FL FL - Michelle Parker, 33, Orlando, 17 Nov 2011 - #16

[Pias]

A thought and question what if Dale dropped the twins off and this was the normal routine not something special that day when Michelle would bring them over he went to his parents leaving the children... Since He went to work the next day....Did he get up and take the twins to his parents home again...

The reason why I ask this...is if he took the work van to work usually there is not a place for car seats.. seems like he would have to take the children in the red truck then go back home get the work van then go to work.....

Lot of shuffling vehicles if he had the children early in the morning?

IIRC, it is stated on news video that jr dropped the kids off at his folks house on 11/17, therefore, he would not have had the children the following morning... and we still do not know that there is any van what so ever involved in this case... in fact, i just about bet we can eliminate any van from the equation...

 

[Pias]

Thank you so much for all of your warm welcomes! Much appreciated.

Sparky, I am aware of your connection to Michelle (from reading here) and I am very sorry that you are going through this. My heart aches for her family as well. It bothered me a lot in the beginning when some were intent on blaming the victim and the victims family. Women that find themselves in an abusive relationship are not somehow "flawed" or at fault. I blame society and the media for this opinion with the constant images of violence against women , people are more desensitized than they realize. The oversexualization of women in pop culture and the media is also to blame for this, reducing them to expendable eye candy. Violence against women is not only rampant in our culture it is at times, excepted subconciously through desensitization. Why is it so difficult for some to see the outright manipulation and controlling ways of an abuser?

Women in abusive relationships are in the most danger when they leave. That is a statistical fact, and 70% of male abusers that threaten suicide or harm actually DO IT. Wasn't Dale the type to threaten suicide in times of desperation with the women in his life?

In any event, when I first read about Michelle's case it was very clear to me that something was very much "off" about DS jr. His behavior is classic abuser and I have no doubt that he is absolutely responsible for whatever happened to her. I think he was humiliated after watching the episode and he was seething right before she came over. She was happy, healthy, moving on, in a new relationship, and wanted nothing to do with him other than what she had to do custody wise.

He could not STAND that.

I don't know how he did it, but he did it, and I believe that all will come to light sooner than later.

It blows my mind that he shoved that reporter on his way in to a child welfare hearing. If I were that social worker ( that is what I am currently getting my degree in) I would have brought that up in court as soon as I found out about it, and would have argued that he clearly has no control over his temper and aggressive tendencies. It is very difficult to have a child removed from the custody of a parent, but I believe that the judge made a huge mistake in this case. He should have allowed them to stay in the only home they knew, with Yvonne to avoid any further disruption and emotional turmoil.

I always thought that the fact that Michelle was about to introduce her new boyfriend to her father and family had something to do with DS jr snapping. It was the final straw, he knew that she didn't want him anymore. That coupled with his embarrassing People's Court performance made him go where he had been threatening to go the entire time he dated Michelle. Abuse escalates and more women die at the hands of the men in their lives than we care to really digest.

I hope they find Michelle soon so that her family and friends can have some answers.

very well put.

I suffered every abuse growing up that one could experience.

When I look at this one photo on the dale supporters site, of jr and the 2 kids, the little boy is sticking his tongue out, and neither child looks comfortable to me. the girl looks just a little scared to me as she nestles in... and the boy is acting out... I lived the life, i see what they are feeling in that moment... not everyone can, i'm sure. but to me, i have to wonder what they saw. what they know...

I had picked up on something else a while back...

I think the kids had been coached before getting back to the parker family...

Why?

Because, it was said that the children saw a picture of their mom and the first thing that came to their mind was 'mommy's at work...' they had to hear that A LOT IMO, to make that statement rather than "where's mommy, or I miss my mommy, etc..."

IMOO, those kids knew something... the only saving grace in this where THEY are concerned, and their memories of that time, is that a news report also states that LE spoke with the children... so, hopefully they were able to extract some undistorted facts as seen through the eyes of a 3 year old...

