GUILTY FL - Jordan Davis, 17, shot to death, Satellite Beach, 23 Nov 2012 #8

[ElleElle]

What does this mean, exactly? Serious question. I'm not sure what that means wrt gun violence.

But putting aside what your meaning was, I'm sure drugs are there already and have been for a long time. Including heroin. There's still almost no gun crime and I don't think much, if any, of what there is is related directly to drugs -- as in related to drug transactions.

jmo

eta: of the last two murders I know of in Scottsdale, one was a husband who choked his wife to death in their home and turned himself in immediately. The other was a jealous STBex who shot the new boyfriend then himself. Not sure if his gun was legal or not.

I should have been more clear. From my experience and where I live(d), if there are any shootings it is usually gang related and where there are gangs, there are drugs. I currently reside in a more wealthier part of town and the only shootings that seem to occur is usually: sex, drugs and booze related.

I've also lived in so called "ghettos" and the killings there were more stabbings because guns are expensive and harder to get in Canada.

 

[ElleElle]

I noticed as Im sure everyone did that MD was very careful to make tons of eye contact with that jury on every answer and I sort of got the impression that he was focusing on one or two. Some are speculating about an older guy that they thought may be have been a holdout...don't know but I fully agee. I believe the fact that JA was on that stand for so many days is why they could not decide the penalty.

BBM~ Older? As in older than MD?

I have a feeling it may a woman, possibly single.

 

[Jellyworker]

That's really interesting. Thanks for elaborating. I'm in AZ and I imagine the laws are similar here. I'm going to look to see if I can find a case where a minor carrying a loaded weapon in public used it to defend themselves and what happened.

And, btw, I'm not black and neither are my kids, but I've also taught both of them not to talk to the cops. Ever. Until they have a lawyer present. I actually got into it one day with the school police over that. They called to "let me know" they were going to talk with my dd. Yeah--no!

Yea. Never ever ever talk to the cops. Never agree to a search. Keep your hands on the steering wheel if you get pulled over. Only remove your hands after the cop gives you permission. And even then say out loud to the cop, I'm reaching for my license and wait for the second verbal ok. It's sad but I've drilled this into her.

Also carrying a loaded weapon, teen or adult, in Texas without a permit in a public place is a nono. Don't do that. Unless by carrying a loaded weapon you meant concealed inside the car.


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[tlcya]

:bump:

You nailed it Zuri!

Yes, Zuri nailed it indeed. And it caused me to look at myself and the people around me. It caused conversation about something we are trying to be too politically correct to discuss as a society, as a nation.

If this case, or any other that has played out in the press recently which leaves one person shooting another in alleged fear of that other, causes me to examine myself, or check myself, I think that a good and right thing.

That is key IMO to take away from this case. Whether it is retried, and it seems it will be, or not, that is what I take from this.

I live in a depressed area. I live in a very racially and culturally diverse area. I struggle with my own opinions and prejudices daily. But I do try. I do examine self. I do examine my neighborhood and try to see it's residents as individuals, as folks, not colors or jobs, or station in life. I check myself. I check others around me when I can.

I hope others take that vigilance from this case. That self examination. NO matter the future outcome of a retrial on Murder of Jordan Davis.

 

[Karmady]

Yea. Never ever ever talk to the cops. Never agree to a search. Keep your hands on the steering wheel if you get pulled over. Only remove your hands after the cop gives you permission. And even then say out loud to the cop, I'm reaching for my license and wait for the second verbal ok. It's sad but I've drilled this into her.

Also carrying a loaded weapon, teen or adult, in Texas without a permit in a public place is a nono. Don't do that. Unless by carrying a loaded weapon you meant concealed inside the car.


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Here's the NC statute. I'm gathering from looking into it that this varies widely state to state -- just like general gun law


§ 14-269.7. Prohibitions on handguns for minors.

(a) Any minor who willfully and intentionally possesses or carries a handgun is guilty of a Class 1 misdemeanor.

(b) This section does not apply:

(1) To officers and enlisted personnel of the Armed Forces of the United States when in discharge of their official duties or acting under orders requiring them to carry handguns.

(2) To a minor who possesses a handgun for educational or recreational purposes while the minor is supervised by an adult who is present.

(3) To an emancipated minor who possesses such handgun inside his or her residence.

(4) To a minor who possesses a handgun while hunting or trapping outside the limits of an incorporated municipality if he has on his person written permission from a parent, guardian, or other person standing in loco parentis.

(c) The following definitions apply in this section:

(1) Handgun. - A firearm that has a short stock and is designed to be fired by the use of a single hand, or any combination of parts from which such a firearm can be assembled.

(2) Minor. - Any person under 18 years of age. (1993, c. 259, s. 1; 1994, Ex. Sess., c. 14, s. 5; 1993 (Reg. Sess., 1994), c. 597, s. 1; 2011-183, s. 9; 2011-268, s. 6.)


http://www.ncga.state.nc.us/EnactedLegislation/Statutes/HTML/BySection/Chapter_14/GS_14-269.7.html

 

[Karmady]

I should have been more clear. From my experience and where I live(d), if there are any shootings it is usually gang related and where there are gangs, there are drugs. I currently reside in a more wealthier part of town and the only shootings that seem to occur is usually: sex, drugs and booze related.

