Beach.

[...]

When found, a pair of purple and grey tweed effect pants was dangling from his ankle. Blue jeans jacket, black loafers and a short sleeve pull-over knit shirt also were found in the area.

In addition, deputies said they found a black leather wallet, with blue and green paint on it, containing $6.17.

[...]

"We believe he was the victim of a sex attack," Duff said, "and it probably was something of a homosexual nature.

"He had been disrobed, and all the hair on his lower body had been shaved off," Duff said.

According to Investigator Art Dees, deputies are working on the theory the young man was killed somewhere other than in the wooded area, but brought to the area after his death.

"We are fairly sure he was not killed where we found him," Dees said, "as we found no signs of a struggle or any fresh blood."

[...]

"We keep running into dead ends," Dees said. "We believe the young man was a transient who probably stole the bicycle and was heading north when he met his murderer.

"But we do not have anything other than theory, and a few bits and pieces of information to go on," Dees said.
Click to expand...
It's critical they keep referring to his age of about twenty yrs. which is so different then 11 - 14 in the Namus file. I see a person of twenty being sexually active by choice but ran into the wrong person. Totally different from a situation with a 11 - 14 yrs. boy IMO.

Did they hold on to the beer cans by any chance? There could be still DNA on it?

Maybe a weird question. Does the pink shirt has any meaning, because there was a time pink clothing for men was associated with being gay. But maybe not in the early 70's?
 
citizen_sleuth said:
A few new details:

- When deputies first responded, they didn't see any signs of foul play, but later revised their assessment to state that he may have died from internal bleeding caused by a blow to the chest and was either murdered or was the victim of a hit-and-run. It was not until the autopsy was completed that the cause of death was determined to be from stab wounds. The victim was stabbed three times in the chest, three times in the leg, and once in the abdomen.

- The bike found at the scene had been reported stolen from a New Smyrna Beach home on May 3, but police determined it was unconnected to the case. A black wallet with blue and green paint on it, containing $6.17, was also found at the scene.

- Volusia County Sheriff Ed Duff stated that "the victim was unclothed from the waist down, and we think it is highly possible he may have been sexually attacked before the murder." His pants were still hanging from one of his legs and his pubic hair was reportedly shaved off.

- Although no murder weapon was recovered at the scene, police believe it was likely pocket knife sized.

- It is believed that the boy was killed elsewhere and his body later dumped in the isolated area, as no blood was found at the scene.

"Probe Launched After Body Found," Orlando Sentinel, 8 May 1972, 7A.
View attachment 393153
Volusia County sheriff's deputies Sunday night were attempting to identify a body found by two motorcyclists Sunday afternoon in a wooded area near here.

According to Sheriff Ed Duff, the body of a man believed to be between 15 and 30 had been in the woods "for some time."

The body was found off Indian Lake Road west of Interstate 95 near the Volusia County juvenile home.

[...]

Deputies said Sunday night they have not been able to pinpoint the time of death. Deputies said there were no "immediate signs of foul play."

"Murder Possible In Teen's Death," Orlando Sentinel, 9 May 1972, 3A.
View attachment 393154
Cause of death of a male teen-ager whose body was found in an isolated, wooded area near here Sunday was listed Monday as internal bleeding due to a severe blow to the chest.

Sheriff Ed Dugg, who said the badly decomposed body was found off Indian Lake Road west of I-95 by two motorcyclists, said the boy may have been murdered or the victim of a hit and run.

A bicycle, stolen from a Daytona Beach home early last week, was found near the scene, as was a number of empty beer cans.

Dr. Arthur Schwartz, Volusia County medical examiner, said Monday the body had been dead at least four days when he was found.

"Unidentified Man Victim Of Murder," Orlando Sentinel, 10 May 1972, 2B.
View attachment 393156
An unidentified young man, whose body was found Sunday in an isolated area near here, was definitely murdered, Volusia County sheriff Ed Duff said Tuesday.

According to autopsy reports, the victim, believed to be about 20 years old, was stabbed three times in the chest, three times in the leg and once in the abdomen.

"We have a murder case on our hands," Duff said, "and right now we need to identify the body so we can start working on leads to find the murderer."

[...]

When found Sunday afternoon by two motorcyclists off India [sic] Lake Road west of I-95, he was wearing a blue jean jacket, purple and grey tweed-type pants, black loafers and a short-sleeve, pull-over knit shirt. The shirt is maroon and white.

[...]

According to Dr. Arthur Schwartz, Volusia County medical examiner the boy had been dead about four days when his body was found. He was carrying a black, leather wallet containing $6.17 but no identification.

"Youth Victim Of Sex Killer," Orlando Sentinel, 11 May 1972, B2.
View attachment 393159
The body of a young man found Sunday in a wooded area near here remained unidentified Wednesday as Volusia County sheriff Ed Duff said he believes the man was the victim of a sex killer.

"The victim was unclothed from the waist down," Duff said, "and we think it is highly possible he may have been sexually attacked before the murder."