 

[Pias]

There are a lot of questions regarding why the drop off was at that time on a weekday, especially if he had to work the next day. How long were the children supposed to have been staying with him, was this an early weekend visitation because MP had something planned for the Friday or DSJr requested them early because he really didn't have to work the next day? Or if he did have to work and he was taking them over to his parents as soon as they arrived, why didn't he just get MP to drop the children off with his parents in the first place and meet her there?

Were the children at the condo when LE came over to look around on the evening of the 17th or had he left them with his parents? Was that his excuse for going over there at 4:30pm? Or had he planned on spending time with the children at the condo but something went horribly wrong with the drop off. And of course the obvious question, why didn't DSJr pick up the children from day care since it appears he was just hanging around with nothing better to do anyway. MP had another child coming home from school and had to work that evening so I'm sure it would have been much more convenient for her if he had just picked the children up from daycare.

I'm sure LE know the answers to a lot of these questions based on interviews with her family and what they knew of these plans so that's probably just one more reason why DSJr is the prime suspect.

MOO

Thank you for stating this mentally visual perspective from angles that help probe the mind... sometimes seeing things in writing helps others to ponder the why's and what for's.

Why, indeed?

I read somewhere that is was only an overnite drop off, too...

Things that make ya go hmmm....:waitasec:

 

[Pias]

To add to what Camille has said: I don't think that we even know for sure if Dale spent the night of 11/17 at his condo or Rose Ave. He may very well have returned to Rose Ave. sometime after the police left.

Or, he coulda went anywhere... the next night on his FB, he said he still hadn't slept... why's that?

As a non guilty person, who was at odds with 'his children's mother,' as he puts it, HIS children's MOTHER... then, wouldn't you first be laughing that she couldn't stand the emberassment of the show and she'd motel'n it somewhere...?' and be laffing and mocking her???

but somebody with guilt on there conscious would have a hard time sleeping...

hmmmm...

she shoots, she scores

 

[sandina]

Newbie here. I've been lurking since early Dec when MP went missing and finally joined this week. You are all doing amazing work here!


Today, I've been spending sometime on the map reviewing the possible sightings, cell pings, potential route from DSjr to DSsr, etc. A few questions popped up for me. Maybe you've explored them before and I've missed it, but wanted to pose them in case someone has similar haunting questions.

If it was normal for DSjr to get the kids on Thursday and since he works on Fridays he takes the kids to parents for Thursday night (pure speculation) then why would he take them IMMEDIATELY instead of maybe hanging out with them for awhile before dumping them at the parents house?


I'm looking at where the cell phone pinged near Sand Lake & Orange and the possible sighting of Hummer near the mall and the power down of cell phone up a little further north. If DSjr is the actual person of interest, then we can assume HE was in these areas (versus the likely route to DSsr house as shown on the map). I see so many wooded areas or water areas along this other route....makes me wish more searches were happening!


One question - I thought there was a possible sighting of DSjr near a wooded area with his truck. I didn't see that on the map, does someone remember where that possible sighting was?


I also wonder if LE has cell phone ping info off DSjr's phone & if so, you'd think more searches would be conducted where those pings occurred. (sorry, it's just odd that more searches aren't happening)


Keep up the great work!

 

[Pias]

I just wanted to comment on this as far as the neighbour's video is concerned. If there was footage of DSJr's truck passing by that camera at 4:10pm, wouldn't that have been shown as well before the whole thing was pulled?

That whole surveillence camera thing is very strange. It appears as though TP got that footage from the neighbour and LE were aware of it at the time. Were LE aware that they were going to put that footage on the news? Did they want the arrival time to get out there knowing full well that DSJr was going with a 4pm time in his statements? Was that to rattle him? And the first black Hummer leaving wasn't a problem either since they knew it wasn't Michelle's. But again it might play with DSJr's head a bit.