I've also lived in so called "ghettos" and the killings there were more stabbings because guns are expensive and harder to get in Canada.

The fluffy bunnies are the Dale's claim to gang violence. lol So far, no murders and, afaik, they haven't been heard from since this bust. But I'll have to check.

 

[Jellyworker]

Here's the NC statute. I'm gathering from looking into it that this varies widely state to state -- just like general gun law


§ 14-269.7. Prohibitions on handguns for minors.

(a) Any minor who willfully and intentionally possesses or carries a handgun is guilty of a Class 1 misdemeanor.

(b) This section does not apply:

(1) To officers and enlisted personnel of the Armed Forces of the United States when in discharge of their official duties or acting under orders requiring them to carry handguns.

(2) To a minor who possesses a handgun for educational or recreational purposes while the minor is supervised by an adult who is present.

(3) To an emancipated minor who possesses such handgun inside his or her residence.

(4) To a minor who possesses a handgun while hunting or trapping outside the limits of an incorporated municipality if he has on his person written permission from a parent, guardian, or other person standing in loco parentis.

(c) The following definitions apply in this section:

(1) Handgun. - A firearm that has a short stock and is designed to be fired by the use of a single hand, or any combination of parts from which such a firearm can be assembled.

(2) Minor. - Any person under 18 years of age. (1993, c. 259, s. 1; 1994, Ex. Sess., c. 14, s. 5; 1993 (Reg. Sess., 1994), c. 597, s. 1; 2011-183, s. 9; 2011-268, s. 6.)


http://www.ncga.state.nc.us/EnactedLegislation/Statutes/HTML/BySection/Chapter_14/GS_14-269.7.html

Very interesting. A permission slip from mom always makes things ok. Lol


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[tlcya]

BBM~ Older? As in older than MD?

I have a feeling it may a woman, possibly single.

funny I got male.

 

[luvmygarden]

think about this for a minute. do you think a jury that couldn't reach a verdict when no gun was ever found, if those kids had shot back, do you think the jury would believe those black kids were shooting back in self defense?

seriously. would anyone have believed that he shot first and they were shooting back unless there was a clear video showing it.


remember. even unarmed black teens in florida are guilty. i can't imagine how they'd treat a black youth that tried to defend themselves.

You're right
And that is what is wrong with our country, some would only believe if there was a video of the entire incident. It is getting ridiculous with the confidence a gun gives someone. I believe in gun rights but not the misinterpretation of the right. The other night we were going to my 10 yr old granddaughters basketball game. We were second in line from the light at a left hand turn. The guy behind us started honking like crazy then he was yelling where did u get your drivers license? My husband smokes so he had his window down and so we could hear what was said. We have cameras at intersections to get people who go thru red lights on left turns at busy intersections. We were not going to go just because this guy 3rd car back from the light wanted to get thru the yellow light.
Being that I follow this Dunn case needless to say I was stressed. I believe Dunn was under the influence of alcohol and maybe even drugs. He is a road rage kinda guy. I think the guy behind us was a road rage kinda guy so who knows what can happen to us on a typical going to basketball kinda night. Those boys were interested in getting some girlfriends not giving a second thought about harassing an old fat man. Sorry for my rant.

 

[sdmike1974]

Not that you can necessarily draw an accurate comparison, but here is the timeline for jurors speaking publicly after the last high profile trial in Florida.

SAT 7/13 George Zimmerman Acquittal
MON 7/15 Juror B37 speaks to CNN (2 days after trial ended)
THU 7/25 Juror B29 speaks to ABC (12 days after trial ended)

B37 was considered one of the more aggressive jurors and was thought to have been forceful during deliberations. This may have played a role in her coming forward so quickly.
B29 was rather meek by comparison and the only minority on the jury. She was the one who entertained second thoughts about voting not guilty.

 

[ElleElle]

Yes, Zuri nailed it indeed. And it caused me to look at myself and the people around me. It caused conversation about something we are trying to be too politically correct to discuss as a society, as a nation.

If this case, or any other that has played out in the press recently which leaves one person shooting another in alleged fear of that other, causes me to examine myself, or check myself, I think that a good and right thing.

That is key IMO to take away from this case. Whether it is retried, and it seems it will be, or not, that is what I take from this.

I live in a depressed area. I live in a very racially and culturally diverse area. I struggle with my own opinions and prejudices daily. But I do try. I do examine self. I do examine my neighborhood and try to see it's residents as individuals, as folks, not colors or jobs, or station in life. I check myself. I check others around me when I can.

I hope others take that vigilance from this case. That self examination. NO matter the future outcome of a retrial on Murder of Jordan Davis.

Great post tlcya!

I hope there a retrial ASAP and a witness could come out and tell the truth about MD's possible alcoholism.

And, for me, traveling the world and living in cities where refugees were abundant from all over the world gave me the insight that at the end of the day, we are all humans with red blood.