Jackie Van Hoose, "Unidentified Body Baffles Sheriff's Investigators," Orlando Sentinel, 14 June 1972, B2.
View attachment 393163
Art Dees of the sheriff's office said Tuesday, "We are still getting some very strong leads, but today we can't put our finger on a single one that exactly fits the facts we already have in the case."

The strongest lead seemed to be a bicycle found at the death scene.

Reported stolen from a New Smyrna Beach home on May 3, just four days before the body was discovered by two motorcyclists it seems now to have no connection in the case, Dees said.

The victim was stabbed seven times, according to the medical examiner. Three times in the chest, three times in the left leg and once in the abdomen. No weapon has been recovered but it is believed to be pocket knife size.

Found unclothed from the waist down on May 7, the youth's trousers still hung from one leg, authorities said.

[...]

"We have sent all details of the case to the FBI Washington files and have fingerprinted the victim's hands. Although badly decomposed they have not indicated he had a crime record."

Ron McIntosh, "3-Month-Old Murder Baffles Deputies," Orlando Sentinel, 25 July 1972, V1.
View attachment 393168
Nearly three months ago, the battered and badly decomposed body of a young man was found floating in a stream in a wooded area off Indian Lake Road, near Daytona Beach.

[...]

When found, a pair of purple and grey tweed effect pants was dangling from his ankle. Blue jeans jacket, black loafers and a short sleeve pull-over knit shirt also were found in the area.

In addition, deputies said they found a black leather wallet, with blue and green paint on it, containing $6.17.

[...]

"We believe he was the victim of a sex attack," Duff said, "and it probably was something of a homosexual nature.

"He had been disrobed, and all the hair on his lower body had been shaved off," Duff said.

According to Investigator Art Dees, deputies are working on the theory the young man was killed somewhere other than in the wooded area, but brought to the area after his death.

"We are fairly sure he was not killed where we found him," Dees said, "as we found no signs of a struggle or any fresh blood."

[...]

"We keep running into dead ends," Dees said. "We believe the young man was a transient who probably stole the bicycle and was heading north when he met his murderer.

"But we do not have anything other than theory, and a few bits and pieces of information to go on," Dees said.
Click to expand...
Oh citizen sleuth thank you so much for posting all these articles. Lots of info!!
 
I'm pleased to report that underwritten by Genealogy For Justice™ (G4J), a newly discovered sample for this Volusia County Johnny Doe (1972) is being extracted now.

There is a whole group of people at FHD Forensics, G4J, VCSO and our lab partner, Astrea Forensics who are DEDICATED to doing whatever possible to name this young boy. The idea that the world thought for decades that this body was for a 20 year old man leads to all kinds of potential tragedies for his family in missed opportunities.

Please hold good thoughts and send positive vibes to the whole team for the next six weeks - a critical time for this case. This work is so hard on even the most experienced investigators. The sheriff's office started in the hole after decades of no leads and no usable technology. And we don't know what his remains were exposed to that have made it impossible so far to extract usable DNA. Many different things have been attempted and we will continue to attempt until we run out of options.

In a stroke of divine order, we discovered him when we went looking for a case with ties to Dean and Tina Clouse's hometown. The fact is, he was likely born around the same year or so that Dean was born. We felt like it was meant to be for us to take on this case.

Thank you all for your interest in this young boy. It is articles like these are what help fuel our work and led to our call to the Sheriff.

This is a hard one for all of us. If you want to help make sure Johnny is identified, please look for his DNA expenses fundraiser on the Genealogy For Justice fundraising portal. Links are on G4J and FHD websites.
 
FamilyHistoryDetectives said:
I'm pleased to report that underwritten by Genealogy For Justice™ (G4J), a newly discovered sample for this Volusia County Johnny Doe (1972) is being extracted now.

There is a whole group of people at FHD Forensics, G4J, VCSO and our lab partner, Astrea Forensics who are DEDICATED to doing whatever possible to name this young boy. The idea that the world thought for decades that this body was for a 20 year old man leads to all kinds of potential tragedies for his family in missed opportunities.

Please hold good thoughts and send positive vibes to the whole team for the next six weeks - a critical time for this case. This work is so hard on even the most experienced investigators. The sheriff's office started in the hole after decades of no leads and no usable technology. And we don't know what his remains were exposed to that have made it impossible so far to extract usable DNA. Many different things have been attempted and we will continue to attempt until we run out of options.

In a stroke of divine order, we discovered him when we went looking for a case with ties to Dean and Tina Clouse's hometown. The fact is, he was likely born around the same year or so that Dean was born. We felt like it was meant to be for us to take on this case.

Thank you all for your interest in this young boy. It is articles like these are what help fuel our work and led to our call to the Sheriff.

This is a hard one for all of us. If you want to help make sure Johnny is identified, please look for his DNA expenses fundraiser on the Genealogy For Justice fundraising portal. Links are on G4J and FHD websites.
Click to expand...
This is great news. Thank you for sharing.
 
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