Did LE specifically ask them not to show footage of DSJr leaving? Or isn't there any? As a reporter I'm sure that TP would have wanted to show it if it existed. But all they showed was the two black Hummers. And perhaps the panic ensued when that picture of the 5:17pm black vehicle got put in there and then whole thing got retracted. The more I look at the front right wheel of that vehicle, the more it looks like a Hummer to me with the protruding wheel cover. :waitasec:

And then we've got neighbours of the Senior Smiths talking about them having Hummers on that radio show, or at least having them in the driveway area of their home. Could be friends, employees etc that visit the house regularily. So a black Hummer without the Glow decals in their driveway would not be unusual?

Is it possible that DSJr drove the Hummer over to his parents with the children (and possibly even MP *shudder*) after the decals were removed and then the cover-up went into play? Dropped off the kids, dumped MP and then the Hummer and then got picked up and a ride back home.

MOO

I feel there is no cadaver trail associated with the hummer or this investigation would be further along. I also feel there is no cadaver trail leading to jr's truck or even a work van... undoubtedly, if there were a work van in this equation, LE would have had dogs over to jr's place of employment by now... MOO

 

[Sparky]

You're married to the Devil's Advocate!:devil:

About your video camera recording the neighbors stealing the fence...so you're saying that you put up a camera and the neighbors didn't see it, so just kept on stealing?

I'm thinking of the idea of hiding something in plain sight. RG is trying to get a record of whoever might damage his car, and yet he doesn't exactly hide the surveillance camera. We say that the camera is in plain sight, but that's because we know it's there. I think there might be something about the camera being set higher and most people thus not noticing it. Just speculating here, of course. I have absolutely no expertise in such matters!

BBM

Yes, I had it hooked to the computer and sitting between the window and the screen. The only ones that knew it were there was my family. But, I had the sensitivity turned up so high it never caught him. What it did catch was my son's ex girlfriend beating him in the head with a purse. :floorlaugh: when I asked her about it, she said she never did such a thing. Imagine that!
The look on her face was priceless when I showed her the video. She was so :shocked2: she walked out the door without a word.:floorlaugh:

 

[Pias]

On question 6: to paraphrase, "Did Dale know about the camera?"

IMO He may have known at one time, but he may have forgotten. If he knew about the camera, wouldn't he have told the police that MP arrived at 3:20 or so? Lying about the time would automatically make him suspect.

in addition, this was a big day. The show was on. you would have a good idea about the time already. and the time of day sheds light as well. we know it would be close to the sun setting by the time he would have taken his children to his parents house... that pretty much sets a window up right there for anyone... even if you were not wearing a watch... it just seems to me he could better guess the time, just by the events as they occurred, alone... IMO

 

[Pias]

btw, i had went to TPC website, and they have the history of their shows and when they were aired. THEIR case segment was aired second out of 3... it was also divided by a commercial, so you have a pretty clear time on when it aired... and how much time lapsed before the hummer arrived...

 

[Sparky]

Quote:
Originally Posted by captdj
I totally agree the wooded area closest to Dale's should be searched just to eliminate it ... I think Caylee's case proved that.



I would almost have to bet m will not be found there... sparky, i'm just sayin... review, review, review...

I'm sorry I don't understand the reference to me. TIA

 

[Sparky]

IIRC, wasn't there going to be a search for MP this morning?

Also, did anyone go to the garage sale yesterday on Goldenrod (or is anyone going today) Just curious.

Yes searching today. No I didn't get to go, because of unforeseen circumstances. Maybe AlwaysWright did or maybe today.

 

[truthsleuth]

Newbie here. I've been lurking ...

Hey sandina,

Welcome to WS!

and good job on your first post. Don't be a stranger!:seeya:

:fireworks:

ts

 

[Pias]

I am a long-time lurker, joined a few months ago and still lurk multiple times per day for updates on Michelle. I have had this feeling for a long time now, but I never say it because its horrible but I guess I'm going to finally say it.