To me, race does not matter. I always believed once a fine, black fellow became president along with all the talented music artists, actors etc... our society would of learned to accept each for who were are.
I suppose some parts of the continent have it in their blood to hate and still equate "black teenagers in hoodies driving SUV's listening to rap music buying Skittles and Arizona iced tea" to sub-class.

I wonder how different the case would of turned out if the SUV had white teenagers? Personally, I don't think there would of been any shots fired. :twocents:

 

[Karmady]

This is a very interesting opinion. Thanks for posting it.


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Indeed. That pesky Constitution and those archaic provisions that were intended to free us from tyranny and what not :facepalm:

 

[ElleElle]

This is a very interesting opinion. Thanks for posting it.


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I've said it many times. There are some people who use guns as a curtain for their personal weaknesses, be it anger, jealousy, and/or a combination with mind-altering substance(s) and not self-defense - the way they are intended to be used for.

It just seems over and over again ... "Whoops, I shot and killed someone? It was self-defense".

It's becoming really sad. I wish these murderers would just own up and admit to what they did is wrong.

I have yet to see a true self-defense case involving a gun that is not mainstream.

 

[luvmygarden]

I think everyone should carry a small spray bottle of ammonia. Lets face it if someone has a gun they can shoot from quite a distance. So if u are going to get shot u may not even know ahead of time. If someone gets in your face that close u can spray the ammonia and at least try to get away. I remember my brother watching Roy Rodgers and Gene Autry even Clint Eastwood had a quick draw. I have to say with the wild shooting Michael Dunn did I am not impressed, he was all over the place. Who has to shoot 9 bullets into a car. Especially as it was driving away. He wanted to shoot.... I think he was delusional that night. He needs to be convicted of the killing of Jordan Davis. He needs that aloof smurk off his face. He talks like a baby.

 

[Spellbound]

All handguns must be concealed in Texas, no matter the age, unless on private property. Texas is not a open carry state. I'm saying it is legal for teens to own weapons in Texas. And it is legal to transport a concealed weapon in Texas. Concealed. My 17 year old daughter meets me at the gun range often and she brings her 9 in her car. All legal.


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Jellyworker, are you sure it is OK for a 17 year old? I ask only because what I find in searching for Texas gun laws states otherwise and i don't know if they are current laws. Here is what I believe to be the most current law (2007, I think?), which states age 18 is the minimum age for transporting a handgun in a vehicle. It sure seems like laws are writtien to cause more confusion than to make things real clear.

http://www.handgunlaw.us/states/texas.pdf

Minimum Age for Possessing and Transporting of Handguns.
Texas 18 Y/O Title 10 Sec. 46.06
This is the minimum age for possessing and transporting a handgun unloaded and secured in a vehicle without any type of permit/license to carry firearms

 

[turaj]

funny I got male.

Well after thinking and reading what is available after the verdict...I do pretty much think it was an older man...what is older well on that jury there were some up to 70 but probably a white man MD's age or olde who identifyed with his situation and believe me there are many out there. Actually with that mindset I am surprised they got the other convictions but so thankful they did.

 

[LambChop]

Jellyworker, are you sure it is OK for a 17 year old? I ask only because what I find in searching for Texas gun laws states otherwise and i don't know if they are current laws. Here is what I believe to be the most current law (2007, I think?), which states age 18 is the minimum age for transporting a handgun in a vehicle. It sure seems like laws are writtien to cause more confusion than to make things real clear.

http://www.handgunlaw.us/states/texas.pdf

Minimum Age for Possessing and Transporting of Handguns.
Texas 18 Y/O Title 10 Sec. 46.06
This is the minimum age for possessing and transporting a handgun unloaded and secured in a vehicle without any type of permit/license to carry firearms

It says without permit/license. Maybe her daughter has a license to carry a concealed weapon. jmo

 

[turaj]

new phone call tapes released today feb. 18th...michael says he is the victim here...anyone surprised??

 

[popsicle]

WSers may not recognize the name Darren Kavinoky. But if you watched HLN or CNN coverage, you'll probably recognize him from the picture at the link below.

He was even on CNN with Don Lemon right after the verdict.

Anyway, the reason I brought him up is because today he wrote a blistering attack of John Guy's cross examination of Michael Dunn.
http://www.darrenkavinoky.com/justice-delayed-jordan-davis-murder-trial/

Thank you for that link. I completely agree with him and have always liked his insight. While Guy might be a good lawyer his forte is not cross examination imo.

 

[Jellyworker]

Jellyworker, are you sure it is OK for a 17 year old? I ask only because what I find in searching for Texas gun laws states otherwise and i don't know if they are current laws. Here is what I believe to be the most current law (2007, I think?), which states age 18 is the minimum age for transporting a handgun in a vehicle. It sure seems like laws are writtien to cause more confusion than to make things real clear.

http://www.handgunlaw.us/states/texas.pdf

Minimum Age for Possessing and Transporting of Handguns.
Texas 18 Y/O Title 10 Sec. 46.06
This is the minimum age for possessing and transporting a handgun unloaded and secured in a vehicle without any type of permit/license to carry firearms

This is news to me. Thanks for pointing this out. As many times as I have read the law, I've never seen mention of age.


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