I was in a very abusive relationship for 10 years, and it is sooo hard to get out and she is such a strong girl to put her life back together after being with someone like "him". My ex was so much like him is why this case is so important to me. And the one thing that I learned about my ex is that the two things they most enjoy when they are in that "rage" is doing what you hate the very most, and hurting you where they love you the very most. What I'm trying to say is... they will do their best to do to you what they know upsets you the most... and they will try to take from you what they love most about you, to be sure what they think are your best qualities you will never be able to share with anyone else.

Because I have seen this exact attitude in my own ex-husband, it is what I am most mortified that he may have done to her. You could tell the way she talked about him "abandoning her" in places where she had no transportation, no way to reach anyone to come help her... this is what bothered her the very most about how he treated her. I am sooo fearful that he has abandoned her somewhere. This would mean that dogs could never detect death in his condo or his vehicles... If they can't find her, how will they ever be able to charge him?? He could never pass a lie detector because of the question "do you know where Michelle is" but he could pass it if the question was "did you kill Michelle" because what if he didn't kill her but just left her somewhere that she could never survive? I have been sooo scared for her, I can't even tell you the feeling deep in my heart.

I feel horrible in sharing this feeling, but I could no longer hold it in my head... I think tonight when I read the statement about that brush they were searching thru today, and how thick and impossible it was to get thru... I just had a horrible sinking feeling for fear he left her some awful place like that.

The way DSjr talked about 'they were meant to be together, just things go wrong but they'll be together again, they'll end up together' (paraphrased) makes me fearful that he did to her what she hated the most. Not just that he got carried away, but upon realizing that she had a new man that was truly good to her, that he flew into that "rage" and he abandoned her somewhere, intentionally, just to make her pay the worst price he could. I hate him.

I'm sorry to be so long winded. To Sparky and other friends of Michelle, she is so lucky to have you as friends, you are so diligent and true to her... bless you! We all have to keep trying, she deserves it!

Thank you for saying what i have been thinking all along...

whatever happened to michelle, didn't happen in whole, or possibly, just remotely, may not have happened at all, at that condo...

either way it went down, she was still breathing until she got to wherever it is she will be found...

I believe he did not want to get his hands dirty. I'm not saying he didn't snap her neck once he got her where he wanted her, but I do believe, no matter how it went down, i.e. under threat that he would harm the kids, drugging, etc..., she was breathing until she got where she is now...

and by some of the heavy reading i've done, i can't help but wonder exactly what you propose, in that, she was left to die... some things have left me to ponder that it was possible to still make changes for a time, after the wheels were set in motion... I cannot post anymore about this than MOO... due to restrictions of this site's policies, which I respect in full.

 

[AlwaysWright]

Here is a photo of the garage sale yesterday:

and I think I might have found the white van parked on the curb which was at the pool and work out clubhouse......

Got some other pics that I will share my thoughts a bit later today.... I don't have the time at the moment to go over my finds but I will be back later in the day and share some pretty interesting stuff..... I will let you know that there are other videos recorders in the area and I have them photographed..... The homeowners probably got home and said who is that taking a picture of our recorder.... No I am not a freak! just a sleuther.... LOL

 

[Pias]

Here is question #9

When was MP supposed to meet boyfriend NM for dinner?

Well, we can say for sure it was after 3:18 when she was supposed to drop off the kids and before 7pm when she was supposed to be at work. So, it would have HAD to be between 4:00pm and 6:30pm (IMO).

I would need to know what type of dinner they were meeting for...was it a quick bite someplace where you order at a counter or drive through an have a seat and eat or was it a place they would be seated and have a server take their order. Seemingly, a seated dinner would take longer.

Pias, you are awesome with narrowing down time...maybe you can be a little more precise with timing on this question? TIA

all i know is that it was noted by someone as a quick bite to eat at 7pm... but I can not remember where i found that... on a side note, if michelle was known to arrive 10 mins early for her shifts, and IF the meal really was planned for 7pm, and you would need some drive time, unless that meeting place were at your job, or just across the street, AND you would have to allow time to order, that makes for a very tight spot when you are introducing your new bo to your dad... and, either dad or NM would have most likely went to the location they were to meet at, if one had been set up, to see if she had simply lost her phone while having car trouble, and was going to perhaps show up there...

when you do not know WHAT is happening or what HAS happened, you still try to see if what was supposed to happen, will happen at some point... does that make sense?

SO, I guess what I am saying is, in order to really get the answer to that question, we might want to ask m's dad, sister, or NM for this answer... and even if one has already been given early on by the family, to re-verify it's accuracy.

 

[Pias]

:floorlaugh:

BBM

Yes, I had it hooked to the computer and sitting between the window and the screen. The only ones that knew it were there was my family. But, I had the sensitivity turned up so high it never caught him. What it did catch was my son's ex girlfriend beating him in the head with a purse. :floorlaugh: when I asked her about it, she said she never did such a thing. Imagine that!
The look on her face was priceless when I showed her the video. She was so :shocked2: she walked out the door without a word.:floorlaugh:

 

[Wild@Heart]

I posted last evening/early morning information in regards to DS Jr's phone...it has since been removed. Was I in error posting this information? If so can I re-word the post in order to make it known? I think it's an important piece of information. I am friends with DS Jr on FB, but I do not know him personally. I became FB friends with him after this case broke. HELP PLEASE!

 

[captdj]

So my husband and I just had a major discussion about DSjr which has just pizzed me off. I told him about the hummer leaving at 5:17 and he says so she stayed until than and left. I said DSjr said she left at 4 pm, he says time got away from him, I said no way, he says think about how many times we've thought it was a certain time and it was much later then that. I said well he wouldn't even take a poly and he says neither would I. I said he has the twins and he says why wouldn't he he's their dad. I said because he has this horrible background and he says so. I then said look at the way everything has lined up, from the condo to where the hummer was found. Yeah he says it's a coincendece, I said I don't believe in coincendece, he says someone set him up.

I said well who's side are you on anyways? He said yours and Shelly's. Well then you need to agree with me. He said i didnt say he didn't do it, I'm just trying to show you there are other explanations.

Grrrrr...

:slap:

Ok if the 5:17 is Michelle Hummer if DS2 per DS1 neighbor saw him at the parents home with kids in tow at 4:30 would it still give him enough time to have his father come back to the condo and drop him off and get into the hummer? I say yes.

With all we know there is no evidence to say it could NOT be the hummer? right? In fact that timeline would fit really well in their plan...

I do believe Dale is the prime suspect for a reason and if we had all that LE does your husband might be more in agreement.

Women go more on intutive feelings I think than men so your reasoning is more acutely based on feelings along the facts....comes from being a mom and having eyes and ears in the back of our heads:great:

But Sparky just to be sure I've checked out the carjacking and homicide in Orlando for the last 90 days and there were 12 Carjacking and then I overlayed the homicides and none were from the carjacking...(FWIW)

The thing is we start by trying to clear DS2 and trying to debunk that he could have done something to Michelle since he was the last to see her...but clearly if DS2 wanted to do something he had history, ample opportunity and motive.JMO

 

[Pias]

I posted last evening informati/early morning in regards to DS Jr's phone...it has since been removed. Was I in error posting this information? If so can I re-word the post in order to make it known? I think it's an important piece of information. I am friends with DS Jr on FB, but I do not know him personally. I became FB friends with him after this case broke. HELP PLEASE!

usually, all you gotta do is add IMO or MOO, unless it mentions a new name...:seeya:

 

[Wild@Heart]

Can someone let me know the make/model of the suspicous burnt orange car in DS Sr's driveway on the day of the custody hearing? Thanks All!

I had my hubby (Car Enthusiast) watch the video and look at the pictures of the Hummers (in and out). He states that both MP Hummer and the one leaving at 5:17 pm, could be the same vehicle. He was able to determine the wheels are factory on both Hummers. The color could look gray because of the sun's reflection. JMO as always!